Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 8 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Teckos Pech
The Executives Executive Outcomes
5925
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 01:43:05 -
[91] - Quote
Wolfgang Jannesen wrote:Is there a gameplay problem with shield tanked mining ships or are you just complaining?
Just complaining.
ORE ships are not Gallente ships. This is like complaining you can't armor tank Caldari ships.
"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek
|
Teckos Pech
The Executives Executive Outcomes
5925
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 01:44:24 -
[92] - Quote
Mark O'Helm wrote:Steve Ronuken wrote:The real reason has been given.
More low slots = people will just cram them full of mining laser upgrades, not tank. Then give the ship less mining bonus to regulate the more lowslots. Wich means, more choice. Right?
They'll still put in the mining upgrades.
"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek
|
Mark O'Helm
Fam. Zimin von Reizgenschwendt
268
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 01:45:04 -
[93] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:Amojin wrote:No, he wants a safe space. Someone has said something politically incorrect. Last post on this thread (IB4TL, reported). Opinions are fine - differing opinions are even better. But this whole thread is just ******* stupid.PSA: Please stop feeding the troll. Please. I can assure you, he is not a troll.
Just a very stubborn and religious guy, who cannot loose an argument.
I know him for quite a while and he is not easy to deal with.
But he is a very good patience teacher.
And i have to admit, he has a point. Even if it is does not bother me at all, like him, that i cannot have a mining barge with a proper armor tank option.
"Frauenversteher wissen, was Frauen wollen.
Aber Frauen wollen keine Frauenversteher.
Weil Frauenversteher wissen, was Frauen wollen." (Ein Single)
"Wirklich coolen Leuten ist es egal, ob sie cool sind." (Einer, dem es egal ist)
|
Mark O'Helm
Fam. Zimin von Reizgenschwendt
268
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 01:47:52 -
[94] - Quote
Teckos Pech wrote:Wolfgang Jannesen wrote:Is there a gameplay problem with shield tanked mining ships or are you just complaining? Just complaining. ORE ships are not Gallente ships. This is like complaining you can't armor tank Caldari ships. But mining ship wrecks are gallente wrecks.
"Frauenversteher wissen, was Frauen wollen.
Aber Frauen wollen keine Frauenversteher.
Weil Frauenversteher wissen, was Frauen wollen." (Ein Single)
"Wirklich coolen Leuten ist es egal, ob sie cool sind." (Einer, dem es egal ist)
|
Mark O'Helm
Fam. Zimin von Reizgenschwendt
268
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 01:52:05 -
[95] - Quote
Teckos Pech wrote:Mark O'Helm wrote:Steve Ronuken wrote:The real reason has been given.
More low slots = people will just cram them full of mining laser upgrades, not tank. Then give the ship less mining bonus to regulate the more lowslots. Wich means, more choice. Right? They'll still put in the mining upgrades. He is not the only one, who fly his barge tanky. I know a guy with 20 skiffs, who prefer them at 90khp. And i do it too at weekends. 10 catas can kill a yield fitted skiff. I saw code. do that right next to me.
"Frauenversteher wissen, was Frauen wollen.
Aber Frauen wollen keine Frauenversteher.
Weil Frauenversteher wissen, was Frauen wollen." (Ein Single)
"Wirklich coolen Leuten ist es egal, ob sie cool sind." (Einer, dem es egal ist)
|
Scipio Artelius
Savage Moon Society
46881
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 02:24:50 -
[96] - Quote
Amojin wrote:David Therman wrote:3. You're the first person I've seen complain about this problem of mining ships being predominately shield-tanked... which indicates that this problem is really not a problem at all. Your 3 is really interesting. I also noted this. I looked for other posts to respond to, but I, like you, found none. Very interesting. Very fascinating how much they were willing to spend up two or more months, to just keep the peace... Why would anyone be spending two months or more to get an adequate shield tank?
Most barges and exhumers that fit tank at all seem to go for shield extenders, adaptive invul and some damage specific resists.
It's only a few days of training into T2. |
Mark O'Helm
Fam. Zimin von Reizgenschwendt
268
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 02:34:06 -
[97] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Amojin wrote:David Therman wrote:3. You're the first person I've seen complain about this problem of mining ships being predominately shield-tanked... which indicates that this problem is really not a problem at all. Your 3 is really interesting. I also noted this. I looked for other posts to respond to, but I, like you, found none. Very interesting. Very fascinating how much they were willing to spend up two or more months, to just keep the peace... Why would anyone be spending two months or more to get an adequate shield tank? Most barges and exhumers that fit tank at all seem to go for shield extenders, adaptive invul and some damage specific resists. It's only a few days of training into T2. He is complaining, because he has no choice for a well tanked mining barge, other then to tank it shield wise.
AND HE HATES SHIELDS!
"Frauenversteher wissen, was Frauen wollen.
Aber Frauen wollen keine Frauenversteher.
Weil Frauenversteher wissen, was Frauen wollen." (Ein Single)
"Wirklich coolen Leuten ist es egal, ob sie cool sind." (Einer, dem es egal ist)
|
Scipio Artelius
Savage Moon Society
46881
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 02:52:57 -
[98] - Quote
Mark O'Helm wrote:He is complaining, because he has no choice for a well tanked mining barge, other then to tank it shield wise. AND HE HATES SHIELDS! It seems as though he might not quite understand what skills affect what modules if he thinks two months or more is required to train into an adequate shield tank. Hence the question.
Why he's complaining is obvious. |
Amojin
Entropic Synergies Research
1
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 03:02:32 -
[99] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Mark O'Helm wrote:He is complaining, because he has no choice for a well tanked mining barge, other then to tank it shield wise. AND HE HATES SHIELDS! It seems as though he might not quite understand what skills affect what modules if he thinks two months or more is required to train into an adequate shield tank. Hence the question. Why he's complaining is obvious.
Then I over-estimated your skill line. I admit I have not trained any shield skill past 3. Getting to 5's in all the armor, was over two months.
I'm surprised to see Mark taking my side, but, thanks, Mark. You did well say I am hard to deal with. :P
Let's, however, Scipio, say it takes me only two minutes to get a top-flight shield tanks.
I'm forced to do it. I'd still want an armor tank option, and I'd still extract those two minutes of skills. I don't like having them on my character sheet. More importantly, mining is the only activity where I am forced to. |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Escalating Entropy
11548
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 03:38:10 -
[100] - Quote
Amojin wrote:Let's, however, Scipio, say it takes me only two minutes to get a top-flight shield tank.
I'm forced to do it. I'd still want an armor tank option, and I'd still extract those two minutes of skills. I don't like having them on my character sheet. More importantly, mining is the only activity where I am forced to. I will echo what everyone else has said; your problem is not really a problem. It is a perception.
If you want to only use some "tools" and not others purely because of your own personal preference, you have to accept that you will not be able to do everything you want or perform at the same effectiveness as everyone else who chooses to not abide by your perceived notions of "how things should be."
Also... I am pretty sure there is a DEV out there reading this and laughing his ass off. As are the ISDs.
This thread should have been locked LONG ago for a variety of reasons (ranting being chief among them).
How did you Veterans start?
|
|
Amojin
Entropic Synergies Research
1
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 03:54:38 -
[101] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:Amojin wrote:Let's, however, Scipio, say it takes me only two minutes to get a top-flight shield tank.
I'm forced to do it. I'd still want an armor tank option, and I'd still extract those two minutes of skills. I don't like having them on my character sheet. More importantly, mining is the only activity where I am forced to. I will echo what everyone else has said; your problem is not really a problem. It is a perception. If you want to only use some "tools" and not others purely because of your own personal preference, you have to accept that you will not be able to do everything you want or perform at the same effectiveness as everyone else who chooses to not abide by your perceived notions of "how things should be." Also... I am pretty sure there is a DEV out there reading this and laughing his ass off. As are the ISDs. This thread should have been locked LONG ago for a variety of reasons (ranting being chief among them).
You may very well be right about people laughing their asses off. I'm used to that. Having principles, is at first, a dangerous thing. It's only afterwards, when it catches on, that everyone else feels it safe to join in.
But, then again, everyone, I do seem to remember, said Brexit would fail, the British Economy would collapse. It would never happen. People mocked Christians, until 1948. Oops. When Israel reappeared, making things not so impossible, the world had the fear to consider for at least a few days.
Trump? No, Trump will never be elected. Never. Oops. Laugh all you want. I'm not worried about laughing because I don't respect those doing it. How can I, if they don't even follow their own ideals? |
Chopper Rollins
Far Beyond Triggered
1773
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 04:04:36 -
[102] - Quote
Amojin wrote:I will tell you again. It is offensive to me to require Gallente Starship Engineering for these pieces of ****. This is a Caldari vessel. Every single one of them.
The phrase "x is offensive to me" contains no information worth discussing. I'm sorry you feel that way and we can leave it at that.
Mining barges are from ORE, require Gallente skills to build or invent from and show as Gallente wrecks. Other non-empire hulls require empire skills, very often two different ones, to fly.
Then you turn it RLpolitical and make a damn fool of yourself.
Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good.
|
Amojin
Entropic Synergies Research
1
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 04:11:33 -
[103] - Quote
Chopper Rollins wrote:Amojin wrote:I will tell you again. It is offensive to me to require Gallente Starship Engineering for these pieces of ****. This is a Caldari vessel. Every single one of them.
The phrase "x is offensive to me" contains no information worth discussing. I'm sorry you feel that way and we can leave it at that. Mining barges are from ORE, require Gallente skills to build or invent from and show as Gallente wrecks. Other non-empire hulls require empire skills, very often two different ones, to fly. Then you turn it RLpolitical and make a damn fool of yourself.
Really? 'x is offensive to me' contains nothing worth discussing? Hmm... So when 'Black Lives Matter' or Anifas attacks, because they're offended by something, no information worth discussing has happened?
I'm sorry that we can't have a meaningful dialogue about anything at all, then. When I tell you something is wrong, and then I explain why it's wrong and what values are at play that are being violated, well, if you refuse to hear it, then I guess you refuse.
ORE is not a 'pirate' faction. Those all require two faction lines of skills, don't they? Does ORE? Nope.
Too bad I'm such a fool that we have not communicated anything. |
Nat Silverguard
Aideron Robotics
678
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 04:25:44 -
[104] - Quote
STFU dude and quit dragging the good name of Gallente w/ your 'problems', lel.
if you are a true Gallentean, stop mining and fight the Caldari scum.
Just Add Water
|
Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
1491
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 04:55:03 -
[105] - Quote
I knew I was going to lose, so therefore I won....because I lost (my ****)?
This is some quality shitposting.
Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."
|
Chopper Rollins
Far Beyond Triggered
1774
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 05:41:33 -
[106] - Quote
Amojin wrote:I think those of you in question should have yourself a nice cup of cocoa and play in a nice safe space so you don't get triggered anymore.
Says the turnip who is offended by skill reqs for a pixel spaceship.
Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good.
|
Atomic Virulent
Dark Matter Industrial
182
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 05:52:49 -
[107] - Quote
It's simple. The mods that effect laser efficiency or cap usage, etc are low slot mods... just like their counter parts would be for a combat ship (heat sinks, etc...).
This leaves mids for tank. Show me a mid-slot armor tank mod and I'll show you a big fat LIAR!!! |
Merias Tylar al-Akhwa
Order of Contention
129
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 06:34:30 -
[108] - Quote
Amojin wrote:I think those of you in question should have yourself a nice cup of cocoa and play in a nice safe space so you don't get triggered anymore..
Oh how preciously adorable. He thinks he can deflect his rage off onto everyone else.
Psst. Kiddo. We all know you're getting super triggered here by all the negative responses to your ideas, just own up to it. You're angry that literally no one supported your uninformed opinions. It's natural. But the butthurt from every single post you make can be felt from miles around so denying it just makes you look... Kind of sad? Pathetic? |
SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
3127
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 06:44:39 -
[109] - Quote
Amojin wrote:Neuntausend wrote:A retriever can be hulltanked about as well as it can be shield tanked, and Gallente ships are by no means armor only, if you take a look at shield tanking Ishtars or hull tanking Dominixes for example. The Ninazu even has a remote shield boosting bonus.
Shield tanking just makes a lot more sense for mining boats. Tank aside, what goes into a med slot? Cap modules, tracking modules, propulsion modules and electronic warfare. What goes into low slots? Fitting modules and damage/yield modules for the most part. Now, Mining ships being intended for non-combat roles typically don't need tracking modules, or electronic warfare. They also don't benefit much from propulsion modules in most cases, and if they are skilled/fit properly, they don't require cap- and fitting-modules either. So, that leaves yield modules. And where do those go? They go into lowslots. And if you cram your low slots full of armor modules, then you won't have much left for tank.
If CCP were to introduce armor-bonused mining barges, most people would still just cram the low slots full of yield modules, because greed is good. And after all, the purpose of a barge is to mine lots of ore, so in a way this fitting philosophy makes sense. Armor modules and yield modules are simply in conflict with each other, which is why shield tanking a mining ship makes perfect sense. Already talked about that. Shield tanked Ishtar is a joke, now. They rebalanced a lot of slot layouts to make you stop being an asshat and play your race. The Ishtar one, included. You're not gonna shield tank an Ishtar and get away it, today.
That 4x cap recharger stratios you died in suggests you should probably refrain from commenting on fitting choices or the meta game.
At all.
Ever.
"Help, I'm bored with missions!"
http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
|
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite CODE.
3590
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 06:51:10 -
[110] - Quote
Amojin wrote:Nana Skalski wrote:You dont have to put tank on your mining ships. They will mine just fine without any defence modules. Never heard of CODE, have you? Wow... No, no they won't do just fine without tanks... Have you considered legalising your mining by purchasing a mining permit?
permit tank, best tank
the Code ALWAYS wins
Elite PvPer, #74 in 2014
|
|
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
1483
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 07:18:26 -
[111] - Quote
Amojin wrote:[quote=Neuntausend]I will tell you again. It is offensive to me to require Gallente Starship Engineering for these pieces of ****. This is a Caldari vessel. Every single one of them.
No it is not. ORE is a former Gallente corporation that left the Federation. They decided to shield tank their ships? So what.
Remove standings and insurance.
|
Yarosara Ruil
Haighare Pirates
918
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 07:27:18 -
[112] - Quote
> OP wears a Guristas hat... > Moans about ORE using shields and drones
Take off that hat you filthy casual! Absolutely disgraceful! |
Amon Schi
Bergbau und Co inPanic
5
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 07:48:06 -
[113] - Quote
Amojin wrote:Neuntausend wrote:Amojin wrote:Neuntausend wrote:Man up already and train those shield tanks. No. I'm a Gallente player. And I choose to remain at least loosely tied to that. Which means armor tanks only. If that's your fetish, all the power to you. Don't expect the game to cater to your special snowflake style of playing, though. Normally, I wouldn't. But their past actions, making every role viable with any tank? Well, even if they didn't verbalize it, they said it. They can keep cheating us. I have the skills I need up to 3's and they're not going anywhere until I extract them. But don't be surprised if, someday soon, you see an armor miner than can actually beat the hell out of you. You code cowards are just that. A single miner should not be able to win, certainly, but give a few of us a bit more offense? Oops. It's high time that we had the right to use our racial tanks, and toss a bit more than drones at you. Even a single extra high slot would make 8 of you think again.
Hey Little Boy,
even if all of us try to explain, that miningships are NOT gallentean ships, you try to have the final say. Every race has it's special ship that uses shield instead of armor (or armor instead of shield), Missiles instead of guns and so on.
And be sure - an armortanking exhumer is a bad choise - you don't have enough Slots for mining Upgrades and tank and damage-mods... atmortank makes you even slower than this cans already are....
Learn from the old ones and trust them if they say "armor on miningships is ****"...
Podcast by Amon Schi
|
Mark O'Helm
Fam. Zimin von Reizgenschwendt
268
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 09:39:04 -
[114] - Quote
Amon Schi wrote: And be sure - an armortanking exhumer is a bad choise - you don't have enough Slots for mining Upgrades and tank and damage-mods...
Careful here. That is exactly, what he is complaining about the whole time, and you don't want to agree with him, or do you?
He wants more low slots and the same base armor and shield tank, so he can tank the ships with armor, even if that means an overall reduced base mining bonus on the ship.
Am i right, Amojin?
"Frauenversteher wissen, was Frauen wollen.
Aber Frauen wollen keine Frauenversteher.
Weil Frauenversteher wissen, was Frauen wollen." (Ein Single)
"Wirklich coolen Leuten ist es egal, ob sie cool sind." (Einer, dem es egal ist)
|
Reinhardt Kreiss
TetraVaal Tactical Group
211
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 10:25:14 -
[115] - Quote
This thread.... smh. |
Henry Plantgenet
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
160
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 10:37:34 -
[116] - Quote
Well the prospect would be the example of an armor tanked miner. so OP's premise is wrong ;) |
zluq zabaa
Inhumanum Legionis LowSechnaya Sholupen
28
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 12:04:48 -
[117] - Quote
OP learn to inform yourself. Ever heard about a Gallente Mining Ship called Vexor? There you go. Topic solved. |
Owen Levanth
Sagittarius Unlimited Exploration
543
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 12:19:03 -
[118] - Quote
Amojin wrote:Arthur Aihaken wrote:Look - all ORE ships are shield and/or hull-tanked. If you have this thing with armor-tanking your ORE ship just do it. Not quite. In the real world, if ORE refused to do what I wanted, if enough of us existed, we'd make a company to compete with ORE, with ships that were designed to bonus mining. We can't do that, in the game. But in reality, it would happen. No, I don't have to use a starter ship with a 100mm plate and a laser, to get by. This is a flaw in the game. It should be addressed.
In reality you also have the option to fail hard with your venture. How fun would that be? You're aware that most new companies fail with their products? For every successful start-up, there are a hundred of those failures. Modelling a 99% failure rate for the chance to be the next ORE? And then CCP nerfs your new ships into the ground and you still fail. No thanks.
|
Jdom TheHunter
Quantum Jumpers Elemental Tide
12
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 13:13:12 -
[119] - Quote
A retriever is a horrible shield tank but can make an alright armer tank as it's 1 mid and 3 lows. That said if you don't use mining upgrades then it can take forever to fill her up. So there is an option for a non Caldari like tank. But if you take forever to fill up and CODE, pirates or in null and hostiles show up that tank really isn't gonna do you much good. When mining in Eve I've learned the faster you fill and move the better your chances of not getting zapped. Procurer is best for tank for barges even if you don't like shields.
You can use em and thermal rigs with em and thermal hardeners. You have 2 mids left to use survey and shield extender. Or go booster and extender. Tough tank that can survive highsec gankers and gives you a good shot at survival in lowsec, wh, null excetra. It also allows you to use mining upgrades.
I'm sure yall know this but that's the simple answer. Yes there's armer tank mining ships but it makes sense to use shield based ones if you're looking for survivability. If CCP gave us more low slots then miners would use them for mining ugs and cargo extenders instead of tank. |
ImYourMom
Retribution Holdings Corp Retribution.
114
|
Posted - 2017.02.14 13:19:22 -
[120] - Quote
so the guy asked if he can have a armor tank mining ship - sounds reasonable ... thats it.. stop being typical eve angry trolls, hes not asking for much . wow listen to yourselves |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 8 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |