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NanDe YaNen
Liberal Universalists
0
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Posted - 2017.04.16 13:50:17 -
[1] - Quote
Where can we extract a lot of ISK from the economy to account for ratting and mission running?
Let's start with someone else's problem. Whenever gankers suicide gank with alts and pick up the loot, they use unaffiliated accounts in order to acquire the loot because the gank accounts lose security status and can't get to the can.
No problem.
Let's apply a tax to the cargo.
- Cargo is flagged when non-wardec gank happens in system with security > 0.0
- Flagged cargo is not able to be sold on market or entered into contract until tax is paid
- Tax rate depends on both the security where the cargo was regarded as stolen and where the cargo gets put onto market
- War-dec loot no problem
- 0.0 stolen loot no problem
- 0.0 delivered loot no problem
- Ganked outside Rens station and sold in Rens, holy crap expensive
- Base tax on estimate used in assets window
Everyone's happier that this tax is applied according to the severity of the security violation and usually will affect suicide gankers using new accounts that feel more like an abuse of alpha accounts than intended game mechanics? I'll accept your applause. Seriously. Who's complaining? Maybe you should live outside Jita occasionally.
The only person not happier is a suicide ganker that needs to get 5bn ISK liquid to sell that loot or somehow get it to low sec so that they can move the gear, and now they can join the risk reward club.
I'm preparing a doctrine for Liberal Universalism. Because the doctrine is heavily focused on trade, the broker fees and sales tax are generally regarded as an enemy to all pod pilots. The fact is that this tax is not set by any market. The spreads are set somewhat by the tax.
This proposal is one of many that will be made for the benefit of the universe. Please set standings negative if you have a problem, and do so LIBERALLY. |
Old Man Prae
Silver Leaf Commerce Co.
Greater D.U.S.K. Coalition
0
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Posted - 2017.04.22 04:34:22 -
[2] - Quote
As cool as this sounds it will never happen. Reason is this. Suicide ganks etc take isk out of market.
Person rages. Buys plex. Plex brings money into CCP's pocket. Will CCP change there whole financial income model? Nope. Why not you ask, because it makes them money.
This game encourages you to be Jerk, etc.
Long term it will turn off players in alpha due to people abusing people with alphas. But what can you do this stuffs been beat to death in these forums by those who enjoy being jerks to others. Just my opinion but what ever.
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NanDe YaNen
Liberal Universalists
7
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Posted - 2017.04.22 09:47:11 -
[3] - Quote
Old Man Prae wrote:Suicide ganks etc take isk out of market Goods, not ISK. I don't understand the rest of our reply. If the goods are subject to market re-entry tax, it makes ganks less profitable in terms of ISK because to avoid market re-entry tax, you have to ship those goods.
The real losers would be nullsec dwellers having to blow up gankers trying to haul their goods to NPC or open stations to avoid tax. Takes a lot of ammo and exerts intel burden. Hope the goods make up for it. |
Old Man Prae
Silver Leaf Commerce Co.
Greater D.U.S.K. Coalition
0
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Posted - 2017.04.22 15:02:08 -
[4] - Quote
Let me clarify. I think of all goods as isk. It takes isk to buy goods. Guy gets ganked, losses his isk in the form of goods. The guy doing the ganking has a buddy that picks up the goods sells them for isk. So goods equal isk .
With the tax thing it would have to be tax from concord not any individual corporation or what I said would happen. Second you'd have to tag all the goods with that tag so that if you do get ganked you can prevent or whatever the ganker and his buddies from profiting off of it.
Id suggest that you have a secondary insurance like you do on ships to be on your cargo.....at like 75% of est amount that way you prevent people from gaming the system.
When it comes to gankers I find it hard that null sec players would have to blow up gankers to ensure there goods get to market.
Theres other ways to ensure that your goods get to the designated npc or market.
If you goal is to prevent ganks then just have CCP just prevent people from ganking each other in high sec. War dec no prob go for it. But in the long run isk removed from ganks either in the form of ships or goods it still profits CCP while it really only hurts new players. Thus going back to my original post. Won't happen. |
NanDe YaNen
Liberal Universalists
7
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Posted - 2017.04.22 22:00:02 -
[5] - Quote
Old Man Prae wrote:If you goal is to prevent ganks
Goal is to sink ISK. CCP is basically sinking all of the ISK via trade if you look at the numbers. Liberal Universalists takes the position that the brokerage fee hinders trade, but citidels can fix that, which leaves a problem: where will the ISK get ground up if player economy quickly shifts to citadels?
Read up on inflation to have a good model of currency vs goods.
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Toxic Yaken
The Dickwad Squad
Rote Kapelle
182
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Posted - 2017.05.09 21:26:30 -
[6] - Quote
NanDe YaNen wrote:Where can we extract a lot of ISK from the economy to account for ratting and mission running? Let's start with someone else's problem. Whenever gankers suicide gank with alts and pick up the loot, they use unaffiliated accounts in order to acquire the loot because the gank accounts lose security status and can't get to the can. No problem. Let's apply a tax to the cargo.
- Cargo is flagged when non-wardec gank happens in system with security > 0.0
- Flagged cargo is not able to be sold on market or entered into contract until tax is paid
- Tax rate depends on both the security where the cargo was regarded as stolen and where the cargo gets put onto market
- War-dec loot no problem
- 0.0 stolen loot no problem
- 0.0 delivered loot no problem
- Ganked outside Rens station and sold in Rens, holy crap expensive
- Base tax on estimate used in assets window
Everyone's happier that this tax is applied according to the severity of the security violation and usually will affect suicide gankers using new accounts that feel more like an abuse of alpha accounts than intended game mechanics? I'll accept your applause. Seriously. Who's complaining? Maybe you should live outside Jita occasionally. The only person not happier is a suicide ganker that needs to get 5bn ISK liquid to sell that loot or somehow get it to low sec so that they can move the gear, and now they can join the risk reward club. I'm preparing a doctrine for Liberal Universalism. Because the doctrine is heavily focused on trade, the broker fees and sales tax are generally regarded as an enemy to all pod pilots. The fact is that this tax is not set by any market. The spreads are set somewhat by the tax. This proposal is one of many that will be made for the benefit of the universe. Please set standings negative if you have a problem, and do so LIBERALLY.
As someone who largely survives off of ganking for funding my activities, I don't personally like this idea, though it would be neat to see the black market trading for larger ticket items through trade windows to avoid paying these taxes. Of course, players could also just sell stuff in citadels where there are player set tax rates.
Also what do you mean with your point about Alpha gankers?
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NanDe YaNen
Liberal Universalists
9
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Posted - 2017.05.18 11:05:14 -
[7] - Quote
Quote:Also what do you mean with your point about Alpha gankers?
I'm only recently coming back to the game after a long break. IIRC a highsec gank usually is done with alts either to shoot things or to scoop loot to avoid being associated with the criminals as far as Concode is concerned.
About using citadels to avoid the tax, I'm not 100% sure. I was under the impression that sales tax is levied even at citadels while citadel owners set the brokerage fee.
In any case, moving to WH space or nullsec is a perfectly fine safety valve that requires exposure to risk. I can't imagine allowing setting the stolen goods tax rate as this is part of the relationship lowsec and highsec citadels would have with Concorde; a tax-free haven would be nullsec or WH space, not a citadel receiving Concode protection from random blaps happening outside. |
NanDe YaNen
Liberal Universalists
9
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Posted - 2017.05.18 11:22:56 -
[8] - Quote
Quote:As someone who largely survives off of ganking for funding my activities
Just a curiosity, do you mostly hisec gank or lowsec gank?
I concur with your judgement that ultimately this would shift ISK sinking onto a smaller number of players than uniform brokerage fees and sales tax.
Is it healthy for the game overall? I could see more colorful relationships between low and nullsec, such as moving goods to nullsec to launder them and taking them back to highsec. I could foresee camping a 0.1 instead of a 0.4 to get better tax rates and making sec status less trinary. |
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