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Lisa Wu
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Posted - 2007.05.03 02:32:00 -
[1]
I am pretty ticked off about this situation and would like to hear from CCP if this behavior is something they are requiring of retailers, or if the retailers are just being paranoid to the point of obnoxious.
First, only a few of the sites listed as "official retailers" have English sites, so there's only a few choices to begin with.
Online CD Key - This site, at least, had the decency to say they were out of stock before I registered or attempted to purchase anything. Thank you for at least not wasting my time.
Markee Dragon (shatteredcrystal) - This site claims that the longest wait for a new customer to receive their codes is "2.5 hours". They'll need to update that now, because 15 hours after accepting payment, they have yet to deliver what I purchased.
These people insisted on a phone call, during which some guy asked many, many questions. I honestly thought he was going to ask my height, weight and blood type before he was done. At the end of it, he actually wanted to know if I could provde a digital scan of a picture ID!
Then he said he would send an email about my order. 15 hours later, there is no email and I'm wondering if I need to file a fraud report at Paypal.
The grand prize in all this goes to Battleclinic.com - This site accepted payment for codes without even having any codes at hand. Strike ONE.
They asked if I could wait until Monday and I emailed back to say that was fine. Monday comes, no contact. Tuesday, my money is returned. Strike TWO
Something that I found curious is that this site demands the name of an EVE character during registration. The hell? I gave this alt's name, since that is none of their business.
This morning, I receive an email from them saying that they have restocked, if I am still interested. I promptly logged in and bought the codes again. An hour later, another email arrives demanding the name of more characters. WTF? After taking a deep breath and deleting the many furious responses I had typed out, I wrote back with "no". They canceled the order. They referred to some policy page, the link for which leads to a page that doesn't exist.
Strike THREE and a petition has been filed with CCP for EULA violation.
Quote:
B. Passwords and Names (snip) You may not obtain, attempt to obtain, use or attempt to use the login name or character name of anyone else.
Every other English site also insisted on a phone call, and probably would send me through the same obnoxious process as shatteredcrystal. Having done that once and still not received what I've paid for afterward, I'm not interested in finding out.
CCP,
If this is something you are requiring of your retailers, you need very seriously to rethink it. It's costing both you and your retailers money. If this is not your policy, then you need to have a word with these people. This is all paranoid to the point of ridiculous. Fraud prevention my ass. The money has been sent securely through Paypal. At that point, you send what the person is buying. That's how you prevent fraud - by not committing it. |
Elgar Lightfoot
Lightfoot Industries
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Posted - 2007.05.03 02:37:00 -
[2]
ShatteredCrystal are excellet. Never had a problem with them. I suggest you check your email address and your junk mail folder.
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monkeyduck
Mithril Inc Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.05.03 02:38:00 -
[3]
Edited by: monkeyduck on 03/05/2007 02:36:43 I must say I was JUST talking about this last night to my guild leader in another game. I was shocked and felt like I was in an interrogation with the hot light beaming down on me.
Nearest Airport? All major highways around your area? Colleges within 25 miles? On and on. I was afraid of getting something wrong! They have officially annoyed me enough to do all my time purchases through CCP themselves...
Edit: Oh, I did pass their test by the way and received the code within a minute. By that time I was laying on the floor shaking from the ordeal and couldn't use the code anyway
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Elgar Lightfoot
Lightfoot Industries
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Posted - 2007.05.03 02:44:00 -
[4]
Lol, their questions are not that bad. I was asked what was my closest motorway. I answered there were two and gave their numbers. Really simple questions, but questions which realy help to prove you are who you claim to be. I'd much prefer two minutes of really simple questions over someone else using my details to buy things on-line.
Even then it's a one time thing. I only had to answer those questions ONCE. Never again, and I've been buying GTC's for quite a while now.
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Raider Null
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Posted - 2007.05.03 02:53:00 -
[5]
The questions are there to protect you, you know. Fraud and ID theft are rampant and huge problems.
The questions asked are much better than having your CC stolen/cloned/what have you. So lighten up, Francis.
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monkeyduck
Mithril Inc Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.05.03 03:28:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Raider Null The questions are there to protect you, you know. Fraud and ID theft are rampant and huge problems.
The questions asked are much better than having your CC stolen/cloned/what have you. So lighten up, Francis.
Anyone competent enough to steal a CC can punch in the zip to mapquest and answer any questions they asked. As a native to where I live, I had absolutely no idea how to answer the airport question. The thief would be able to answer better than I had...
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Elgar Lightfoot
Lightfoot Industries
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Posted - 2007.05.03 04:03:00 -
[7]
Most thieves wouldn't think to do that. They'd not be expecting to answer those questions, only personal ones like Date of birth.
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Hexman
Cryo Crypt inc. FREGE Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.03 04:48:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Elgar Lightfoot Most thieves wouldn't think to do that. They'd not be expecting to answer those questions, only personal ones like Date of birth.
Now they would
btw, I've never had a problem with shatteredcrystal - Answered their questions the first time and since then been able to buy new ETC's in minutes.
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sableye
principle of motion Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.05.03 04:54:00 -
[9]
shattered crystal rang me it was all fine, they american though so I pickied hours I knew they'd be working anyway that was ages ago, the first time, since then they've never bothered me since and I buy my time cards for all my 3 characters, sometimes security can be frustrating for any website but just be thankful they are being this secure I used to pay my subs via third party via pay pal and they were always getiing locked out, they only doing what they have todo is a phone call form america to uk and that was'nt cheasp for them.
Join The Fight With Promo Today |
Josan Alfuano
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Posted - 2007.05.03 05:02:00 -
[10]
They called my place once, my roommate answered, slammed the phone down during the q&a and filed a complaint against them for stalking or something while I was away
Still got the code through email
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Alyth
Gallente Ma-Ven Industries Phobos Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.03 06:39:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Lisa Wu I am pretty ticked off about this situation and would like to hear from CCP if this behavior is something they are requiring of retailers, or if the retailers are just being paranoid to the point of obnoxious.
First, only a few of the sites listed as "official retailers" have English sites, so there's only a few choices to begin with.
Online CD Key - This site, at least, had the decency to say they were out of stock before I registered or attempted to purchase anything. Thank you for at least not wasting my time.
Markee Dragon (shatteredcrystal) - This site claims that the longest wait for a new customer to receive their codes is "2.5 hours". They'll need to update that now, because 15 hours after accepting payment, they have yet to deliver what I purchased.
These people insisted on a phone call, during which some guy asked many, many questions. I honestly thought he was going to ask my height, weight and blood type before he was done. At the end of it, he actually wanted to know if I could provde a digital scan of a picture ID!
Then he said he would send an email about my order. 15 hours later, there is no email and I'm wondering if I need to file a fraud report at Paypal.
The grand prize in all this goes to Battleclinic.com - This site accepted payment for codes without even having any codes at hand. Strike ONE.
They asked if I could wait until Monday and I emailed back to say that was fine. Monday comes, no contact. Tuesday, my money is returned. Strike TWO
Something that I found curious is that this site demands the name of an EVE character during registration. The hell? I gave this alt's name, since that is none of their business.
This morning, I receive an email from them saying that they have restocked, if I am still interested. I promptly logged in and bought the codes again. An hour later, another email arrives demanding the name of more characters. WTF? After taking a deep breath and deleting the many furious responses I had typed out, I wrote back with "no". They canceled the order. They referred to some policy page, the link for which leads to a page that doesn't exist.
Strike THREE and a petition has been filed with CCP for EULA violation.
Quote:
B. Passwords and Names (snip) You may not obtain, attempt to obtain, use or attempt to use the login name or character name of anyone else.
Every other English site also insisted on a phone call, and probably would send me through the same obnoxious process as shatteredcrystal. Having done that once and still not received what I've paid for afterward, I'm not interested in finding out.
CCP,
If this is something you are requiring of your retailers, you need very seriously to rethink it. It's costing both you and your retailers money. If this is not your policy, then you need to have a word with these people. This is all paranoid to the point of ridiculous. Fraud prevention my ass. The money has been sent securely through Paypal. At that point, you send what the person is buying. That's how you prevent fraud - by not committing it.
Check your paypal account. If you have only put your initials against the bank account or payment card you are trying to use, a lot of retailers will reject that for verification purposes which is why I had so much trouble with them and I can see why. Anyone can put Mr A B C Smith against an account and when they phone you to confirm, anyone can answer yes. It's harder to fake when you give a name such as Alan Brian Charles Smith and they ask YOU to confirm the full name on the payment.
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Lisa Wu
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Posted - 2007.05.03 08:16:00 -
[12]
My full name is on record at Paypal, the account is 4 or 5 years old and is linked to my bank account and my credit card. Never had a problem with it. That particular email address does not have a junk filter and every other email arrived without an issue. They simply haven't sent one since the phone call (21 hours later now).
Taking precautions against fraud is fine. Treating every new customer like a criminal with a bag full of stolen credit cards and interrogating them is not and is way over the line. Whether I ever see that time code or not, not one of these sites will ever see a dime from me again.
Most of my aggravation is with Battleclinic accepting payment for something they didn't have and then demanding to know who my other characters are before delivering. That is absolutely none of their damn business. |
Thuul'Khalat
Gallente Phoenix Wing
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Posted - 2007.05.03 08:59:00 -
[13]
I can't say i'm able to relate to your problems. I've used shatteredcrystal ever since I started playing, and after a call on my first order with some very simple questions, I have bought maybe 50 codes from them and gotten every single one within a couple minutes of ordering. ---
We are Recruiting! |
Ka'lorn Font'a
Amarr Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.05.03 09:18:00 -
[14]
I've had horrendous problems trying to purchase time cards in the past.
ShatteredCrystal even called me, I answered their questions, and they sent the code - YES!
A week later, I had a second email from them, stating that I needed to provide two forms of Photo ID, as they suspected fraud. I live out in France, I've not been out here that long, and tbh - 'finding' a scanner in a country you do not actually speak the native language of is not worth the hassle.
EVETimecode.com underwent the same process. I've had my paypal for 5 years, it has it's full details filled in (no initials).
Absolutely abhorred by the services, tbh.
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Kate Nexus
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Posted - 2007.05.03 09:29:00 -
[15]
I just wish these GTC cheese heads would stop spamming Jita chat!!!!!
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Anson Halleck
Lost Eden
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Posted - 2007.05.03 11:42:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Anson Halleck on 03/05/2007 11:39:21
Originally by: Lisa Wu If this is something you are requiring of your retailers, you need very seriously to rethink it. It's costing both you and your retailers money. If this is not your policy, then you need to have a word with these people. This is all paranoid to the point of ridiculous. Fraud prevention my ass. The money has been sent securely through Paypal. At that point, you send what the person is buying. That's how you prevent fraud - by not committing it.
You should complain to PayPal for their policy. If someone buys virutal stuff like game time code via stolen PayPal account or using stolen credit card, there is no way to get the item or money back. PayPal just cancels the transaction, so seller has no code and no money. If you think this is rare, then you are wrong, there will be at least one scam like this in every 10 orders.
Also complain do dumb ppl who let scammers steal their PayPal accounts and credit cards. Retailers are the only ones losing money due to these scams, even though they are not resposible for it (dumb users and PayPal are).
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mackem
Fusion Enterprises Ltd DeStInY.
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Posted - 2007.05.03 11:56:00 -
[17]
I use shattered crystal, got the phone call 15-20mins after ordering answered a couple of really easy questions about the nearest streets my street and the nearest motorway.
Got the code less than 5mins later. From then on in I've received my codes instantaneously. Plus shattered crystal are currently the cheapest around.
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SghnDubh
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Posted - 2007.05.12 03:18:00 -
[18]
Hello Lisa Wu, I'm sorry you believe you had problems purchasing codes from BattleClinic Deep Space Supply.
I'd ask you to look at this from the side of the retailer. We unfortunately suffer from a high degree of fraud from unscrupulous players. Fraud losses can wipe out months of profits. We are not in business to lose money.
PayPal does not protect retailers who sell intangible goods. All risk of fraud is assumed by online ETC retailers. Our methods for combating this fraud are the result of not having any acceptable method of recourse.
We're disappointed that you didn't contact us about your dissatisfaction, nor give us a chance to work with you. We could have provided you with your codes in an amiable way. Unfortunately, what you fail to mention in your post is that our purchase rules are posted clearly, and that you failed to read those when you made your order.
In any event, please note that we have suspended our requirement for character names and will take other measures to eliminate fraud. We do look forward to continuing to serve our many customers.
We are committed to the EVE community. Players are welcome to contact me directly with questions: chris at battleclinic.com
Thank you.
Fight Smart: http://www.BattleClinic.com
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Lisa Wu
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Posted - 2007.05.14 23:28:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Lisa Wu on 14/05/2007 23:25:36
Originally by: SghnDubh stuff
ummm... No
Quote: I'm sorry you believe you had problems
What definition of the word "believe" are you using? It ended with no merchandise delivered, a refund being sent and you being reported for violating the game's license. Sounds like a bit of a problem to me.
Quote: PayPal does not protect retailers who sell intangible goods.
And yet, the "buy" link sends you straight to Paypal. You've heard of credit cards, yeah? I have two of them and would have preferred to use either of them over using Paypal to begin with.
Quote: We are not in business to lose money.
Indeed. You rejected the sale of 5 items and greatly offended what might have been a repeat customer. Odd way of doing business.
Quote: We're disappointed that you didn't contact us about your dissatisfaction, nor give us a chance to work with you. We could have provided you with your codes in an amiable way.
Nice attempt to look like you tried to work on this. Now if only it were true.
I sent payment, received an unacceptable demand for information instead of what I'd bought, said "no" and my order was promptly cancelled. Sorry bud, I'm the customer. I don't jump through hoops to receive what I've paid for. You cancelled the order and sent the payment back. That was the end of my association with you.
Quote: Unfortunately, what you fail to mention in your post is that our purchase rules are posted clearly, and that you failed to read those when you made your order.
I fail to mention it because I prefer to stick with what actually happened, not to make things up. I clicked a "buy" button. I filled in a registration form. I got redirected to Paypal. There were no purchase "rules" posted anywhere in the middle of all that.
On the other hand, after my purchase, I did receive an email with a link that referred to policies. That was the email where you demanded the names of my other characters and broke Eve's license.
The link landed me on an error page. Either the email linked the wrong address or the page is locked behind a registration barrier and can't serve as public notice. In either case, it happened after payment was sent. A little late to be discussing "rules" after the sale.
Quote: In any event, please note that we have suspended our requirement for character names
CCP got right on that didn't they? If only they reacted to macro miners that fast. |
Vanth Dreddstar
Caldari Murky Inc. Vigilance Infinitas
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Posted - 2007.05.16 13:18:00 -
[20]
I am an American that lives over seas and I find this sort of thing happens quite often. (To me anyway) On the other hand I have been always able to figure it out w/ the retailer too. I have to admit it is taking me 3 days to get my time card. I tried all of the English sites listed and returned to the first one I tried. I had declined to use my work email as a method to vet my identity. This time I went ahead with it. IÆm still waiting because a manager has to approve it. Go figure. As far as IÆm concerned, let the money guy handle fraud prevention. Once the retailer has captured the funds they should be able to deliver the product with out worry. ThatÆs why we use instruments like Pay Pal and Visa. Best, _______________________________________________
Come dance with me now on the Devil's dance floor. |
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Miss Anthropy
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2007.05.16 14:00:00 -
[21]
Wow, this really sucks. I was thinking of buying Time Cards sometime but if it's this complicated I probably won't bother. I buy stuff from Amazon (I live in the UK), Gameplay, and other online stores a hell of a lot and never get trouble like that. What's so different about buying a GTC than buying a book? Credit Card details are the same whether you pay via Paypal or directly by typing the info in yourself. At least, I would have thought so.
I'd better quit now before I slap out a wall of text.
--------- Dude, where's my face ?
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heheheh
Singularity. The Cartel.
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Posted - 2007.05.16 14:17:00 -
[22]
Shattered crystals service is excellent. You would be moaning a hell of alot more if they didnt use security precautions and someone emptied your account. I am willing to bet that they did mail you and the mail went straight to your trash can.
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heheheh
Singularity. The Cartel.
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Posted - 2007.05.16 14:19:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Miss Anthropy Wow, this really sucks. I was thinking of buying Time Cards sometime but if it's this complicated I probably won't bother. I buy stuff from Amazon (I live in the UK), Gameplay, and other online stores a hell of a lot and never get trouble like that. What's so different about buying a GTC than buying a book? Credit Card details are the same whether you pay via Paypal or directly by typing the info in yourself. At least, I would have thought so.
I'd better quit now before I slap out a wall of text.
Dont listen to the OP,I think hes just bitter. My experience with buying GTCs from shattered crystal has been a very good one, i get GTCs mailed to me instantly. They just need to phone you the first time that is all.
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max bygraves
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Posted - 2007.05.16 14:21:00 -
[24]
Originally by: monkeyduck
Anyone competent enough to steal a CC can punch in the zip to mapquest and answer any questions they asked. As a native to where I live, I had absolutely no idea how to answer the airport question. The thief would be able to answer better than I had...
lol how wrong you are.
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Zeddicus Thermopyle
Caldari Solar Wind Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.05.16 15:08:00 -
[25]
I had problems with shatteredcrystal.com also. After placing the order, I waited for the phone call, none came. I received an email about 30 minutes later saing that they could not contact me, replyed back saying I was sitting right next to the phone and it had not rung please try again. Another email saying they still could not contact me, order cancelled. Tried again the next day with my office phone number. Another email saying they cold not get through to me and that I needed to have correct contact info, emailed back saying that everyone else in the fracking world could get me at those 2 numbers why couldnt they? Order cancelled.
Went to battleclinic saw the link for the time code rules, had to register on their forums to read the rules, kind of a pita to have to register to read the rules for purchasing. Gave them my character's name and had the codes with in 30 minutes.
Battleclinic gets my repeat business, shatteredcrystal lost several potential repeat customers because of the way they handled it.
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Exphexis
m3 Corp
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Posted - 2007.05.16 15:22:00 -
[26]
i always use shatteredcrystal and now that im an approved customer, my timecards are sent pretty much instantly through email.
My details where wrong on paypal so they couldn't get through to me, they emailed me explaining and i updated my paypal profile and shortly after i had my phone call. they asked a couple of questions nothing overly personal, just your general secuity questions really.
The guy i spoke to was american now im not sure if they base for operation is in american, if it is this could explain the delay in your phone call.
They are the only ETC seller i have used, i honestly cant fault them and shall continue to use them for many time cards to come :P
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SghnDubh
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Posted - 2007.05.26 00:21:00 -
[27]
Lisa Wu, It seems clear that you'd rather grind an axe, so I won't be returning to this thread. I personally wish you the best in your EvE career. Good luck, fly safe, and Fight Smart.
Chris C. "SghnDubh" BattleClinic Deep Space Supply http://shop.battleclinic.com
Fight Smart: http://www.BattleClinic.com
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Kal Ferrin
Caldari Darklite inc Darklite Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.26 00:31:00 -
[28]
why are u writing to ccp about this? what do u want them to do? either it never happened and you want attention or ur a 15 year old who stole ur dads credit card to buy gametime and they didnt fall for it.
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R0ot
InNova Tech Inc Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.26 00:33:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Elgar Lightfoot ShatteredCrystal are excellet. Never had a problem with them. I suggest you check your email address and your junk mail folder.
/me seconded
They are very quick, and customer support is A+ ------------------------------------------------------------------
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Gehbrant
Gallente Lucri Causa
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Posted - 2007.05.26 00:44:00 -
[30]
i have used ShatteredCrystal for many many many years now, never had problems that where not corrected within 1 hour
the firts time they called me up, asked my name, adress, to verify who i was, then asked how i payed and that was it. no more then 5 mins later i had my codes. and the 1 time i had a problem was a typo in a code they sent me, and within 1h it was corrected.
ive bought codes from 6 different games from them, up to 5 codes at the same time, never had a problem and always got them within 5 mins of purchase. you dont whant my sig here
S.I.G. Master |
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