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Katrina Coreli
Soar Angelic
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Posted - 2007.02.20 21:06:00 -
[1]
Given that its never going to happen i thought i would express this more as a thought rather than an idea for implimentation. I havent been on eve for long so i wasnt here for the introduction of tech 2, i was just wondering what the point of tech 2 (Im thinking modules here, ofc tech 2 Ships are important).
One of the things that has always intregued me about eve is the fact that sp does not equal victory, someone with low sp can in theory have a good chance vs a high sp player. However this does not sit very well with Tech 2. Tech 2 On the whole requires a large amount of time investment to get to but is most definatly worth it. However given the power of tech 2 over tech 1 Tech 1 guns automatically become defunct so long as you have the isk to afford them. Tech 2 doesnt realy add anything more to the game, they are in essence just advanced versions of Tech 1.
I also see this slightly with named kit, atm there is no real reason to fit baisic Tech 1, if you have the skills you use tech 2, if you dont you use the best named you can afford.
Though it is a good idea to stick to the phrase, "If something isnt broke dont try to fix it" i think CCP have missed abit of a trick with named, there is variation within it but not enough imo. I think it would be interesting if named kit had genuinly diferent characteristics. For example you take your baisic 125 mm Railgun, standard stats all round, however if your setup required it you could chose a named weapon that could decrease fitting requirements at the expense of damage modifier, or you could chose a named weapon with increased range to fit your neads but a lower rate of fire.
I think it would make sense if only 2 of the stats were altered, 1 increased and 1 decreased. The increased stat would actually be slightly better than the tech 2 Counterpart but all other stats would still be at stock tech 1 level and one would be even worse.
Of course i dont expect this to be implimented but if it was it could have several possitive impacts on the game i.e
1.Reasons to use Named over Tech 2 rather than purely fitting requirements
2.This would also bring down the prices of Tech 2 Modules
These were just afew jumbled thoughts but id be interested to hear your thoughts on the subject.
Thanks for your time
-Kat
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Miranda Ceres
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Posted - 2007.02.20 21:10:00 -
[2]
Compare tech I named nosferatu to tech II...
You'll basically find that the good named versions are much easier to use and fit than their tech II counterparts, whilst not being that much less effective...
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Gamesguy
Amarr
E X O D U S
Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.02.20 21:18:00 -
[3]
This is a great idea.
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Katrina Coreli
Soar Angelic
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Posted - 2007.02.20 21:40:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Miranda Ceres
Compare tech I named nosferatu to tech II...
You'll basically find that the good named versions are much easier to use and fit than their tech II counterparts, whilst not being that much less effective...
Indeed, but wouldnt it be nice if there was a reason to fit named rather than fitting constraints or skill constraints?
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Crewman Jenkins
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Posted - 2007.02.20 22:11:00 -
[5]
I like this idea. Have t2 be better than the t1 standard, but make the named t1 mods have their enhanced bonus better than t2 and their lowered bonus worse than t1 standard. I always thought there should be more to the different mod types.
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Zubakis
Bambooule
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Posted - 2007.02.20 22:25:00 -
[6]
I was thinking of a similar idea. Giving best named items
higher fitting requirements and best stats. T1 standard
versions would have lesser fitting requirements and worst
stats.
It's partly implemented but not at all modules.
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Katrina Coreli
Soar Angelic
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Posted - 2007.02.20 23:18:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Zubakis
I was thinking of a similar idea. Giving best named items
higher fitting requirements and best stats. T1 standard
versions would have lesser fitting requirements and worst
stats.
It's partly implemented but not at all modules.
Im not realy in favour of making tech 2 defunct and boosting Best named above it, however if named modules had one atribute better than tech 2 then there would be more reason to think about your setup rather than slapping on tech 2 wherever you can
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Vampie
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Posted - 2007.02.20 23:25:00 -
[8]
To the OP, you claim that "However given the power of tech 2 over tech 1 Tech 1 guns automatically become defunct so long as you have the isk to afford them. Tech 2 doesnt realy add anything more to the game, they are in essence just advanced versions of Tech 1."
have you even checked the markets? Best named guns and other modules are more expensive (usually) or the same price as T2.
Forge Region:
425mm Prototype I Gauss Rail - 14.8mil low price to 22.5mil high price
425mm Railgun II - 13.3mil to 20mil
150mm Prototype I Gauss Rail - 1mil to 1.8mil
150mm Railgun II - 995k to 1.8mil
Arby Siege Launchers - 4mil to 6 mil
Siege Launcher T2 - 4mil to 10mil
Local Hull cargo Expander I - 10mil to 20mil
Cargo Expander II - 9mil to 20mil
T1 items, specialy best named are not cheaper than T2 items, if you are lucky, they may cost you the same, usualy they cost more than T2. This gets even more marked the larger the guns get, since it would require a very long time to specialize, therefore more people use the best named versions.
Also please remember that it is incredibly hard to fit a full rack of largest guns for size in T2 flavour on pretty much any ship, most often you have to sacrifice low slots for fitting modules just to be able to fit the guns, at which point, you may be better off using the best named T1 and a damage mod to make up for the damage difference.
I dont have much love for T2 manufacturers, but guns are the one field in which their prices actualy make sense, since as can you see, t2 guns are either cheaper or the same as best named t1.
Now, if you talking about T2 ships, than yah, T2 is far more expensive than T1......
Vampie
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Katrina Coreli
Soar Angelic
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Posted - 2007.02.21 07:57:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Katrina Coreli on 21/02/2007 07:55:22
When i talk about tech 1 in this context i mean vanilla tech 1 not named. I am well aware that people fit named guns for fitting issues but the fact still remains that appart from fitting there is no real reason to chose Tech 1 / Named over Tech 2.
I wa mearly proposing an idea by where a player could think more about their setup rather than putting on tech 2 if they have the skills and it will fit or the best named they can afford if tech 2 wont fit.
For a hypothetical example i have spare Pg and Cpu on by Brutix and i am going for the max damage i can wiht 7 tech 2 Ions. I could chose to swap out the 7 Tech 2 Ions for 7 Prototype Ion Blasters which would us more fitting but would afford me even more damage than even Tech 2 which could be suitable for what i want to do with a setup.
I dont belive price is an acurate estimate of how useful an item is, it is often a good guide line but if best named items are costlier than tech 2 there are several possible reaons for this
1. People can not use the tech 2 items in question
2. They are not significantly worse than Tech 2 with a lower fitting etc
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Pinky Denmark
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Posted - 2007.02.21 08:32:00 -
[10]
If you find a T2 siege launcher for 4m or close plz let me know... 
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Adril Alatar
Minmatar
Galactic Shipyards Inc
HUZZAH FEDERATION
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Posted - 2007.02.21 09:03:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Katrina Coreli
the fact still remains that appart from fitting there is no real reason to chose Tech 1 / Named over Tech 2.
T2 modules:
- more fitting then best named t1
- more skills then best named t1
- some modules are better then best named t1, some not
so you want named modules that need less fitting, less skills and are better than t2?
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Katrina Coreli
Soar Angelic
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Posted - 2007.02.21 17:45:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Katrina Coreli on 21/02/2007 17:41:36
Originally by: Adril Alatar
so you want named modules that need less fitting, less skills and are better than t2?
In one respect yes, but I think it would be nice if every named module was better than tech 2 in one atribute, for example re fire rate and all the others would be at tech 1 baisic level apart from the one atrib that is penalised.
Tech 2 is still better in almost everyway but it would offer more customisation as far as fitting is concerned aswell as lowering tech 2 prices, potentialy.
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Kazuo Ishiguro
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Posted - 2007.02.21 18:16:00 -
[13]
To a certain extent, faction & officer modules already allow people to do this - for instance, the Gistii A-type 1mn Microwarpdrive is the best of its type in the game, but it requires 18mw compared to only 15mw for the T2 equivalent. There are many other examples of this.
I quite like things the way they are 
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Top speed calculation spreadsheet - feedback welcome :) |
Kehmor
Caldari
PAK
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Posted - 2007.02.21 18:38:00 -
[14]
i have an idea, why don't we make civilian mods the ebst, so i can pwn vets on my first day.
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Bronson Hughes
Caldari
Knights of the Wild
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Posted - 2007.02.21 19:21:00 -
[15]
To some extent the type of variation yuo speak of is already present. Take a look at heavy missile launchers:
The Advanced 'Limos' Heavy Missile Bay has a higher RoF and missile capacity than the 'Malkuth' Heavy Missile Launcher, but the Malkuth requires less CPU to fit than the Limos. So do you use up all of your CPU on the better launchers or save some and fit another BCS? And Faction/Officer gear adds even more variety.
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