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Kavioleth
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Posted - 2007.05.03 12:12:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Kavioleth on 03/05/2007 12:10:19
I'm a little baffled. I've moved from spending a few hours a night mining Scord in 1.0 sec to my first night of 0.7 Plag mining. W00t and thanks to the help I got here.
The thing that's got me thinking is that I could sell my Scord at 16isk per unit on a quick sell. When I mine Plag it sells for around 28isk. The thing is, I can get 2760 units of Scord per pull, while I only get 1182 untis of Plag per pull.
Now, that means with Scord I am potentially earning (16*2760) 44160isk per minute. However, with Plag I'm potentially earning (28*1182) 33096isk per minute. Given these facts it seems to make more sense to mine Scord.
Am I missing something?
Is my maths wrong?
Is it better to make sell orders for more isk but take longer to liquidate the ore?
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Terreen Rha
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Posted - 2007.05.03 12:15:00 -
[2]
I've heard that the price of Scordite has been rising lately. I'm not sure why but that's the market for you.
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Lag Hon
Minmatar
Lag Hon Security
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Posted - 2007.05.03 12:25:00 -
[3]
Mining is based on cubic meter (m3) per gun cycle, Plaigoclase is a larger ore 0.35m3 than Scordite 0.15m3, so you will pull more Scord per cycle than Plaig but Plaigoclase contains Mexallon which can only be found in Plaigoclase, Pyroxers and Kernite (as far as Empire space ores are concerned anyway) so from a miners point of view, of just mining and selling ores Scordite is better but from a manufacturers point of view where Mexallon is required for a lot of items Plaigoclase is occasionally more desirable.
Study the market a bit and look at what other sell orders you are competing against, most of the time you will do better to place a sell order at a strategically calculated price, rather than just take the first price offered to you.
 Quote:
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom. Against that power governments, and tyrants, and armies can not stand.
G'Kar
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Vasiliyan
AVALON FOUNDATION
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Posted - 2007.05.03 12:28:00 -
[4]
Scordite gives you pyerite, which is at a high price at the moment. Use the evegeek.com ore calculator, set the volume to the size of your hauler, and it will tell you which is the best ore to mine (you mine a constant m3 rate which gives you different units depending on ore). At the moment it's scordite.
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Kavioleth
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Posted - 2007.05.03 12:49:00 -
[5]
Ooooh. Thanks for the EveGeek tip. Makes calculating things much more easier. :D
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Brian Kith
Caldari
The White Star Consortium
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Posted - 2007.05.03 13:43:00 -
[6]
This is a spreadsheet I use:
Mindata Spreadsheet
It's based on the pull rate of one Miner I with no bonuses on it. At the very bottom in blue you'll see the cash per minute calculation. It takes all the factors into account, ore size, batch size, etc and gives you an idea about how much ISK you make per minute with one unmodified Miner I pulling that ore.
The prices are based upon prices in the space I live in, which is Solitude, but should be generally relevant with respect to the game as a whole.
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Tkar vonBiggendorf
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.05.03 13:48:00 -
[7]
The Isogen from Omber should still get you ISK faster than Scordite, and possibly Kernite, but nothing else beats Scordite right now in high-sec due to current Pyerite prices on the market. Omber and Kernite are harder to find, and usually mined out as soon as they respawn (only twice a week), while Scordite is plentiful.
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Donathan Slade
Kay Korporation
Knights Of the Southerncross
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Posted - 2007.05.03 17:20:00 -
[8]
Another thing to remember is that your just selling ore. If you have the time, you can also lvl up your refining skills, refine the ore and sell the materials for more money.
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pass lake
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Posted - 2007.05.03 17:32:00 -
[9]
I like to mine plagioclase. It refines into tritanium, pyroxere and mexallon. I watch the market and sell forward the one which is increasing in price, sell the stable priced mineral immediately and hold the lowest priced mineral for future price improvements. Mexallon saved my profit margins for quite a while when tritanium prices dropped dramatically a while back.
Plagioclase gives me more options.
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Brian Kith
The White Star Consortium
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Posted - 2007.05.03 17:54:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Brian Kith on 03/05/2007 17:53:06
Omber is slightly less cash per minute than Scordite. The main reason being that the size of Omber is so much greater. You can simply pull Scordite a lot faster.
It's not much difference, but there is definitely a noticeable amount of money per minute difference in favor of Scordite.
Plagio is a great ore, but not as cash ready as Scordite in a mine and sell routine. In a refine and hold scenario, you can probably do well with Plagio, or if you are actually using the minerals yourself. It's the most efficient source of Mexallon in the universe, and the second most efficient source of Pyerite. It's a really good ore.
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Jeslik
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Posted - 2007.05.03 17:59:00 -
[11]
Scordite is definately the better option in terms of isk/hr, but in the .5 system I mine, the scordite disappears to fast, so I occasionally switch over to Plag. Heck, sometimes I have to switch to Veld! Omber is too rare, and the roids too small to last past spawn day. But if you have the option, stick to 1 & .9 space for Scordite, and you won't have to worry about NPC Rats, so you can focus on strictly mining (and ore thieves :P)
What I'd be thinking on is how much you are losing by not refining that ore. Train up refining skills asap, and you'll significantly increase your $$.
Also, I would never perform a quick sell. You can usually sell your goods much higher than the buy orders that are on the market. Do an advanced Sell Order, and set your price in the middle of all the other Sell orders, set the term for 3 months, and it'll sell. May take a week or 2, but unless you need $$ immediately, its a better deal.
Please refrain from posting if you have something to contribute.
Thank you. -Hango
(http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=496403)
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Brian Kith
The White Star Consortium
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Posted - 2007.05.03 19:19:00 -
[12]
Refine and hold is a great strategy for an established player, but a new player seeking to make money quickly is simply looking to mine and sell as quickly as possible. They must rely on existing buy orders.
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Stefx
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Posted - 2007.05.03 21:56:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Kavioleth
Edited by: Kavioleth on 03/05/2007 12:10:19
I'm a little baffled. I've moved from spending a few hours a night mining Scord in 1.0 sec to my first night of 0.7 Plag mining. W00t and thanks to the help I got here.
The thing that's got me thinking is that I could sell my Scord at 16isk per unit on a quick sell. When I mine Plag it sells for around 28isk. The thing is, I can get 2760 units of Scord per pull, while I only get 1182 untis of Plag per pull.
Now, that means with Scord I am potentially earning (16*2760) 44160isk per minute. However, with Plag I'm potentially earning (28*1182) 33096isk per minute. Given these facts it seems to make more sense to mine Scord.
Am I missing something?
Is my maths wrong?
Is it better to make sell orders for more isk but take longer to liquidate the ore?
Here is the best reference for mining:
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=434899
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Kethry Avenger
Pale Riders Incorporated
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Posted - 2007.05.03 23:20:00 -
[14]
I've been in this game since December 2006, and in that time in the Heimatar region where I play most of the time, Scordite has been the best Ore to mine in terms of isk/per minute in high sec space. Sometimes there has been an order in a limited demand that made it worth it to track down some Omber, or Plag. I go to EveGeekto use the ore calculator there with my cargo space set to 27500, size of a jet can, put in my relavant skills, and the price I think I can seel the mins for. This then computes very accurately which Ore has the best price per time/cargo space, which is the same thing for isk making purposes. The site also has information about which ores are best to mine to get a certian mineral if you ever start building things. It also works in the in game browser but not as clean.
I ussually set it up once a day and check the prices I would get for refining ORE compared to a quick check of what I would get selling it whole once a day.
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Drizit
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.05.04 14:47:00 -
[15]
For the short term.
Check the info for each ore type and note how many units it takes to refine. Hold shift and move the amount from the main pile. Select all the small piles of minerals and refine them.
Sell each mineral and see how much you get. When you've done this, split off the same amount for refining again from each large pile and sell it raw.
Now compare how much you made raw from each small pile as compared to how much you got for it if refined. That will help you decide whether refining and selling the minerals is better than selling the ore raw or not.
I know it's a long process but you'll only have to do it once to get an idea of prices in your local region. The tiny amount you lose by selling the lower value is worht it to see what will get you the most in the long run. Chances are, you have been losing far more than that by selling raw anyway. Most times, refining is more profitable but it really depends on the regional prices.
If you do decide to refine all the ore, remember that you'll have some ore left over for the next refining run because you'll always have a bit less than a full refining amount. Save this to add to the next lot you mine.
If you have enough room in your hold for minerals such as Isogen and Mexallon that you've refined, check the market prices for them to see if you can get a better price within a couple of jumps or so.
For the long term.
Mine and hold as much as you can. Skill up to fly a hauler and increase you refinery skills to increase yield from refining. When you have a very large amount of ore, refine it.
Once refined, the minerals will take up less room than the ore it came from. Use your hauler to take the minerals to the best buy orders nearest you. Remember that time=isk so a long haul is losing you isk if it only sells there for a couple of isk more unless you have a really big load of it. Try to stay within 2 or 3 jumps if you can for smaller amounts.
hope this all helps.
--
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Tkar vonBiggendorf
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.05.04 20:54:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Brian Kith
Refine and hold is a great strategy for an established player, but a new player seeking to make money quickly is simply looking to mine and sell as quickly as possible. They must rely on existing buy orders.
Another reason FOR refining. If you want to sell NOW, there are most likely better existing buy orders a few jumps away from your current station. Minerals take up a lot less space than raw ore, so it takes fewer trips to transport it there. That's time you could have spent mining to more than overcome the small loss of not-quite-perfect refining skills.
To refine, you want to get Refining to level 5, then Refinery Efficiency to 2 or 3, then the invididual ore processing skills for the ores you're interested in to 2 or 3. Once you have Refinery Efficiency to at least 1 and the specific ore processing to at least 1, your refining waste is marginal. (This assumes you're in Empire stations, not out in the 0.0 wilderness where the station equipment is less efficient to start with.)
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Drizit
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.05.05 12:33:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Tkar vonBiggendorf
To refine, you want to get Refining to level 5, then Refinery Efficiency to 2 or 3, then the invididual ore processing skills for the ores you're interested in to 2 or 3. Once you have Refinery Efficiency to at least 1 and the specific ore processing to at least 1, your refining waste is marginal. (This assumes you're in Empire stations, not out in the 0.0 wilderness where the station equipment is less efficient to start with.)
As this is a noob forum, I would like to state that the above skills are not compulsory, it just reduces the waste that you would otherwise lose due to poor refining skills.
You can also increase profits from refining by doing missions for the agents of the station you are refining in, that helps standings with the NPC corp and reduces the tax they charge.
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Tkar vonBiggendorf
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.05.11 19:47:00 -
[18]
It takes a lot more in the way of skills and effort to get your standing high enough with an NPC Corp running missions to reduce the taxes than it does to train refining skills. Plus, refining skills are good everywhere, while NPC Corp standing is only good at that corp's stations.
A dedicated miner will eventually want both.
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