EVE Search - Petition: Different Sized Rigs

All Channels

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Petition: Different Sized Rigs

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: [1] :: one page
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Riddick Valer	Posted - 2007.04.29 16:36:00 - [1] I know this has been posted before, but its a good idea that should be done. Create frig, cruiser, BC, and BS sized rigs. Frigs= 1/10 the materials Cruiser= 1/3 BC= 2/3 BS= Stay the same It might actually make rigs useful for smaller ships, instead of just being limited to bigger ships. Who wants to put 60m in rigs on a 2m frig?
Vincent Almasy Gallente The Underground	Posted - 2007.04.29 16:42:00 - [2] Originally by: Rid*** Valer* I know this has been posted before, but its a good idea that should be done. Create frig, cruiser, BC, and BS sized rigs. Frigs= 1/10 the materials Cruiser= 1/3 BC= 2/3 BS= Stay the same It might actually make rigs useful for smaller ships, instead of just being limited to bigger ships. Who wants to put 60m in rigs on a 2m frig? I would disagree with this idea but would support lowering prices by other means. What rig would be 60mil for a frig?
Riddick Valer	Posted - 2007.04.29 17:10:00 - [3] Its not the cost of 1 rig, its the cost of a full 3 rigs. 5-6 million would be much better for a frig then 50-60. Even if frigs were 1/5, some players would still find it useful. Otherwise, its a lot of money tied up in a very fragile shell.
Vincent Almasy Gallente The Underground	Posted - 2007.04.29 17:28:00 - [4] Originally by: Rid*** Valer* Its not the cost of 1 rig, its the cost of a full 3 rigs. 5-6 million would be much better for a frig then 50-60. Even if frigs were 1/5, some players would still find it useful. Otherwise, its a lot of money tied up in a very fragile shell. well in truth at fair prices of 50k for uncommon and 100-200k for rarer units then the prices would drop rigs down to about 5mil each for t1 rigs. To make your idea more possible for cheaper rigs would be another idea, to be able to build said rig parts perfectly then treat them to make them like salvaged parts making them take longer and a few more skills but the fact that is is no long chance base would lower most of the 500k rig part parices drasticly.
Riddick Valer	Posted - 2007.04.29 18:17:00 - [5] Still, 5-6m for a t1 rig is a bit much for a frigate. It makes no rp sense for it to take the same number of components to modify a ship the size of a frig as to modify a BS. Secondly, I'd like to see rigs accessible to fairly new players. 1-2m isn't much for most players, but for someone starting out it can be a significant investment. So, a full set of t1 rigs at 3-6m would take some saving, but would give them an incentive to stay in frigs a bit longer instead of just rushing into a cruiser->BC etc...
Vincent Almasy Gallente The Underground	Posted - 2007.04.29 18:27:00 - [6] Originally by: Rid*** Valer* Still, 5-6m for a t1 rig is a bit much for a frigate. It makes no rp sense for it to take the same number of components to modify a ship the size of a frig as to modify a BS. Secondly, I'd like to see rigs accessible to fairly new players. 1-2m isn't much for most players, but for someone starting out it can be a significant investment. So, a full set of t1 rigs at 3-6m would take some saving, but would give them an incentive to stay in frigs a bit longer instead of just rushing into a cruiser->BC etc... why do you want them to stay in frigs? fri = lv1 mission cruiser = lv 2 mission Battle cruiser = lv 3 mission Battle ship = lv 4 mission With progression they become mroe powerful and better at fighting. Having them stay in a lower class when they can advance to a higher class does not make sense. Rigs should be roughly 5mil as 5mil is the payment in the end for a good lv3 mission or a couple of lv 2 missions. Rigs are not ment for new characters they are ment for moderate or better characters. Younger characters are just trying to learn the system then try to use everything. By the time they have the basics for ship setups and those skills befor they would think about extra is about lv2 missions. By such a time they will become moderate players and start into mild t2 tanks for missions in which time they will see the value of a rig. In a fully moderate player getting into a battlecruiser they will use rigs to fine toon their ships even more specialized then a cruiser for lv2. Rig's effects on frigs are small and really only become evident once they are applies to cruisers(some of which still arn't large enough) and battle cruisers.
Riddick Valer	Posted - 2007.04.29 19:30:00 - [7] Not everyone wants to jump right to BS. Some people actually expand into things like AF or Intys, both of which benefit from experience in frigs and frig skills. Plus, where does it say rigs are only meant for experienced players? Wouldn't having a lower priced option available for frigs help new players become more experienced? The whole point of my idea was to change rig prices to reflect the ship they fit on. Using lvl 3 missions as a guide is a horrible idea. Why should a ship be able to fit a rig because it runs 1 level 3 mission? I'd think a ship, any ship, should have to work to afford a rig, but not enough to put it out of the realm of possibility for the ship. Hence, the scaling prices depending on ship sizes. Each ship would work equally hard to get a rig priced for that size. Also, not everyone wants to get into bigger ships to run missions. T1 and T2 frigs can be used in PvP, especially in groups, and affordable rigs for these sizes could only help. Last, some rigs can be beneficial to frigs. Many of the navigation rigs are great for intys, for example. The price of them doesn't work with the risk of putting them in such a fragile ship.
Nanatara	Posted - 2007.04.29 20:13:00 - [8] Complaining to ccp about rig price is just wrong. Price is high because ppl are willing to pay such price just basics of demand and supply market. -- Jup another alt post, buy me a GTC so i can post with my main again :P
Vincent Almasy Gallente The Underground	Posted - 2007.04.29 20:15:00 - [9] Then you want to recalibrate the while susyem as form your request then the size but the amount of rig would increase by 4 times meaking parts for the most part 4 times rarer for one. For two why would someone get a rig when they don't even know how to really do anything? For three, a player who can run lv 2 and 3 missions is a exsperianced player, thanks for your views on the subject. As for cepter pilots and other t2 frig pilots, they have a cruiser or larger to pay for their t2 frigs as they have to make that 10-20mil for their t2 ship let alone the month for the skills. In two weeks you can fly a good cruiser with ok skills. If you want the problem inhanced with new balancing issues because with it costing less it will be a demand to nerf them to be weaker then the larger ones because they 'should' be one size fit all like dmg modules or power difference like weapon modules.
Kramer Verone Amarr	Posted - 2007.04.29 20:17:00 - [10] I shutter at the thought of the boost this gives t2 frigates...
Sheriff Jones Amarr Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United Cult of War	Posted - 2007.04.29 20:40:00 - [11] Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 29/04/2007 20:36:53 Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 29/04/2007 20:36:21 I think the price isn't a problem. I think the rig price going down so much, would "overpower" t2 frigates among other things. So, make different sized rigs with different sized bonus. Just like every other mod works. Except that you could fit bigger rigs to smaller ships. You want your frigate to have that 45% bonus to whatchamacallit? Buy the big rigs. Or go cheaper and get a less oomf, while still getting A oomf
Vincent Almasy Gallente The Underground	Posted - 2007.04.29 20:40:00 - [12] Originally by: Kramer Verone I shutter at the thought of the boost this gives t2 frigates... If ship 1 weights 10kg less then ship 2 while everything else the same people will complain
Drizit Amarr	Posted - 2007.04.29 22:15:00 - [13] Originally by: Kramer Verone I shutter at the thought of the boost this gives t2 frigates... The big problem for frigates is the downside. Having 15% more than 200 shield is practically nothing from a defensive point since it takes less than one shot to remove that advantage. However, losing 10% of your speed is disasterous for a frigate that relies on speed or 10% of your cap when you have hardly enough to run a booster/repper to start with. --
Tarron Sarek Gallente Cadien Cybernetics	Posted - 2007.04.29 23:54:00 - [14] Well I think people already put rigs in their T2 frgs, as they don't mind fitting them with expensive T2 gear. It's not uncommon to have 20-40 million worth of modules in a well fitted AF. So.. Whereas T1 frigs having rig slots atm is pretty useless at any rate. My idea would be to: 1. Reduce rig bonuses and drawbacks to 1/5 2. Increase drop rate accordingly 3. As the Op suggested, introduce frigate and cruiser size rig blueprints Result would be nice cheap and totally not overpowered rigs as sweet little tweaks and modifications. _________________________________ - The sky is the sky wherever you go -
Vincent Almasy Gallente The Underground	Posted - 2007.04.30 01:23:00 - [15] Originally by: Tarron Sarek Well I think people already put rigs in their T2 frgs, as they don't mind fitting them with expensive T2 gear. It's not uncommon to have 20-40 million worth of modules in a well fitted AF. So.. Whereas T1 frigs having rig slots atm is pretty useless at any rate. My idea would be to: 1. Reduce rig bonuses and drawbacks to 1/5 2. Increase drop rate accordingly 3. As the Op suggested, introduce frigate and cruiser size rig blueprints Result would be nice cheap and totally not overpowered rigs as sweet little tweaks and modifications. This idea is a little better but is flawed from a key reason... If you reduce a rig's effect it is usless sorry to say. 15% bonus to a 3% would just have people getting the full effect as in most cases it adds on a special new slot. I fail to see what the real problem with the prices of most goods are save a few rare units but if those units were reduced it would be about 5-10mil a T1 rig.
Viro Melchior	Posted - 2007.04.30 02:59:00 - [16] Solution: Introduce "Civilian" Rigs. They would cost about 10-30% of their normal cousins, provide 30% the bonus at 50% the penalty. Then just drop the calibration in half as well, and you've got pathetic little rigs that cost a ton less but encourage players to rig their ships even if it's just a tech 1 frig or cruiser.
Riddick Valer	Posted - 2007.04.30 03:26:00 - [17] If you're going to introduce new rigs, introduce the different sizes. Different component requirements will dictate different prices. No real need for lesser effects. While +% is nice, frigs have such low stats it won't make a huge difference.
Tarron Sarek Gallente Cadien Cybernetics	Posted - 2007.04.30 04:21:00 - [18] Vincent, people pay millions for some 3% or 5% implants. I wouldn't go as far as saying that 3% is useless.. _________________________________ - The sky is the sky wherever you go -
Pedo Fortis	Posted - 2007.04.30 11:57:00 - [19] +1 My 2p with different numbers. Pedo Fortis
Christopher Dalran Gallente Deadly Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.30 12:52:00 - [20] Rigs dont actually cost anywhere near what they cost. The thing however is that most people do not salvage their wrecks, but they complain about the high prices for rigs. Start salvaging your mats to increase the supply of Rigs. I along with many other rig makers out there would probably take your random assortment of rig components and knock quite a bit off the rigs of your choice based on the ammount of materials you trade. Next time your out ratting in 0.0 and you cant find any rats fly around the belts salvaging all the wrecks nobody else wanted to bother salvaging (probably looting too if they arent faction) because it slows down their ratting until some more spawn. I am however on board with different class rigs, obviously it should not take as much to modify the capacitor of a frigate as it would the capacitor on a Battleships (sheer size difference). Right now I wouldnt put a rig on a frigate, not even if i made it. Theres a good chance i would stick one on a cruiser however. ------------------------------- C.D's Formula for success ------------------------------- Credit Card = Game Time Card Gametime Card = ISK Therefore Credit Card = ISK.
Vincent Almasy Gallente The Underground	Posted - 2007.04.30 14:05:00 - [21] Originally by: Tarron Sarek Vincent, people pay millions for some 3% or 5% implants. I wouldn't go as far as saying that 3% is useless.. % implants go for all ships not one at a time and if you do reduce them they won't be used. 3% mass reduction vs 15%? 5% resistance vs 25%?
Drizit Amarr	Posted - 2007.04.30 18:49:00 - [22] But it's not the bonus that is the problem for frigs. Having an extra 25% is great but losing 10% on the downside is drastic. If the increase is lowered on reduced price rigs, so should the drawback. for small rigs, +3% and -2% for T1 or +5% and -3% for T2. Losing 2 or 3 percent doesn't hurt so much on a frig or a destroyer but it's balanced by the small gain. Assault ships are a different matter entirely but in general, rigs as they are now are only useful for cruiser upwards. --
Vincent Almasy Gallente The Underground	Posted - 2007.04.30 19:38:00 - [23] Originally by: Drizit But it's not the bonus that is the problem for frigs. Having an extra 25% is great but losing 10% on the downside is drastic. If the increase is lowered on reduced price rigs, so should the drawback. for small rigs, +3% and -2% for T1 or +5% and -3% for T2. Losing 2 or 3 percent doesn't hurt so much on a frig or a destroyer but it's balanced by the small gain. Assault ships are a different matter entirely but in general, rigs as they are now are only useful for cruiser upwards. Now I would like to know why they are only good for them. Cost of ship? -AFs normaly cost 2x-3x a cruiser's cost right now NPC Power? -AFs so lv 3 missions ok PvP Power? -Depends on the pilot but a AF can take down a cruiser solo Skill amount? -It takes more ksills to fly a AF then it does a Cruiser or BattleCruiser sometimes.
Drizit Amarr	Posted - 2007.04.30 22:10:00 - [24] Originally by: Vincent Almasy Originally by: Drizit But it's not the bonus that is the problem for frigs. Having an extra 25% is great but losing 10% on the downside is drastic. If the increase is lowered on reduced price rigs, so should the drawback. for small rigs, +3% and -2% for T1 or +5% and -3% for T2. Losing 2 or 3 percent doesn't hurt so much on a frig or a destroyer but it's balanced by the small gain. Assault ships are a different matter entirely but in general, rigs as they are now are only useful for cruiser upwards. Now I would like to know why they are only good for them. Cost of ship? -AFs normaly cost 2x-3x a cruiser's cost right now NPC Power? -AFs so lv 3 missions ok PvP Power? -Depends on the pilot but a AF can take down a cruiser solo Skill amount? -It takes more ksills to fly a AF then it does a Cruiser or BattleCruiser sometimes. That's why I said "Assault ships are a different matter entirely". They have more armour and shield than a T1 frig so they benefit from the standard rigs as much as a cruiser with minimal loss from the downside just as a cruiser would. It's the penalty for using them for smaller T1 ships and weaker T2 ships I was talking about. T1 Frigs, Covops, Destroyers and even Dictors don't have much to begin with. Take 10% off anything for them and you're left with a paper plane. Therefore a rig that reduces by a small amount with the small benefit would help give them an edge but not weaken them too much in other areas. --
Suoh Amshar	Posted - 2007.05.01 01:09:00 - [25] I realize that this idea is not entirely my own but that it is compiled from others in this post (with a little change from me). If your idea is in here, you know who you are. That being said. Heres the idea. Different sized rigs. As was stated, it should not take the same amount of materials to modify a frig as it does to modify a BS. The smaller rigs should have a tiny fraction of the materials requirements and therefore isk cost. These rigs should be limited by the calibration fitting. However, in this case, it needs to be set up differently than modules. In a module, a larger module (a large turret compared to a medium or small one) has an increasing powergrid requirement because, logically, a bigger gun needs more power to shoot. For rigs on the other hand, i think that the calibration cost should decrease as the size gets bigger. This is because, logically once again, on a smaller ship there is more precision involved. You cant use a sledgehammer for brain surgery but it works fine if you're doing construction. This also would having the effect of making it impossible to fit a small (and much less expensive) rig to a very large ship. With this said, i come to the topic of rig strength. On this topic i think that there should be no change. If a rig increases some stat by 15% it should increase that stat by 15% on everything. This is because on a smaller ship, even if it is 15%, its 15% on the original value of 200 (an increase of 30) as opposed to 15% on an original 20000 (an increase of 3000) for a much larger ship. If this number were reduced to say 5% for a smaller ship, it would only recieve a bonus of 10, which regardless of the stat in question is essentially useless. So even if your complaining about the guy whos shooting at you from inside an AF getting the same bonus as you. think about this. even though he's still getting a 15% bonus, using capacitor as an example (using the numbers from my own AF) hes only getting about 72 extra cap. total. thats either 32 extra small laser shots (wow so deadly) or 72 extra cap for you when you nos it off from your larger ship. You, on the other hand (using a dominix base numbers) would be getting 750 cap with the same increase. thats almost double his base cap, and still significantly larger than his increased cap. And thats not even including any other bonuses from, say, energy management which I included on the bonus for the AF. Anyway thats the basic idea. any additions or commentary would be appreciated.

Pages: [1] :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.