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What made Amarr really good?

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Tega Khan	Posted - 2007.02.16 04:48:00 - [1] I could be wrong, but ive read in a few places that the Amarr used to be really kickass, then it was brought down by nerfs. Im just curious, if this was true, what about them made them so good? Were resists less effective back then? or was nos less effective? or did lasers just do more damage? Just a curiousity that needs to be satisfied. (also im a new player so I dont know much about how the races fared during the last 3ish years of the game)
Mr Peanut STK Scientific INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.02.16 04:51:00 - [2] Well, for one, we could fill all of our low-slots with heatsinks and not have to worry about stacking.
Benglada Infinitus Odium Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.16 04:52:00 - [3] 1. There used to be almost no stacking penalty, amarr have tons of lows so they would do insane damage 2. Omni tanks became usefull, and as such, everyone now has insanely high EM resists. --------------------------- Originally by: Arkanor 0.0 is the Final Frontier. Bring money and friends. Sig nerfz0r - maximum allowed siz0r is 24000 bytz0r. - Devil ([email protected]) Sig By Ortos
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.16 05:39:00 - [4] Edited by: Goumindong on 16/02/2007 05:40:39 Originally by: Tega Khan I could be wrong, but ive read in a few places that the Amarr used to be really kickass, then it was brought down by nerfs. Im just curious, if this was true, what about them made them so good? Were resists less effective back then? or was nos less effective? or did lasers just do more damage? Just a curiousity that needs to be satisfied. (also im a new player so I dont know much about how the races fared during the last 3ish years of the game) Damage mods werent stacked. So all weapons did lots and lots of damage when you fitted a whole bunch of heat sinks. When you added that to the natural long range of pulse lasers you got armageddons that could destroy battleships before they could allign. To kick that off, pulse lasers had even longer range, and on top of that had a higher base damage[i believe, not sure on the last, sure about the longer range]. Combine that with lack of the EANM tanks and much lower hit points[this is the second HP buff, maybe the third, i dont know] and it goes a long way to makeing a 1200 dps armageddon @ 45+ km looking truely frightening[1500 @ 20km or so]. Not that it wouldnt be frightening as it is today, but more so without the HP boosts and omni tanks. And tech 2 short range ammo also did even more damage. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
Blood Raine	Posted - 2007.02.16 05:43:00 - [5] Yup Geddons could pretty much almost 2 volley an untanked battleship back in the day. With the stacking nerf they should bring the damage on the lasers back to where it was.
Tega Khan	Posted - 2007.02.16 06:21:00 - [6] Ah, i see. that pretty much answers my question thankyou
Jaketh Ivanes Amarr Riggers Incorporated	Posted - 2007.02.16 08:21:00 - [7] Its not even that long ago, that geddons were so usefull.. I remember jumping into a system, with a tempest hugging the gate and 2 more confirmed enemies in local. I opened up on the pest, and in a few seconds, it ran through the gate with less then 50% armor, just as his 2 friends (a cyclone and t2 rupture) showed up.. I got both of those.. Those were the days..
Kashre Minmatar Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.02.16 08:35:00 - [8] Originally by: Tega Khan I could be wrong, but ive read in a few places that the Amarr used to be really kickass, then it was brought down by nerfs. Im just curious, if this was true, what about them made them so good? Were resists less effective back then? or was nos less effective? or did lasers just do more damage? Just a curiousity that needs to be satisfied. (also im a new player so I dont know much about how the races fared during the last 3ish years of the game) Autocannons... ok no seriously... I think that in the days before t2 ammo made every race able to shoot out to 200km and do crazy damage tachyon beams were popular for fleet combat. At least I recall seeing some old BOB videos where they're whole fleet seemed to be amarr BS. Other than that, I never thought they were ever all that great, except for the non-stacking nerfed damage mods thing. +++ "Etiquette is for the Dojo. In war there is only victory or death." - Eiji Yoshikawa
enymphia Vortex. Maelstrom Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.16 08:40:00 - [9] scorp+425mm t2 railes+8tracking comps t2+magstabs t2's in the lows. this must have been pretty funny to fly aswell ??
IonHammer Minmatar Black Avatar Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.02.16 08:42:00 - [10] back in the hey day you could get your geddon to 1k + dps with some good guns and skills now with t2 everything i max out at around 760 dps and have much worse tracking i could get some more dps with rigs and implants but at suck an extra cost. Man i miss those geddons If thats your real life i'm very jealous - Petwraith
Sir Bart Vendetta Underground Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.02.16 08:43:00 - [11] Edited by: Sir Bart on 16/02/2007 08:42:30 Yeah here's the way it went: 1) Lasers were good and there were no stacking penalties so Amarr had great guns and lots of low slots to take advantage of many stacked damage modules 2) Amarr was seen as too strong so lasers effectiveness was reduced 3) Damage modules could no longer stack and EW was made very effective with just 1 module (amarr sucks at this point) 4) Introduction of armor compensation skills makes Energized adaptive nanomembrane tanks common and Amarr becomes even less useful since everyone is already wanting to Armor tank and use midslots for ECM 5) ECM is nerfed really hard and hitpoints increased by 50% (at least now we won't get jammed while we are getting our asses kicked) In hind sight, if lasers did not get the nerf and they instead balanced Amarr by adding stacking penalties to dmg mods (reducing the advantage of many low slots) Amarr would still be semi useful. EANM would be problem, a big problem, but anyone without the eanm tanks would be in trouble if they tried to go toe to toe with Amarr. As it is, Amarr are just average in firepower so average in a fight when not against EANM. And they are useless against EANM tanks. They only really shine in sniping... Abaddon is good for short engagements and Geddon is pretty good in real fleet battles. They can make a good nos-tank setup too but it's a pretty boring setup. -Bart Edit: With the introduction of the Rokh, there's really only one fleet sniper worth a damn anymore... so hard to compliment Amarr here... at least you don't get raped on the price of 425mm rails on a geddon. \o/
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.02.16 10:00:00 - [12] In addition to what's already been said, pulse lasers used to have around 20% longer optimal range. Dulce et decorum est pro imperator mori
DarkElf Caldari Veto. Academy	Posted - 2007.02.16 10:02:00 - [13] Originally by: Benglada 1. There used to be almost no stacking penalty, amarr have tons of lows so they would do insane damage 2. Omni tanks became usefull, and as such, everyone now has insanely high EM resists. yep those are the 2 main points that have 'nerfed' amarr to date. to be fair tho the gankageddon was way too overpowered which showed because about half the pvp bs you saw used to be them. soooo much fun to fly. and yeah triple eanm +dmg control tanks are just plain stupid to fight with em primary dmg. DE
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.16 10:08:00 - [14] Originally by: Rodj Blake In addition to what's already been said, pulse lasers used to have around 20% longer optimal range. Yea, i think i had covered that. They were pretty bad. In the sense that it was overpowered. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
twit brent Dark Centuri Inc. Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.02.16 10:35:00 - [15] Geddons used to have 8 heatsink II's and pump out arround 1200dps with multifreq. It did the same damage as a blasterthron with neutrons and full magfield stabs. BS's had alot less HP and tanks were made of 50% hardeners and large reps. Untill revelations hit I was doing a little over 1000dps with tachyon II's (beam spec V) at 46km optimal but gleam crystal nerf just screwed me over completely.
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.16 10:55:00 - [16] Edited by: Goumindong on 16/02/2007 10:51:22 Originally by: twit brent Geddons used to have 8 heatsink II's and pump out arround 1200dps with multifreq. It did the same damage as a blasterthron with neutrons and full magfield stabs. BS's had alot less HP and tanks were made of 50% hardeners and large reps. Untill revelations hit I was doing a little over 1000dps with tachyon II's (beam spec V) at 46km optimal but gleam crystal nerf just screwed me over completely. With Tachyon IIs, pre-kali gleam, and 3 tech 2 Heat Sinks at max skills you should have been doing 862 DPS with an armageddon. Which is still very significant, mainly thermal, and 130 DPS over what you can hit with scorch and pulses[mainly EM] today. Not counting hardwiring though. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
Frools Chaos Reborn	Posted - 2007.02.16 11:03:00 - [17] Originally by: IonHammer back in the hey day you could get your geddon to 1k + dps with some good guns and skills now with t2 everything i max out at around 760 dps and have much worse tracking i could get some more dps with rigs and implants but at suck an extra cost. Man i miss those geddons you're doing something wrong man, i get about 900 turret dps with megapulse, no implants or rigs (damage rigs stack with damage mods so kinda pointless for trying to gank) oh and twit used to get 1k dps with tachyons cos he has TS heatsinks and turret hardwirings :P
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.16 11:33:00 - [18] Originally by: Frools Originally by: IonHammer back in the hey day you could get your geddon to 1k + dps with some good guns and skills now with t2 everything i max out at around 760 dps and have much worse tracking i could get some more dps with rigs and implants but at suck an extra cost. Man i miss those geddons you're doing something wrong man, i get about 900 turret dps with megapulse, no implants or rigs (damage rigs stack with damage mods so kinda pointless for trying to gank) oh and twit used to get 1k dps with tachyons cos he has TS heatsinks and turret hardwirings :P Yea, you do with conflag and 4 damage mods yes. Not with scorch. The difference between 45km and 15km is fairly severe. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
Kharakan Amarr Magnificent Beavers Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.02.16 17:15:00 - [19] Especially when you consider that 45 KM is OUT of nos range, but 15 km is IN nos range this signature space is claimed in the name of eris, haha I got to him first. neeneer
Sir Bart Vendetta Underground Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.02.25 07:05:00 - [20] Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: Frools twit used to get 1k dps with tachyons cos he has TS heatsinks and turret hardwirings :P Yea, you do with conflag and 4 damage mods yes. Not with scorch. The difference between 45km and 15km is fairly severe. But not really relevant since conflag and scorch can't be used in tachyons. He's useing Gleam.
Dopefish Amarr Quad and Fish	Posted - 2007.02.25 07:41:00 - [21] Edited by: Dopefish on 25/02/2007 07:40:32 Geddon is fine as it is now except for megapulse range. Why nerf optimal from 30 to 24 and then introduce scorch. I liked 17km optimal with mf Edit: Or was it 19km? i forget
Godar Marak Amarr Return Of Red Dawn	Posted - 2007.02.25 07:56:00 - [22] Edited by: Godar Marak on 25/02/2007 07:55:46 Originally by: Tega Khan Im just curious, if this was true, what about them made them so good? Back then you could fit your ship like a man as someone already have mentioned here. Amarr rewarded high gunnery skillpoints amungst other things. None of this pantsy max 3 damage mods rubbish. First radio crystals were nerfed, SERIOUSLY nerfed and so were pulse lasers. Pulse laser nerf was ok since they were overpowered. But the radio nerf was a stupid decision in my opinion. Tachyons used to bbq people before resistance and hitpoints were boosted, today they are just a pain in the ass to fit and you cant tank at the same time. However, since CCP has FINALLY admited Amarr needs luving (after years of complaining of these forums) I have decided to belive that Amarr win once more be top dog. -------------------- '\0/\0/\0/\0/\0/' Cant we all just get along?
Royaldo Old Farts	Posted - 2007.02.25 08:04:00 - [23] Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: Rodj Blake In addition to what's already been said, pulse lasers used to have around 20% longer optimal range. Yea, i think i had covered that. They were pretty bad. In the sense that it was overpowered. there was 1 problem ship when nerf was screamed. gankageddon. mega pulse *7 and 7-8 dmg mods.
Royaldo Old Farts	Posted - 2007.02.25 08:05:00 - [24] and 2 volley any ship my ass. wasnt anything like that at all.
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys	Posted - 2007.02.25 12:52:00 - [25] Originally by: Sir Bart Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: Frools twit used to get 1k dps with tachyons cos he has TS heatsinks and turret hardwirings :P Yea, you do with conflag and 4 damage mods yes. Not with scorch. The difference between 45km and 15km is fairly severe. But not really relevant since conflag and scorch can't be used in tachyons. He's useing Gleam. Except totaly relevent because the quote being replied to was "you're doing something wrong man, i get about 900 turret dps with megapulse, no implants or rigs (damage rigs stack with damage mods so kinda pointless for trying to gank)" which you convieniently snipped out of my reply. ---------------------------------------- Thou Shalt "Pew Pew"
Zhaine Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2007.02.25 13:45:00 - [26] People say all this, but I'm still coming top of damage mails a lot of the time with DHP/MP split load with conflag, T1 heavy drones and decent but not perfect gunnery skills. In short: People exaggerate, because things "Ain't loik they were back in moi day!" - - - - - - - - - - Give this a read.

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