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Temugen Crimson Squall Molotov Coalition	Posted - 2007.06.03 22:25:00 - [1] Im not sure if this is the right section of forums but here go's. CCP needs to do something about sentry's shooting drones. Never have i seen gate/station sentrys shoot the guns/launchers off someone's ship. With certain ships ie domi, myrm, ishtar, etc., the only offensive weapons they use are drones. When the sentry's start shooting their drones that would be the same as sentrys shooting guns off of a megathron or a tempest. Basically the sentry's are disarming the ship that uses drones but not the ships that use guns/launchers. CCP PLEASE FIX THIS!!! Thank you for your support I love carebears....Tastey >: )
Ash Vincetti Agony Unleashed Agony Empire	Posted - 2007.06.03 22:29:00 - [2] So lowsec sentries kill the drones, but highsec sentries/concord don't. Nice. -----
jilahed	Posted - 2007.06.03 22:32:00 - [3] But you can't target guns as it stands. Shooting drones on the other hand is a viable tactic for players - so why not for the sentries? Actually drone ships have quite some advantages in the versatility section over traditional gun ships. Now its true they don't shine on gatecamps, but so what? If you want to use a domi/myrmidon on a gatecamp use t1 drones and fit some weapons in your hi slots. No need for a change imo.
Xoria Krint The Movement	Posted - 2007.06.03 22:51:00 - [4] Temugg vinner. --- My Movies
Chronus26 Gallente Team Laser Explosion Molotov Coalition	Posted - 2007.06.03 23:02:00 - [5] Originally by: Temugen With certain ships ie domi, myrm, ishtar, etc., the only offensive weapons they use are drones. These ships have turret hardpoints - use them. -----
space hobo Gallente DIE WITH HONOUR	Posted - 2007.06.03 23:03:00 - [6] I OWN >:( ------------------- 400x120@24000 bytes Maximum please. - Acario Vito its not my fault that noobs PC's cant handle small image's - space hobo
Temugen Crimson Squall Molotov Coalition	Posted - 2007.06.03 23:20:00 - [7] It doesnt matter how much you guys whine about it..it is completely wrong that drone spec'd ships are not on a "level playing field"Ö with gun/missle spec'd ships. I shouldnt be required to train for guns to fit in my slots of a drone spec'd ship. If im going to be drone spec'd then ccp should fix this screwed up game so that either guns get shot by sentry's or drones do not... its that simple! CCP...FIX THIS NOW!!!! Thank you for your support I love carebears....Tastey >: )
Temugen Crimson Squall Molotov Coalition	Posted - 2007.06.03 23:33:00 - [8] Actually i need to add another thing about drones. If there are going to be drone spec'd ships then drones should be treated like guns/launchers. I should be able to attack cans or anything else that guns can shoot. I love carebears....Tastey >: )
Pilk Axiom Empire	Posted - 2007.06.04 00:09:00 - [9] Edited by: Pilk on 04/06/2007 00:09:20 CCP, having now flown a Vulture for a couple months, I've noticed that my guns have an issue with something called "tracking". My missiles NEVER HAD THIS PROBLEM. It's ABSURD that my guns can't function in the EXACT SAME WAY as a completely different weapons system. CCP PLEASE FIX THIS! Oh, and by the way, you're immune to ECM bursts, ECM, and damps, your weapons auto-aggress and return fire even before you lock me, they never run out of ammo, and they take no fittings. Stop whining, and start adapting. Edit: Yes, though, there's no reason drones shouldn't be able to hit cans, corpses, and anything else they can't hit at the moment. --P Kosh: The avalanche has already started. It is too late for the pebbles to vote.
SiJira	Posted - 2007.06.04 00:27:00 - [10] sorry this comes to the point of what i shall now dubb DULL BALANCE its when you want every ship to be able to do what every other ship can drone ships cant gate/station camp so too bad ____ __ ________ _sig below_ the jet cans are made so that people that dont mine can get free ore miners ritually donate the ore to anyone wishing to take some
Jacob Castillo Caldari Copperhead Inc.	Posted - 2007.06.04 00:29:00 - [11] No. You can't shoot another player's guns off his ship, so sentry guns should not be able to either. Fit guns on your drone ships, and use them as a backup weapon for gate camps.
Siigari Kitawa Gallente The Aduro Protocol	Posted - 2007.06.04 00:30:00 - [12] Originally by: SiJira drone ships cant gate/station camp so too bad Shut up. I can gatecamp in a drone ship in lowsec just fine and use ONLY DRONES and do a really great job killing things. _________________ Burn.
Lance Fighter	Posted - 2007.06.04 00:39:00 - [13] I loled when I find that you posted here too. You can see my repsonce here http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=531270 or since i know you are all lazy, i copied it for you. shrug So what? Are you complaining because game mechanics allow your ship to get disarmed? IMO, drones are meant to be a supplement to your damage. Sure, one some ships, they are not much of a supplement, but still. Oh yes, and you don't see your opponent in a pvp engagement shooting off your guns either. So, we do 2 things - make it so that drones don't get shot at (bad idea) or make it so that guns can get shot at (better)... Or, we can make sentry guns insta-pwn any ship they want to shoot at, and you don't have much of a problem, do you? Hmm I suppose CCP could hurry up with subsystem targeting and make sentries shoot at your guns... But you really would not like that idea either, trust me. Someone keeps truncating my signature, I swear
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Sparta Alliance	Posted - 2007.06.04 00:48:00 - [14] It does suck yes, but thats drones for you. Part and parcel of using them. Either learn to live with it or.....well, don't learn to live with it, and just use something else. If you're finding it difficult to pirate in drone ships because of this, switch to a turret based ship. Every job has it's tool, I suppose. --------
ghosttr Amarr ARK-CORP FREGE Alliance	Posted - 2007.06.04 01:15:00 - [15] Originally by: Temugen It doesnt matter how much you guys whine about it..it is completely wrong that drone spec'd ships are not on a "level playing field"Ö with gun/missle spec'd ships. I shouldnt be required to train for guns to fit in my slots of a drone spec'd ship. If im going to be drone spec'd then ccp should fix this screwed up game so that either guns get shot by sentry's or drones do not... its that simple! CCP...FIX THIS NOW!!!! Thank you for your support You don't have to use ammo, dont have to worry about accuracy, drones are cheaper than any gun..... Drones are fine. Each weapon has its fallbacks. Please dont take away the things that make each weapon unique! Make Mining Better
Arushia Nova Labs Empire Research	Posted - 2007.06.04 05:53:00 - [16] Originally by: Pilk Oh, and by the way, you're immune to ECM bursts, ECM, and damps, your weapons auto-aggress and return fire even before you lock me, they never run out of ammo, and they take no fittings. And never obey orders =( Tired of Waiting? Use Empire Research
Dyavn Ryyre Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2007.06.04 06:19:00 - [17] Erm, I've seen people pop their jet cans with drones when I try and steal from them. I'm pretty sure you can attack cans with drones. ________________________________________________ Originally by: "Alumion" Welcome to EVE, where many wars are started over forum posts.
Galan Amarias Amarr Vendetta Underground Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.06.04 06:23:00 - [18] Originally by: Temugen It doesnt matter how much you guys whine about it..it is completely wrong that drone spec'd ships are not on a "level playing field"Ö with gun/missle spec'd ships. I shouldnt be required to train for guns to fit in my slots of a drone spec'd ship. If im going to be drone spec'd then ccp should fix this screwed up game so that either guns get shot by sentry's or drones do not... its that simple! CCP...FIX THIS NOW!!!! Thank you for your support My my, someone got his undies twisted. For me I love it when the sentries shoot my drones. Takes a few hits to waste one and that's several hundred less points of dammage my armor has to shrug off. Then again I had to learn turrets and drones, and armor and capicitor and fitting... and well we all learn lots of skills eh? Why is it you think you shouldn't have to? It only takes about a mil and a half sp into drones to have some real monsters you know. Use the Vespa II's your Dominix can hold tons of em. Or quit ****ing, adapt and get a megathron. As for your level playing field, yeah it is wrong that I as an Amarr should have to be terrified of ships with huge drone bays, MWD bonuses and racks of Nos. Nerf drone ships! EVE is balanced, no ship is great at everything, no strategy will win every time. Whining to fix that is just unimanagitive play. -Galan
Ladyah Liandri VMF-214 Blacksheep	Posted - 2007.06.04 06:33:00 - [19] There's nothing to fix since that part with drones ain't broken. a.) Sentry guns shoot at ANY drones not specifically the ones from Gallente ships. b.) Drones launched from specialized drone boats are able to hold together a fair bit longer to sentry fire than others - so they're able to deal more DOT. And they divert fire from your ship all in all longer. c.) You can't pop cans and stuff with drones? Come again? Totally not true.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United Cult of War	Posted - 2007.06.04 06:44:00 - [20] Allrighty then. Let's compare the two from a gun point of view(i fly amarr so i use both and some missiles too...we're the omnirace that's "great" at everything ) My turrets don't auto-attack next target. My turrets can't shoot with one(or two) clicks all targets. I can't group my turrets. I can't carry several different damagetype turrets. I actually have two types, and only one for longer then 20km distance(as amarr) Sure, there are differences, in all aspects, but that's what makes EVE so...special of a lady
Wrayeth Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.06.04 06:54:00 - [21] Originally by: Temugen It doesnt matter how much you guys whine about it..it is completely wrong that drone spec'd ships are not on a "level playing field"Ö with gun/missle spec'd ships. You're right - they're NOT on a level playing field with gun/missile ships. In fact, they're significantly better in almost every situation but fleets and long range sniping. Yep, that's right. They get to use all of their highslots to fit nos/guns/whatever the hell they want as a secondary weapons system, they can devote all of their lowslots to tanking since they don't need those annoying damage mod thingies, and--lest we forget--their drones have ridiculous amounts of hitpoints and they usually have the drone bay for multiple flights even if the first one gets destroyed. You ever tried taking out a properly-kitted nos-domi in a turret ship? No? You should try it - the domi will rip you a new one. It will nos your cap dry so you can't fire or tank, all the while tanking everything you can throw at it. Shield-tanked missile ship? Even worse - your DPS will never even come close to breaking the domi's tank, and your cap-hungry shield booster won't last long against the dominix' nos. -Wrayeth n00b Extraordinaire "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
murder one Gallente Death of Virtue Vigilance Infinitas	Posted - 2007.06.04 07:04:00 - [22] Drones shouldn't be shot by the sentries, but my motivation isn't the same as the OPs. POS guns don't shoot drones, so it's not hard to make the sentry code replicate the behaviour of POS guns, as an example. IMO sentry guns should focus 100% of their fire on the player, 100% of the time. All too often players use cheap T1 drones as a 'distraction' for the sentries, to keep the sentry fire off of them for just that few critical seconds for them to kill a target and then jump out. Not shooting drones would be a small buff to drone ships, but it would be an even more effective upgrade to sentries in general. Another upside is that if a pirate (me) has yummy T2 drones, then they might just survive the fight if I die to be scooped up and looted by the victors. As it sits now, there will never be any lootable drones if they get deployed. Because I said so...
Malcanis High4Life Curse Alliance	Posted - 2007.06.04 07:34:00 - [23] Originally by: Temugen Im not sure if this is the right section of forums but here go's. CCP needs to do something about sentry's shooting drones. Never have i seen gate/station sentrys shoot the guns/launchers off someone's ship. With certain ships ie domi, myrm, ishtar, etc., the only offensive weapons they use are drones. When the sentry's start shooting their drones that would be the same as sentrys shooting guns off of a megathron or a tempest. Basically the sentry's are disarming the ship that uses drones but not the ships that use guns/launchers. CCP PLEASE FIX THIS!!! Thank you for your support And never have I seen guns that take no high slots, ignore EW/Damps/Target Disruptors and never run out of ammo. Almost as if there's some kind of risk:reward thing going on.
Miz Cenuij OctoberSnow Corp	Posted - 2007.06.04 07:35:00 - [24] signed "Men are going to die.. and im going to kill them".
Mr Friendly That it Should Come to This	Posted - 2007.06.04 09:49:00 - [25] Edited by: Mr Friendly on 04/06/2007 09:51:45 Drones aren't part of your ship. Guns are part of your ship. Further, they shoot at things independent of what your ship is doing. It stands to reason that 'discrete units that fire independently' of your ship would gain aggro. I'm a sp-heavy drone user, and I don't think of drones as guns. I think of them as little gun-boats. It sucks they can be blown up and leave me without the means to shoot back, but it also sucks I can't NOS from 150 kn's out, like a real gunboat can shoot me from. It's all about niches and the 'correct tool for the job'. Use a non-droneboat if you want to camp gates/stations. Simple.
Ashaz Mindstar Technology United Confederation of Corporations	Posted - 2007.06.04 10:48:00 - [26] Edited by: Ashaz on 04/06/2007 10:48:48 Originally by: ghosttr You don't have to use ammo, semi-True. Drones are their own ammo. altho normal ammo can be stored in teh cargo bay. drones can not, so the ammo becomes very limited. Quote: dont have to worry about accuracy, False. Quote: drones are cheaper than any gun..... Very false! combined with the unreliable behaviour of drones these days, they are very expencive to use. to the point of many people sticking with T1 drones achtually. Quote: Drones are fine. False False False. http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=497078
CrestoftheStars Perkone	Posted - 2007.06.04 11:10:00 - [27] loled complaining about sentry's doing the smartest thing?! hehehehheheheheheeheheh your SOO far out:P ccp DON'T change this, would be stupid if you did andvery unrealistic. ___________________________________________ Humans take everything that is beautiful and sweet and turn it into something horrifying and ugly. http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&thr
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Sparta Alliance	Posted - 2007.06.04 11:57:00 - [28] Originally by: Ladyah Liandri c.) You can't pop cans and stuff with drones? Come again? Totally not true. Last time I checked, he's right. Drones can't target wrecks or cans. I was very frustrated when they first changed that, because it meant that I couldn't use my drones for housecleaning wrecks full of useless loot. I haven't tested it in a fair while though, so maybe they've fixed it. Would be nice. Drones have got their benefits, and they have their drawbacks. The drawbacks are that they are extremely expensive compared to gun use, and you can be completely disarmed in combat (making them very "ammo limited", in practice), have an extremely delayed alpha strike, and finally, they have the AI of a parakeet. The pros are that they do hell of a lot of damage when used on a drone boat, use no high slots, can't be blocked with EWAR very easily, and are the kings of small group PvP. The pros are so good that they need the cons to keep them balanced. And if you need to do something that one of the cons are preventing you from doing, you just have to use something else. --------
Galan Amarias Amarr Vendetta Underground Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.06.05 06:50:00 - [29] Originally by: Ashaz Edited by: Ashaz on 04/06/2007 10:48:48 Originally by: ghosttr You don't have to use ammo, semi-True. Drones are their own ammo. altho normal ammo can be stored in teh cargo bay. drones can not, so the ammo becomes very limited. Not the same thing. Drones are a weapon system not ammo. Ammo runs out all on it's own drones have to be destroyed as individuals to go away and can have their shields repaired instantly if the drone boat pilot is paying attention. Also they fit just fine into the cargo bay, but the cargo bay has no drone launcher so ya have to dock to fit them to their launch rails. Quote: Quote: dont have to worry about accuracy, False. True, there is a skill that increases drone accuracy but only insanely fast ships can out fly drones. Again similar, but different. Quote: Quote: drones are cheaper than any gun..... Very false! combined with the unreliable behaviour of drones these days, they are very expencive to use. to the point of many people sticking with T1 drones achtually. Drones cost less than 10mil each. Usually 1-5 mil for T2. T2 guns, unless you plan to stick them on a frigate, usually start at 2-5 mil and get progressivly more ugly. Additionally T2 guns use T2 ammo wich further inflates costs. Finally, after a battle drones are totally unnefected by the detonation of their parent ship, guns have a % chance to remain in the wreck. Furthermore, my drones have been very reliable. Quote: Quote: Drones are fine. False False False. http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=497078 Ok here I agree with you. Drones aren't "Fine". They are Great! One final point. Drones kill wrecks just fine. They seem able to attack jet cans too, though I'm only pretty sure I did that. What they can not be made to attack is Giant secure containers. Dunno why? Then again GSC are just all arround obnoxious to kill.
Petrothian Tong Gallente	Posted - 2007.06.05 07:13:00 - [30] on the plus side, there aren't that many gallente Whine threads =P we are waaaay overdue for one. Drones are great btw, no need for buffing. they: -don't have to reload, and they last awhile if you know what you are doing. (*scoop to drone bay, ah, look ma, shields recharged!) -don't miss 10/10 if its something that faster than your weapon. (would love to see someone outrun T2 Light drones and fight you at the same time.) -"smart" in 1 vs 1 siturations. the all aggro that guy. -immune to ECM, Ewar, -easily replace damage types. -can shoot up to 100km (sentry drones) -keep aggro off you for a bit. is the most versatile system in the game... what more can you want?.. oh, and yeah if you whine about not being able to shoot guns off a ship... wait till CCP get around to subsystems targeting... is on the drawing board =P -Siggi- ""PvP" isn't only direct person to person combat, it can be very indirect. Selling an item on the market which somebody buys from you is resulting in another guy not getting a sale." Oveur
Kappas. Galaxy Punks	Posted - 2007.06.05 09:16:00 - [31] Edited by: Kappas. on 05/06/2007 09:17:58 Originally by: ghosttr You don't have to use ammo, dont have to worry about accuracy, drones are cheaper than any gun..... Amarr don't have to use ammo, drones do variable damage as with normal turrets, depending on their tracking, you can't destroy the guns on the side of the ship, you can, however, destroy a few 2m isk drones... By your logic there should be a serious "nerf amarr" thread around soon since you guys don't use ammo either edit: to your point about t2 guns being cheaper, 425mm Railgun II's are now around 4-5m each and unless you die they don't. Unlike drones where you lose a couple nearly every time.
Ishur Gallente Ore Diggers	Posted - 2007.06.05 09:17:00 - [32] Hey Temugen. Ya this is the guy you pwned twice in the last month - I think you are missing the point you yourself make- Sentries hit what forms the biggest threat. (And lowest hitpoints sometimes.) If that threat is formed by a domi with drones it is logical it'll take out the drones. ''I know that human beings and fish can coexist peacefully'' - George W Bush.
jilahed	Posted - 2007.06.05 11:21:00 - [33] Originally by: Kappas. Amarr don't have to use ammo, drones do variable damage as with normal turrets, depending on their tracking, you can't destroy the guns on the side of the ship, you can, however, destroy a few 2m isk drones... By your logic there should be a serious "nerf amarr" thread around soon since you guys don't use ammo either We use ammo. They are called crystals and we use them to adjust damage/range ratio according to our need. It is true that t1 crystals don't burn out so they're infinite so in a way we don't use ammo. But when it comes to t2 crystals your statement is wrong. A t2 crystal will survive 1000 shots after that he has to be replaced. That isn't the same as with other turrets because you typically don't have to reload during fight which is an advantage. But still its ammo and it uses up. Its also very uncomofortable to carry crystals for like 20million in your cargo hold when you fly a battleship. Comparing the tracking of drones to laser tracking is a bit optimistic. Drones have far less problems due to tracking at least thats my experience (t2 drones eben have better tracking than t1's - compare that with the tracking penalties of t2 crystals). Of course its still a valid point that they indeed suffer from accuracy.

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