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Trasch Taranogas State War Academy Caldari State 35	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:15:02 - [1] - Quote Why isnt this ingame? Like stargates, when leaving stations et.c. there should be 60 sec cloak. I miss my IS-7
Diane Persis 12	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:18:27 - [2] - Quote Trasch Taranogas wrote: Why isnt this ingame? Like stargates, when leaving stations et.c. there should be 60 sec cloak. Sure but just as when jumping a gate, you won't be moving. Choose wisely.
Shadow President Future's Inc. 0	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:26:09 - [3] - Quote Diane Persis wrote: Trasch Taranogas wrote: Why isnt this ingame? Like stargates, when leaving stations et.c. there should be 60 sec cloak. Sure but just as when jumping a gate, you won't be moving. Choose wisely. Also since a ship can't cloak within 2000m of a station, you would have to be outside of docking range for this to work.
Maekchu Gunpoint Diplomacy 553	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:31:19 - [4] - Quote Yeah, burning an insta-undock is so hard... -.-
Trasch Taranogas State War Academy Caldari State 35	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:33:15 - [5] - Quote Hmm, 2000 meters is for everything isnt it? So stargates are the exception from the rule? I miss my IS-7
Maekchu Gunpoint Diplomacy 554	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:39:19 - [6] - Quote Trasch Taranogas wrote: Hmm, 2000 meters is for everything isnt it? So stargates are the exception from the rule? You spawn about 12km (?) from a stargate. So no, the stargate isn't within your decloak range to start with. However, most docks would be since you are within 0km when you undock from most stations. What Shadow Presidents proposal is, is that we will allow cloaking when undocking from a station, however all stations will be kick-out stations leaving you +2000m from the undock. TL:DR Using stargate mechanics on undock would buff instalocking campers on hubs A LOT! So pick your poison...
Diane Persis 14	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:40:02 - [7] - Quote Trasch Taranogas wrote: Hmm, 2000 meters is for everything isnt it? So stargates are the exception from the rule? You mean to tell us you don't even know how the game mechanics work on a subject you're asking changes for?
Ralph King-Griffin Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance 19986	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:40:14 - [8] - Quote Trasch Taranogas wrote: Why isnt this ingame? Like stargates, when leaving stations et.c. there should be 60 sec cloak. This is why we say newbros should get in a Corp. A group of lads even pretending not to be idiots would likely not only have told you this by now, but would actually have these already for you to use. The Eve Uni wiki wrote: When you undock you leave the station aligned to a constant direction moving at your maximum velocity. In theory, if you place a bookmark at least 150 km away aligned to this direction you could warp out almost instantly to this bookmark without being target-locked. There are two ways to create such a bookmark There are two pretty easy ways to get a near perfect undock bookmark, depending on whether the station undocks you horizontally or vertically, both using your tactical overlay: Most (but not quite all) horizontally undocking stations are aligned directly along one of the 'compass lines' that display when your tactical overlay is active. Adjust your camera so that you're looking almost straight down that compass line (you can't do it directly down one because your ship would be in the way) and double click where that row of numbers disappears into the horizon. That should be the mean direction of station undocks, and get you a bookmark you can warp to instantly. On a vertically-undocking station, select the station so it is in your Selected Items box, then a line will display on your tactical overlay showing you exactly where the station is horizontally relative to your position. Once you go off grid this line will disappear, but the bright spot where it intersects your horizontal plain will still be visible even then. Keep flying downwards and adjusting your direction slightly so that the bright spot remains as close to your ship as possible, and you've got yourself a perfectly aligned undock bookmark . Murderers of Negotiable Motivations Lords.Of.Midnight currently recruiting
Tau Cabalander Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs 6590	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:41:41 - [9] - Quote Trasch Taranogas wrote: Why isnt this ingame? Like stargates, when leaving stations et.c. there should be 60 sec cloak. Well you already have invulnerability upon undocking.
Ralph King-Griffin Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance 19986	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:43:03 - [10] - Quote Maekchu wrote: Yeah, burning an insta-undock is so hard... -.- Provided you you're aware of their existence. Murderers of Negotiable Motivations Lords.Of.Midnight currently recruiting
Trasch Taranogas State War Academy Caldari State 35	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:46:59 - [11] - Quote Tau Cabalander wrote: Well you already have invulnerability upon undocking. That I did not know, so why are everybody making all these bookmarks then? Just what this game needs, another set of bookmarks. I miss my IS-7
Trasch Taranogas State War Academy Caldari State 35	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:48:19 - [12] - Quote Ralph King-Griffin wrote: Maekchu wrote: Yeah, burning an insta-undock is so hard... -.- Provided you you're aware of their existence. Sweet lord. I cant even undock like everybody else. Back to google. I miss my IS-7
Jonah Gravenstein Machiavellian Space Bastards 27302	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:49:06 - [13] - Quote Undocking gives a 30 second invulnerability window unless you activate a module, target someone or move your ship in any direction other than the one it's travelling in; combined with the speed at which you're "kicked" from the station, this is often used in conjunction with bookmarks for an instant warp to a point in line with the station kickout. TL;DR the current undock mechanic is probably more useful to most than a gate cloak. In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded. New Player FAQ Feyd's Survival Pack
Tau Cabalander Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs 6590	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:52:12 - [14] - Quote Trasch Taranogas wrote: Tau Cabalander wrote: Well you already have invulnerability upon undocking. That I did not know, so why are everybody making all these bookmarks then? Just what this game needs, another set of bookmarks. Because it can take a long time to align and reach warp velocity. Example: Blockade Runners are shoot-on-sight, and should never be uncloaked, but they can't cloak close to station. Although very fast, they don't insta-warp, especially when not aligned.
Maekchu Gunpoint Diplomacy 554	Posted - 2017.01.06 22:54:19 - [15] - Quote You are invulnerable for 30s (?), if I remember correctly, when you undock. However, you lose this invulnerability whenever you start any action, including initiating a warp. As you may know, actually getting into warp, your ship needs to align and get to 75% velocity. During this time, when the ship align you are not invulnerable anymore and would mean an instalocking camper would be able to disrupt and shoot you during this. An insta-undock bookmark enables you to warp immediately after undocking. Removing the vulnerable time, where you would initiate your warp on the undock. But just google those, think it is easier to just read about them, than me typing out an explanation.
Jonah Gravenstein Machiavellian Space Bastards 27302	Posted - 2017.01.06 23:19:00 - [16] - Quote Trasch Taranogas wrote: Ralph King-Griffin wrote: Maekchu wrote: Yeah, burning an insta-undock is so hard... -.- Provided you you're aware of their existence. Sweet lord. I cant even undock like everybody else. Back to google. Eve Uni Wiki Bookmark it, you'll find most stuff there; CCP use it too. In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded. New Player FAQ Feyd's Survival Pack
Ralph King-Griffin Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance 19988	Posted - 2017.01.06 23:27:43 - [17] - Quote Trasch Taranogas wrote: Ralph King-Griffin wrote: Maekchu wrote: Yeah, burning an insta-undock is so hard... -.- Provided you you're aware of their existence. Sweet lord. I cant even undock like everybody else. Back to google. Only if there's scary people outside Murderers of Negotiable Motivations Lords.Of.Midnight currently recruiting
Aiwha Infinite Point Test Alliance Please Ignore 1205	Posted - 2017.01.07 00:10:04 - [18] - Quote You're invulnerable for a bit after undocking as long as you don't do anything. Same thing, except you can be seen. Sanity is fun leaving the body.
Bjorn Tyrson EVE University Ivy League 141	Posted - 2017.01.07 02:06:35 - [19] - Quote I'm of two minds on this... on the one hand not moving when leaving the station removes insta-undocks. Would also clog up the outside of stations. On the other hand I have been nearly ganked in the past while undocking because I couldn't load the environment fast enough. Giving rhe ganker plenty of time to scan, lock, and fire before I had even loaded grid. (The only thing that saved me was his first shot was a glancing blow otherwise I would have ended up another statistic of idiots moving plex in a shuttle. .. yes I know it is dumb) Maybe a compromise. A 10 second invuln timer. (Didn't that used to be a thing?) But maintain the momentum. Can still be locked, non hostile mods (cargo scanners etc) still work. Any action other than stopping breaks the timer. Would give a small buffer to people who are slow on loading grid. Preventing literally unstoppable ganks due to hardware /Internet issues. While not making people 100% immune.
Maekchu Gunpoint Diplomacy 557	Posted - 2017.01.07 02:13:01 - [20] - Quote Bjorn Tyrson wrote: Maybe a compromise. A 10 second invuln timer. (Didn't that used to be a thing?) But maintain the momentum. Can still be locked, non hostile mods (cargo scanners etc) still work. Any action other than stopping breaks the timer.. How the **** did you miss all those posts pointing out, that you currently have a 30 second invulnerability timer when you undock?
Bjorn Tyrson EVE University Ivy League 141	Posted - 2017.01.07 02:58:04 - [21] - Quote Maekchu wrote: Bjorn Tyrson wrote: Maybe a compromise. A 10 second invuln timer. (Didn't that used to be a thing?) But maintain the momentum. Can still be locked, non hostile mods (cargo scanners etc) still work. Any action other than stopping breaks the timer.. How the ** did you miss all those posts pointing out, that you currently have a 30 second invulnerability timer when you undock? Bjorn Tyrson wrote: otherwise I would have ended up another statistic of idiots moving plex in a shuttle** And wtf? What the hell are they teaching at the uni these days? First, you don't move PLEX. Second, if you really have to, you don't do it in a shuttle. Okay I must have missed the 30 second invuln somehow. Does it show in the same place as the cloak timer? If not then it should. If it does then clearly I need to pay more attention or get a better potato. As for the second point. I admitted it was stupid. I freely admitted to it. And in fact offered my consolidations and in fact payed the attempted ganker for the value of his ship because by all rights he should have had Me. Also my market alt didn't have acess to an instawarper yet. Although it probably wouldn't have done much considering in that particular case my microwave froze and didn't load grid for like a minute
ShahFluffers Ice Fire Warriors Escalating Entropy 11330	Posted - 2017.01.07 03:53:28 - [22] - Quote Bjorn Tyrson wrote: Okay I must have missed the 30 second invuln somehow. Does it show in the same place as the cloak timer? If not then it should. If it does then clearly I need to pay more attention or get a better potato. Not anymore. Part of the reason that the "invulnerability period" was introduced was because of the Session Timer (that little circle thing that appears and quickly times down each time you undock, jump through a stargate, or switch ships). The Session Timer was created because the DEVs realized that no everyone in the game has the same internet speed... so they instituted a form of "you can't do anything 'major' (see: dock, jump, switch ships, etc) for a set period of time to make sure that the server is communicating correctly with the client." Basically... the "Invulnerability Period" was designed to last a little longer than your "Session Timer"... which meant that you used the Session Timer (+ a little extra time) as your "Invulnerability Period" timer. But it looks like the "Session Timer" has be reduced to mere seconds. So there is no timer for the "Invulnerability Period." Speaking from experience; you do not want to use up all 30 seconds of the "Invuln Period." It simply gives more time for your enemies to prime their weapons for you. Better to prepare in advance so you can make a snap decision once you undock. Or, if you want to see what is going on outside, you don't want to linger more than absolutely necessary (15 seconds is usually enough). How did you Veterans start?
Mo Skor 24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire 2	Posted - 2017.01.07 09:46:51 - [23] - Quote The Eve Uni wiki wrote: When you undock you leave the station aligned to a constant direction moving at your maximum velocity. In theory, if you place a bookmark at least 150 km away aligned to this direction you could warp out almost instantly to this bookmark without being target-locked. There are two ways to create such a bookmark There are two pretty easy ways to get a near perfect undock bookmark, depending on whether the station undocks you horizontally or vertically, both using your tactical overlay: Most (but not quite all) horizontally undocking stations are aligned directly along one of the 'compass lines' that display when your tactical overlay is active. Adjust your camera so that you're looking almost straight down that compass line (you can't do it directly down one because your ship would be in the way) and double click where that row of numbers disappears into the horizon. That should be the mean direction of station undocks, and get you a bookmark you can warp to instantly. On a vertically-undocking station, select the station so it is in your Selected Items box, then a line will display on your tactical overlay showing you exactly where the station is horizontally relative to your position. Once you go off grid this line will disappear, but the bright spot where it intersects your horizontal plain will still be visible even then. Keep flying downwards and adjusting your direction slightly so that the bright spot remains as close to your ship as possible, and you've got yourself a perfectly aligned undock bookmark . I've never heard of all this. I have just been hitting the MWD or afterburner after undocking, waiting until I'm 300+ km out, then bookmarking. Is this a problem because I might get bumped when undocking, messing up my alignment? Seems to have worked so far.
Reinhardt Kreiss TetraVaal Tactical Group 62	Posted - 2017.01.07 10:14:46 - [24] - Quote Mo Skor wrote: I've never heard of all this. I have just been hitting the MWD or afterburner after undocking, waiting until I'm 300+ km out, then bookmarking. Is this a problem because I might get bumped when undocking, messing up my alignment? Seems to have worked so far. That EVE uni text states it a bit weirdly, and is outdated, but when you undock there is some deviation in the vector you're doing. Not sure on the actual number but you're likely to be some 5-10 degrees off. That in itself is not a problem if you made a perfect undocking bookmark, 10 degrees is close enough to get into warp. But if you made the bookmark, say, 10 degrees upwards because you didn't adjust your vector when you made it and THEN you undock while going 10 degrees downwards then there's a total of 20 degrees and THAT will get you in trouble. So when making an undocking bookmark first make SURE you're leaving the station straight out the undock and THEN hit MWD to burn away, while adjusting course all the time if need be. Then you'll have a good bookmark that'll work with any deviation you might have when undocking.
Zarek Kree Lunatic Legion Holdings 16	Posted - 2017.01.27 17:37:34 - [25] - Quote Bjorn Tyrson wrote: Also my market alt didn't have acess to an instawarper yet. Although it probably wouldn't have done much considering in that particular case my microwave froze and didn't load grid for like a minute A day 1 character can fly an Atron loaded up with Nozzle Joint rigs and Inertial Stabilizers and get an align time under 2 secs (i.e. an "instawarper"). Due to the way the server ticks work, it's virtually impossible to catch on a gate in lowsec or highsec unless your connection is laggy. Of course that doesn't help you getting out of stations (for that you need the undock bookmarks), but it's 100 times better than a shuttle if you simply MUST move small, high value cargo. Since you're in E-Uni, let me highly recommend Seamus Donohue's bi-weekly class on game mechanics. It's free form Q&A so you can ask him anything. Ask him about "instawarping" or station invulnerability timers and he'll talk for 30 minutes in excruciating detail about how these mechanics work. Most classes available to non-Uni members as well. http://calendar.eveuniversity.org
Agondray Avenger Mercenaries VOID Intergalactic Forces 392	Posted - 2017.01.28 12:03:31 - [26] - Quote Trasch Taranogas wrote: Tau Cabalander wrote: Well you already have invulnerability upon undocking. That I did not know, so why are everybody making all these bookmarks then? Just what this game needs, another set of bookmarks. there was once a time people made mass amounts of money making thousands of bookmarks because you needed them for everything. upon undock once you click in a direction, your invul timer goes away and you get popped in aligning. "Sarcasm is the Recourse of a weak mind." -Dr. Smith
Tuttomenui II Aliastra Gallente Federation 443	Posted - 2017.01.28 13:45:18 - [27] - Quote 2000m thing doesn't actually effect gate cloak as it is the gate that is cloaking you. You can be within that range sometimes of other people who have also used the gate and not decloak each other. There is a reason for gate cloaks, there is not a reason for there to be station cloaks. Undock gives you an invulnerability state for a given time it is better than a cloak. Although it is less effective on kickout stations you have to decide faster whether or not you need to re-dock. Your question made me remember this little jewel: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=254101
Rroff Antagonistic Tendencies 1048	Posted - 2017.01.28 17:45:06 - [28] - Quote Tau Cabalander wrote: Example: Blockade Runners are shoot-on-sight, and should never be uncloaked, but they can't cloak close to station. Although very fast, they don't insta-warp, especially when not aligned. Have a fleet mate sitting at the instawarp bm and fleet up - you can warp to them from the fleet window (around 1 server tick earlier) before you can warp to a bookmark on undocking meaning that for warping to an insta they are nigh on unshootable.

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