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Auron Shadowbane
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Posted - 2007.03.30 14:33:00 -
[1]
... in missions.
It's ok to have a module with nearly no counter (Sensor Boosters are not a counter since 1.60*0.5 = 0.8 one damp and one booster) in PvP where you can do the same to your enemy.
In missions it's hilarious since you can neither jam/damp 50+ ships nor can you dream of any way to fit enough sensor boosters to counter their damps AND tank their damage.
If you want to make missions more like PvP fights then remove the frig&cruiser swarms in high-end missions and make the BS hard enough to make it a real fight, not annoy us with tons of EW frigs & cruisers with nearly no bounty.
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Arcadia1701
Gallente
Federation of Freedom Fighters
Executive Outcomes
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Posted - 2007.03.30 15:27:00 -
[2]
Anything that interfears with ur sensors is overpowered, i had a recon ship put my raven to 3KM lock range, rendering my 35 mill sp, totaly usless. thank u CCP.
My sig>
**Post with your main or STFU ** |
Eleana Tomelac
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.03.30 15:30:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Auron Shadowbane
tons of EW frigs & cruisers with nearly no bounty.
Those are here to be annoying on a single ship disrupting it as much as they can, this way people make missions more easyly with gangmates.
I guess you go to a lvl 4 mission in a sniper or heavy tank setup. But what about finding someone with a destroyer, a cruiser or an assault ship to shoot the small annoying things?
It is meant to favor teamplay, if you get damped, your mate that is not supposed to tank (and entered a few seconds after you aggroed ennemies) will be able to shoot all the dampening (or any EW) frigates and cruiser with a quite specialized ship for it.
I've been doing lvl 4 missions in teams of 2 to 4 (more is often useless), half BS and other half support.
I've been shooting frigates with a destroyer quite fast, and then upgraded to an cruiser (vexor with light & med drones to shoot small things) or AS and had not to withdraw if some (not all, a few ones) NPCs targeted me.
The answer is teamplay, and about removing the small bounties ships in high level missions, do this, and I'll go run lvl 4 missions in an assault ship with no risk and big bounties falling with very small investment (getting more than my ship's total value in any combat mission)... It's the diversity of the ennemy ships that make the missions harder.
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Pocket drone carriers (tm) enthousiast !
Flying Vexor and Ishkur, Myrmidon was too slow, got ganked by 3 BC and a Megathron... |
Eleana Tomelac
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.03.30 15:31:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Arcadia1701
Anything that interfears with ur sensors is overpowered, i had a recon ship put my raven to 3KM lock range, rendering my 35 mill sp, totaly usless. thank u CCP.
What about FoF missiles?
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Pocket drone carriers (tm) enthousiast !
Flying Vexor and Ishkur, Myrmidon was too slow, got ganked by 3 BC and a Megathron... |
Arcadia1701
Gallente
Federation of Freedom Fighters
Executive Outcomes
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Posted - 2007.03.30 15:37:00 -
[5]
They hit the closest agressed target, which is mostly some light drons that are hitting u, so are then useless also  .
My sig>
**Post with your main or STFU ** |
phillie blunt
State War Academy
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Posted - 2007.03.30 15:53:00 -
[6]
hmm fit sensor booster
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Auron Shadowbane
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Posted - 2007.03.30 16:07:00 -
[7]
Originally by: phillie blunt
hmm fit sensor booster
try or stfu.
sensor boosters help vs 20 damping cruisers like a small shield booster on a BS, trying to tank a tripple 1.8bs spawn...
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Vincent Almasy
Gallente
The Underground
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Posted - 2007.03.30 16:23:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Auron Shadowbane
Originally by: phillie blunt
hmm fit sensor booster
try or stfu.
sensor boosters help vs 20 damping cruisers like a small shield booster on a BS, trying to tank a tripple 1.8bs spawn...
Umm first what mission.
Second that sounds like pvp, a trackler and stunner, which is either a good damp user or a jammer specialist befor the gank squad pwns you.
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Eleana Tomelac
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.03.30 16:37:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Eleana Tomelac on 30/03/2007 16:34:04
Right, sensor booster don't help, when a celestis gives you targeting range/12 after dampening, what will you do add full med slots of sensor boosters to limit it to range/3? And think about your scan resolution, you will take 30-200 secs to lock anything.
The best option is to set the celestis as new target for your gang, not having tons of sensor boosters. If you were alone, what were you expecting to do anyway?
Anyway, it's not the celestis that will kill you, all the EW ships need backup from damage dealers. It's a tactical advantage you have to take, having a Celestis, a Blackbird and an Arbitrator in your gang (if big enough) is recommended.
This makes tactics more important, and not just "my higher DPS wins".
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Pocket drone carriers (tm) enthousiast !
Flying Vexor and Ishkur, Myrmidon was too slow, got ganked by 3 BC and a Megathron... |
Veneth
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Posted - 2007.03.31 15:32:00 -
[10]
He is probably referring to The Assault vs Serpentis, I did that mission the other day and.. wow it was very annoying, it's not just the frigs though in that mission, half the dampners where on Thoraxs and Megathrons that was annoying..
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William Hamilton
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Posted - 2007.03.31 15:34:00 -
[11]
Well, there are FoF missiles, but those are only for missiles...
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Arcadia1701
Gallente
Federation of Freedom Fighters
Executive Outcomes
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Posted - 2007.03.31 15:42:00 -
[12]
Originally by: William Hamilton
Well, there are FoF missiles, but those are only for missiles...
See my earlyer reply, FOFs also target stuctures, which is even more fun.
My sig>
**Post with your main or STFU ** |
William Hamilton
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Posted - 2007.03.31 16:00:00 -
[13]
Yeah, guess that's pretty discount then.
Mabye they should just stacking nerf dampers a bit......
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SN3263827
The Black Rabbits
Fatal Persuasion
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Posted - 2007.03.31 17:18:00 -
[14]
Originally by: William Hamilton
Yeah, guess that's pretty discount then.
Mabye they should just stacking nerf dampers a bit......
Sensor damps are penalised for stacking.
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Auron Shadowbane
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Posted - 2007.03.31 19:11:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Auron Shadowbane
... in missions.
for all of those who appear to be extra smart and think I'm speaking PvP.
all I'm talking about is damps on NPC-rats.
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Delezar
Hellfire-Empire
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Posted - 2007.04.01 23:11:00 -
[16]
The stacking penalty does effect the npc as well right? So with 2 Sensor Booster II you should be able to do the missions just like before, oh well, a Raven pilot might cry. 
But you got friends right? Get some help for the mission, as mentioned above.
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Tonto Auri
Center for Advanced Studies
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Posted - 2007.04.02 03:52:00 -
[17]
When You can't do something solo, call Your friend or go play C-S.
And please stop crying on forum.
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.04.02 06:04:00 -
[18]
For all the so wise people remembering stacking penalityes, those don't work:
1) if the EW enemyes are multiple ships instead of one;
2) on NPC.
for the bring a friend:
1) true, but most mission don't give a return sufficent to make it profitable to do them in a group;
2) the mechanism of the missions is broken when you bring a friend, in some of them you get istan aggro from all the room, and some the rewards can't be shared (faction standing gains, LP);
3) the main advantage of the missions is that you can do them when you have time, even if no friend is on line. Changing them so that you can do them only when 1+ of your friends are on line is big change.
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Mr Friendly
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Posted - 2007.04.02 23:31:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Tonto Auri
When You can't do something solo, call Your friend or go play C-S.
And please stop crying on forum.
*Sigh*
I ran a few lvl4's in my sniping Mega last night for fun (I usually run a Domi). The Serps had me damped to less than 13km's... and the cycles overlapped so much I rarely could start to target ships out at 17 and 21 ... let alone FINISH targeting before my lock range was again down to 12.5 or so.... my point being is this is clearly overpowered. I called in my corp mate and he had fun killing everything himself.
I used to sometimes get damped etc in missions... now I am ALWAYS damped etc... Too large of a change, imo.
ECM was nerfed for player ships precisely because it removed the ability to be effectively countered w/o totally gimping your ship's setup. Why should we accept overpowered npc's?
Balance is good.
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Vincent Almasy
Gallente
The Underground
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Posted - 2007.04.03 00:34:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Mr Friendly
Originally by: Tonto Auri
When You can't do something solo, call Your friend or go play C-S.
And please stop crying on forum.
*Sigh*
I ran a few lvl4's in my sniping Mega last night for fun (I usually run a Domi). The Serps had me damped to less than 13km's... and the cycles overlapped so much I rarely could start to target ships out at 17 and 21 ... let alone FINISH targeting before my lock range was again down to 12.5 or so.... my point being is this is clearly overpowered. I called in my corp mate and he had fun killing everything himself.
I used to sometimes get damped etc in missions... now I am ALWAYS damped etc... Too large of a change, imo.
ECM was nerfed for player ships precisely because it removed the ability to be effectively countered w/o totally gimping your ship's setup. Why should we accept overpowered npc's?
Balance is good.
why not simply ask to have less damps per pack of NPCs?
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Nyphur
Pillowsoft
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Posted - 2007.04.03 00:38:00 -
[21]
I've only encountered damping NPCs in gallente missions. It seems that the intent is to force you into close range combat, which forces you to use your racial weapon type, the blaster. It favours gallente missions being run by gallente ships, which is a nice change from the old system where ravens were the best ship to run any race's missions.
Eve-Tanking.com - For tanking spreadsheet and resources. |
Kagura Nikon
Minmatar
Guardians of the Dawn
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.04.03 12:41:00 -
[22]
I used to make this missions wih sniping tempest with some speed and AB II. I move away .. out of their dampener range. Then snipe them to death...
If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough |
Sir Bart
Vendetta Underground
Rule of Three
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Posted - 2007.04.03 17:45:00 -
[23]
I don't think rsd's are overpowered. They are good modules but level 4's don't even come into consideration when balancing modules. The modules are balanced for pvp. Missions can be adjusted for balance issues without changing any modules.
When ECM got it's nerf, everyone was fitting them. Vinidactors where way stronger than Navy Megathrons simply because they could have a multispec ECM on board.
RSD are not equipped on all ships because they simply aren't strong enough. You need to put huge amounts of SP in them to make them half ways useful in fleets and even in 1v1 situations, only the specialized ships really use them. In gang situations they are sometimes used but it's hard to stay out of lock range and scramble with rsds most of the time.
RSD are good modules, but no in need of any nerfs.
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Tonto Auri
Center for Advanced Studies
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Posted - 2007.04.03 18:48:00 -
[24]
When You play EVE, keep in mind that it is a multi-player game.
(Hewe was a repeat of my previous answer, deleted)
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Elain Reverse
Caldari
Shokei
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Posted - 2007.04.03 19:03:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Tonto Auri
When You play EVE, keep in mind that it is a multi-player game.
(Hewe was a repeat of my previous answer, deleted)
Thats more like masive online instead of multiplayer, and that doesnt mean you need fleet for everything you want to do.
Changes as CCP do disencourage small corps and players whitch do 1-2 missions per day from playing as not allways someon from friends is online to help you.
And even when they are online, they have plenty of things to do for themself (ie mine, haul, PVP, their own missions etc).
L4s shoud be doable solo in BS same as L3 with BC, L2 in cruiser and L1 in frig.
Doing missions against so many and so much overpowered EW is like doing PVP solo vs fleet.
And playing game is suposed to be for fun. What is fun on situation when they cant break your tank because they dont have enough DPS and you cant kill them either because you cant lock them ?
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Tonto Auri
Center for Advanced Studies
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Posted - 2007.04.03 19:47:00 -
[26]
I think You trying to shift discussion.
Ok, let' follow You.
I not say "massively" because You need (and it enough) to get one player helping You in L4. Even with smaller ship than Your but with enough firepower to kill rats.
And for Your though about mission scale.
L1 for frigs(gang of frigs) and in Destroyer You'll be pretty safe.
L2 for Cruisers(gang of cruisers) and in Battlecruiser You'd looks safe as well as in DD doing L1.
L3 for BC and BS which is safer, but You may call friend to support You get it down faster.
L4 should be enough hard to be interesting for MT2/MT3 BS or gang of BC/BS, which not mean "fleet" (as I read - "blob").
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Tonto Auri
Center for Advanced Studies
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Posted - 2007.04.03 19:50:00 -
[27]
One side-note about EVE.
Only main problem of EVE is their chat system.
Very disassociating, provoke players to collapse in their corp channels and ignore anything around 'em.
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doctorstupid2
Dirty Deeds Corp.
Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2007.04.03 20:32:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Arcadia1701
Anything that interfears with ur sensors is overpowered, i had a recon ship put my raven to 3KM lock range, rendering my 35 mill sp, totaly usless. thank u CCP.
Not like you would have faired any better if it were a jamming recon.
Quote:
How's that saying go? something about a pot calling a kettle black.... but the kettle getting the last laugh because it was banging the pot's sister? Yeah, that sounds right.
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Elain Reverse
Caldari
Shokei
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Posted - 2007.04.03 21:23:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Elain Reverse on 03/04/2007 21:21:24
Originally by: Tonto Auri
I think You trying to shift discussion.
Ok, let' follow You.
I not say "massively" because You need (and it enough) to get one player helping You in L4. Even with smaller ship than Your but with enough firepower to kill rats.
And for Your though about mission scale.
L1 for frigs(gang of frigs) and in Destroyer You'll be pretty safe.
L2 for Cruisers(gang of cruisers) and in Battlecruiser You'd looks safe as well as in DD doing L1.
L3 for BC and BS which is safer, but You may call friend to support You get it down faster.
L4 should be enough hard to be interesting for MT2/MT3 BS or gang of BC/BS, which not mean "fleet" (as I read - "blob").
CCP never said L4s are ment for "gang needed", they actualy said "L4s going to be closer to L3s and hardest L4s becoming L5"
L1s with gang of frigs , well lol, T1 frig and 2-4 weeks old char can do them solo and with t2 they are prety much easy.
L2s you can do in t1 cruiser or even T2 frig prety good
L3s even some of ppl do them in small gang of T2 frigs, with BC or HAC is prety easy as well, dont even need T2 ships and T2 fit.
L4s You dont need BS for them, if you get good enogh skills and good fiting you can do them in BC, Yes, BS or commandships help you to get thru them faster.
And please, before starting arguing about missions, try to do some of them.
Things about L4s is you can do them alone, it take some time, but you can do it, and ofcourse you can use help, whitch only help you do them faster.
You dont need BS for l3s and you dont need BS for L4s as 2 BC will be same speed or even faster.
And please read about what CCP meaned with missions in 1st place.
PS: If l3/l4s are meaned with team, why then they discourade from it by adding additional agro if someon else or drone enter fight ?
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