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Dreads: Do they do other stuff?

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CoLe Blackblood Murder-Death-Kill Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.05.02 13:43:00 - [1] IS there a use for a dread other than POS takedown? I am trying to decide which to train for: Carrier or Dread For fleet ops would a dread be completely useless?
Scordite	Posted - 2007.05.02 13:45:00 - [2] Dreads also shoot other dreads ----------------------------------------------- The only legitimate use of the BLINK tag: Schr÷dinger's cat is [BLINK] not [/BLINK] dead.
Caffeine Junkie Caldari Elite Storm Enterprises Storm Armada	Posted - 2007.05.02 13:50:00 - [3] ...and carriers ___________________ ...and its "Armour" not "Armor" ... m'kay! passive armour-tanking ftw! ;-)
Chronus26 Gallente Team Laser Explosion	Posted - 2007.05.02 13:50:00 - [4] Originally by: Scordite Dreads also shoot other dreads And Carriers. And somtimes BS, although most aren't particularly efficient at it. Problem I see with a Dread in a fleet-battle is that it needs to be in Siege mode to do any real damage, and that makes it immobile for 10 minutes. Basicly once your in the fight thats you committed. No retreating. -----
CoLe Blackblood Murder-Death-Kill Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.05.02 14:16:00 - [5] hmmm, so a dread could have a role as an anti-cap ship?
Corwain Gallente Zero Team	Posted - 2007.05.02 14:18:00 - [6] You can easily set up a Moros in Domi config. Its a really fat gank Domi with a monster tank.
Ansol Gallente Madhatters Inc. Maelstrom Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.02 14:42:00 - [7] Originally by: Corwain Its a really fat gank Domi with a monster tank. For some reason I cannot possibly fathom, that is the single funniest thing I've heard all week. Not because it's wrong or anything, just because it sounds so... naughty. The dead remember our silence, The dead remember our indifference.
Mydrial Jacor Amarr Imperial Tech Imperial Research	Posted - 2007.05.02 14:43:00 - [8] Originally by: Ansol Originally by: Corwain Its a really fat gank Domi with a monster tank. For some reason I cannot possibly fathom, that is the single funniest thing I've heard all week. Not because it's wrong or anything, just because it sounds so... naughty. It's true though, some people have been known to sit outside stations in a Moros with lots of sensor boosters and drones waiting for targets, although admittedly much less so with warp to zero allowing insta docking anywhere. Imperial Research Services Now Available
Kadrer	Posted - 2007.05.02 14:51:00 - [9] Originally by: Mydrial Jacor Originally by: Ansol Originally by: Corwain Its a really fat gank Domi with a monster tank. For some reason I cannot possibly fathom, that is the single funniest thing I've heard all week. Not because it's wrong or anything, just because it sounds so... naughty. It's true though, some people have been known to sit outside stations in a Moros with lots of sensor boosters and drones waiting for targets, although admittedly much less so with warp to zero allowing insta docking anywhere. Can¦t you do the same with a carrier?
Corwain Gallente Zero Team	Posted - 2007.05.02 14:58:00 - [10] Yes, but the dread has something a carrier doesn't. Siege mode..which makes it immune to EWar. Thus you're not killed by the first small gang that brings a Celestis/Blackbird.
Luscious Linda	Posted - 2007.05.02 15:21:00 - [11] So you fit NOS, go into siege mode and pop everything in sight with the drones? If so that is truly nassssty.
xenodia Gallente RONA Corporation RONA Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.02 16:43:00 - [12] Originally by: CoLe Blackblood IS there a use for a dread other than POS takedown? I am trying to decide which to train for: Carrier or Dread For fleet ops would a dread be completely useless? Just train for both. If you can fly one youre probably within a month or so of flying the other anyway. As to the uses... dreads can shoot other dreads, or carriers, or given certain conditions, other ships. Moros with t2 heavies or sentry drones is nasty against battleships, for example, especially if you have a rapier or something with you that can web stuff. Phoenix + webber drones + target painters = nasty against battleships. And when the new level 5 missions come out, you could do them, if mission running is your thing for making money. http://www.eve-ronacorp.com RONA Corp is Recruiting
xenodia Gallente RONA Corporation RONA Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.02 16:45:00 - [13] Originally by: Kadrer Can¦t you do the same with a carrier? Yes but a moros does more damage. Moros drone damage bonus is just plain nasty if youve got gallente dread trained up well. http://www.eve-ronacorp.com RONA Corp is Recruiting
smallgreenblur Minmatar Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.05.02 16:46:00 - [14] Nope, you fit blasters and sensor boosters, get somebody nice to dual web the target, and pop it rather fast with your upwards of 6000 dps... sgb
madaluap Gallente Mercenary Forces Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.05.02 17:09:00 - [15] Originally by: smallgreenblur Nope, you fit blasters and sensor boosters, get somebody nice to dual web the target, and pop it rather fast with your upwards of 6000 dps... sgb No way you get 6k dps out of siegemode, also in siegemode its hard (impossible?) to get 6 k dps and be able to kill enemy bs. Even when they are dual webbed. _________________________________________________ Breetime A killmail!11!1 omgrawr: BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
smallgreenblur Minmatar Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.05.02 17:10:00 - [16] Originally by: madaluap Originally by: smallgreenblur Nope, you fit blasters and sensor boosters, get somebody nice to dual web the target, and pop it rather fast with your upwards of 6000 dps... sgb No way you get 6k dps out of siegemode, also in siegemode its hard (impossible?) to get 6 k dps and be able to kill enemy bs. Even when they are dual webbed. I ain't gonna say anything, but I know a man who would disagree ^^ sgb
kill0rbunny Alpha-Hirogen The Pentagram	Posted - 2007.05.02 17:26:00 - [17] I guess the name of this man would be heikki. Saw him do some nasty things to battleships outside p-v station with his tackling blackbird mate.
Kazuo Ishiguro	Posted - 2007.05.02 19:04:00 - [18] I know another - having a spreadsheet with the hit chance formula in it is certainly useful A dual webbed battleship will move at about 10m/s (after a few seconds to slow down) ; even in siege mode, the chance to hit at 20km with capital blasters is in the region of 70%. And that's before you factor in up to 12.5 heavy drones' worth of damage, or a painter, or a tracking enhancer... ------ Spreadsheets: Top speed calculation - Halo Implant tanking
Spy4Hire	Posted - 2007.05.02 19:14:00 - [19] What's the one that shoots missiles? I can't count the number of BS I've seen the shields/armour literally vaporize off of after getting hit by a volley of citadels. Luckily I was always able to run away in the time it took to spam another volley.
Marcus Alkhaar Conisor Excavations Syndicate Antagonistic Assembly	Posted - 2007.05.02 19:34:00 - [20] Originally by: Kazuo Ishiguro Edited by: Kazuo Ishiguro on 02/05/2007 19:11:30 I know another - having a spreadsheet with the hit chance formula in it is certainly useful A dual webbed battleship will move at about 10m/s (after a few seconds to slow down) ; even in siege mode, the chance to hit at 20km with capital blasters is in the region of 70%. And that's before you factor in up to 17.5 heavy drones' worth of damage, or a painter, or a tracking enhancer... 10 m/s? lets see your BS are going at 1000 m/s without any speed mods? 10000.10.1 = 10.... sure you can use a mwd to get a WHOLE 10m/s but then your signature would be like 2-2,5k at which point he will hit you very hard ------------------ Might Aswell Train Another Race Idiot
Chronus26 Gallente Team Laser Explosion	Posted - 2007.05.02 19:35:00 - [21] Originally by: Spy4Hire What's the one that shoots missiles? I can't count the number of BS I've seen the shields/armour literally vaporize off of after getting hit by a volley of citadels. Luckily I was always able to run away in the time it took to spam another volley. The Caldari Phoenix most likly. Although the Naglfar also has 2x Citadel Siege launchers -----
Nyphur Pillowsoft	Posted - 2007.05.02 19:37:00 - [22] Mining!11oneoneone (and getting blown up while you do it >_>) Seriously, though. Dreads make awesome haulers for jumping large volumes over a short distance. Carriers are better for small volumes (under 60k m3) over a long distance but dreadnoughts can get cargo volumes in excess of 70k m3 without all that fiddling about with emptying cargo containers and taking hauler ships out of a special bay. You can move freighterloads in a matter of hours because you can get in two or three roundtrips per cyno (10 minutes). Just drag the cargo into the cargohold, undock, jump, dock, drag the cargo out, undock, jump back, dock and repeat until you're done. In PvP, the caldari dreadnought can be extremely effective in an anti-battleship role with a few support ships webbing and painting the target to hell. I also heard of them being used for combat outside a station, too. The idea was to take your target by surprise by dropping to siege, then webbing and painting anything bs sized as it undocks and then kill it in one volley. I would imagine this only works because you take your victim completely by surprise as they expect to be able to dock if they take too much damage. Eve-Tanking.com - For tanking spreadsheet and resources.
Kazuo Ishiguro	Posted - 2007.05.02 19:41:00 - [23] Originally by: Marcus Alkhaar 10 m/s? lets see your BS are going at 1000 m/s without any speed mods? 10000.10.1 = 10.... sure you can use a mwd to get a WHOLE 10m/s but then your signature would be like 2-2,5k at which point he will hit you very hard I was being generous and assuming that the BS was travelling at 250m/s, and that the tackler was only using 80% webs instead of 90%. Running the same numbers with 150m/s and 2x 90% web gives almost 90% chance to hit ------ Spreadsheets: Top speed calculation - Halo Implant tanking
Heikki Gallente Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.05.03 10:18:00 - [24] Originally by: CoLe Blackblood IS there a use for a dread I would say Dread is pretty useful for aggressive gang ops, while carrier has more uses as support. One such risky tactic would be surprise dropping a dread to help friendly gang, and go in siege if facing annoying ECM (regardless of the usability of such dread, it seems to scatter hostiles gangs pretty fast). Another nearly-exploiting usage is to park a non-siege dread within station, and terrorize locals from there. Even if things go awry, it's very hard to kill you before the aggression timer runs out. For some concrete numbers; my combat fitted Moros in Siege has DPS of 4812, with some 900 extra from drones (without maxed skills). The guns have signature radius of 1000, so actually DPS is somewhat less, but still more than enough. Siege is just not so good for surprises; even with multiple sensor boosters locking even battleship takes ages (30s+). Originally by: CoLe Blackblood which to train for IMHO the actually question is 'which to train first', since both classes have so much overlap in required support skills. So if you can afford to lose occasional ship and want to participate in fights, go for combat dread. Otherwise find out which one your corp prefers. Originally by: Nyphur Dreads make awesome haulers I think they are still subpar to Carriers unless you dedicate the dread for that industrial use (i.e. fit cargo rigs). Typical combat carrier can be quickly converted to carry 10k (cargo) + 10k (hangar) + 37k (itty mk5) + a few cruiser sized ships. Unloading the content will take bout 10 secs longer than with dread. As a bonus you get longer jump distances. In practice I've gotten about 6 minute round trip time for one jump hauling, which makes it feasible alternative to freighter hauling expensive (small) stuff through 0.0. -Lasse playing with such nifty toy
Sokratesz Paradox v2.0 1 Shot 1 Kill	Posted - 2007.05.03 10:22:00 - [25] Moros with 3x sensorbooster II, domi web, good ranged scram and 5 ogre II's is evil. COAD: OMG bob post flame flame flame Kieron: DIE ban OMG bobdevs! log-in alt flame flame flame
Xikin Gallente SH Brotherhood	Posted - 2007.05.03 10:44:00 - [26] i saw a moros insta pop a cheetah at a gate camp hehe that made my day :P
El Yatta Mercenary Forces Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.05.03 11:06:00 - [27] Originally by: smallgreenblur Originally by: madaluap Originally by: smallgreenblur Nope, you fit blasters and sensor boosters, get somebody nice to dual web the target, and pop it rather fast with your upwards of 6000 dps... sgb No way you get 6k dps out of siegemode, also in siegemode its hard (impossible?) to get 6 k dps and be able to kill enemy bs. Even when they are dual webbed. I ain't gonna say anything, but I know a man who would disagree ^^ sgb No, i cant see that happening. 2000 DPS ish is reasonable for a blaster Moros in seige with dread 4 and ogre IIs, so i can see someone with max skills maybe pushing 2200,2300, 2400? Even with 3 shadow mag stabs, you cant be looking at multiplying that by 2.5x, you cant even double it. You might be making the mistake of thinking seige mode affects drone DPS (it does not.) One of your two rotating signatures exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes - Devil ([email protected])
achoura	Posted - 2007.05.03 11:14:00 - [28] Originally by: El Yatta Originally by: smallgreenblur Originally by: madaluap Originally by: smallgreenblur Nope, you fit blasters and sensor boosters, get somebody nice to dual web the target, and pop it rather fast with your upwards of 6000 dps... sgb No way you get 6k dps out of siegemode, also in siegemode its hard (impossible?) to get 6 k dps and be able to kill enemy bs. Even when they are dual webbed. I ain't gonna say anything, but I know a man who would disagree ^^ sgb No, i cant see that happening. 2000 DPS ish is reasonable for a blaster Moros in seige with dread 4 and ogre IIs, so i can see someone with max skills maybe pushing 2200,2300, 2400? Even with 3 shadow mag stabs, you cant be looking at multiplying that by 2.5x, you cant even double it. You might be making the mistake of thinking seige mode affects drone DPS (it does not.) Ever heard of officer hardwires? guess not... Target painters help immensly too, once youve seena maxed out drad pilot with his officer implants wreak a domi for 63k (insta pop!) you might understand
Nyphur Pillowsoft	Posted - 2007.05.03 11:18:00 - [29] Edited by: Nyphur on 03/05/2007 11:15:07 Originally by: Heikki Originally by: Nyphur Dreads make awesome haulers I think they are still subpar to Carriers unless you dedicate the dread for that industrial use (i.e. fit cargo rigs). Typical combat carrier can be quickly converted to carry 10k (cargo) + 10k (hangar) + 37k (itty mk5) + a few cruiser sized ships. Unloading the content will take bout 10 secs longer than with dread. As a bonus you get longer jump distances. In practice I've gotten about 6 minute round trip time for one jump hauling, which makes it feasible alternative to freighter hauling expensive (small) stuff through 0.0. I get a 2-3 minute roudtrip times in my Moros. You really don't notice the difference until you try it, it's a lot more than just ten seconds. And yes, I use cargo expander rigs to put the volume over 70k without cans. With the carrier, you have too many fiddly things to do to access the cargo and god help you if you want to use cargo cans. As long as the route is well planned, a dreadnought's lack of jump distance isn't a huge factor, especially if you're only jumping through prime camped spots. And the shorter jumping times means hauling multiple freighterloads is very fast compared to using a carrier. As I said, the carrier is better for small volumes across long distances and the dread is best for large volumes across a short distance. EDIT: And a carrier can't carry a battleship :D. They're 50k m3 packaged, so a dreadnought can carry them. Eve-Tanking.com - For tanking spreadsheet and resources.
Varrakk Chosen Path FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.03 11:45:00 - [30] 9/10 situations you will have more use from a carrier. Its sole purspose is to blow up shi* thats massive in size/hitpoints. Dreads also a misery to move around, short jump range.
Heikki Gallente Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.05.03 11:51:00 - [31] Edited by: Heikki on 03/05/2007 11:49:37 Originally by: Nyphur dread is best for large volumes I concur..but would like to note that only Chribba is licenced to humiliate those ships by industrial oriented rigs (which is reason I gotta stick to carrier, and build those damn battleships). Originally by: El Yatta 2000 DPS ish is reasonable for a blaster Moros The number I used above was from direct show info stats of actual field Moros: 3108.6(56+40)/6.50 = 4812, + drones with x3 Moros multiplier. Edit: For comparision, even AM railguns have DPS around 1800 in tanked mode, and 2971 in gank setup. -Lasse
Nyphur Pillowsoft	Posted - 2007.05.03 13:11:00 - [32] Originally by: Heikki Originally by: Nyphur dread is best for large volumes I concur..but would like to note that only Chribba is licenced to humiliate those ships by industrial oriented rigs (which is reason I gotta stick to carrier, and build those damn battleships). Damn, I need to contact Chribba and get a license I guess ^^;. Eve-Tanking.com - For tanking spreadsheet and resources.
CoLe Blackblood Murder-Death-Kill Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.05.03 17:08:00 - [33] How does the Siege module work?
Sokratesz Paradox v2.0 1 Shot 1 Kill	Posted - 2007.05.03 17:50:00 - [34] Originally by: CoLe Blackblood How does the Siege module work? See description. Takes strontium as fuel. Activation lasts 10 minutes, no movement possible. Greatly reduced tracking / explosion velocity, greatly reduced lock speed. Highly increased tankability and OMGWTF damage modifier on all weapons except drones. COAD: OMG bob post flame flame flame Kieron: DIE ban OMG bobdevs! log-in alt flame flame flame
xenodia Gallente RONA Corporation RONA Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.03 22:33:00 - [35] If only the moros drones got a damage mod multiplier from siege mode... Id be really happy in the pants. In the mean time, I fill time in between POS ops by shooting the POS of certain of my corp members who always forget to fuel their POS, thus spamming my box with low fuel warnings every hour. http://www.eve-ronacorp.com RONA Corp is Recruiting
madaluap Gallente Mercenary Forces Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.05.03 22:38:00 - [36] Originally by: xenodia If only the moros drones got a damage mod multiplier from siege mode... Id be really happy in the pants. In the mean time, I fill time in between POS ops by shooting the POS of certain of my corp members who always forget to fuel their POS, thus spamming my box with low fuel warnings every hour. far too overpowered. _________________________________________________ Breetime A killmail!11!1 omgrawr: BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Strill	Posted - 2007.05.04 01:40:00 - [37] Originally by: xenodia If only the moros drones got a damage mod multiplier from siege mode... Id be really happy in the pants. but then they'ld get the tracking penalty too.
Vincent Almasy Gallente The Underground	Posted - 2007.05.04 02:45:00 - [38] Originally by: Strill Originally by: xenodia If only the moros drones got a damage mod multiplier from siege mode... Id be really happy in the pants. but then they'ld get the tracking penalty too. WTFOMFGBBQ! drone dmg but no tracking as they over shoot unless sentries but with sentries their short range for the job what what hurts them.
Arron S Gallente Rampage Eternal Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.05.04 03:24:00 - [39] only dread good for PVP is the Moros. Corp mate of mine wiped out a gang of 10 in his one time with his drones.
Liora Vahan Gallente Axe Gang	Posted - 2007.05.04 05:00:00 - [40] Originally by: Heikki Another nearly-exploiting usage is to park a non-siege dread within station, and terrorize locals from there. Even if things go awry, it's very hard to kill you before the aggression timer runs out. I concur. It scared the living **** out of me when you undocked on us in that bubble! I can't belive I lived. A legend in my own mind
Mr Breakfast	Posted - 2007.05.04 05:19:00 - [41] Do people ever fit large guns on Dreads so that they'll be able to hit BSes more easily? I can see a Moros with drones + large rails/blasters killing stuff.

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