I would like to call upon the opinions of players, particularly PVP players with regards self-sufficiency. Be it your own corpGÇÖs or alliances doctrines which may be expensive, or when looking for a new corp and they announce that you must be self-sufficient in your isk making which essentially means no SRP. How do you efficiently make your ISK? I realise that is a question that none will answer in any detail but IGÇÖll throw this post out there on the off chance.

Let say for example you want, or your corp doctrine dictates you have a ship that costs between 300m and 400m to buy and fit. Some people see that as pocket change, but for others it is quite an investment. How do you get to a level where that kind of expenditure is OK to do without thinking that you have to spend hours doing a random PVE task (mining, industry, ratting, exploration) in order to make that money back should the ship explode into a thousand pixels.

I have 2 accounts, with 6 toons and my main source of income is PI, I live in a WH so the planets are pretty good, that nets me between 800 / 900m a month gross, skim a bit off for poco taxes and other costs as well as time and I suppose I have about 750 to 850m per month in my wallet, now I do not PVP that much and if I do it tends to be in cheaper T1 cruisers.

But say I wanted to PVP in a ship costing 350m, if I lose 3 of those in a month (yeah I am bad at pvp) I am running at a loss. I donGÇÖt really rat anymore but when I did in null I was making maybe 50m a site inc salvaging, that would take maybe 20/25 minutes. So approx. 100m an hour, 3.5hours to make the isk to get the ship. It just seems like a lot of time to get the isk to get that level of ship.

Some people of course have good knowledge of markets and trade, some know how to research markets for industry, and there are of course other ways to make isk, and that my fellow capsuleers is what I am trying to discover.

I make 2.8b per month per account (3 toons 6 planets each all relevant PI skills at V)

You are doing PI wrong... It is my main income, and I do have more than 1 account as well...

The only way to do PI right is to call in the holy Inquisition to perform exterminatus on the whole planet and then move on.



Expect to make somewhere around 100-250 million isk per pilot on PI per month. Depending on how much of you Eve time you want to spend on PI (the less the better)

If you want to make isk then put an Ishtar alt into some null sec entity that has sov and do low effort nullsec sites. It's a good income because it allows you to make isk independently of where you yourself are operating.


And honestly. 350 million isk ships? That is ridiculously expensive for run of the mill pvp. You need to move on to ships you can afford to lose. Have you tried T3 destroyers? They are very strong, mobile and not very expensive.

Use your alts for exactly what they are trained for. Any additional SP gained can be sold at 300mil per injector.

Hadn't thought of SP farming

I have 2 accounts, with 6 toons and my main source of income is PI, I live in a WH so the planets are pretty good, that nets me between 800 / 900m a month gross.....

Come to think of it, I haven't earned money in two years...

How the hell do I do it!???

PvE not for me

Dunno, if you wanna share though, feel free :)

800-900mil/month should be PER character so I dont know what you are talking about that you cannot afford a 350mil isk ship every month.



You should feel bad for this entire thread. Not only are you bragging but you are also whining and trolling.

plex, much like myself he cba grinding

800m-900m/month from 6 PI characters, in a wormhole? you're doing it wrong.

Are you selling P1, P2, P3 or P4 planetary products? Seriously, you need to have a good look at your setups, I average >400m/month/character from PI.

You live in a WH, have you thought about setting up production for T3 components? Gas harvesting can be very profitable.

Paid for plex with cash? thats kinda the oppsoite of how I want to do it, if I plex I want to earn the isk in game to buy game time, not buy plex to sell for isk.

Another option is to review the doctrine and see if there is a niche role you can fufill at a lower cost. For example, yes a HAC or BS may cost 500 mil and be a good addition to the front line. However, an interceptor or interdictor can be just as valuable but cost a fraction of the dps ship. Or you could opt to provide EWAR support in the form of a black bird or celestis.

Now granted, this may not work in all scenarios. The above suggest work for PvP but may not help in PvE. Still, in PvE a t1 logi cruiser may be a cheap and useful option you could use. An assault frig could take out smaller rats, letting the bigger ships focus on the larger ones.

In other words, don't assume there are not cheap options that could compliment existing comps. It just may be you have to find this niche.

Ah, but the question becomes how do you value your time. In some cases people make enough money in real life with limited game tima that they woukd prefer to enjoy PvP and purchase plex to afford ships.

Paid for plex with cash? thats kinda the oppsoite of how I want to do it, if I plex I want to earn the isk in game to buy game time, not buy plex to sell for isk.

to each their own, i value my in-game time quite highly,
i spend a little extra every now and again (when i have the disposable income) to forgo unnecessary grinding.

Tried gas, bored me more than ratting tbh, I may retry to see how lucrative it is, we (as in my corp) do Ninja huffing from time to time. production seems time consuming, I dont have my own POS with a industry setup .

Out of interest, what kind of ships (value) do you fly, ie how long does that plex last you?

both blingy and dirt cheap, and a fairly long time, often ill get some of the isk back if a liquidate stuff.

granted iv found my feet and know how to keep my stuff alive (for the most part),
i was hemorrhaging money when i was learning though so that was almost exclusively cheap stuff

SO, kids. If you PvP, lol, you're losing MONEY. You HAVE to go out eventually and
EARN IT LIKE THE CAREBEARS!!

Whoopsy. I feel soooooo very neglected.

I'm actually making my money via pvp... Though I just noticed this isn't my main.

It's easy to get more back in isk than you lose. You just have to do a little planning beforehand.

" Out of interest, what kind of ships (value) do you fly, ie how long does that plex last you?"


Look at my kb. I mostly fly solo battleships

After insurance, the cost is around 140mil per bs.

With my limited time, my plex money lasts me all month. And I fly pretty crazy

You could easily fly smart and earn enuff in t1 cruisers just looting wrecks, picking up drones, to sustain you indefinatly.

Whoopsy. I feel soooooo very neglected.

Unless you're selling plex, or having money handed to you so you can fight, behind every successful pvp pilot is a personal money empire. Some of us are crazy enough to eat where we sh*t. That's what living in and defending sov null is like. In my first year of EVE I had to run incursions to play the game for free. Then I started developing money alts that paid for themselves.

Personally I would not join a group, requiring me to lose and pay for ships more often, than I'm casually being able to replace. Without such a group self-sufficiency is quite easy, because you can always define your own investment and with whom and how you fly. My focus is on T3D and below (price wise), hence I can afford to regularly lose 100m ships. My somewhat steady income source is PvP loot / clone tags, and currently a good part from manufacturing. Additionally if I'm getting bored of PvP from time to time I do relic exploration. I tried almost everything including incursions, and didn't like PvE with low but steady income, it feels too much like work. I much prefer all the chance based income sources including market opportunities.

It's nothing fancy
Just a record of a good ol boy having fun

IGÇÖve lived in null, before I had my 2nd account, I used to go out a rat mainly, 25/30 minutes I think it was forsaken havens I used to do (I cannot recall for sure) and I used to pull in maybe 50m but I used to drop MTU to salvage etc (it may have been less than that but letGÇÖs say 50m

And that is the basis around my question, let say it take me 30 mins to make 50m by ratting, if I buy and lose a 300m ship, that is 3 hours to make that money back, if my game time is 4 hours then I am spending 75% of my time ratting to do 25% of PVP and I am.

In my corp I wouldnGÇÖt be covered for that ship in a solo capacity but if I was doctrine and on a fleet I would but my query was more around that GÇ£must be isk efficientGÇ¥ notifications that I see on certain recruitment posts, if you had to be 100% isk efficient to buy doctrine ships, some of which can be expensive then doing 50m every 30 minutes just aint gonna cut it.

As well as myself who has a fairly large bank balance I was thinking about new guys to the game in general and thinking that it is the isk making rather than lack of skills (as it seems a reason for new players not feeling engaged is the SP gap) that maybe drives new players away.

I think this is way I am currently, or at least want to to go. personally I am flying T1 cruisers at the moment so my loses are sub 50m, my PI gives me more than enough currently, I will get onto T3D but the fact that they are so overpowered in fact puts me off a little (perhaps I am a glutton for punishment)

I do exploration too which from a WH base is pretty good in C2 and below WHs as well as the multiple low/null sec exit we get.

As i say though, my group does SRP, my query is outside of that, I would not join a group... indeed I left one, where although the hull was SRPd the fitting were not and some doctrine ships were 650m, way above my comfort zone.

So your corp asks you to be self-sufficient and fly doctrines, what do you get in return? Eve is a game of actions and consequences. Those that say PVP is nothing bit an ISK sink have never defended anything of actual value. Something that, for instance, would enable a corp / alliance to at least support their members to get into those ships. Anything between local markets and actual pre-fitted fleets ready to be insured and boarded.

Let's say that your corp holds a few POCO's and your tax is 0%. Or holds an area where good PVE content is found. Utilize that space. If your corp is effective at driving out competitors the sites are yours. Members profit. Yeah, you can tell people to "go run incursions" or something like that but it requires them to flutter about. The conquest game is also about shaping the universe itself to your group's advantage. You don't get to run good sites in bling ships without making other people think twice about entering your living space.

That is pretty good money, I hear that the ships used are very blingy and expensive though, way above the example costs I was using. And thinking beyond myself to new players the EvE that would take them a pretty substantial training queue and ISK investment to get into, but certainly an option for me that I may look into, thanks.

I have 2 accounts, with 6 toons and my main source of income is PI

PI isn't supposed to be a main income. It's supposed to be passive extra income on the side while you do your real job.

How do you efficiently make your ISK?

Miktek, I myself am also unsure as how to determine a corp's culture looking from the outside in. Fact is tho... corps need people. People don't need corps. OR alliances. If leadership never gives anything back, that group will eventually disintegrate. I've never met a player that didn't like the idea of not having to risk his own ship in a stratop. We're not the biggest corp, but nobody ever left because they felt we drained their wallet with PVP demands. It's silly and would have lost us people. But I'm telling this from a lowsec pespective, where the money isn't free and system security doesn't exist.