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Black Pedro Yammerschooner 3242	Posted - 2017.03.12 12:44:59 - [151] - Quote Sally Clay wrote: Quote: To fix your sec status how much ISK does it cost? u already know it don't be silly lol 4x trainer > 5.6kk 6x recruiter > 12kk 6x trans > 110kk 4x nego > 80kk ----------- 210 kk and voil+á ur ss is oki How much it? 200+kk it's only ONE HOUR run burner msn in hs < it's nothing How long it was in past? it was FEW DAYS kill npc in lowsec belt If 200M ISK is nothing, then why are people constantly whining about their losses to suicide gankers? ISK is so plentiful even a freighter can be replaced in a few hours with your Burner income. Why should it take days to grind up status for the ganker when it only takes hours (or even minutes) to earn enough for a new barge, exhumer or hauler according to you? I like Tags for Sec. It is a very Eve-like solution to the issue of grinding security status. It created a mini-profession and stimulates activity in lowsec, and allows pilots to outsource something they may not like doing to someone who does like grinding. It is a win-win and a great example of a success of maximizing happiness in the game giving both parties what they want which is what a game developer should be trying to do. Most gankers rarely use it as except for a few niche applications, as most are capable and even proud of operating at -10 in highsec (or lowsec if we are talking of the pirates that live there). Plus, it really isn't that useful to use regularly as you still have to deal with the trade-able killrights which keep you at risk for 30 days even if you repair your security status. But it does allow for a change of profession or corporation, at a cost, if a player deems it necessary and is willing to pay someone else to do the grinding for them. I think it should be expanded to faction standings as well. Let's add some more reason for players to be in lowsec and let players who have trashed their standings with one of the main factions pay someone else to fix it for them. The 8 Golden Rules of Eve Why Do They Gank?
Sally Clay State War Academy Caldari State 13	Posted - 2017.03.12 12:48:32 - [152] - Quote Hiasa Kite wrote: ... If you don't want to lose your ship, learn to play. Stop forcing other people to grind just because you can't be bothered to learn. ^^ this u can see good example "no u" answer hows ur siphon? D
Ima Wreckyou The Conference Elite CODE. 3739	Posted - 2017.03.12 13:59:10 - [153] - Quote Sally Clay wrote: 5.6kk space gold? WOW is this way the Code ALWAYS wins Elite PvPer, #74 in 2014
Jonah Gravenstein Machiavellian Space Bastards 28010	Posted - 2017.03.12 14:27:38 - [154] - Quote Sally Clay wrote: ccp need remove lowsec tags for clean sec. status few years ago before that tags was added balance with gank&punishment was ok you shoot someone > ok > then go to lowsec and clean ur ss > SPEND UR TIME < most important thing What we see now? gankers kill whatever they want don't care about ss coz u easy fly to near hub just buy tags and few minute later ur ss clean and u can kill next freighter, barge, e.t.c. < it's broken Very few gankers bother with tags, something like 90% of the people that regularly gank with CODE. have outlaw status and can be shot at anytime. What is broken is people thinking that hisec is a safe place to stuff their ships with shinies and use autopillock or otherwise go afk in space; despite CCP stating repeatedly that Eve is a PvP game and that nowhere is safe. If people want to be safe in Eve then it's up to them to make themselves safe, not CCP. If all of the whining wazzocks stopped doing stupid shite with their spaceships, their spaceships wouldn't explode as much. In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded. New Player FAQ Feyd's Survival Pack
Hiasa Kite Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 531	Posted - 2017.03.12 14:38:02 - [155] - Quote Sally Clay wrote: Hiasa Kite wrote: ... If you don't want to lose your ship, learn to play. Stop forcing other people to grind just because you can't be bothered to learn. ^^ this u can see good example "no u" answer Yup. Which highlights the problem with your suggestion. "Everyone else in EVE should work harder so I don't have to." Quote: add @Pedro pls don't say about kill-rights it's easy clean with alt < another broken system You can't dodge kill rights by rolling clean ALTs, it's a bannable offence. <^.^> I'm a cat lol
Daichi Yamato Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass 3830	Posted - 2017.03.12 15:15:13 - [156] - Quote @otlichnik Speak for yourself. I am a 'non-ganker'. I fly freighters and mine more than most other activities. I am a gankers main target. But ganking is pretty essential to eve's eco-system. Without it it would be far too easy to transport goods and far too easy to mine. The game would be boring and production would be out of control (production already far out weighs destruction and the margin on goods in eve is a joke). Taking valuable freight through dangerous gank systems and trying to 'beat' the gankers is what makes the game fun. On top of that gankers attack my competition. More specifically my dumb and lazy competition. Without them i make less money. We'd all be totally complacent and bored without it. Oh and btw, i escort my freighters. Quote: Non-Ganker: id tell you to play eve but its pretty tough game takes a long time to learn and you have to watch out because there are whole groups of people that will just kill you for no reason and you cant tell who they are till they show up and there is nothing you can do back you just have to eat it and still try and have fun... you know what.. screw eve lets go play something else. And this is why YOU are part of the problem. Games where players kill eachother for no reason is not some new phenomenon. The whole point of this game is that you can be shot anywhere. That IS the fun. Thats WHY we play. If you don't like that why the **** were you ever here?! It's not enough that you can't hack this game, you have to lie to other players to make them think the game is impossible to play? If this game is so hard on freighters and miners why have i never been ganked in a freighter or barge in nearly 7 years? You think gankers are the problem? Not the dishonest and toxic carebears actually telling people not to play? Not the entitled whiners who joined a pvp sandbox game but want to change it into something thats non-pvp and not a sandbox? It begs belief. Off you go. And don't let the door hit you on the way out. EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided" Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
Jonah Gravenstein Machiavellian Space Bastards 28014	Posted - 2017.03.12 17:08:54 - [157] - Quote ^^ Likewise, I classify myself as a noncombatant in terms of shooting others in the face. Unlike the hapless folks that keep feeding easy kills to the suicide gankers I take care to protect my stuff. The competition exploding at the hands of predators presents opportunity for those of us not dumb enough to be them. Not being ganked because you're smarter, faster, harder to kill and generally more prepared than the other guy is as much PvP as ganking the guy that isn't. In a game of cat and mouse there is no shame in being the better mouse. ~ one of Eve's great lowsec industrialists. In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded. New Player FAQ Feyd's Survival Pack
Arthur Aihaken CODE.d 6027	Posted - 2017.03.12 18:35:49 - [158] - Quote Or the better rat. I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Hiasa Kite Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 532	Posted - 2017.03.12 19:03:43 - [159] - Quote Ditto Jonah and Daichi. I don't so much shoot other people, I just enjoy giving other people reason to shoot me. <^.^> I'm a cat lol
Otlichnick Dread Fleet Sanctus Silentium 6	Posted - 2017.03.12 20:05:13 - [160] - Quote If gankers were put to a stop it would be easier to mine. Prices would drop for minerals. Ships would be come cheeper. What is the problem with that. Sounds more like content for other people that actually declare war or live in lawless space. More bang for their buck when they plex and more opportunity for engaging game play instead of the ganking 12 on 1 playstyle. How can i be what is wrong with this game when when this game first started there wernt whole gangs running around wasting ships killing haulers and the game was friggen great then. Highsec was safe. No one was complaining. Content was being created easily. Now you say how Ganking is essential to eve. That is the biggest made up bs i have ever heard. No one is buying that. Its ruining experiences for lots of players before they even try to have an experience. They are getting ready to have fun and get blown out of the sky before it happens. Really there is no worse game experience when a large group of people prey on individuals for a profession with out risk or repercussion. You have a monopoly on highsec space. These arbitrary rules of how much will get ganked and when can change at any point and for any reason. Wasn't 0.0 just revised because it was to easy to hold large amounts of space with out really trying or risking anything. It is time to throw in a wrench in the highsec ganking thugs network for the same reason. The people getting ganked are not dumb. They are not lazy. They are just NOT INTERESTED is griefing. Some of us are informed and know about ganking some do not or think its really not worth the effort to protect against since they will not survive no matter the amount of preparation which ofc is true.
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 6157	Posted - 2017.03.12 20:12:04 - [161] - Quote Sally Clay wrote: Quote: To fix your sec status how much ISK does it cost? u already know it don't be silly lol 4x trainer > 5.6kk 6x recruiter > 12kk 6x trans > 110kk 4x nego > 80kk ----------- 210 kk and voil+á ur ss is oki How much it? 200+kk it's only ONE HOUR run burner msn in hs < it's nothing How long it was in past? it was FEW DAYS kill npc in lowsec belt First off you can't just go "get a burner" mission. They come along randomly. Second, not everyone with a neg sec status has the standings to go get that mission. Third, 210 million is about 1/5th or so of a PLEX, so somewhere that player got 6 days worth of game time in ISK to fix his sec status. "The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 6157	Posted - 2017.03.12 20:39:09 - [162] - Quote Otlichnick wrote: If gankers were put to a stop it would be easier to mine. Prices would drop for minerals. Ships would be come cheeper. What is the problem with that. Sounds more like content for other people that actually declare war or live in lawless space. More bang for their buck when they plex and more opportunity for engaging game play instead of the ganking 12 on 1 playstyle. Cheaper minerals and ships is not more content. Content is when players interact, either cooperatively or non-cooperatively. Both are good, IMO. Quote: How can i be what is wrong with this game when when this game first started there wernt whole gangs running around wasting ships killing haulers and the game was friggen great then. Highsec was safe. No one was complaining. Content was being created easily. Oh yes there were. Very early on there was M0O (or was it MO0). They set up camp and would destroy any ship coming through. Players would rage about them on the forums. Quote: Now you say how Ganking is essential to eve. That is the biggest made up bs i have ever heard. No one is buying that. Ganking demonstrates the core principle of EVE: if I am willing to accept the consequences of shooting you I can shoot you anywhere in game. Further, destruction is important to the EVE economy and alot of destruction happens in HS and it should remain that way. Quote: Its ruining experiences for lots of players before they even try to have an experience. They are getting ready to have fun and get blown out of the sky before it happens. Really there is no worse game experience when a large group of people prey on individuals for a profession with out risk or repercussion. You have a monopoly on highsec space. These arbitrary rules of how much will get ganked and when can change at any point and for any reason. Nope. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A92Ge2S8M1Y Quote: The people getting ganked are not dumb. They are not lazy. They are just NOT INTERESTED is griefing. Some of us are informed and know about ganking some do not or think its really not worth the effort to protect against since they will not survive no matter the amount of preparation which ofc is true. People getting suicide ganked in HS are doing so because they are imprudent. They can be imprudent due to ignorance, stupidity, laziness, and combinations of those and probably some more. It is not a good thing. And no, preparation can save you. A scout can save you. Not overloading your freighter can save you. Putting a tank on your freighter can save you. Having a scout, not overloading your freighter and putting a tank on it can save you times 3. Like I said, if you anti-tank your freigher, put 6 billion worth of cargo in it, and auto-pillock through Uedama...those are choices the player made. Choices that made him a significant target. Not making those choices makes you much less of a target. "The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 6157	Posted - 2017.03.12 20:46:35 - [163] - Quote Despite all the anti-ganking histrionics tons of cargo value moves around New Eden. http://cdn1.eveonline.com/community/MER/Feb_2017/8_net_exports.png "The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek
Merin Ryskin Peregrine Industries 220	Posted - 2017.03.12 20:51:42 - [164] - Quote Otlichnick wrote: If gankers were put to a stop it would be easier to mine. Prices would drop for minerals. Ships would be come cheeper. What is the problem with that. The obvious problem is that miners would receive less ISK for their products. If you're a smart miner who knows how to avoid getting suicide ganked you should encourage suicide ganking. It keeps prices higher, removes your competition, and even drives demand for more minerals to build new ganking ships. Quote: How can i be what is wrong with this game when when this game first started there wernt whole gangs running around wasting ships killing haulers and the game was friggen great then. Highsec was safe. No one was complaining. Content was being created easily. Suicide ganking (or whatever other method of killing in highsec fit the mechanics) has been part of the game since the beginning. Quote: Now you say how Ganking is essential to eve. That is the biggest made up bs i have ever heard. No one is buying that. It's essential to the premise of EVE, that it's a cold dark universe where survival of the fittest is the primary rule. Suicide ganking must exist because highsec can not be 100% safe space. A fundamental design principle of EVE is that it is possible to kill you no matter where you are, the only question is how hard it will be to do it. Take away suicide ganking and you break that principle, making highsec 100% safe. Quote: Its ruining experiences for lots of players before they even try to have an experience. No it doesn't. First of all, ganking/scamming/etc in the newbie starter systems is a bannable offense. If you see someone preying on new players before they have a chance to experience anything you should report it. Second, ganking only happens if you make yourself a profitable target. Nobody is ganking a week-old character in a T1 frigate fitted with T1 mods. If you've accumulated enough wealth that suicide ganking is a relevant threat then you've had experiences. And by that point in your EVE career you should be aware of the risks and able to take the necessary precautions to avoid getting suicide ganked. Quote: The people getting ganked are not dumb. They are not lazy. They are just NOT INTERESTED is griefing. Some of us are informed and know about ganking some do not or think its really not worth the effort to protect against since they will not survive no matter the amount of preparation which ofc is true. No, as you very nicely demonstrate, they are dumb and/or lazy. It's very easy to avoid getting ganked, if you choose to protect yourself. If you make yourself a target you die, and that's how it should be.
Dom Arkaral The Conference Elite CODE. 1023	Posted - 2017.03.12 21:28:21 - [165] - Quote I'm just going to leave this here... OP needs to HTFU Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester. Broadcast 4 Reps -- YOU ARE NOT ALONE, EVER Instigator of the First ISD Thunderdome CCL Loyalist
Jonah Gravenstein Machiavellian Space Bastards 28019	Posted - 2017.03.12 21:37:21 - [166] - Quote Otlichnick wrote: If gankers were put to a stop it would be easier to mine. Prices would drop for minerals. Ships would be come cheeper. What is the problem with that. Sounds more like content for other people that actually declare war or live in lawless space. More bang for their buck when they plex and more opportunity for engaging game play instead of the ganking 12 on 1 playstyle. It's already easy to mine, and in as close to complete safety as you can get without CCP locking people to green in hisec, it's called paying attention to your environment using all the tools that are at your disposal. Quote: How can i be what is wrong with this game when when this game first started there wernt whole gangs running around wasting ships killing haulers and the game was friggen great then. Highsec was safe. No one was complaining. Content was being created easily. Now you say how Ganking is essential to eve. That is the biggest made up bs i have ever heard. No one is buying that. When was this? Ganking has been in Eve since beta. Quote: Its ruining experiences for lots of players before they even try to have an experience. They are getting ready to have fun and get blown out of the sky before it happens. Really there is no worse game experience when a large group of people prey on individuals for a profession with out risk or repercussion. You have a monopoly on highsec space. These arbitrary rules of how much will get ganked and when can change at any point and for any reason. There most certainly is risk involved in suicide ganking, and there's repercussions too. If you feel that the risk and repercussions aren't enough then it is up to you to make them harsher, you already have the tools to do this. Quote: The people getting ganked are not dumb. They are not lazy. They are just NOT INTERESTED is griefing. I'm pretty sure that doing anything AFK in a PvP game is considered dumb and lazy, putting eleventy billion isk in an unescorted freighter in a full loot PvP game is also considered dumb, especially if the pilot autopillocks it into a chokepoint or hub. Quote: Some of us are informed and know about ganking some do not or think its really not worth the effort to protect against since they will not survive no matter the amount of preparation which ofc is true. Risk mitigation isn't risk elimination, 99.5% of the time the fact that I'm at the keyboard, not packed with shinies, have a respectable tank, know who to look for etc means that someone else gets ganked; nothing is guaranteed but you can tilt the odds considerably in your favour by not being imprudent with your stuff. In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded. New Player FAQ Feyd's Survival Pack
Daichi Yamato Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass 3834	Posted - 2017.03.12 22:06:57 - [167] - Quote Why are low prices bad? Lord above. Just another dishonest carebear that doesn't know his arse from his elbow. Ganking doesn't ruin the game for players who've come for what eve offers. You are prime example of the kind of player whos in the wrong game. Even when you're not getting ganked you're still in and out the game. You 'level up your raven and quit'. Whereas players who come looking for the harsh pvp sandbox stick with the game longer. If you aren't interested in non-consensual pvp you are playing the WRONG game. Its not a secret that eve means 'everyone vs everyone'. Deal with it or gtfo. The game grew in subs every year until they nerfed wardecs and nerfed ganking with the new crimewatch. EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided" Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
Otlichnick Dread Fleet Sanctus Silentium 6	Posted - 2017.03.13 01:24:09 - [168] - Quote Saying ganking on new players is wrong would probably be right. But im not a new player and most people getting ganked are not new players. New players are generallky not an attractive target. Not being new is somehow being the defacto standard which makes it the defence to gank ok. I don't buy it. The only people finding ganking fun is the gankers. This is really a bad model. As far as its necessity to teach players how cold and dark eve is, is just another ploy to justify some really bad etiquette for your ganking actions. Almost every thing about eve can be cold and dark solitary and deadly with risks of getting taken for your things and conquered around every corner. At least in their aspects its not so dam cheaty. Sitting on a gate knowing you will lose your ship with out consequences waiting for haulers to show up is just low and really is just sad gameplay. I doubt most gankers dont know about setting up pos's, mining moons, real small gang warfare (AGAINST OTHER SMALL GANGS). If you want to be a pain in the butt and cause tears you should do it in a more cooperative way with your enemy. shooting fish in a barrel and telling them they shouldn't be fish is not an argument. If people stopped carrying 2b 5b and 50b in a freighter gankers will just start ganking you when you have 500m in your cargo or some other number. Don't try to say that when everyone starts to avoid ganking that gankers will somehow win something and stop ganking. The argument wont go away. Ganking on gates in highsec is wrong and needs to stop. You will never stop seeing people complaining about this. Typing ganking and gankers so many times is starting to be very comedic...
Lawrence Lawton The Conference Elite CODE. 102	Posted - 2017.03.13 01:37:55 - [169] - Quote Dr'Laaq wrote: Since recently i lost my freighter, full set of highgrades and my pod ofcourse.. thanks to 60 or 70 t1 destroyers. Your Charon lossmail includes numerous 100m ISK Taloses and 40m ISK bombers. It was done that way because response times in a 1.0 are very short and we needed to be certain of success on the first attempt. Dr'Laaq wrote: The losses being made on their side , they even MAKE a profit with the insurrance. It's a WIN WIN for them. There is no insurance payout on losses to CONCORD. You don't seem know what you are talking about. Siginek wrote: suicide ganking isnt problem ... problem is that suicide gankers are untouchable ... their ships cost is close to none and they are ignored by most npc so they can freely roam trough space ... i dont mind suicide gankers but i think their actiosn shouldnt be free as they are now ... ATM you can ** off many players and it costs you nothing now adn nothing to future becasue you have nothign to lose ... this should change ... gankers shouldnt be allowed into npc stations Ever notice how those who oppose ganking cannot formulate a coherent sentence but also feel qualified to make gamebreaking changes? Hiasa Kite wrote: Why must the only motive for space violence be money? Why can't it be political, strategic or ideological? We, as players, are free to exert our will in any way we choose, as long as it remains in the sandbox. Carebears are primarily concerned with the generation of ISK. It is a compulsion that has seized them completely. They simply cannot conceive of another motivation to undock. Daichi Yamato wrote:** Thinking back makes you realise how much content has been lost... Carebears have a long history of demanding nerfs for the features that make EVE most interesting. CCP has an equally long history of granting them. Carebears are no less than an existential threat to EVE Online and should be exterminated on sight by anybody who cares about EVE.
Daichi Yamato Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass 3839	Posted - 2017.03.13 02:11:13 - [170] - Quote You talk of etiquette yet you will lie to push your agenda? Eve allows you to attack other players in dishonourable ways. Thats WHY we play, the freedom to make that choice. And try to remember, im not a ganker. Not fun getting ganked? It's about as fun as being evicted from your home in a wh or null. About as fun as being hot dropped by supers. About as fun as losing your stuff to a scam or theft. That's the game. That's why eve is real. Because it doesn't hold your hand. Without them this would be a very hollow place to be. I'd rather be ganked than lose yet more content to people who want to play this game afk and with safeties on. I have no problem with new players or those who take breaks. I have problems with people who refuse to realise that eve is a pvp sandbox and want to turn it into wow in space. They think all mmos should be the same, theme parks and rainbows. But if you look at these players they shortly quit if not quit frequently when they play eve. Eve is not for them. It's like playing Cod and saying it should have more dinosaurs. You start to wonder what the **** are they doing here in the first place. Ganking is not bad etiquette. Eve is not the game where you are 'cooperative' with your enemies. That's why we love it. EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided" Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 6160	Posted - 2017.03.13 02:33:22 - [171] - Quote Otlichnick wrote: Saying ganking on new players is wrong would probably be right. But im not a new player and most people getting ganked are not new players. New players are generallky not an attractive target. Not being new is somehow being the defacto standard which makes it the defence to gank ok. I don't buy it. The only people finding ganking fun is the gankers. This is really a bad model. You really are all over the map, and you post as if nothing anyone else posts matters. You are like a person in their own little echo chamber hearing only the sound of your own voice. Ganking is part of the game. Always has been, hopefully always will be. Ganking is the punishment for being imprudent and foolish. If you are not imprudent or foolish your risk of being ganked is quite small. Quote: As far as its necessity to teach players how cold and dark eve is, is just another ploy to justify some really bad etiquette for your ganking actions. Almost every thing about eve can be cold and dark solitary and deadly with risks of getting taken for your things and conquered around every corner. At least in their aspects its not so dam cheaty. Wrong, wrong, wrong. Ganking is the punishment for being imprudent and foolish. I have not had my haulers ganked in a very long time. Because I am prudent in how I do my hauling. Last time I lost a hauler, not to a suicide gank, I was very, very foolish and imprudent. I was to blame Ganking is the error part of trial-and-error. That you want to circumvent that process speaks ill of you in that you do not want your fellow players to learn from making mistakes. Quote: Sitting on a gate knowing you will lose your ship with out consequences waiting for haulers to show up is just low and really is just sad gameplay. I doubt most gankers dont know about setting up pos's, mining moons, real small gang warfare (AGAINST OTHER SMALL GANGS). If you want to be a pain in the butt and cause tears you should do it in a more cooperative way with your enemy. And the thing is it can be stopped by haulers not being foolish and imprudent. Why are you not hectoring the foolish and imprudent? Why are you here hectoring and lecturing those who punish the foolish and imprudent. Why do you want to reward those who are foolish and imprudent? In fact...I'll go big here. IRL, people like you are what is wrong with the world. Protecting people from that which is foolish and imprudent just gets us more imprudence and foolishness and is the primary reason why we can't have nice things. Because we have to keep bailing out the imprudent and foolish. Screw you. Screw your horse. And screw you riding in on your horse, and kindly GTFO. Quote: shooting fish in a barrel and telling them they shouldn't be fish is not an argument. Yes it is. Being an idiot in this game means somebody is going to eventually shoot you for being an idiot. Don't be an idiot and they can't shoot you. Very freaking simple. Works in real life too. Seriously, you are arguing in favor of imprudence and foolishness. You don't see how ridiculous that is? "The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek
Teckos Pech The Executives Executive Outcomes 6173	Posted - 2017.03.13 02:41:16 - [172] - Quote Daichi Yamato wrote: Not fun getting ganked? It's about as fun as being evicted from your home in a wh or null. About as fun as being hot dropped by supers. Some of the most fun I have had in game has been when I have been on the losing side of a war. Our sniper HAC roams into Goon space back when TEST and Goons were pushing into Fountain? Awesome. Goons always brought the fight. When Goons were losing Deklein I could log in and get in fleets, get fights, killmails, etc. Yes we were losing, but I was having fun. And yes, you can have fun trying to avoid the gankers. There are a variety of ways to do it, and it adds excitement to the game. Without ganking industry would be as boring as mining in a well tanked skiff. "The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek
Merin Ryskin Peregrine Industries 224	Posted - 2017.03.13 03:15:19 - [173] - Quote Otlichnick wrote: The only people finding ganking fun is the gankers. This is really a bad model. And the only people who find mining fun are miners. The only people who find manufacturing fun are the industrial players. Etc. If you don't like being exploited so that the gankers can have fun then stop sucking at EVE, defend yourself (which means near-100% gank immunity), and don't let them gank you. Quote: Sitting on a gate knowing you will lose your ship with out consequences waiting for haulers to show up is just low and really is just sad gameplay. Welcome to EVE. "Low" tactics are the heart of the game and have been so since day 1. The strong prey on the weak, and if you don't like it then don't leave yourself vulnerable to "low" tactics. Quote: I doubt most gankers dont know about setting up pos's, mining moons, real small gang warfare (AGAINST OTHER SMALL GANGS). Lolwut? Who cares if they don't know about industry, they aren't playing that part of the game. There's nothing in EVE that requires you to actively participate in all parts of the game. I don't see any whine threads that all those evil miners don't do enough suicide ganking. Quote: If you want to be a pain in the butt and cause tears you should do it in a more cooperative way with your enemy. Uh, no. This is EVE, not some weird WoW-style arena game. PvP is not a cooperative thing. It's a thing where I decide to kill you, and I make it happen. You either fight back and live, or get killed for my entertainment. If you're expecting a game where you negotiate a way to have both sides cooperate and enjoy a fight then you're in the wrong game. Quote: If people stopped carrying 2b 5b and 50b in a freighter gankers will just start ganking you when you have 500m in your cargo or some other number. Nonsense. There's a lower limit on the cargo that is worth ganking because the price of the suicide ships is more than the expected value of the loot. If all targets stop being profitable to gank then suicide ganking will be almost nonexistent. Maybe a tiny handful of people will do it just for fun, but the vast majority of potential gank targets will be safe.
Ajem Hinken Quaice Industries 45	Posted - 2017.03.13 12:16:23 - [174] - Quote ShahFluffers wrote: Quote: Thus when i stay in highsec concord garantees my safety. Since recently i lost my freighter, full set of highgrades and my pod ofcourse.. thanks to 60 or 70 t1 destroyers. Hyperbole aside, Do you honestly expect that a player, who has taken no precautions and is working with no one, to be able to survive an attack from multiple players who are working together and have planned their attack well in advance? And no where in the game does it say that CONCORD guarantees your safety. Quite the opposite in fact. Hell... most of the advice given to new players is "you are safe nowhere in this game, not even High-sec." Quote: The losses being made on their side , they even MAKE a profit with the insurrance. It's a WIN WIN for them. Gankers do not get insurance. They pay the full price of their ship and the modules on it... whether the gank is successful or not. CONCORD can protect you from most things - your own idiocy is not one of those things. CONCORD ain't your mother. Deal with it. Also, why do you even fly big ships? Big ships = big losses - so if you can do a job just as well in a smaller ship you should.
Dom Arkaral The Conference Elite CODE. 1023	Posted - 2017.03.13 12:25:30 - [175] - Quote Ajem Hinken wrote: ShahFluffers wrote: Quote: Thus when i stay in highsec concord garantees my safety. Since recently i lost my freighter, full set of highgrades and my pod ofcourse.. thanks to 60 or 70 t1 destroyers. Hyperbole aside, Do you honestly expect that a player, who has taken no precautions and is working with no one, to be able to survive an attack from multiple players who are working together and have planned their attack well in advance? And no where in the game does it say that CONCORD guarantees your safety. Quite the opposite in fact. Hell... most of the advice given to new players is "you are safe nowhere in this game, not even High-sec." Quote: The losses being made on their side , they even MAKE a profit with the insurrance. It's a WIN WIN for them. Gankers do not get insurance. They pay the full price of their ship and the modules on it... whether the gank is successful or not. CONCORD can protect you from most things - your own idiocy is not one of those things. CONCORD ain't your mother. Deal with it. Also, why do you even fly big ships? Big ships = big losses - so if you can do a job just as well in a smaller ship you should. Correction CONCORD is only there to punish... not to protect :) Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester. Broadcast 4 Reps -- YOU ARE NOT ALONE, EVER Instigator of the First ISD Thunderdome CCL Loyalist
Jonah Gravenstein Machiavellian Space Bastards 28022	Posted - 2017.03.13 16:28:45 - [176] - Quote Dom Arkaral wrote: CONCORD is only there to punish... not to protect :) Further correction. They do protect one thing, and one thing only, as revealed long ago in the following post. Concord Guy's Cousin wrote: My cousin, Angry Concord Guy, would like to point out that Concord are only responsible for the punishment of criminals, that is their sole remit when it comes to dealing with capsuleers. The only things that Concord protects are beyond the door, especially the donut shops that can be found on level 2 of the food mall present in every station. It is a capsuleers responsibility to provide for their own protection, as far as Concord is concerned those that fail to do so may as well turn in their implants and clones and resume life as a mortal. In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded. New Player FAQ Feyd's Survival Pack
Mike Voidstar Voidstar Free Flight Foundation 1177	Posted - 2017.03.13 18:49:06 - [177] - Quote OP is beyond ridiculous, and I say that as a hard boiled carebear. I'd have tried to move that BPO in a fracking shuttle before I loaded it into a freighter, assuming I ever let it leave that station in the first place. Honestly I'd probably have tried something like an interceptor, but really anything at all would have been better than a freighter. First rule of carebearing- Not being in a fight is the best way to survive one. Keep your huge tanks on ships that take a week to align, I'll take the one that can be in warp, landed on gate and into the next solar system before you can lock it in anything other than another frigate. The only thing wrong with ganking in highsec is using bumping as tackle.
Ajem Hinken Quaice Industries 45	Posted - 2017.03.13 22:07:09 - [178] - Quote Mike Voidstar wrote: OP is beyond ridiculous, and I say that as a hard boiled carebear. I'd have tried to move that BPO in a fracking shuttle before I loaded it into a freighter, assuming I ever let it leave that station in the first place. Honestly I'd probably have tried something like an interceptor, but really anything at all would have been better than a freighter. First rule of carebearing- Not being in a fight is the best way to survive one. Keep your huge tanks on ships that take a week to align, I'll take the one that can be in warp, landed on gate and into the next solar system before you can lock it in anything other than another frigate. The only thing wrong with ganking in highsec is using bumping as tackle. Yeah. I'd like to see something that just pushes lighter ships away, for freighter use. Then freighters can just say no to bumpers, but bumpers can't use the module for bumping without making a ship that weighs more than a small moon.

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