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Revan Neferis
Amarr
Bloodveil
The Sani Sabik
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Posted - 2007.04.01 11:21:00 -
[91]
 Originally by: Arnulf Ogunkoya
Out of interest.
Many pilots of the Fraction posting here seem passionately against the institution of slavery, especially in it's more cruel forms. Do I take it then that the Fraction is attempting to use what influence it has on Revan and Bloodviel to moderate their behaviour?
Star Fraction has no influence at all over my Faith and Religious Douctrine.
Star Fraction has no influence at all over my system of Modus Operandi.
Star Fraction is Star Fraction. Bloodveil is Bloodveil.
Now if you speak about personal relations, I think you adressed your question in a wrong way. Perhaps, you would have another answer.
"Power destroys the ones who dont have it"
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Jasmine Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.04.01 12:22:00 -
[92]
Originally by: Gaius Kador
Originally by: Tatsue Nuko
Edited by: Tatsue Nuko on 01/04/2007 00:57:53
*¦
Quite progressive.
Time to let your guns do the talking slaver. You don't have to trouble yourself with the evidently painful business of formal debate any longer (just as well since its hardly your forte) 
Star Fraction is recruiting
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Gaius Kador
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.04.01 12:32:00 -
[93]
Originally by: Jasmine Constantine
Originally by: Gaius Kador
Originally by: Tatsue Nuko
Edited by: Tatsue Nuko on 01/04/2007 00:57:53
*¦
Quite progressive.
Time to let your guns do the talking slaver. You don't have to trouble yourself with the evidently painful business of formal debate any longer (just as well since its hardly your forte)
Your bold statements and latest fashions hardly impress me, but yes and no.
There never was any point in debating with subhumans.
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Jasmine Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.04.01 13:10:00 -
[94]
Originally by: Gaius Kador
Your bold statements and latest fashions hardly impress me, but yes and no. There never was any point in debating with subhumans
Laughable you'd even dream that I'd seek your approval and I hope in the future you'll exhibit the discipline required to remain silent when you have nothing to say.
Star Fraction is recruiting
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Tatsue Nuko
Tabula Rasa Systems
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.04.01 13:12:00 -
[95]
Originally by: Arnulf Ogunkoya
Do I take it then that the Fraction is attempting to use what influence it has on Revan and Bloodviel to moderate their behaviour?
The Star Fraction is a military organization, not a parliamentary lobby group. The extent of ties between the Star Fraction and Bloodveil is the personal relationship between Jade Constantine and Revan Neferis - and the odd occasion where we happen to have the same targets.
Indeed, to attempt to influence the religious minds and practices of any devoted religious order is itself a silly proposal. The religious mind does not cede to logic nor argument and therefore, with the religious, there's only the times when you have similar goals for differing reasons, and when you don't.
Well, and thirdly there's when you've got conflicting goals and start shooting each other. So far, this has not happened with the Sani Sabik.
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Keerie Jeanmot
Gallente
Bloodveil
The Sani Sabik
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Posted - 2007.04.01 14:01:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Tatsue Nuko
Well, and thirdly there's when you've got conflicting goals and start shooting each other. So far, this has not happened with the Sani Sabik.
I take your sentence as a sign of an emerging "Veiled Threat."
Lady Neferis will be notified.
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Sable Schroedinger
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.04.02 11:12:00 -
[97]
Originally by: Keerie Jeanmot
Originally by: Tatsue Nuko
Well, and thirdly there's when you've got conflicting goals and start shooting each other. So far, this has not happened with the Sani Sabik.
I take your sentence as a sign of an emerging "Veiled Threat."
Lady Neferis will be notified.
Saucer of milk, table number 6
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Join Now |
Merdaneth
Amarr
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.04.02 12:59:00 -
[98]
Originally by: Tatsue Nuko
The Star Fraction is a military organization, not a parliamentary lobby group. The extent of ties between the Star Fraction and Bloodveil is the personal relationship between Jade Constantine and Revan Neferis - and the odd occasion where we happen to have the same targets.
So, you mean to say that Jade publically despises Revan, but privately loves her?
And SF members publically support this affair, but privately condemn it?
Is Jade perhaps infected by inferior memes to have fallen for heretic Neferis? Is love a transhuman attribute or not?
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The Illusion of Freedom | The Truth about Slavery |
Sable Schroedinger
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.04.02 13:20:00 -
[99]
If a friend of yours fell in love with someone you didn't like and they both seemed happy together, would you not be happy for your friend even if you didn't like the relationship?
See? Duality is possible and its not even a stretch!
Pull your head out your rear - or someone elseÆs if thatÆs what floats your boat - and stop beating this dead horse for cheap political points. This quadruped is deceased!
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Join Now |
Revan Neferis
Amarr
Bloodveil
The Sani Sabik
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Posted - 2007.04.02 13:25:00 -
[100]
I really feel sorry for all of you.
"Power destroys the ones who dont have it"
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The Cosmopolite
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.04.02 13:26:00 -
[101]
Originally by: Merdaneth
So, you mean to say that Jade publically despises Revan, but privately loves her?
I simply don't know how you can put such a tendentious interpretation on Tatsue's words except from motives of sheer malice.
I certainly won't seek to speak for my good friend Jade but I will say that she is someone who acts in public in a way that is perfectly in line with her personal philosophy, views and, yes, loves.
Quote:
And SF members publically support this affair, but privately condemn it?
I do indeed support Jade's choices of personal association, would expect any other Free Captain to respect those choices and I regard the private and personal reasons for such choices as none of my business.
Quote:
Is Jade perhaps infected by inferior memes to have fallen for heretic Neferis? Is love a transhuman attribute or not?
Regard for another individual, whether it be simple esteem, friendship or one of the varieties of love is in no way in contradiction with the decision to travel one of the many paths of transhumanism.
The Cosmopolite
The Star Fraction Communications Portal |
Octavinus Augustus
Amarr
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.04.02 14:24:00 -
[102]
In my (probably rather simple) mind, all this boils down to one thing.
Star Fraction has declared war upon PIE as you despise our views and everything we stand for - or so you claim.
Tell me, Mr Cosmopolite, how does Star Fraction look upon the policies and beliefs of "Lady" Neferis? Her denounciation of free speach and free thought? Her apparent bloodlust and false belief in her own superiority? Her adherence to the usual blood raider creed that the weak is simple there to be fed on by the strong? Does her beliefs warrant a wardec? Or is it that you perhaps find her policies more to your liking than ours?
You must forgive me that I find it somewhat hard to pay serious attention to the political rantings you so often submit to the public. This is (at least partly) because your organisation rarely seem to live by the words that you so fervently preach.
Motto: Vae Victis - Woe to the vanquished. |
Jasmine Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.04.02 15:13:00 -
[103]
Originally by: Octavinus Augustus
In my (probably rather simple) mind, all this boils down to one thing. Star Fraction has declared war upon PIE as you despise our views and everything we stand for - or so you claim. Tell me, Mr Cosmopolite, how does Star Fraction look upon the policies and beliefs of "Lady" Neferis? Her denounciation of free speach and free thought? Her apparent bloodlust and false belief in her own superiority? Her adherence to the usual blood raider creed that the weak is simple there to be fed on by the strong? Does her beliefs warrant a wardec? Or is it that you perhaps find her policies more to your liking than ours? You must forgive me that I find it somewhat hard to pay serious attention to the political rantings you so often submit to the public. This is (at least partly) because your organisation rarely seem to live by the words that you so fervently preach.
Nobody excepts you to pay attention to public writings that are not aimed at you. What some of us do expect is that you board your ships and fight for the nationalist delusion you glorify with words alone in this place. Come and fight us in space, then you might be worthy of our notice if not our mercy.
Star Fraction is recruiting
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Tharrn
Amarr
Epitoth Fleetyards
Vigilia Valeria
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Posted - 2007.04.02 15:16:00 -
[104]
Apparently he was worthy of your attention - or was that wardec an accident caused by someone fiddling with the corp controls in a drunken stupor?
Star Fraction and double standards? No, that doesn't add up as we all certainly know.
Ceterum censeo 'Concordia' esse delendam.
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Sable Schroedinger
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.04.02 15:55:00 -
[105]
Edited by: Sable Schroedinger on 02/04/2007 15:52:47
Originally by: Tharrn
Apparently he was worthy of your attention - or was that wardec an accident caused by someone fiddling with the corp controls in a drunken stupor?
Star Fraction and double standards? No, that doesn't add up as we all certainly know.
Let me introduce a little concept to you, they call it (and I know this may shock you) ôFree willö. Its been around for a while, though there are many that have tried to stamp it out over the years.
It means, amongst other things, that not everyone is a mindless drone and is able to interpret things in their own way.
So, on one hand we have Comso, the warrior poet (well, to be honest its actually warrior diplomat and philosopher, but that doesnÆt trip off the tongue anywhere near as easy) , heÆll cross words, swords, gun fire whatever for his cause. And then we have Jasmine û straight up warrior and not much else, sheÆll shoot you in the face as soon as look at you (please donÆt hurt me Jas  ).
Is this a double standard? Is how they conduct themselves in public contradictory? Are their takes on the same philosophy incompatible? Does this make anyone a hypocrite?
No, its just the ôFreeö in Free Captain in action.
Lots of people, fighting for the same cause, of their own free will, with their own values. But all committed to the core values of the cause. Yes it means that corp ops are like herding cats sometimes, but its never boring.
The fact that the so called superior race canÆt seem to ever grasp that, never ceases to amaze me. I understand it can sometimes make following what we have to say a little difficult, but its not impossible and you are supposed to be superior after all. Or are your rantings just based on the fact it makes it hard for you to score cheap, childish political points to make yourself look big in front of the people of GalNet? If so, please go talk to Jas. 
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Join Now |
Tatsue Nuko
Tabula Rasa Systems
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.04.02 16:02:00 -
[106]
The many creative interpretations of my latest entry on this thread are most amusing.
Try interpreting it as exactly what I said:
As an organization, Star Fraction is not attempting to subvert the Sani Sabik because as a religious order there is not much point to the attempt. Rather, there's situations where we have similar objectives - whereupon we co-operate - and situations where we don't have similar objectives - whereupon we don't co-operate. And the last option, conflicting objectives, which could cause conflict, has so far not happened.
And Jade's private life is her own personal business.
How difficult is it?
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Revan Neferis
Amarr
Bloodveil
The Sani Sabik
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Posted - 2007.04.02 16:11:00 -
[107]
Originally by: Tatsue Nuko
How difficult is it?
Perhaps the same level of difficulty you all find on stop commenting about a relation you all have no clue about. All sides, all comments here are worthless.
So unless any of you can claim to jump in the bed with me and Jade, or understand the methods of how my religious Order works I seriously advice to stfu.
Speculations are just adding to an empty shell here.
"Power destroys the ones who dont have it"
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Octavinus Augustus
Amarr
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.04.02 16:12:00 -
[108]
Originally by: Sable Schroedinger
So, on one hand we have Comso, the warrior poet ..., heÆll cross words, swords, gun fire whatever for his cause. And then we have Jasmine û straight up warrior and not much else, sheÆll shoot you in the face as soon as look at you
Surprisingly you are missing the point altogether Sable.
The point being that the cause of "Lady" Neferis should be at least as incompatible to Star Fraction as the cause of PIE and allies is to your organisation. Incompatible that is, if we judge you by your words rather than your deeds.
Yet we see Mr Cosmopolite taking no action whatsoever against the Sani Sabik - he even more or less embrace them, while at the same time he lashes out at the righteous soldiers of GOD.
That Mr. Sable is a double standard if ever I saw one. So you are right that people such as your precious Jasmine does not seem to have double standards (she appears to have none at all judging by her choice of bedfellow). Mr Cosmopolite however, clearly demonstrates double standards in what he says and what he does.
But I assume that even such things are allowed under your precious "freedom act" - having either no standards or several as you see fit. We Amarr think differently, we live and fight by one noble ideal.
I personally would respect you a lot more if you fought by one standard instead of many.
This is, incidentally, another reason why I deem Star Fraction an insignificant threat compared to that of the U'K terrorists. At least that enemy lives by the words that they creed - false and sinfull words though they are.
Motto: Vae Victis - Woe to the vanquished. |
Rodj Blake
Amarr
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.04.02 16:16:00 -
[109]
Originally by: Sable Schroedinger
Let me introduce a little concept to you, they call it (and I know this may shock you) ôFree willö. Its been around for a while, though there are many that have tried to stamp it out over the years.
This would be the free will that your friends in Bloodveil attempt to stamp out at every opportunity?
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |
Octavinus Augustus
Amarr
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.04.02 16:21:00 -
[110]
Edited by: Octavinus Augustus on 02/04/2007 16:18:17
Originally by: Revan Neferis
So unless any of you can claim to jump in the bed with me and Jade, or understand the methods of how my religious Order works I seriously advice to stfu.
As you so honour us with your advice, I think it only fair that I give you a piece of my own in return:
If you wish to have your private life remain private then stop making announcements about it here on the public channels.
Motto: Vae Victis - Woe to the vanquished. |
Merdaneth
Amarr
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.04.02 16:22:00 -
[111]
Originally by: Sable Schroedinger
If a friend of yours fell in love with someone you didn't like and they both seemed happy together, would you not be happy for your friend even if you didn't like the relationship?
I sure would, but it would not stop me from reporting my friend's new partner to the authorities if he is a wanted criminal. Just because I want my friend to be happy does not change my values overnight.
I understand love can make blind. I just did not expect the lover's friends and associates to turn a blind eye to this as well.
Additionally, if that friend falls I love with someone I think is a criminal or morally corrupt person, I see it as my duty warn and try to dissuade my friend to continue said relationship. If my friend continues to support said criminal in word and deed, I would have no choice but to end my friendship.
I do agree with you that the issue is quite the deceased horse to most readers here, the apparent contradication seems clear to all but the SF members themselves. Or possibly there is indeed an internal debate going on with SF members trying to convince Jade to end the relationship, and you just refrain from posting here to keep up the appearance of a unified front, which I consider most sensible.
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The Illusion of Freedom | The Truth about Slavery |
Tatsue Nuko
Tabula Rasa Systems
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.04.02 16:26:00 -
[112]
Originally by: Revan Neferis
So unless any of you can claim to jump in the bed with me and Jade, or understand the methods of how my religious Order works I seriously advice to stfu.
Make me.
It is even more amusing than the random amarrian troglodytes before that you too appear to somehow read more into my words than is actually there.
But seriously now. If you want silence:
Make me.
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Revan Neferis
Amarr
Bloodveil
The Sani Sabik
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Posted - 2007.04.02 16:28:00 -
[113]
Originally by: Tatsue Nuko
Originally by: Revan Neferis
So unless any of you can claim to jump in the bed with me and Jade, or understand the methods of how my religious Order works I seriously advice to stfu.
Make me.
It is even more amusing than the random amarrian troglodytes before that you too appear to somehow read more into my words than is actually there.
But seriously now. If you want silence:
Make me.
As if any words could change what it is. Silence is highly adviced but if my relation with Jade causes you all to have a reason to rabble here, by all means go on.
"Power destroys the ones who dont have it"
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Merdaneth
Amarr
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.04.02 16:30:00 -
[114]
Originally by: Rodj Blake
Originally by: Sable Schroedinger
Let me introduce a little concept to you, they call it (and I know this may shock you) ôFree willö. Its been around for a while, though there are many that have tried to stamp it out over the years.
This would be the free will that your friends in Bloodveil attempt to stamp out at every opportunity?
I think that according to Star Fraction it is only free will when they agree with the outcome. When they don't agree, it is the result of regressive memetics, and thus not really free will at all.
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The Illusion of Freedom | The Truth about Slavery |
The Cosmopolite
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.04.02 16:39:00 -
[115]
Originally by: Octavinus Augustus
Yet we see Mr Cosmopolite taking no action whatsoever against the Sani Sabik - he even more or less embrace them, while at the same time he lashes out at the righteous soldiers of GOD.
That Mr. Sable is a double standard if ever I saw one. So you are right that people such as your precious Jasmine does not seem to have double standards (she appears to have none at all judging by her choice of bedfellow). Mr Cosmopolite however, clearly demonstrates double standards in what he says and what he does.
In the first instance, I do not accept your interpretation of Sani Sabik philosophy and practice.
In the second place, I see no double-standard in attacking a theocratic system and those who support it while not attacking someone who does not support that system and is not on good terms with such supporters.
These rather pathetic attempts to paint us as doing one thing while saying another fail everytime because you simply do not take the time to understand what it is we say and why we do what we do.
That is fine, don't bother to understand us if you don't wish to, but realise that your accusations of hypocrisy and double-standards will always fall short.
The Cosmopolite
The Star Fraction Communications Portal |
Tatsue Nuko
Tabula Rasa Systems
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.04.02 16:48:00 -
[116]
To your credit, Revan, you're as boneheaded as I am.
To your discredit, you're perpetuating what you apparently want replaced with silence. So badly so, indeed, that you'd stray dangerously close to the territory of threat and insult to get that silence. You should have picked someone else, because I regret to inform you that I don't cede to such practices.
Instead, tell me, why do you find as offensive my notion that we would co-operate with your organization when goals coincide and won't when goals don't coincide? Or maybe it was the fact that if our goals ever come into serious conflict there might be... conflict? Was that it? Because it all seems terribly logical to me, and while it's charming that you yet again drag Jade into it, I would politely inform you that it's completely beside the point.
What you and Jade do on your private time is one matter.
What the Star Fraction does is another matter.
What the Sani Sabik does is yet another matter.
Which, incidentally, was the entire point of my initial post on the topic, too.
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Revan Neferis
Amarr
Bloodveil
The Sani Sabik
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Posted - 2007.04.02 16:52:00 -
[117]
Originally by: Tatsue Nuko
To your credit, Revan, you're as boneheaded as I am.
To your discredit, you're perpetuating what you apparently want replaced with silence. So badly so, indeed, that you'd stray dangerously close to the territory of threat and insult to get that silence. You should have picked someone else, because I regret to inform you that I don't cede to such practices.
Instead, tell me, why do you find as offensive my notion that we would co-operate with your organization when goals coincide and won't when goals don't coincide? Or maybe it was the fact that if our goals ever come into serious conflict there might be... conflict? Was that it? Because it all seems terribly logical to me, and while it's charming that you yet again drag Jade into it, I would politely inform you that it's completely beside the point.
What you and Jade do on your private time is one matter.
What the Star Fraction does is another matter.
What the Sani Sabik does is yet another matter.
Which, incidentally, was the entire point of my initial post on the topic, too.
Fine by me, unfortunatelly I have much more serious matters at hand to debate and so have you I 'd hope. Convo me privatelly if you wish to debate this further, get your credit, you win, debate is over.
"Power destroys the ones who dont have it"
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Octavinus Augustus
Amarr
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.04.02 16:54:00 -
[118]
Edited by: Octavinus Augustus on 02/04/2007 16:51:00
Originally by: The Cosmopolite
In the second place, I see no double-standard in attacking a theocratic system and those who support it while not attacking someone who does not support that system and is not on good terms with such supporters.
So now we are getting closer to the truth it seems.
I take it from your own words, that you are natural allies of any enemy of the Amarr Empire? At least your reason for not attacking Neferis and her cronies are that they do not support our system.
Does it not bother you at all that the Sani Sabik is a religious cult and at least as theocratic in nature as the Amarr Empire? It is just another form of theocracy - and a far more sinister one at that.
But in any case, I think we can draw the following conclusion: Wether someone is your friend or your foe is not defined by their agreement or opposition to your own views, but rather by their stand to the Amarr Empire. That is actualy quite flattering. But if this is the case, why even bother arguing your own views?
You are quite right about one thing: I do not understand you.
Motto: Vae Victis - Woe to the vanquished. |
Sable Schroedinger
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.04.02 17:04:00 -
[119]
My friends in bloodveil? Actually, I'm not sure I've ever met any of them - strangely enough, Jade doesn't invite me round when she goes visit. Can't think why 
As for Jasmines choice of bed fellows, afraid I have, nor for the safety of my limbs do I want to have, the faintest idea who or what they are. IÆd be very surprised if any of them were in bloodveil though. Jade, on the other hand, is an entirely different packet of cake sprinkles (which reminds me, I need some more, this frame of mind is nothing if not upsetting). For a start, Jade shares CosmoÆs love of big words, though thankfully not his love of doing squishy things to the bodies of PIE pilots û IÆm still having nightmares of just the look on his face when he took ArchiÆs corpse into his lab 
Basically boys and girls, regardless of how obsessed with Jade and RevenÆs relationship you guys are, we arenÆt beyond how happy it makes Jade. How things stand politically between SF and Bloodveil is just unimportant at this time (or at least as far as I am concerned). YÆsee, we have this war going on, and its amazing how during a time of war your mind can focus on who is shooting you and who is not. Bloodveil is not shooting me at this time nor does it seem to be making noises about doing so (bar the peanut thrower earlier saying something about veiled threats). Therefore, theyÆre on my plus list.
Now, as for why we chose to shoot at PIE and not bloodveil, well, to start with I canÆt comment on what bloodveil does or does not stand for. I personally, just honestly donÆt know û and forgive me if I wonÆt take your word for it, its not like you can be called unbiased or anything is it? û secondly, we are currently fighting the forces of Imperial mimeticÆs, particularly in the form of loyalist militias û even you must of spotted the pattern. KD > CYI > PIEà So as they are not such a group, theyÆre not even in the running now are they? Will they ever be? I really donÆt know, so IÆm just not going to either comment nor speculate. PIE, however, was a no brainer to me.
As for the points that keep getting thrown around about not fighting this bunch or that bunch, why do you even ask? You can hardly be expecting SF to be stupid and impractical by declaring war on everyone at once and then explode in a puff of insanity? And donÆt be preaching about standards and morals now, since you pro Amarr empire bunch donÆt have a war dec against every none amarr citizen out there (as it is perceived as the duty of the Amarr to reclaim and all that kack), so please donÆt throw mud at us for not doing something you wonÆt unless you want to be judged by your own standards. Alright?
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Join Now |
The Cosmopolite
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2007.04.02 17:14:00 -
[120]
Originally by: Octavinus Augustus
I take it from your own words, that you are natural allies of any enemy of the Amarr Empire? At least your reason for not attacking Neferis and her cronies are that they do not support our system.
Always, you try to read more into our words than is actually said. I have not stated my reasons for my views with respect to Lady Revan one way or the other. I have also not said that any foe of the Empire is a friend of mine necessarily.
Quote:
Does it not bother you at all that the Sani Sabik is a religious cult and at least as theocratic in nature as the Amarr Empire? It is just another form of theocracy - and a far more sinister one at that.
We differ on our assessments of the Bloodveil cult. This much is quite clear. I am not personally threatened or in any way perturbed by the activities of Lady Revan and those who think as she does.
Quote:
But in any case, I think we can draw the following conclusion: Wether someone is your friend or your foe is not defined by their agreement or opposition to your own views, but rather by their stand to the Amarr Empire.
You have insufficient data from which to draw that conclusion. As usual, you grasp at straws and seek to make rather crumbly bricks from which to build your tottering edifices of false conclusions and misleading assertions.
The Star Fraction will work with those who have, for whatever reason, interests overlapping our own and who are willing to treat with us on a diplomatic or political basis that does not demand of us that we act contrary to our beliefs.
This principle has a far wider application than mere opposition to the Amarr Empire.
The Cosmopolite
The Star Fraction Communications Portal |
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