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Pilgrim vs. Rapier - solo piracy

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VJ Maverick Caldari Maverick Specialized Services	Posted - 2007.03.08 03:37:00 - [1] Which one? Discuss!
DubanFP Caldari Four Rings Myriad Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.08 03:39:00 - [2] Rapier is better against one target "more sucessful with a proper setup", however because you have to wait till the enemy runs out of cap normally you're more prone to his friends showing up and ganking you. __________________________
VJ Maverick Caldari Maverick Specialized Services	Posted - 2007.03.08 03:40:00 - [3] Originally by: DubanFP Rapier is better against one target "more sucessful with a proper setup", however because you have to wait till the enemy runs out of cap normally you're more prone to his friends showing up and ganking you. So Pilgrim kills faster?
DubanFP Caldari Four Rings Myriad Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.08 03:42:00 - [4] Originally by: VJ Maverick Originally by: DubanFP Rapier is better against one target "more sucessful with a proper setup", however because you have to wait till the enemy runs out of cap normally you're more prone to his friends showing up and ganking you. So Pilgrim kills faster? DPS is similer, but the pilgrim will suck out thier cap, and they can't shield boost/armor rep without it. Where a Rapier can easily dictate range with it's web bonus leading to not getting hit, but the enemies cap has to run out normally before you can bust im'. __________________________
VJ Maverick Caldari Maverick Specialized Services	Posted - 2007.03.08 03:52:00 - [5] Originally by: DubanFP Originally by: VJ Maverick Originally by: DubanFP Rapier is better against one target "more sucessful with a proper setup", however because you have to wait till the enemy runs out of cap normally you're more prone to his friends showing up and ganking you. So Pilgrim kills faster? DPS is similer, but the pilgrim will suck out thier cap, and they can't shield boost/armor rep without it. Where a Rapier can easily dictate range with it's web bonus leading to not getting hit, but the enemies cap has to run out normally before you can bust im'. I actually considered that. "Snare/Root" or "Life Drain" - both great things. Too bad I can't have both. Do you think it would be wise to use Neut drones with the Rapier to speed things up a bit?
DubanFP Caldari Four Rings Myriad Alliance	Posted - 2007.03.08 03:54:00 - [6] Originally by: VJ Maverick Do you think it would be wise to use Neut drones with the Rapier to speed things up a bit? Definately not since artillery "to take advantage of the ranged webifiers" has such low DPS you really need to squeez all the DPS out of your drones possible. __________________________
VJ Maverick Caldari Maverick Specialized Services	Posted - 2007.03.08 04:19:00 - [7] So how is a Rapier better against single targets then?
Marcus Druallis Quantum Industries Prime Orbital Systems	Posted - 2007.03.08 04:29:00 - [8] Not sure, but the ability to dictate range with the webbers? -- Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes - Devil ([email protected])
VJ Maverick Caldari Maverick Specialized Services	Posted - 2007.03.08 04:49:00 - [9] Originally by: DubanFP Originally by: VJ Maverick Do you think it would be wise to use Neut drones with the Rapier to speed things up a bit? Definately not since artillery "to take advantage of the ranged webifiers" has such low DPS you really need to squeez all the DPS out of your drones possible. Really? I thought Arties had decent damage.
king jks New Age Solutions New Age Solutions Amalgamated	Posted - 2007.03.08 06:58:00 - [10] I'd take a pilgrim any day tbh. ------------------------ Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds. -Albert Einstein
Batelle	Posted - 2007.03.08 07:57:00 - [11] Originally by: VJ Maverick I actually considered that. "Snare/Root" or "Life Drain" - both great things. I cancelled my WoW subscription for a reason. Say "Web" and "Nos."
Exus Die Trying	Posted - 2007.03.08 08:28:00 - [12] Originally by: Batelle Originally by: VJ Maverick I actually considered that. "Snare/Root" or "Life Drain" - both great things. I cancelled my WoW subscription for a reason. Say "Web" and "Nos." rofl òò
Commoner Caldari Emergent Chaos The Core Collective	Posted - 2007.03.08 08:37:00 - [13] Originally by: Batelle Originally by: VJ Maverick I actually considered that. "Snare/Root" or "Life Drain" - both great things. I cancelled my WoW subscription for a reason. Say "Web" and "Nos." Actually the quote has merit. It has on numerous times been that cap == life. So it's kinda true...
Aramendel Amarr Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.03.08 11:19:00 - [14] Personally I would rather pick the rapier. My problem with the pilgrim is it's low range. Once you have a ship outside your nos range (12k unless you use faction nosses) which is faster than you and which can kill your drones before they can kill it you are pretty much dead, so it's no good vs multiple targets. Also, if you fight vs a target which has a scrambler and which isn't sucked dry yet (which can take quite some time with BSs and BCs) and local fills up you are usually dead because you cannot disengage. The main difference between both ships is their target range. The rapier is better vs frig targets, the pilgrim better vs BS targets, both are about equally good vs cruisers. But the rapiers higher operational range allows it to contral the battlefield to a much greater extend than the pilgrim.
Zakgram Atomic Heroes The OSS	Posted - 2007.03.08 11:35:00 - [15] Originally by: Aramendel My problem with the pilgrim is it's low range. Once you have a ship outside your nos range (12k unless you use faction nosses) which is faster than you and which can kill your drones before they can kill it you are pretty much dead, so it's no good vs multiple targets. Also, if you fight vs a target which has a scrambler and which isn't sucked dry yet (which can take quite some time with BSs and BCs) and local fills up you are usually dead because you cannot disengage. I disagree. It's easy to dictate range in a pilgrim - first you control who you want to fight, second fit 2 x damp rigs and 3 x phased muon dampers and pretty much any ship that doesn't have insane range will immediately fall to about a 10k range. Thus I can push the warp/cloak button any time I like, even accidentally which I've done once ;-) Additionally flying the ship properly helps. E.g. first 20-30 seconds use all modules (nos, neut, damps) and watch for the neut having no positive effect and immediately turn off a nos, a neut and if it's not a missile ship all 3 damps can be turned off (and reactivated if they start doing damage with something). Pull back your drones in the event they start getting attacked and immediately send em back also helps keep em alive.
Aramendel Amarr Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.03.08 11:51:00 - [16] Mhh.. true, your average BS should have a 7-8k targeting range there, so it's possible to stay out of it's range. You're screwed if it has a single sensor booster, though. And still limits you vs a single target (not that the rapier is any betetr there).
Adrian Kerensky Caldari STK Scientific INVICTUS.	Posted - 2007.03.08 12:24:00 - [17] Edited by: Adrian Kerensky on 08/03/2007 12:21:18 I'd take a curse over both of them. [EDIT] I should probably explain why; Recon 5 = 5x 40km Heavy NOS NOS? Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes - Devil 258 bytes over!
Zakgram Atomic Heroes The OSS	Posted - 2007.03.08 13:12:00 - [18] Originally by: Aramendel Mhh.. true, your average BS should have a 7-8k targeting range there, With 3 damps and rigs the effect of 3 damps (66.24% each) reduces a 90km bs to 8.13k - and thus it sits idle. With a single 60% booster the range goes from 144k down to 13.02k - which is outside of NOS range but again being careful makes it all very doable since the lock time will still be long. Just dance in, NOS and neut, as soon as their lock completes you've got a tank still and worse case you move back out of range and break the locks. Note that this isn't a setup for the faint of heart - only a few seconds of distraction and life gets "interesting". BTW - 13k isn't bad anyway with faction NOS, Neuts, and webber... The only thing I suggest is avoiding "fast" ships with nos - with a 14k webber you'll only get a 70% reduction so anything that can go >900m/s will be able to get away if it has a cap booster. A normal NOS domi should be no trouble but a nano-domi will be "exciting".

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