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Crystal Starbreeze
Happy Hungry Hippos
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Posted - 2007.02.27 22:54:00 -
[1]
I posted this in another thread but almost feel it deserves its own attention. I love this idea
Too gain the eve universe trust that MC are truely independant they should hold a PUBLIC AUCTION for their services. Offer the auction in two weeks. This would force the coalitions to get organized and come up with a incentive package each alliance is willign to wager and estimated value in which they are willing to bid for their service against BOB. This would be entirely public, no hidden agreements so everybody knows the price and what each alliance/friends are willing to wager. BOB and the Coalition/north bid and counterbid until the best offer wins. This would be extremely profitable for MC I imagine and the wining bidder gets MC help till either side wins.
I think it would be fun and if outside bids would be accepted into the total winning side the pot grows bigger and bigger. For example I want to sweeten the offer for MCS help with the North by adding to the initial offer 200m isk out of my own pocket and 3 battleships say. I would be able to pledge my support and assuming a winning bid i would be obligated to give MC financial offer my bid. We would have to work on neutral escrow party and maybe with CCP help it could be fair and scam free.
It would take a bit of planning but would be fun, ensure fairness and educational. Yeah logistics wise might be an issue but I would be willing to help planning something like this.
What do you think ...inovative or extremly bad idea
The more i think about the only winner in this is MC really. I know lots of people that arent affiliated with major alliances but wish they could afford Mercs to attack BOB. this would allow these small corps, etc to get involved that together have the resources but alone do not. It would have to be entirely public.
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Dionisius
Gallente Vagabundos THE H0RDE
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Posted - 2007.02.27 23:10:00 -
[2]
You are assuming they feel the need to appear independant or not.
Anyways seems like a nice ideia...maybe. _______________________
What we have here is total lack of respect for the law...
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Crystal Starbreeze
Happy Hungry Hippos
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Posted - 2007.02.27 23:20:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Crystal Starbreeze on 27/02/2007 23:19:14 Regardless if they need to appear independent or not i think the combined offers they would receive would be too good to pass up.
Im just one person that would gladly donate to a war fund and my friends are like me. If only half of the people that post on EVEO on these politics put a small sum of money towards the action the POT would grow HUGE. Compound that with bids from small corporations, combined bids from the large allaince currently involved. The monetary, equipment, etc gain would grow astounding. Let alone a public process and MC is the only one that still maintains trust even thought their neutrality is in question.
The more advertisement the bigger the pot. Even noobs that got popped by BOB and only have 50m isk might be willing to throw 20m isk into the pot...small change yes but the universe together...the possibilities are endless.
I really think it would boost morale universe wide as people start to slip into BOB is too powerful, there is nothing that can be done. Miners, noobs, small corps everybody can have their part in hiring the best MERC corporation.
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Liu Kaskakka
PAK
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Posted - 2007.02.27 23:22:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Crystal Starbreeze MC is the only one that still maintains trust even thought their neutrality is in question.
How would they maintain trust if they would stab bob in the back now that they've said they've been hired by bob?
King Liu is RIGHT!!
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Dachtor
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Posted - 2007.02.27 23:24:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Dachtor on 27/02/2007 23:21:09 delete
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Crystal Starbreeze
Happy Hungry Hippos
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Posted - 2007.02.27 23:25:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Crystal Starbreeze on 27/02/2007 23:23:38 It would be public for BOB to bid as well. Contract is being renegotiated it isnt breakign trust. It is a hostile takeover bid by the north, friends, other that BOB has to counter. There would be no lost trust
Remember its all business. Its a win win for MC. Regain neutrality, maintain trust and make a buttload of money
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Liu Kaskakka
PAK
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Posted - 2007.02.27 23:30:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Crystal Starbreeze Contract is being renegotiated it isnt breakign trust. It is a hostile takeover bid by the north, friends, other that BOB has to counter. There would be no lost trust
Not breaking trust? ^_^
Bobsies> Hey, we just paid you big iskies! MCs> stfu, the other guys are gonna pay bigger iskies!
King Liu is RIGHT!!
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Crystal Starbreeze
Happy Hungry Hippos
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Posted - 2007.02.27 23:33:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Crystal Starbreeze on 27/02/2007 23:32:47 I would assume to maintian trust MC would refund the deal and BOB could bid the same amount in their bid for MC help. I think this idea scares BOB as the combined hatred, fear whatever toward them they would not be able to compete.
Key word in renegotiation not steal the isk and ask for more. Its business
Quote: In Seleene's own words Even despite the fact that BoB are the best business partners weÆve ever had, I honestly hoped that someone might give us the opportunity to ôprove the Mob wrongö. That really would have been pretty neat to see. However, ultimately, all that matters to us is, ôWho is the highest bidder?ö The answer to that is self-apparent.
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Der Pfaffe
KIA Corp KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2007.02.27 23:38:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Crystal Starbreeze Edited by: Crystal Starbreeze on 27/02/2007 23:23:38 It would be public for BOB to bid as well. Contract is being renegotiated it isnt breakign trust. It is a hostile takeover bid by the north, friends, other that BOB has to counter. There would be no lost trust
Remember its all business. Its a win win for MC. Regain neutrality, maintain trust and make a buttload of money
If you read MC's posts I think you'll find that while ISK plays a part in whether they accept a contract or not, they also need a plan, apart from "keel zem all".
Secondly anonymity if often requested by the client. Obviously a public auction would negate this.
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Crystal Starbreeze
Happy Hungry Hippos
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Posted - 2007.02.27 23:42:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Crystal Starbreeze on 27/02/2007 23:39:34 Anominity could be worked in. I am unsure how MC deals with that. Say I didnt want my name attached to the bid. My bid would go into that sides database of offers/pledges as anonymous. MC would know who to collect from. The amounts though must be made public. Like i said logistics need work but I dont think its impossible.
Plan. I think the plan is simple. Take BOB space. Complete destruction of all POS and takeover of all starbases. Regarldless the amount of isk MC could easily make from an auction like this im usure their strategic commanders could work up a plan with coaltion forces after the fact
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Omber Zombie
Gallente Frontier Technologies
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Posted - 2007.02.27 23:43:00 -
[11]
i offer 1.5trillion isk in assets for you all to STFU, stop posting, and get in game and shoot stuff. ----------------------
FTEK | Production ~ Research ~ Sales ~ Election Fixing |
Boliknar
The Shadow Order Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2007.02.27 23:53:00 -
[12]
This whole thread is silly...No one who has been involved in the political scene for more than a few days buys the whole "We are MC. We are neutral". Line of crap. They fight along side BoB or is allies exclusively. So it would not matter that there would be a public auction they would simpily say thet BoB and friends were the highest bidder regardless of the facts.
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Crystal Starbreeze
Happy Hungry Hippos
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Posted - 2007.02.28 00:33:00 -
[13]
Please lets not turn this into another MC are not neutral post. This was to discuss the option of a public auction. Seemed like a good idea to me and my acquaintances that are too small to make a difference in the war and do not have monetary means to hire a merc corp the quality of MC. There are tons like us that would like to get involved but neither have the money, time, skill, whatever to get involved in a large part...but together we just might be able to make a difference.
I really doubt that MC would not take a better offer. Everybody has a price
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Qolde
Minmatar Rising Knights SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2007.02.28 01:50:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Boliknar This whole thread is silly...No one who has been involved in the political scene for more than a few days buys the whole "We are MC. We are neutral". Line of crap. They fight along side BoB or is allies exclusively. So it would not matter that there would be a public auction they would simpily say thet BoB and friends were the highest bidder regardless of the facts.
Ok, I thought i was the only one thinking this.
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Stamm
Amarr Three Holdings Rule of Three
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Posted - 2007.02.28 01:51:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Omber Zombie i offer 1.5trillion isk in assets for you all to STFU, stop posting, and get in game and shoot stuff.
ROFL. Got to agree with Mr Zombie here. I too pledge his assets if you all shut up.
Galaxian Recruitment Info |
Akov Stohs
Caldari FATAL REVELATIONS FATAL Alliance
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Posted - 2007.02.28 02:29:00 -
[16]
Anything less then 4 Outposts, and the Deathstars to support such things.
Think thats worth like what...(35000 * 4 + 200 * 30) = 146 Billion Isk worth of Assets...
So to make it fair...170 Billion Isk Minimum Bid for MC vs Bob?
or was it 3 outposts?
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Ikarushka
Gallente A.O.U. Corp
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Posted - 2007.02.28 02:44:00 -
[17]
That assumes that siding with either side would cost the same ammount of isk, which is not the case I bet
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Dark Shikari
Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.02.28 02:54:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Liu Kaskakka
Originally by: Crystal Starbreeze MC is the only one that still maintains trust even thought their neutrality is in question.
How would they maintain trust if they would stab bob in the back now that they've said they've been hired by bob?
Yeah, it seems like this idea is a few days too late, unfortunately.
The other issue is how you could prevent alliances from making joke bids.
EVE-Trance Radio--The EVE Textboard |
Herculite
Hunters Agency Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.02.28 03:17:00 -
[19]
From what I gather, the key issue is you need a PLAN that MC accepts.
I don't think the BoB leaders just said 'Fight the zerg, here is money.'
You had MC attacked by the zerglings which itself holds 'value' as well as I would assume a plan from BoB for what they need MC to do in the war. MC would have to weigh what a sides chance was as well. I don't think they would commit suicide just for isk.
If you were MC, attacked by AAA and friends, thought BoB would win, are already assumed to be 'pro-bob' and then BoB comes at you with a plan and a giant pile of isk, how could you say no?
An open bid might have been fun to see, especially since it would have included assets as big as outposts and constellations, but I think the outcome was clear, not because of bias, but because no other alliance can offer MC what BoB can. Hell to even EQUAL the starting bid, D2 would have to give the value of MC static assets in PB. Thats a spicy meatball.
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Exortius Amarrus
The Clearwater Society Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.02.28 03:19:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Herculite If you were MC, attacked by AAA and friends, thought BoB would win, are already assumed to be 'pro-bob' and then BoB comes at you with a plan and a giant pile of isk, how could you say no?
QFT ------------------------ Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed dimensions of 400*120 pixels -Conuion Meow ([email protected]) |
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Pallidum Treponema
KIA Corp KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2007.02.28 06:37:00 -
[21]
The fun thing in all of this is that it's not like MC *haven't* given out the complete recepie for taking on a contract against BoB several times already. They've essentially lined up step-by-step HOWTOs in Contracting MC 101. <-- Note! Bloody Obvious! Note!
To be honest, it's damn simple. Right now, the coalitions have a great chance to take out BoB. A much better chance than anyone's ever had. What they need to do is sit down, think out a long term plan, work in potential allies, potential enemies and what to do if either of them changes sides. And more importantly, how to make them change sides.
For example: "Gee, these FIX guys are gonna be tough to beat, how about we offer them a deal to make them fight WITH us for a change?" or "Perhaps we need help removing Xelas from that chokepoint system. Let's hire those mercs and give them the xelas outpost for their trouble."
BoB knows how to think long-term. They're damn good strategists. That's one of the biggest reasons for why they're doing so good. If the coalition is to defeat BoB, they need to think long-term in the same way.
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King Storm
Caldari Pfex Privat Corp
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Posted - 2007.02.28 09:21:00 -
[22]
Well, it does not really work like that.... as the contracts are considerably different.
It might very well be that to accept a contract against BOB, the price has to be a few times higher .. just because BOB has a lot of experience in PvP and killing and poping structures and cap ships... have a logistic advantage in the area... might have good knowledge of MC tactics, and let us not forget that MC would have to charge for 4 new Stations in some other part of the galaxy and for a compensation of going throw the table to move in the first place....
So... a public auction... , unless it is regulated, aka bid increase is made by depositing the stated sum to an escrow, it is just flame bate and MC's decision would be highly debatable.
And let us not forget.. why does anyone think that they have some sort of say in how MC does THERE business.
It is there responsibility to look out for themselves.. not ours.
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Smagd
Encina Technologies Namtz'aar k'in
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Posted - 2007.02.28 11:15:00 -
[23]
Well I wasn't really planning to post anything in this whole mess but "Have a good Pew Pew everyone!" - which would be a bit redundant of course - but what you bring up is what I secretly thought myself:
MC terms ask you to approach them with a battle plan and then they fix your price for you, with a guarantee of non-disclosure on their part.
Doesn't that seem to favour their friends just a little maybe?
For one thing, they'll probably be talking to each other already and have a much better idea on what's an acceptable plan, and for another: What stops the MC from charging non-friends (neutrals, or past enemies) 50x over? And nobody gets upset because past contracts won't be disclosed.
Please note that I didn't say their contractor needs to be disclosed, but a better idea on what sort of plans are available at what cost would probably go a long way towards making me a little less paranoid about their motives.
Of course it's their prerogative to claim neutrality and rely on everyone's trust. They do have an impressive reputation, and good politicians have been successfully doing this since the beginning of time.
Family Tahar, of Clan Hadar, of Caravan of Namtz'Aar K'in |
Gericault m0id
Contention Inc
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Posted - 2007.02.28 12:53:00 -
[24]
You miss the point. MC is not, has not and will never be independent from BoB as long as the latter is around. They are minions and Seleene is in denial. Not only should their overt actions over the past few years indicate this, but check out the flow of pilots flip-flopping between these two alliances. It's one huge gang bang and the greatest trick they ever pulled was to convince most of EVE that they are separate entities.
Wake up.
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HatePeace LoveWar
Amarr FATAL REVELATIONS FATAL Alliance
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Posted - 2007.02.28 13:00:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Omber Zombie i offer 1.5trillion isk in assets for you all to STFU, stop posting, and get in game and shoot stuff.
Eve vs WoW |
Cabadrin
Caldari Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.02.28 13:24:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Cabadrin on 28/02/2007 13:22:07 Just FYI, the way we ensure anonymity is through trust, and by restricting the client's identity to as few people as possible. We also trust our clients to not betray us, and to pay on time.
I can also say that I have never quoted different prices to any client because of their political affiliation. What changes prices is the scope of the operations. We'll fight to the death in our capital fleet if you pay us enough.
I understand trust is a hard commodity to come by in Eve, but it's something we have in ourselves and our employers, whoever they may be.
We hope that the Eve universe can trust us as we trust them. _______________________________________________
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Redbad
Minmatar Be Inspired Inc.
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Posted - 2007.02.28 14:51:00 -
[27]
They are "engaged" atm.
join us today! |
Blade AOI
Caldari Out of Order
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Posted - 2007.02.28 15:34:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Blade AOI on 28/02/2007 15:31:15 We tried to hire(IMP) MC vs BOB before they said no because it would be a conflict of intrest.
MC are owned and operated By BOB alts. if you try and get them to be friendly pay them tons of money who says they will not just turn around and give it to BOB.
Better yet what if they pretend they are on your side then onces the fighting really gets started they flip...
I trust MC like i trust the developers in BOB.
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Crystal Starbreeze
Happy Hungry Hippos
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Posted - 2007.02.28 18:02:00 -
[29]
OK i think what i am hearing is bad idea, slightly inovative but way too many logistical, trust issues to be tackled by the current maturity of the eve-o forums.
Since this post has degenerated into yet another MC is BOB alts / MC has never been Neutral i request that this post be locked
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Grim Faust
Kinetic Vector Freelancer Alliance
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Posted - 2007.02.28 19:59:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Grim Faust on 28/02/2007 19:58:27 MC was hired by BoB and I highly doubt that will change. The fact that not one offer crossed their path from anyone other than BoB also speaks volumes. MC has pretty much been branded with the affiliation of BoB and quite frankly I don't think they could be fully trusted to be given ISK to fight BoB. I'm willing to wager there has been friendships formed between BoB and MC members and I'd have a hard time beleiving information on MC's contract against BoB wouldn't be leaked to BoB on a day to day basis as to what's going down.
MC constantly speaks of being neutral yet to take on BoB they would require obscene amounts of ISK. Tactically they may have a point to charge large sums, but if they were smart they'd also realize they pretty much cornered themself to never being hired against BoB due to the exorbitant amount they'd expect to fight against BoB. It's kinda like saying, Yeah, we'll fight BoB!... ... when pigs fly! It could happen, right?
It makes you wonder that if they base their contractual incentives off of the supposed risk to themself, how much exactly BoB payed them to fight in the biggest war to hit Eve which is showing the odds actually at their worst for BoB. Or maybe MC just took a lower bid than what would be required to cover their losses because they know no one on the coalition side really see's a point in hiring MC with the sheer numbers and force they already have. It kinda leaves MC in a sore spot. You either wait for BoB to go down and wonder what will happen to your home or help defend it. Which in turn, looks a lot like loyalty and survival on the contrary to neutrality.
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Rancid Beef
Shadow Gypsies R i s e
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Posted - 2007.02.28 21:12:00 -
[31]
What if, now bare with me here this is a totally unique concept, MC and it's pilots don't give a flyn F what the public thinks? But rather act in their own best interests... I know insane thought sorry.
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Grim Faust
Kinetic Vector Freelancer Alliance
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Posted - 2007.02.28 21:49:00 -
[32]
MC can do as they please, as always. It's just amusing how faux-surprised they were when no one wanted them in this war aside thier good old buddies, BoB. No kidding they're going to side with them in Eve's largest war yet. No one offered them squat so that leaves them with 2 options, sit there and do nothing and risk losing their home if BoB falls leaving their rented space under new management or they help BoB because they know their own home is at stake as well. If you ask me, BoB shouldn't have payed MC a dime, it's not as if it's not in MC's interest to protect their already attacked space.
BoB, unless you guys payed MC in hugs and good-will, you got ripped off. MC needs you just as much as you need them. __________________________________________________
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Nez Perces
Amarr Black Spot.
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Posted - 2007.02.28 21:59:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Rancid Beef What if, now bare with me here this is a totally unique concept, MC and it's pilots don't give a flyn F what the public thinks? But rather act in their own best interests... I know insane thought sorry.
Well this entirely depends on whether MC are mercenaries or not.....
If they are not, then correct. They don't need to give a flyin' F about what the public thinks.
However, if they are mercenaries then they need to project an image. An image that MC has been cultivating very carefully for at the last two years via videos, forum threads, battle reports, tailored signatures etc.. etc.. etc.... MC have projected a carefully coiffured image onto the EVE-O forums and for a good while they had us all eating out of the palm of their hands.
This big war has changed all that... nobody is buying the "MC image" anymore or at least those that do are limited to immediate allies (FIX, BoB and maybe their other "mercenary" pals Executive Outcomes).. thats not a very large pool of employers really is it?
So either MC are mercenaries and by default have to care about what *we* think about them... or they are not mercenaries and you are correct.
My money is on you being correct.
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Peanut Swsh
Antares Fleet Yards SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2007.03.01 08:53:00 -
[34]
Are we all assuming that the coalition actually want MC. From what i have seen, most people saw the MC to be on BOB side even before they were officially hired. And would really prefer to crush MC along with BOB. And it was pretty obvious that MC had set an impossible price to turn against their masters. Really who else could have offered them a cushy seat in the middle of what was/is the biggest most powerful alliance ingame.
The MC wouldn't take a contract vs BOB until it was obvious that BOB were in decline and another alliance had taken their top spot. And whatever people may think about how strong the coalition is, in the minds of MC/BOB they are still the strongest alliance/coalition/whatever ingame.
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Shirei
Minmatar Cutting Edge Incorporated
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Posted - 2007.03.01 08:57:00 -
[35]
How about calling MC privateers instead?
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