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Pollution of space in asteroid fields..

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Diamond Valen Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2007.02.20 10:15:00 - [1] I was wondering why many asteroid fields in the game are that full with cargo containers but noone else is around. The last field i entered took full 5 minutes to load and show all the containers and every 1 minute of playing comes a half minute of lag. I can understand that someone puts his ore in a container for someone else to gather it or what ever, but there were hundreds of them and not even one single ship around. Is there any way to tell the game "please ignore all aspects of cargo containers, dont load and/or show me them"? That makes the game nearly unplayable. And the worst is, when i want to make the space clean from that pollution, i become a criminal.
Culmen Caldari Gekidoku Koroshiya Buntai	Posted - 2007.02.20 10:25:00 - [2] The Reason is that some people deploy a giant secure can, so they can mine without getting their ore stolen as for why they stay there.... well thats a question alot of experienced players ask, and CCP never answers as for ignoring them... right click-> remove from overview should remove them from your over veiw, but wont remove those annoying yellow dimonds _____________________________________________________ Why do i even need a sig?
Humpalot	Posted - 2007.02.20 14:06:00 - [3] Originally by: Culmen as for why they stay there.... well thats a question alot of experienced players ask, and CCP never answers Amen to that. Players have been asking for a long time now to have some way of clearing these from all over (at gates and stations as well where they are used as advertisements). I have yet to see a single person argue that they should be left as they are and indeed now they are becoming so ubiquitous they impact game play. I'd think CCP would want to thin this herd if for no other reason than impact on the servers but as mentioned CCP has remained silent on the matter.
Domitianvs Amarr MCL Industries	Posted - 2007.02.20 21:03:00 - [4] I would be really ****ed off if someone removed my secure cans. I use them at least twice a week when the new asteroids spawn. But also in saying that I have seen some of the noob zones with way way too many cans out in the belts and I would agree with a change that if they have not been used in a month or two that they implode and go away. Just dont take them away from those of us who actually put them to good use.
Simon Jax Gallente Freedom Guard Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.20 21:22:00 - [5] My, perhaps ill conceived, solution to the problem involves the ability to hack another players can to gain access to the anchoring mechanism. As you know, a hauler can scoop an unanchored secure can into its cargo hold. Once scooped the contents are all theirs. So I donÆt think its necessary to allow people to hack into the contents of a secure can, just the anchoring mechanism. For balance, there hacking attempt would trigger some sort of timer, during which time the canÆs owner, or the ownerÆs corp can return and reset the password. Make it a 24 hr or 48 hr period to give the owner/corp a chance to go reset it and youÆre set. --Wherever you go, there you are.
Humpalot	Posted - 2007.02.20 21:31:00 - [6] Originally by: Domitianvs I would be really ****ed off if someone removed my secure cans. I use them at least twice a week when the new asteroids spawn. But also in saying that I have seen some of the noob zones with way way too many cans out in the belts and I would agree with a change that if they have not been used in a month or two that they implode and go away. Just dont take them away from those of us who actually put them to good use. I totally agree. If you are using the things then more power to you and the can should remain. But I have no doubt many, many cans are simply forgotten relics. Simon's idea is a fun one. If not that place continuing charge on every can you anchor. Or limit the number of anchored cans you can have out at once. So either pay a weekly fee per can or just cap how many you can use. This could be easily balanced such that players actively using a half dozen cans have little problem but someone who spams them has issues (if you go with a payment arrangement an unpaid can should unanchor itself and be indicated as such to other players since I doubt people would randomly fly to 100 cans to find one that is unanchored).
Bleys Vontagen Gallente Phoenix Logistics Industries	Posted - 2007.02.20 23:16:00 - [7] Edited by: Bleys Vontagen on 20/02/2007 23:12:57 Honestly, these things are a problem. These thing really make many areas of the game look like garbage dumps. They, honestly, don't hold that much ore. Ore thieves seem to be a rarity anymore. I think there should be a depreciation timer on them. From the day they are anchored, they waste away until, at the end of 90 days, they pop from damage due to micro-meteorites, etc. The second part is that the containers should be repairable with a remote armor repairer. That way the abandoned/forgotten/expired account cans will (eventually) fade away into oblivion. The containers used by people will remain.
Tunajuice Convergent Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.02.20 23:39:00 - [8] I too, am suprised nothing is done about this.
Jei'son Bladesmith Caldari Bladesmith Mining and Development Consortium	Posted - 2007.02.20 23:40:00 - [9] I like Humpalot's idea of limiting the maximum number of cans you can anchor, maybe say X number of cans per level of Anchoring skill (then maybe we'd have a real use for training more than Anchoring 1) * Confidence keeps you alive...cockiness will get you podded *
GetergdeKaasboer	Posted - 2007.02.20 23:53:00 - [10] Have usually thrown out that anchored cans should have a decay timer on them.... 1) after 7 days they spontaneously unanchor, and can be scooped by anyone 2) then over the next 7 days they pop if not scooped or reanchored 3) anchoring skill level limits how many you can have anchored at one time but alas, CCP feels that nerfing drones would free up more server space. cant be that hard given all the stuff secured station containers have on them

Baka Lakadaka	Posted - 2007.02.21 00:09:00 - [11] I agree with the timer on the anchor - but seven days is a little short. Maybe 30 or 60 days. I'm not keen on losing my secure cans because I went on holiday for a week, but as long as I use them regularly it should be OK. One concept might be to implement a 90 day timer, see how much gets cleaned up and then walk it back 60, 30, 15, 7 days depending on the outcome of the "trial". This could also constitute "fair warning" in that it's a gradually phased in approach.
Diamond Valen Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2007.02.21 03:06:00 - [12] Or CCP makes some kind of small outpost in the asteroid fields, wich can be used from everyone as an personal secure container, simply like a base with room for everyone or something like that, so no millions of cargo containers are needed anymore.
Max Godsnottlingson Amarr Ivy Industries	Posted - 2007.02.21 09:52:00 - [13] Originally by: Bleys Vontagen Edited by: Bleys Vontagen on 20/02/2007 23:12:57 Honestly, these things are a problem. These thing really make many areas of the game look like garbage dumps. They, honestly, don't hold that much ore. Ore thieves seem to be a rarity anymore. I think there should be a depreciation timer on them. From the day they are anchored, they waste away until, at the end of 90 days, they pop from damage due to micro-meteorites, etc. The second part is that the containers should be repairable with a remote armor repairer. That way the abandoned/forgotten/expired account cans will (eventually) fade away into oblivion. The containers used by people will remain. Best idea to date for dealing with abandoned secure cans. The devs shoul dgive people proir warning to get any cans they want safe then do a sweep of any left in space to get rid of the 'garbage' then let folks redeploy them as sugested by Bleys
Shadow Kyote Caldari Shadow Knight's Corp	Posted - 2007.02.21 11:35:00 - [14] This is somewhat similar to what's been said previously. But I too agree that the garbage dumps are makign things far too laggy. Make each bin's anchor rechargeable. Meanign that everytime it's used by it's owner it recharges the anchoring system for say, another 14 days. At the end of those 14 days if no use has recharged it then it becomes unanchored and 14 days from that it pops. I think this would address the issue perfectly. I'm not sure but this could work straight forward on the anchoring skill itself. Maybe for each level or the skill add 2 days or such to max time bewtween charges. But since PoS's use anchoring and are used often they and their corp members would be contantly recharging them every visit. It's only the unused bins that should be affected. I'm new here so maybe I dont understand fully what all is involved. But from what someone in this thread mentioned, asteroids repop twice a week. That would seem to me to indicate that 7 days is actually too much time. If the person isn't visiting their container at least once a week then it seems it's junk most of the time. And if your going on vacation, which to most of us is a rather rare occurance, then with the investment in the containers you have you'd be encouraged to pick them up before you leave on vacation. Or am I missing something? --- Kyote
Tyson Gallane Caldari	Posted - 2007.02.21 13:12:00 - [15] Originally by: Diamond Valen Or CCP makes some kind of small outpost in the asteroid fields, wich can be used from everyone as an personal secure container, simply like a base with room for everyone or something like that, so no millions of cargo containers are needed anymore. /signed. That's a very good idea. TG. Information is half the battle. (The other half is VIOLENCE.)
Avarice Holt Full Frontal Mining	Posted - 2007.02.22 02:15:00 - [16] I am very up for this but controlled in some way. IMO we should have a secure can "expiration" date of 30-90 days. 30 days is a good length of time. Long enough for even a casual player, unless you're on sabbatical, and short enough to serve as a semi-immediate remedy.
Atalius Vinelgo	Posted - 2007.02.22 11:30:00 - [17] I personally get tired of these stupid advertisement cans everywhere and people drawing shapes with them, it is quite annoying and a mess on my screen. I would like for them to have a 48 hour timer on all containers, this would help the server load out greatly. Also it would take away the mess on my screen.
Imuran	Posted - 2007.02.22 11:33:00 - [18] Originally by: Domitianvs I would be really ****ed off if someone removed my secure cans. I use them at least twice a week when the new asteroids spawn. No problem there - you are using them. There is an awful lot of space litter with Cans that I am convinced are not being used. This subject comes up time and again and is never answered or commeted on
Griimm	Posted - 2007.02.28 14:02:00 - [19] My problem with the cans is the space.... I mine solo and am not a part of a large corporation. I have had 2 instances of ore stealers/pirates in the last 5 days. The solution is to use a secure can. Unfortunately...its near impossible to anchor the can because of the clutter. You cannot anchor within 5000m of an asteroid or other secure can.
Cara Rhondoon	Posted - 2007.02.28 14:40:00 - [20] I think 30 days unused the can should unanchor and unlock, and a week later it should pop if unused. The name on the can should change to regular "cargo" once that timer has expired, so everyone knows it hasnt been used in a long while. the act of putting something in the can should make that timer reset but only for the original owner, it probably should not be anchorable again once that timer has lapsed. I mine and ore thieves ARE VERY common. people that say they arent have been lucky. 48 hour limit is too short, as is 7 days. Many many people go on vacation and dont have access to a pc where they are going. I could see at the shortest 15 days before the secure can went into unlocked and unanchored mode, but shorter than that becomes a problem. I've never seen lag because of cans though, how bad is the problem for you guys that it lags that much for you? You could also try to go into a less populated system, usually you can find one within one or two jumps from your base you are using now. I did that this week and I found almost all the asteroid belts had only one or two cans anchored. some belts had no cans whatsoever, which was indeed very good...

Steele Storm State War Academy	Posted - 2007.03.01 01:27:00 - [21] Originally by: Bleys Vontagen Edited by: Bleys Vontagen on 20/02/2007 23:12:57 Honestly, these things are a problem. These thing really make many areas of the game look like garbage dumps. They, honestly, don't hold that much ore. Ore thieves seem to be a rarity anymore. I think there should be a depreciation timer on them. From the day they are anchored, they waste away until, at the end of 90 days, they pop from damage due to micro-meteorites, etc. The second part is that the containers should be repairable with a remote armor repairer. That way the abandoned/forgotten/expired account cans will (eventually) fade away into oblivion. The containers used by people will remain. I like this idea here. Honestly, why has this problem really remained? Simply put a timer on them. IMO it should be 30 days that a can is unused that it should pop. Maybe make that 60, but either way, they should decay. I can't remember where I was exactly, but in some 0.7 sec space here recently I saw ACE spelled out close to the gate. Props to the guy who did that atleast. --------------------------------------------- "Win as if you were used to it, lose as if you enjoyed it for a change." -Ralph Waldo Emerson
adriaans Amarr The Sirius Cybernetics	Posted - 2007.03.01 13:56:00 - [22] Originally by: Diamond Valen Or CCP makes some kind of small outpost in the asteroid fields, wich can be used from everyone as an personal secure container, simply like a base with room for everyone or something like that, so no millions of cargo containers are needed anymore. /signed --sig-- Knowledge is power!
Roxanna Nailvenom	Posted - 2007.03.01 14:27:00 - [23] Originally by: Bleys Vontagen Edited by: Bleys Vontagen on 20/02/2007 23:12:57 Honestly, these things are a problem. These thing really make many areas of the game look like garbage dumps. They, honestly, don't hold that much ore. Ore thieves seem to be a rarity anymore. I think there should be a depreciation timer on them. From the day they are anchored, they waste away until, at the end of 90 days, they pop from damage due to micro-meteorites, etc. The second part is that the containers should be repairable with a remote armor repairer. That way the abandoned/forgotten/expired account cans will (eventually) fade away into oblivion. The containers used by people will remain. I totally agree, this is a great way to reduce clutter. Our corp has a few cans in belts for mining. Fitting a remote armor repairer to my ship wouldn't be much of a hardship. You could even get a logistical drone to do it for you while you mine! I also like the idea of the outpost. You could prehaps dock 2 ships at it, one miner and a hauler to carry the loads back to your base?
Simon Jax Gallente Freedom Guard Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.01 17:42:00 - [24] I like the suggestions of long term damage over time and the anchoring timer the best personally. Putting outposts in hisec belts seems like too big of a change. I like the damage over time idea because it makes sense and requires a direct level of mainenance from the player to keep up. However, one thing you have to keep in mind is that Secure Cans are not just used in asteroid belts. They are truly invaluable out in deep space where you don't necessarily have access to a hangar or station. Needing to fit armor repair modules or carry an armor repair drone out and about just to shore up your cans would be a huge pain in the butt. From a roleplay/backstory perspective the "anchoring energy" one makes a bit more sense than damage over time, though. For one, it'd be hard to come up with a solid explanation for why all secure cans take damage at the same rate regardless of their position/location in space. Requiring energy makes a bit more sense. Sure, solar panels could theoretically be 'keeping them charged' but it'd be easier to explain that away than the damage aspect. Plus, it'd be easier to maintain your deep space cans if they simply unanchor when the timer expires. I'd go for the DOT can death if it's restricted to those cans placed in belts, as then the consistency of the damage could be explained and deep space cans would be unaffected. Otherwise, I'm on board with the energy-loss unanchor timer. --Wherever you go, there you are.


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