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Alizabeth Vea
Seraph's Wings
Vengeful Seraph
1065
   |
Posted - 2017.02.21 17:54:14 -
[1] - Quote
So, in all the noise regarding the issue of MITG, et al. v. Sanxing, one theme that has perplexed me is that Sanxing is a humanitarian organization. Furthermore, that this quality should have provided them a shield for attack. (There is some debate on that last point.
I will suspend my normal glib and flippant tone for this thread to ask two questions. I am sure there will be varying opinions and thoughts, but this is good.
First Question: What is a Humanitarian Organization?
Second Question: Should a Humanitarian Organization be afforded some protection from attack, either in custom or de jure?
A brief snippet of another thread where this was discussed.
Kolodi Ramal wrote:Alizabeth Vea wrote:Can someone explain to me what a humanitarian organization is? Just so we're on the same page.
Edit: I know I can be flippant. However, I would like to actually know what you mean by humanitarian organization. What defines it specifically? It varies. What it means when we describe Sanxing as a humanitarian organization: Sanxing was created specifically to administer humanitarian aid to the population of the Jin-Mei homeplanet. The aid came from numerous parties through the Villore Assembly - the job of Sanxing was to disburse it. When the relief effort contributed to the Jin-Mei civil war reaching a ceasefire, our new jobs were to help rebuild and to facilitate peace negotiations. The rebuilding hasn't really depended on interstellar support for a little while now, and our facilitations are well in place, so we turned our capsuleer activity to nurturing the prosperity and security of Lirsautton, Ysiette, and the wider Federation when possible. All the while, our internal policies were designed to prioritize baseliner lives and concerns. It was never for its own sake that Sanxing existed.
Retainer of Lady Newelle and House Sarum.
"Those who step into the light shall be redeemed, the sins of their past cleansed, so that they may know salvation." -Empress Jamyl Sarum I
Virtue. Valor. Victory.
|
Pieter Tuulinen
Akagi Initiative
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
7135
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 18:04:25 -
[2] - Quote
Here's my 2 isk.
I'd say there are two parts to being a humanitarian organisation - one is purpose and the second is execution.
An organisation is humanitarian when it was formed specifically for the purpose of humanitarian works and it retains that status for so long as it performs solely humanitarian works. This doesn't mean that non-humanitarian organisations can't do work that is humanitarian in nature - I-RED does a lot of humanitarian work, after all - but it wasn't formed for that purpose and it does work that isn't focused in that direction.
Should a humanitarian organisation be protected from attack? People will defend institutions that they are friendly to or who they think are important. At the end of the day, that is the sole reason that a group will be protected.
Quite often people will defend an institution that is relevant to their interests. I wouldn't, personally, defend a Gallente focused humanitarian organisation, because that is not relevant to my interests. I would be more likely to defend a Caldari focused humanitarian organisation, because it is.
The real question is the nature of humanitarian work. Sansha believe that their work is for the greater good - most of us would beg to differ. Ston's acolytes believed their work to be humanitarian and some people begged to differ there, too.
If someone's work strengthens an enemy or hurts an ally, it's difficult to view it as humanitarian.
For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead
in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a
hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
|
Hetu Hegirin
Otherwhere Circle
54
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 18:19:55 -
[3] - Quote
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:If someone's work strengthens an enemy or hurts an ally, it's difficult to view it as humanitarian.
While difficult, I'd argue that it is also correct. A commonly-attributed tenet of humanitarianism is the promotion of the general welfare. Enemy or no, they are human. If they are in need and unable to provide for their own essential needs, such as medicine, shelter, or foodstuffs, their enemy status ought to be irrelevant to the humanitarian.
Of course, one could become muddled in proscriptive terminology. I will leave that to the academics. |
Mizhara Del'thul
Coreli Corporation
Mercenary Coalition
1272
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 18:56:56 -
[4] - Quote
There's only one thing that shields any capsuleer organization from attack and that's staying docked and never anchoring anything anywhere. Humanitarian or whatever else the group is doesn't really come into play there. There is no real protection from that and there really shouldn't be.
That is however an entirely different issue than what the attack says about the aggressors. Is it the right thing to do? Well obviously it's morally and ethically abhorrent to do these things for the reasons we've seen in the most recent example, particularly when it's couched in such pathetically transparent dishonesty.
Humanitarian organizations will of course differ from place to place. There are (or were) Imperial entities that called themselves humanitarian while performing acts people from less uncivilized nations would consider utterly inhuman and I'm sure there are similar examples in all four nations. They will go ignored or get destroyed, as such things go in New Eden, and there is nothing legally wrong with this as far as CONCORD and the DED goes. These organizations have no rights or protections beyond what everyone else does.
Should however those who prey on such organizations get off on that basis? Of course not. Any decent human being will recognize them for exactly what they are; Creatures that do not belong in civilized society. That they won't even be honest about their motivations or even their actions makes it even more pathetic. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Akagi Initiative
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
7141
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:02:43 -
[5] - Quote
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:There's only one thing that shields any capsuleer organization from attack and that's staying docked and never anchoring anything anywhere. Humanitarian or whatever else the group is doesn't really come into play there. There is no real protection from that and there really shouldn't be.
That is however an entirely different issue than what the attack says about the aggressors. Is it the right thing to do? Well obviously it's morally and ethically abhorrent to do these things for the reasons we've seen in the most recent example, particularly when it's couched in such pathetically transparent dishonesty.
Humanitarian organizations will of course differ from place to place. There are (or were) Imperial entities that called themselves humanitarian while performing acts people from less uncivilized nations would consider utterly inhuman and I'm sure there are similar examples in all four nations. They will go ignored or get destroyed, as such things go in New Eden, and there is nothing legally wrong with this as far as CONCORD and the DED goes. These organizations have no rights or protections beyond what everyone else does.
Should however those who prey on such organizations get off on that basis? Of course not. Any decent human being will recognize them for exactly what they are; Creatures that do not belong in civilized society. That they won't even be honest about their motivations or even their actions makes it even more pathetic.
There's already a thread for suggesting my mother sells her affections for fiduciary gain, Miz. You don't have to be an objectionable hypocrite in every single discussion. Unless that's simply who you are.
For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead
in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a
hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
|
Ayallah
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
755
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:05:00 -
[6] - Quote
Alizabeth Vea wrote:Second Question: Should a Humanitarian Organization be afforded some protection from attack, either in custom or de jure? Should is irrelevant. Unless an organization or coalition of organizations exists to punish those who attack humanitarian groups then they are not afforded anything.
Without force backing up a protection treaty of humanitarian groups then there is nothing to actually defend them but words. Words that will fail the moment someone wants something one of these groups have or just to kick them down.
Given the wealth of earnest but weak corperations that spring up to defend the innocent and fight piracy and then fade away I think we may still have a long time before some defender emerges capable of protecting non-combatant groups who cannot protect themselves.
But then it just becomes about who is in good standing or has the ISK.
As strength goes.
|
Valerie Valate
Church of The Crimson Saviour
Sani-Sabik
1977
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:06:55 -
[7] - Quote
First Question: What is a Humanitarian Organization?
Second Question: Should a Humanitarian Organization be afforded some protection from attack, either in custom or de jure?
Answer 1:
A Humanitarian Organisation is one whose sole or primary mission is the betterment of all of humankind, rather than amassing territory, wealth, knowledge, or other things.
Religious missionaries, such as my own, glorious, organisation could be classed as such, depending on your point of view, as we seek the betterment of all, regardless of racial origin or social standing, through the power of conversion to being one of God's Chosen.
Some may disagree, but, well, they're wrong. Hurr.
Answer 2:
Civilian vessels, engaged on civilian missions, belonging to humanitarian organisations should receive some level of protection in custom - being given a warning to leave a conflict zone, rather than being fired upon without warning.
And providing relief when there is a disaster, then those vessels should generally be allowed to proceed unmolested.
Smuggling arms or couriering military equipment, renders humanitarian status null and void - they have become involved in the relevant conflict, and cannot expect protection either by custom or by law.
However, this situation is greatly complicated by the nature of humanitarian organisations.
Delivering supplies to a besieged planet for example, would allow the defenders to hold out longer, possibly long enough to be relieved. This constitutes interference in a conflict, and thusly, renders humanitarian status null and void.
Evacuating the sick, wounded, or civilians, from a conflict zone, it could be argued that it should be protected, as those persons are no longer combatants, however, their removal from a besieged planet would allow the defenders to make their existing supplies last longer, which it can be argued constitutes interference in the conflict.
Doctor V. Valate, Professor of Archaeology at Kaztropolis Imperial University.
|
Mizhara Del'thul
Coreli Corporation
Mercenary Coalition
1272
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:07:12 -
[8] - Quote
@ Pieter: Come silence me like you did the others that said things you didn't like. Well, try at any rate.
Or is that just something you do when they can barely fight back? |
Pieter Tuulinen
Akagi Initiative
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
7141
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:09:48 -
[9] - Quote
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:@ Pieter: Come silence me like you did the others that said things you didn't like. Well, try at any rate.
Or is that just something you do when they can barely fight back?
You want to send your second to talk to my second? You want to pick the weapons and a time and place? Shall we have equally fitted frigates and meet at the star in a pre-arranged system?
Miz, you're already kill on sight to just about everyone I know. What do you think you just changed? You don't silence capsuleers by killing a ship or a POCO or a Citadel. Did you hit your head recently? You never used to be this stupid.
For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead
in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a
hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
|
Mizhara Del'thul
Coreli Corporation
Mercenary Coalition
1272
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:13:39 -
[10] - Quote
@ Pieter: So no wardec and trying to take on my corporation or alliance's assets? Just going to whine at me on the forums instead? I mean, I've pretty much done exactly the same things your latest targets did. I've sent mails, I've spoken the truth about you and so on. This was enough to justify the war then, so I wonder what is different now?
Maybe that you don't actually have the ******* guts to take on organizations that aren't largely non-combat entities, so instead you whine here when called on your nonsense.
Hypocrisy indeed. Coward. |
Alizabeth Vea
Seraph's Wings
Vengeful Seraph
1065
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:18:15 -
[11] - Quote
Back on point, would SERAPH be categorized as a humanitarian organization? We fight the Drifters for the betterment of humanity. I could argue that this service is a public good.
Retainer of Lady Newelle and House Sarum.
"Those who step into the light shall be redeemed, the sins of their past cleansed, so that they may know salvation." -Empress Jamyl Sarum I
Virtue. Valor. Victory.
|
Mizhara Del'thul
Coreli Corporation
Mercenary Coalition
1273
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:28:36 -
[12] - Quote
Alizabeth Vea wrote:Back on point, would SERAPH be categorized as a humanitarian organization? We fight the Drifters for the betterment of humanity. I could argue that this service is a public good.
Not quite, by the textbook definitions. Humanitarian Organizations are those that perform humanitarian aid. This is most often considered to be material, logistics and medical aid to people in need. Fighting the Drifters may lead to the betterment of humanity in general, but the means are very different. It's a militaristic organization.
However, this isn't taking capsuleer life in general into account. We differ from the baseliner organizations in many respects, one of them being that combat is part of almost all our lives. Even the humblest miner will likely be in combat with pirates or other capsuleers at some point, so there's the question if this particular distinction between us and baseliners stretch so far as to make combat operations something we can include in 'humanitarian aid'.
I don't think it does, for one because it dilutes the language to the point of nigh gibberish, and secondly because we are fully able to divide between these parts of our lives and careers, as combat operations can be incidental, intentional, aggressive or defensive and doesn't necessarily have to be taken into account when we define ourselves as humanitarian organizations or not.
An organization that solely defends itself from aggression or perhaps supplements their humanitarian efforts with adding security operations against pirates and so on can be considered humanitarian as long as this combat isn't the main means or activity as it were. So, I think we can as far as capsuleers go consider something like this a rule of thumb; Humanitarian Organizations primarily focus on humanitarian aid, combat operations are either related or unrelated to this main focus.
Simple enough, but of course New Eden doesn't do 'simple' so there'll probably be a hundred arguments that can prove me very wrong here. |
Lunarisse Aspenstar
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
1055
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:30:37 -
[13] - Quote
Alizabeth Vea wrote:Back on point, would SERAPH be categorized as a humanitarian organization? We fight the Drifters for the betterment of humanity. I could argue that this service is a public good.
I would completely agree Seraph could and should be so defined, even if i have to use *she grits her teeth as to having to cite Valerie Valate* Dr. Valate's definition "A Humanitarian Organisation is one whose sole or primary mission is the betterment of all of humankind, rather than amassing territory, wealth, knowledge, or other things." The drifter threat, threatens all of mankind and Seraph's efforts are a noble one and worthy of the highest praise.
I think Pieter's definition is a bit circular as the definition of humanitarian is highly subjective. There are many different kinds of humanitarian services depending on the worldviews involved and the ends sought to be improved for mankind, or the societies, in question, e.g. spreading a faith, combating disease and poverty, eradication of threats to civilization. What is humanitarian for some, may not be for others.
|
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
2958
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:38:04 -
[14] - Quote
Alizabeth Vea wrote:Back on point, would SERAPH be categorized as a humanitarian organization? We fight the Drifters for the betterment of humanity. I could argue that this service is a public good.
That would kind of open the door to anybody who's engaged in what they consider "the good fight" calling themselves "humanitarian." For example, both PIE and Ushra'Khan would probably be able to justify a claim that way. It'd get a little absurd in a hurry.
Really I'm not sure you get to call yourself "humanitarian" while shooting at anybody at all, even if you're not shooting at things widely thought of as "people". There are a lot of people around who dispute the humanity of their opponents. |
Evi Polevhia
True Slave Foundations
Monyusaiya Industry Trade Group
1289
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:40:56 -
[15] - Quote
By such a definition, I would say Nation qualifies. Only goes to show how subjective the definition can be. |
Mizhara Del'thul
Coreli Corporation
Mercenary Coalition
1273
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:41:57 -
[16] - Quote
Aria Jenneth wrote:Alizabeth Vea wrote:Back on point, would SERAPH be categorized as a humanitarian organization? We fight the Drifters for the betterment of humanity. I could argue that this service is a public good. That would kind of open the door to anybody who's engaged in what they consider "the good fight" calling themselves "humanitarian." For example, both PIE and Ushra'Khan would probably be able to justify a claim that way. It'd get a little absurd in a hurry. Really I'm not sure you get to call yourself "humanitarian" while shooting at anybody at all, even if you're not shooting at things widely thought of as "people". There are a lot of people around who dispute the humanity of their opponents.
That makes capsuleer life rather difficult though. Combat is very much part of our lives, even for most non-combat entities. I still say that if the primary activity of the organization is humanitarian aid and efforts, that counts. There is of course risk of this being utilized as a veil for nastier activities, but that's pretty much the case anyway.
Combat is very much part of almost all capsuleer organizations, but as long as it's not the main activity it shouldn't necessarily detract from the main focus of the organization. |
Alizabeth Vea
Seraph's Wings
Vengeful Seraph
1065
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:44:33 -
[17] - Quote
So, some combat is allowed, so long as it is not the primary focus, Ms. Del'thul?
Retainer of Lady Newelle and House Sarum.
"Those who step into the light shall be redeemed, the sins of their past cleansed, so that they may know salvation." -Empress Jamyl Sarum I
Virtue. Valor. Victory.
|
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
2958
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:44:57 -
[18] - Quote
Evi Polevhia wrote:By such a definition, I would say Nation qualifies. Only goes to show how subjective the definition can be.
Yeah. This. ... I think we're really better off restricting it to organizations who DO focus on medical care, peace initiatives, and so on, and DO NOT shoot things or people.
"Long live the humanitarians, and death to our enemies!" is not a battle cry I want to hear very much. |
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
2958
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:46:26 -
[19] - Quote
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:Combat is very much part of our lives, even for most non-combat entities.
In that case, Miz, maybe we just shouldn't go around easily calling ourselves humanitarians. |
Alizabeth Vea
Seraph's Wings
Vengeful Seraph
1065
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:49:19 -
[20] - Quote
I want to clarify that I am very interested in the debate and viewpoints. I doubt there will ever be one answer everyone is happy with.
It's just a word that I've seen used a few times and found interesting. Also, the Sisters of EVE might be considered humanitarian, but I tell you, they are up to some shady stuff.
Retainer of Lady Newelle and House Sarum.
"Those who step into the light shall be redeemed, the sins of their past cleansed, so that they may know salvation." -Empress Jamyl Sarum I
Virtue. Valor. Victory.
|
Valerie Valate
Church of The Crimson Saviour
Sani-Sabik
1980
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:52:43 -
[21] - Quote
Alizabeth Vea wrote: the Sisters of EVE might be considered humanitarian.
Those naked strumpets ? Humanitarian ?
Outrageous !
Doctor V. Valate, Professor of Archaeology at Kaztropolis Imperial University.
|
Mizhara Del'thul
Coreli Corporation
Mercenary Coalition
1273
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:56:09 -
[22] - Quote
Basically... yeah, some combat is okay. We are fairly unique in New Eden that we don't have anyone to protect us other than ourselves. Humanitarian organizations elsewhere can rely on legal protection or have other forms of protection ensuring that the organization itself can do nothing but humanitarian work.
We don't have that luxury. If we do anything besides staying docked, it's entirely up to us to protect those ventures, be they humanitarian or not.
Combat on its own shouldn't be a factor in whether or not a capsuleer organization qualifies as humanitarian. It's the motivations and primary focus of it that should be the prime yardstick and any combat activity on record needs to be evaluated on its own, to see if it's wanton enough to disqualify the humanitarian aspect.
And just in case someone misunderstands me, no, I have never been part of a humanitarian organization, I personally do not in any way qualify as a humanitarian worker and so on and so forth. The work I do through and for the Network, the staging center in Muttokon or the aid services for freed slaves and so on fall short of those prerequisites on several points. |
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
2958
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 19:57:18 -
[23] - Quote
Alizabeth Vea wrote:Also, the Sisters of EVE might be considered humanitarian, but I tell you, they are up to some shady stuff.
Well-- really, maybe that's even kind of what this discussion is arising from: "humanitarian" is a great adjective to hide a bunch of awful stuff behind.
The SOE's done some great humanitarian work, and I'm not sure many people really dispute that. That they are, as a whole, a humanitarian organization has gotten a little hard to defend as a statement, though, especially since they gave everybody the Alpha-class clone technology. That basically meant they very proactively helped a very deadly class of weapon proliferate.
Yes, I mean us. Opposing us was, on its face, a more humanitarian policy.
Lately I start to wonder whether "the Sisters of Eve is a humantarian organization" might be most accurate when talking about diet.
(Joking. But.) |
Kador Ouryon
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
152
|
Posted - 2017.02.21 21:05:54 -
[24] - Quote
Alizabeth Vea wrote:Should a Humanitarian Organization be afforded some protection from attack, either in custom or de jure?
Doesn't really matter. It was a pitiable display of bravado from State based groups I should be able to respect...
They systematically proved themselves beneath contempt.
What fills the soul?
Something that guides a lost child back to it's parents arms.
Or waves that dye the shores of the heart gold.
A blessed breath to nurture life in a land of wheat.
Or the path the Sef descend drawn in ash.
In the wake of fire.
|
Pieter Tuulinen
Akagi Initiative
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
7142
|
Posted - 2017.02.22 05:36:40 -
[25] - Quote
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:@ Pieter: So no wardec and trying to take on my corporation or alliance's assets? Just going to whine at me on the forums instead? I mean, I've pretty much done exactly the same things your latest targets did. I've sent mails, I've spoken the truth about you and so on. This was enough to justify the war then, so I wonder what is different now?
Maybe that you don't actually have the ******* guts to take on organizations that aren't largely non-combat entities, so instead you whine here when called on your nonsense.
Hypocrisy indeed. Coward.
Winds, you've been the one crying about it, Miz. If you don't like what the organisations involved did, why don't YOU do something about it, instead of being the proof of your own pudding.
Explain to me why I should have to put the legwork in, when you're the one with the chapped ass, here.
You know where to find me, are y our u going to bark all day, yard dog?
For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead
in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a
hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
|
Pieter Tuulinen
Akagi Initiative
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
7142
|
Posted - 2017.02.22 05:50:47 -
[26] - Quote
Kador Ouryon wrote:Alizabeth Vea wrote:Should a Humanitarian Organization be afforded some protection from attack, either in custom or de jure?
Doesn't really matter. It was a pitiable display of bravado from State based groups I should be able to respect... They systematically proved themselves beneath contempt.
Ah, the respect of jaiiji. How much we crave that.
For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead
in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a
hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
|
Nameira Vanis-Tor
Anshar Incorporated
Monyusaiya Industry Trade Group
394
|
Posted - 2017.02.22 07:55:42 -
[27] - Quote
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:@ Pieter: So no wardec and trying to take on my corporation or alliance's assets? Just going to whine at me on the forums instead? I mean, I've pretty much done exactly the same things your latest targets did. I've sent mails, I've spoken the truth about you and so on. This was enough to justify the war then, so I wonder what is different now?
Maybe that you don't actually have the ******* guts to take on organizations that aren't largely non-combat entities, so instead you whine here when called on your nonsense.
Hypocrisy indeed. Coward.
Aside from interpretation of 'truth' from someone uninvolved in events. There is a difference between the actions of a corporations CEO and a member of a corporation undertaking personal interests/grudges. Your equivalency to the situation is false, unless you speak for Corelli or MC suddenly?
It sounds like you are bordering on involving MC in what appears to be a personal objection to our actions; which is likely well beyond your authority. |
Mizhara Del'thul
Coreli Corporation
Mercenary Coalition
1287
|
Posted - 2017.02.22 08:10:31 -
[28] - Quote
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:Mizhara Del'thul wrote:@ Pieter: So no wardec and trying to take on my corporation or alliance's assets? Just going to whine at me on the forums instead? I mean, I've pretty much done exactly the same things your latest targets did. I've sent mails, I've spoken the truth about you and so on. This was enough to justify the war then, so I wonder what is different now?
Maybe that you don't actually have the ******* guts to take on organizations that aren't largely non-combat entities, so instead you whine here when called on your nonsense.
Hypocrisy indeed. Coward. Winds, you've been the one crying about it, Miz. If you don't like what the organisations involved did, why don't YOU do something about it, instead of being the proof of your own pudding? Explain to me why I should have to put the legwork in, when you're the one with the chapped ass, here? You know where to find me. If you want to teach me a lesson, stop talking about hitting me and come hit me. Maybe your words would become worth listening to if they were attached to deeds.
I have never talked about hitting you, Pieter. All I've done is show right here that you and yours are very selective about who you try to suppress with violence and who you just whine and whinge about when they point out your failings and lies. Again, I am guilty of every little thing you used to justify your attack on your latest targets and we have plenty of shiny assets in space. Tell me, why are you not jumping to 'defend honor' and so on? Why is it suddenly on others to come be as low and pathetic as you and yours? Because you know you can't just silence this one with violence.
You know what would have avoided all of this? Honesty. This kind of thing happens almost every damn day in New Eden and people would barely have raised an eyebrow at it, if it hadn't been for the smarmy torrent of self-contradictory and pathetic pretense about why you did it. Just another day in New Eden, just another act of thuggery and destruction for self-aggrandizement and personal profits and people would have shrugged and moved on.
It just speaks volumes that you and yours still have to play pretend about it and then whine pitifully when called on it, and then demonstrate the hypocrisy quite clearly, that your 'honor' turns out to be worthless when you can't 'defend it' with thuggery. Not even just a coward, but a lying one. Pathetic. |
Elanion
71
|
Posted - 2017.02.22 08:11:34 -
[29] - Quote
As spokesperson for UC, I would invite New Eden's capsuleers to refrain from flippant assumptions that every member of every corporation makes every public remark as an official dictum of policy and/or intent for their respective employers.
Your cluster thanks you.
RIP YC111-115 GÇó "The project discarded, its subjects forgotten... thence must the burden be shouldered."
|
Kalaratiri
Hard Knocks Inc.
Hard Knocks Citizens
863
|
Posted - 2017.02.22 08:30:37 -
[30] - Quote
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:Again, I am guilty of every little thing you used to justify your attack on your latest targets and we have plenty of shiny assets in space.
No you're not.
She's mad but she's magic, there's no lie in her fire.
This is possibly one of the worst threads in the history of these forums. - CCP Falcon
I don't remember when last time you said something that wasn't either dumb or absurd. - Diana Kim
|
Mizhara Del'thul
Coreli Corporation
Mercenary Coalition
1287
|
Posted - 2017.02.22 08:31:35 -
[31] - Quote
Kalaratiri wrote:Mizhara Del'thul wrote:Again, I am guilty of every little thing you used to justify your attack on your latest targets and we have plenty of shiny assets in space. No you're not.
Might want to go have a lot of posts in that other thread 'justifying' the attacks edited out then. |
Kalaratiri
Hard Knocks Inc.
Hard Knocks Citizens
863
|
Posted - 2017.02.22 08:46:22 -
[32] - Quote
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:Kalaratiri wrote:Mizhara Del'thul wrote:Again, I am guilty of every little thing you used to justify your attack on your latest targets and we have plenty of shiny assets in space. No you're not. Might want to go have a lot of posts in that other thread 'justifying' the attacks edited out then.
Why?
She's mad but she's magic, there's no lie in her fire.
This is possibly one of the worst threads in the history of these forums. - CCP Falcon
I don't remember when last time you said something that wasn't either dumb or absurd. - Diana Kim
|
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
3055
|
Posted - 2017.02.22 09:00:20 -
[33] - Quote
The State Protectorate is a humanitarian organization, as we slay those, who threaten the humanity - Gallente Federation armed forces. Oh, and TLF of course, because these savages threaten the civilization as well.
Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.
In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
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Syenna Celeste
Anshar Incorporated
Monyusaiya Industry Trade Group
47
|
Posted - 2017.02.22 09:57:03 -
[34] - Quote
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:Kalaratiri wrote:Mizhara Del'thul wrote:Again, I am guilty of every little thing you used to justify your attack on your latest targets and we have plenty of shiny assets in space. No you're not. Might want to go have a lot of posts in that other thread 'justifying' the attacks edited out then.
Are we thinking of the same thread?
Thinking about it I can see why you'd have trouble reading from the usual Minmatar engagement range of 300km. What I didn't realise is that this methodology carried across to the IGS.
Put your hands around my heart and squeeze me until I'm dry.
|
Tyrukko Sakala
Guri Raiders
14
|
Posted - 2017.02.23 20:52:51 -
[35] - Quote
I wouldn't mind a list of these Humanitarian groups. I'm sure we could work out an arrangement to ensure their protection.
Guri Raiders Pirate // Don't want to get your hands dirty? Drop a line.
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Olga Drottning
Antumbra
0
|
Posted - 2017.02.23 22:01:38 -
[36] - Quote
Alizabeth Vea wrote:
Second Question: Should a Humanitarian Organization be afforded some protection from attack, either in custom or de jure?
I don't see any reason why capsuleer organizations should need any protection in and of themselves. If a group devoted to the protection of baseliners is incapable of defending itself then it isn't serving its purpose. Of course, I'm biased: Antumbra is founded on this principal. |
Nameira Vanis-Tor
Anshar Incorporated
Monyusaiya Industry Trade Group
394
|
Posted - 2017.02.23 22:21:23 -
[37] - Quote
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:Pieter Tuulinen wrote:Mizhara Del'thul wrote:@ Pieter: So no wardec and trying to take on my corporation or alliance's assets? Just going to whine at me on the forums instead? I mean, I've pretty much done exactly the same things your latest targets did. I've sent mails, I've spoken the truth about you and so on. This was enough to justify the war then, so I wonder what is different now?
Maybe that you don't actually have the ******* guts to take on organizations that aren't largely non-combat entities, so instead you whine here when called on your nonsense.
Hypocrisy indeed. Coward. Winds, you've been the one crying about it, Miz. If you don't like what the organisations involved did, why don't YOU do something about it, instead of being the proof of your own pudding? Explain to me why I should have to put the legwork in, when you're the one with the chapped ass, here? You know where to find me. If you want to teach me a lesson, stop talking about hitting me and come hit me. Maybe your words would become worth listening to if they were attached to deeds. I have never talked about hitting you, Pieter. All I've done is show right here that you and yours are very selective about who you try to suppress with violence and who you just whine and whinge about when they point out your failings and lies. Again, I am guilty of every little thing you used to justify your attack on your latest targets and we have plenty of shiny assets in space. Tell me, why are you not jumping to 'defend honor' and so on? Why is it suddenly on others to come be as low and pathetic as you and yours? Because you know you can't just silence this one with violence. You know what would have avoided all of this? Honesty. This kind of thing happens almost every damn day in New Eden and people would barely have raised an eyebrow at it, if it hadn't been for the smarmy torrent of self-contradictory and pathetic pretense about why you did it. Just another day in New Eden, just another act of thuggery and destruction for self-aggrandizement and personal profits and people would have shrugged and moved on. It just speaks volumes that you and yours still have to play pretend about it and then whine pitifully when called on it, and then demonstrate the hypocrisy quite clearly, that your 'honor' turns out to be worthless when you can't 'defend it' with thuggery. Not even just a coward, but a lying one. Pathetic. Nameira Vanis-Tor wrote:Aside from interpretation of 'truth' from someone uninvolved in events. There is a difference between the actions of a corporations CEO and a member of a corporation undertaking personal interests/grudges. Your equivalency to the situation is false, unless you speak for Corelli or MC suddenly?
It sounds like you are bordering on involving MC in what appears to be a personal objection to our actions; which is likely well beyond your authority. I speak for no one but myself indeed and I have no influence on who or where Mercenary Coalition deploys against. Since even just undocking for a single op tends to have a price tag of quite a few billion, this largely safeguards almost every entity that is ever represented on these boards from attention simply because it's never a cost effective measure. It is still rather telling that you and yours scrounge together, what... four or was it five different wardecs over the words of a small and harmless group and then backpedal hard and instead just whine when that's not so easily achieved. Or is your 'honor' suddenly worth quite a bit less when it is impugned by someone like me rather than an easy punching bag?
I'm glad you have such a low opinion of our opponents in the war of MITG (70 pilots) vs Sanxing, Electus Matari and Villore Accords (237 Pilots). Fortunately for our 'punching bag' they dared not risk too much in opposing us, although they had multiple opportunities and plenty of time to form a response.
The other war decs were entirely those other entities affairs. Additionally Sanxing only received aid against our war declaration to my knowledge, their allies could have engaged our assets without having to worry about any other parties on the field. In fact we were disappointed that they didn't make an appearance.
We would happily relieve you of some assets should the opportunity arise, a mercenary who shrieks in sympathy pain with incompetent humanitarians and their mostly cowering allies is hardly worthy of the profession due to rank hypocrisy. Shout 'oh the humanity' as much as you like whilst you go on about your clients business of killing for cash.
For us you as a pilot are a target of opportunity, for you we are unassailable and that drives you to these great shows of public outrage backed by total inaction. |
Mizhara Del'thul
Coreli Corporation
Mercenary Coalition
1307
|
Posted - 2017.02.23 22:28:35 -
[38] - Quote
Oh dear, I must have hit a nerve. An illiterate one at that, or perhaps it's just cherrypicking and willful ignorance on display. Next you'll tell me all twenty thousand goons are combat operatives or something.
What astounds me is just how many of you starts whining and whinging when called on your nonsense. |
Nameira Vanis-Tor
Anshar Incorporated
Monyusaiya Industry Trade Group
397
|
Posted - 2017.02.23 22:44:53 -
[39] - Quote
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:Oh dear, I must have hit a nerve. An illiterate one at that, or perhaps it's just cherrypicking and willful ignorance on display. Next you'll tell me all twenty thousand goons are combat operatives or something.
What astounds me is just how many of you starts whining and whinging when called on your nonsense.
Your grief at the loss of Sanxing will pas Miz, now go back to killing who you are told, when you are told at the behest of those who are rich but not strong/motivated enough to handle their own affairs or are not bold enough to strike openly against their targets. Mind you don't fall from your imaginary high horse whilst doing so.
(As a disclaimer I have nothing against people who hire Mercs, I merely take issue with being lectured on morals by a murderous pawn.) |
Kolodi Ramal
Sanxing
389
|
Posted - 2017.02.23 22:50:43 -
[40] - Quote
Nameira Vanis-Tor wrote:MITG (70 pilots) vs Sanxing, Electus Matari and Villore Accords (237 Pilots)
Pretending those numbers mean anything is laughable.
Sanxing had no more than 5 potentially available pilots, GMVA couldn't join the war until after the second vulnerability window because of complications, and the mercenaries Sanxing hired never showed. So that's why there was only EM at the second vulnerability window, and obviously they didn't bring all their pilots because it's impossible to field all your pilots at once unless you strictly never recruit anyone who isn't on the same shift and kick anyone who's not consistently active.
For the third vulnerability window the number of wardecs on us went from four to six. Not knowing how many pilots would be attacking, I decided it wasn't worth risking any more lives. 64, it turned out: not a force we would have had a real chance of countering. |
Evi Polevhia
True Slave Foundations
Monyusaiya Industry Trade Group
1293
|
Posted - 2017.02.23 22:56:06 -
[41] - Quote
Kolodi Ramal wrote:Nameira Vanis-Tor wrote:MITG (70 pilots) vs Sanxing, Electus Matari and Villore Accords (237 Pilots) Pretending those numbers mean anything is laughable. Sanxing had no more than 5 potentially available pilots, GMVA couldn't join the war until after the second vulnerability window because of complications, and the mercenaries Sanxing hired never showed. So that's why there was only EM at the second vulnerability window, and obviously they didn't bring all their pilots because it's impossible to field all your pilots at once unless you strictly never recruit anyone who isn't on the same shift and kick anyone who's not consistently active. For the third vulnerability window the number of wardecs on us went from four to six. Not knowing how many pilots would be attacking, I decided it wasn't worth risking any more lives. 64, it turned out: not a force we would have had a real chance of countering.
I am sorry you have terrible friends.
The Foundations is always looking for new friends. Please stop by one day for a drink, Pilot Ramal. |
Mizhara Del'thul
Coreli Corporation
Mercenary Coalition
1308
|
Posted - 2017.02.23 22:58:21 -
[42] - Quote
Since you seem to think our operations are similar to the highsec 'mercs' (spirits below, that's still so adorable every time) you're familiar with, I invite you to look at the contracts we take and against who we fight. Every last enemy we've fought are one or another nullsec 'empire', all of which are combat entities and aggressors on their own. The pilots high on their own bloodlust and fighting for territory, fame or money.
It's nullsec, there quite literally are no innocents. Only us monsters. Unlike, of course, those highsec dwelling organizations you seem to think qualify for violent retribution over something as heinous as truthful words.
If you wish to call me a hypocrite, you should be using my time in the pendulum wars or perhaps my known actions against Imperial interests. Those have been called the acts of a terrorist and worse. Yes, I most certainly am murderous and every bit as vile as you people are. Not because I hone my skills in Mercenary Coalition until my people need me, or because I fight entities capable of fighting back, but because of my actual crimes and sins.
There is a difference though, one that you people seem completely incapable of grasping. I have never pretended otherwise. That you are so incapable of being honest about who and what you are, and what you do is the reason I take exception. I have done even worse things than you, but I never pretended it was honorable.
You're being lectured less on morals, and more on the fact that you're so pathetically weak that you can't even face what you do honestly. Even children eventually learn that playing pretend is for games and play time. Not when dealing with war, violence and murder. |
Ashlar Vellum
Esquire Armaments
389
|
Posted - 2017.02.23 23:05:45 -
[43] - Quote
Nameira Vanis-Tor wrote:Mizhara Del'thul wrote:Oh dear, I must have hit a nerve. An illiterate one at that, or perhaps it's just cherrypicking and willful ignorance on display. Next you'll tell me all twenty thousand goons are combat operatives or something.
What astounds me is just how many of you starts whining and whinging when called on your nonsense. Your grief at the loss of Sanxing will pas Miz, now go back to killing who you are told, when you are told at the behest of those who are rich but not strong/motivated enough to handle their own affairs or are not bold enough to strike openly against their targets. Mind you don't fall from your imaginary high horse whilst doing so. (As a disclaimer I have nothing against people who hire Mercs, I merely take issue with being lectured on morals by a murderous pawn.)
She is right tho about hitting a nerve somehow, you are migrating from one thread to another arguing and defending your actions. In the end why do you care so much what a pawn thinks. |
Kolodi Ramal
Sanxing
393
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 01:12:09 -
[44] - Quote
Evi Polevhia wrote:I am sorry you have terrible friends.
So what you're saying is that friends are terrible unless they never have anything else going on and always have all their pilots available at one time. |
Elanion
73
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 01:19:27 -
[45] - Quote
The value of a friend is directly correlated to the intensity of their bloodlust. This is Capsuleering 101, really.
RIP YC111-115 GÇó "The project discarded, its subjects forgotten... thence must the burden be shouldered."
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Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
2972
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 02:25:09 -
[46] - Quote
Elanion wrote:The value of a friend is directly correlated to the intensity of their bloodlust. This is Capsuleering 101, really.
This is awful, but it seems a little ... true. That might even kind of be my primary value to the Praefecta.
Only, that would mean that if I get more reluctant to kill people, I become less valuable. I'm sure she'd deny that's the case, but really the greatest utility of our class is our capacity for mass destruction.
What's the use of a blade that won't cut? |
Kolodi Ramal
Sanxing
393
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 02:38:03 -
[47] - Quote
Aria Jenneth wrote:What's the use of a blade that won't cut?
Butter. |
Elmund Egivand
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
2045
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 03:01:40 -
[48] - Quote
Kolodi Ramal wrote:Aria Jenneth wrote:What's the use of a blade that won't cut? Butter.
The block of butter still has to be cut.
A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.
|
Kolodi Ramal
Sanxing
394
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 06:00:02 -
[49] - Quote
Elmund Egivand wrote:Kolodi Ramal wrote:Aria Jenneth wrote:What's the use of a blade that won't cut? Butter. The block of butter still has to be cut.
What about nut butter? |
Nick Bete
The Scope
Gallente Federation
519
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 06:18:36 -
[50] - Quote
Evi Polevhia wrote:
I am sorry you have terrible friends.
The Foundations is always looking for new friends. Please stop by one day for a drink, Pilot Ramal.
At least he has friends unlike you, you crap-spewing troll.
Little wonder why everyone hates you. |
Jev North
Anshar Incorporated
Monyusaiya Industry Trade Group
656
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 06:45:51 -
[51] - Quote
Nick Bete wrote:At least he has friends unlike you, you crap-spewing troll.
Judging by a certain killmail, she has about 63 friends at minimum.
Who are you, again?
Bullets have a beauty and I don't know why.
|
Nameira Vanis-Tor
Anshar Incorporated
Monyusaiya Industry Trade Group
398
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 07:01:32 -
[52] - Quote
Ashlar Vellum wrote:Nameira Vanis-Tor wrote:Mizhara Del'thul wrote:Oh dear, I must have hit a nerve. An illiterate one at that, or perhaps it's just cherrypicking and willful ignorance on display. Next you'll tell me all twenty thousand goons are combat operatives or something.
What astounds me is just how many of you starts whining and whinging when called on your nonsense. Your grief at the loss of Sanxing will pas Miz, now go back to killing who you are told, when you are told at the behest of those who are rich but not strong/motivated enough to handle their own affairs or are not bold enough to strike openly against their targets. Mind you don't fall from your imaginary high horse whilst doing so. (As a disclaimer I have nothing against people who hire Mercs, I merely take issue with being lectured on morals by a murderous pawn.) She is right tho about hitting a nerve somehow, you are migrating from one thread to another arguing and defending your actions. In the end why do you care so much what a pawn thinks.
If you check this threads history you will find that it was Miz who brought up the situation again. I am happy to argue with her wherever she chooses.
As for you Miz I may look into hiring MC the next time I want to smash a high sec Astra just for the amusement of curing your cognitive dissonance :-)
|
Nick Bete
The Scope
Gallente Federation
519
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 07:18:13 -
[53] - Quote
Just someone who hates blowhards and bullies. And who the hell are you? |
Elmund Egivand
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
2046
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 07:27:18 -
[54] - Quote
Kolodi Ramal wrote:Elmund Egivand wrote:Kolodi Ramal wrote:Aria Jenneth wrote:What's the use of a blade that won't cut? Butter. The block of butter still has to be cut. What about nut butter?
Use a spoon. It can scoop up a bigger glob of nut butter to spread across the bread. Blade is not necessary.
A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.
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Jev North
Anshar Incorporated
Monyusaiya Industry Trade Group
656
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 07:32:45 -
[55] - Quote
Nick Bete wrote:Just someone who hates blowhards and bullies. And who the hell are you?
Nick, Nick. I'd tell you to never change, but since this is the exact same question you asked me when I first noticed you, about seven? Eight? years ago?
It's pretty clear you haven't.
Bullets have a beauty and I don't know why.
|
Evi Polevhia
True Slave Foundations
Monyusaiya Industry Trade Group
1295
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 10:11:17 -
[56] - Quote
Nick Bete wrote:Evi Polevhia wrote:
I am sorry you have terrible friends.
The Foundations is always looking for new friends. Please stop by one day for a drink, Pilot Ramal.
At least he has friends unlike you, you crap-spewing troll. Little wonder why everyone hates you.
With an attitude like that, you can consider yourself not invited for a drink. |
Kolodi Ramal
Sanxing
395
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 10:43:53 -
[57] - Quote
Elmund Egivand wrote:Use a spoon. It can scoop up a bigger glob of nut butter to spread across the bread. Blade is inferior for the task and not necessary.
Spoon isn't as good for spreading the stuff flat though. |
Ashlar Vellum
Esquire Armaments
392
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 11:34:13 -
[58] - Quote
Nameira Vanis-Tor wrote:Ashlar Vellum wrote:Nameira Vanis-Tor wrote:Mizhara Del'thul wrote:Oh dear, I must have hit a nerve. An illiterate one at that, or perhaps it's just cherrypicking and willful ignorance on display. Next you'll tell me all twenty thousand goons are combat operatives or something.
What astounds me is just how many of you starts whining and whinging when called on your nonsense. Your grief at the loss of Sanxing will pas Miz, now go back to killing who you are told, when you are told at the behest of those who are rich but not strong/motivated enough to handle their own affairs or are not bold enough to strike openly against their targets. Mind you don't fall from your imaginary high horse whilst doing so. (As a disclaimer I have nothing against people who hire Mercs, I merely take issue with being lectured on morals by a murderous pawn.) She is right tho about hitting a nerve somehow, you are migrating from one thread to another arguing and defending your actions. In the end why do you care so much what a pawn thinks. If you check this threads history you will find that it was Miz who brought up the situation again. I am happy to argue with her wherever she chooses. As for you Miz I may look into hiring MC the next time I want to smash a high sec Astra just for the amusement of curing your cognitive dissonance :-)
That's what make it even more silly. Not only you are happy to argue with what you called a pawn, but this discussion "yes you are, no we aren't" is spread across 3 threads now. For consistency sake just consolidate all your arguments in one thread at least. |
Elmund Egivand
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
2047
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 12:44:07 -
[59] - Quote
Kolodi Ramal wrote:Elmund Egivand wrote:Use a spoon. It can scoop up a bigger glob of nut butter to spread across the bread. Blade is inferior for the task and not necessary. Spoon isn't as good for spreading the stuff flat though.
You are supposed to hold the bread curved. Pointing out that in the case of a nut butter, a blade is not necessary. Any time a blade truly is necessary, it's when something needs to be cut. If a blade can't cut, what do you even need it for?
A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.
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Valerie Valate
Church of The Crimson Saviour
Sani-Sabik
1990
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 14:06:17 -
[60] - Quote
Evi Polevhia wrote:With an attitude like that, you can consider yourself not invited for a drink.
Nick Bete, or, as some wags have dubbed him, "Nick Bleat", has the posting mannerisms of somebody's paid lackey.
Someone has a great beef with you, Evi Polevhia, and numerous other individuals, and pays Nick to say "you suck", or similar sentiments, rather than risk being exposed, and reveal themselves.
Gosh.
So, because it is funny, I'm going to suggest the possibility that Nick Bete is actually Diana Kim's secret Gallente lover.
Tres scandalous, or "very scandalous", as the Gallente would say.
Doctor V. Valate, Professor of Archaeology at Kaztropolis Imperial University.
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Reeves Todako
Caldari Corn Paste
98
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 14:48:59 -
[61] - Quote
Valerie Valate wrote:Evi Polevhia wrote:With an attitude like that, you can consider yourself not invited for a drink. Nick Bete, or, as some wags have dubbed him, "Nick Bleat", has the posting mannerisms of somebody's paid lackey. Someone has a great beef with you, Evi Polevhia, and numerous other individuals, and pays Nick to say "you suck", or similar sentiments, rather than risk being exposed, and reveal themselves.
Who would ever do such a thing?! |
Merchant Rova
Pathway to the Next
Last Calamity
251
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 15:05:56 -
[62] - Quote
Reeves Todako wrote:Who would ever do such a thing?!
Someone with lots of isk. The kind of isk you make off selling corn paste.
Glory to Bob
|
Reeves Todako
Caldari Corn Paste
98
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 15:22:40 -
[63] - Quote
Merchant Rova wrote:Reeves Todako wrote:Who would ever do such a thing?! Someone with lots of isk. The kind of isk you make off selling corn paste.
I need no one to speak for my product, sir! Sales figures alone from our recent launch of Strawberry Pie flavor speaks for itself!
Just remember Caldari Corn Paste is made with the finest grains only that have ever graced the State! Though with all the salt lately we've been focus testing Sea Salt flavor. Focus groups can't get enough of my salty paste! |
Casserina Leshrac
Sanguine Illuminations
58
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 15:26:45 -
[64] - Quote
Alizabeth Vea wrote:Back on point, would SERAPH be categorized as a humanitarian organization? We fight the Drifters for the betterment of humanity. I could argue that this service is a public good.
Having personally witnessed the work of SERAPH myself I would indeed consider them very humanitarian.
Not only do they actively hunt drifters, but frequently bait them away from other areas of local space so others may carry on their work.
However I have seen this only in the system that I work out of daily. To be truly effective they should focus on all Jove Observatories making New Eden safe.
When thou enterest into the Sani Sabik, the Sani Sabik entereth into thee.
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Kolodi Ramal
Sanxing
395
|
Posted - 2017.02.24 22:40:40 -
[65] - Quote
Elmund Egivand wrote:Kolodi Ramal wrote:Elmund Egivand wrote:Use a spoon. It can scoop up a bigger glob of nut butter to spread across the bread. Blade is inferior for the task and not necessary. Spoon isn't as good for spreading the stuff flat though. You are supposed to hold the bread curved. Pointing out that in the case of a nut butter, a blade is not necessary. Any time a blade truly is necessary, it's when something needs to be cut. If a blade can't cut, what do you even need it for?
Ms. Jenneth asked what the use of a blade that won't cut is, not whether one is ever truly necessary. |
Elmund Egivand
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
2047
|
Posted - 2017.02.25 05:51:22 -
[66] - Quote
Kolodi Ramal wrote:Elmund Egivand wrote:Kolodi Ramal wrote:Elmund Egivand wrote:Use a spoon. It can scoop up a bigger glob of nut butter to spread across the bread. Blade is inferior for the task and not necessary. Spoon isn't as good for spreading the stuff flat though. You are supposed to hold the bread curved. Pointing out that in the case of a nut butter, a blade is not necessary. Any time a blade truly is necessary, it's when something needs to be cut. If a blade can't cut, what do you even need it for? Ms. Jenneth asked what the use of a blade that won't cut is, not whether one is ever truly necessary.
Okay then. You are still cutting into the nut butter before scooping it up. Happy now?
A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.
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