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Vdub2002	Posted - 2007.06.19 08:13:00 - [1] As from wiki-Although technical specifications varied, all battlecruisers shared a similar role specification. They were designed to hunt down and outgun smaller warships or merchant ships, and outrun larger warships that they could not outgun. This idea was mainly conceived by British Admiral Jackie Fisher who believed "speed is the best protection". by traditional standards a battlecruiser is a lightly armored ship using battleship sized weapons. The battlecruisers in eve use cruiser classed weapons, with more armor/shields, but not much faster than a battleship. where would ccp go wrong if they were to reclass bc's as heavy cruisers (not to be confused with heavy ASSAULT cruisers) and adding more ships as battlecruisers. this would not only add more ships (who doesnt want new ships) but give the current battlecruisers a more defined role. as it stands a battlecruiser has no chance (except command ships) against a battleship, which in reality shouldnt be the case.
E Vile	Posted - 2007.06.19 08:19:00 - [2] ""stands a battlecruiser has no chance (except command ships) against a battleship"" I'm sorry but I strongly disagree, out of experience. A well skilled and fitted BC can hold it's own very well. "The key to immortality is to first live a life worth remembering." Shohadaku New York Metal
Edania Caldari Ordo Adeptus Astartes	Posted - 2007.06.19 08:19:00 - [3] i dont get it they are faster than BS's which they cant outgun and they can destroy cruisers with ease thats the specification your wiki quote gives and to quote ronseal "they do exactly what they say on te tin" Quote: my Clone was excelent, i just had too many skillpoints
Edania Caldari Ordo Adeptus Astartes	Posted - 2007.06.19 08:22:00 - [4] also with the aid of gateguns i held off a Domi and a raven once forcing them both to withdraw whilst piloting a ferox sure i didnt kill anything but it was a victory none the less Quote: my Clone was excelent, i just had too many skillpoints
Cpt Fina Insult to Injury	Posted - 2007.06.19 08:22:00 - [5] Edited by: Cpt Fina on 19/06/2007 08:22:29 Why do you want to make Eve like real life? Isn't it possible that the defenition of battlecruisers has changed during the hunderds (thousands?) of years that has gone by since the defenitions of battlecruisers was made? Edit: In real life all it takes to blow a ship to pieces is a well placed torpedo... you want that in Eve too, eh?
Odinegras	Posted - 2007.06.19 08:27:00 - [6] i think the only true battlecruiser is the myrmidon. With its BS size drones. But i have to agree with you that the battle cruisers in eve are more a heavy cruiser, but then a drake with less shield/armour and the ability to fit cruise launchers would be too imbalanced, especially if it was substantially faster than a BS. Battlecruisers fill a nice gap between cruisers and BS's and a true battlecruiser would be say a thorax with BS size guns. But then that would be too imbalanced due to the effect of speed in this game.
Ashaz Mindstar Technology United Confederation of Corporations	Posted - 2007.06.19 09:02:00 - [7] Altho the idTa seems fun. Something the size of a BC, but with only 4 highslots that can fit large guns? And a bonus to large guns to make it obvious. Only 4 highs versus a BS 7-8 highs, to make it like the cruiser / BC fittings. could be cool? iDrone
Banana Torres The Green Banana Corporation	Posted - 2007.06.19 09:05:00 - [8] Originally by: Cpt Fina In real life all it takes to blow a ship to pieces is a well placed torpedo... you want that in Eve too, eh? Yah. Except in Eve they are gonna be called bombs.
Acinonyx Jubatus International Multi-Player Consortium Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.06.19 09:06:00 - [9] Medium turrets seem fine due to tracking/dps issues.
Vdub2002	Posted - 2007.06.19 09:08:00 - [10] Edited by: Vdub2002 on 19/06/2007 09:07:04 ashas got what i was saying sure a well fitted high skilled bc could, but how many of you will stay in a bc when those skills could be put to better use in a battleship? and i'd like to see an AVERAGE player in a bc kill a AVERAGE player in a bs... i have very good missile and shield skills (i used to fly drake) i could take on most bs' 1 on 1 and it be a draw, bc's have very low dps and unless fully t2 (which mine is, well was pretty much) it doesnt stand to much of a chance. now dont get me wrong, a bc can make or break a battle but honestly... with my ceptor skills my prophecy gets 180 m/s thats nav 5... i can get hurricane to 195 m/s... but the battle cruisers place is next to a battleship, not with the cruisers and friggies.
Cpt Fina Insult to Injury	Posted - 2007.06.19 09:08:00 - [11] Originally by: Ashaz Altho the idTa seems fun. Something the size of a BC, but with only 4 highslots that can fit large guns? And a bonus to large guns to make it obvious. Only 4 highs versus a BS 7-8 highs, to make it like the cruiser / BC fittings. could be cool? How much more dps do you get from 4 large guns vs 8 medium guns?
Vdub2002	Posted - 2007.06.19 09:22:00 - [12] lol, your not understanding the post at all... doesnt have to have just 4 high slots. a no tank cheap damage dealer thats quick. no more armor than the current battlecruisers, with the same speed, 4 low slots 4 mid slots 6-8 highs, whos soul purpose in game would be cannon fodder pretty much.
Cpt Fina Insult to Injury	Posted - 2007.06.19 09:36:00 - [13] Originally by: Vdub2002 lol, your not understanding the post at all... doesnt have to have just 4 high slots. a no tank cheap damage dealer thats quick. no more armor than the current battlecruisers, with the same speed, 4 low slots 4 mid slots 6-8 highs, whos soul purpose in game would be cannon fodder pretty much. No i don't understand why you have to implement shipdesigns from the early 20th century on spaceships in another galaxy several hundreds of years later. If you want more ships just say so. I found other intresting wiki-facts that you might want CCP to take a look at: -A barge is a flat-bottomed boat, built mainly for river and canal transport of heavy goods. Most barges are not self-propelled and need to be moved by tugboats... Let's make the miningbarge into a big piece of metal that someone else needs to drag around. -At the beginning of the 21st century, cruisers are the heaviest surface combatant ships in use... So, give cruiser the ability to mount large guns... or even siegemodules. -About dreadnoughts "Contemporaneous accounts normally described them simply as battleships. Nerf the dreads!!
Arushia Nova Labs Empire Research	Posted - 2007.06.19 09:42:00 - [14] To add further to the confusion, CCP has compared EVE battlecruisers to pocket battleships in the Rev 1.0 patchnotes. Tired of Waiting? Use Empire Research
KillahB Wokou Enterprises	Posted - 2007.06.19 09:46:00 - [15] Edited by: KillahB on 19/06/2007 09:46:34 nice bagground and shirt=) no ones Illah than KiLLaH
E Vile	Posted - 2007.06.19 09:47:00 - [16] Originally by: Vdub2002 Edited by: Vdub2002 on 19/06/2007 09:07:04 ashas got what i was saying sure a well fitted high skilled bc could, but how many of you will stay in a bc when those skills could be put to better use in a battleship? and i'd like to see an AVERAGE player in a bc kill a AVERAGE player in a bs... i have very good missile and shield skills (i used to fly drake) i could take on most bs' 1 on 1 and it be a draw, bc's have very low dps and unless fully t2 (which mine is, well was pretty much) it doesnt stand to much of a chance. now dont get me wrong, a bc can make or break a battle but honestly... with my ceptor skills my prophecy gets 180 m/s thats nav 5... i can get hurricane to 195 m/s... but the battle cruisers place is next to a battleship, not with the cruisers and friggies. I would be glad to meet you in game to show you how "little" dps a Myrmidon has. Your problem is you mentioned you flew a drake. A drake has crap DPS. "The key to immortality is to first live a life worth remembering." Shohadaku New York Metal
Vdub2002	Posted - 2007.06.19 09:56:00 - [17] lol! myrm is the best bc in game souly because of the drones and ammount of weapons it can hold, it is out of line with all the other battle cruisers.
Na'Kunni Amarr Null Horizon	Posted - 2007.06.19 10:01:00 - [18] Originally by: Vdub2002 Edited by: Vdub2002 on 19/06/2007 09:07:04 ashas got what i was saying sure a well fitted high skilled bc could, but how many of you will stay in a bc when those skills could be put to better use in a battleship? and i'd like to see an AVERAGE player in a bc kill a AVERAGE player in a bs... i have very good missile and shield skills (i used to fly drake) i could take on most bs' 1 on 1 and it be a draw, bc's have very low dps and unless fully t2 (which mine is, well was pretty much) it doesnt stand to much of a chance. now dont get me wrong, a bc can make or break a battle but honestly... with my ceptor skills my prophecy gets 180 m/s thats nav 5... i can get hurricane to 195 m/s... but the battle cruisers place is next to a battleship, not with the cruisers and friggies. I am a partial nub to BC's, being a Ceptor lover an all. But I can say that yes a BC can hold it's own against a BS. I ended up fighting a BS + Arazu (think it was Arazu), and if only i could of stayed out of the blaster range, the tide of the battle would of changed. But it so happend I warped in on top of him, so unlucky on my end I guess. Drake can tank a BS (heck even 2, unless they have changed it now), and yes the Myrmidon gotta take my hat off to that ship. It's the best ship in the game imo, apart from the "ZOMGIPWN" Carriers/Dreads/Titans. But that being said I think the Myrmidon being the best ship in the game, I still wouldn't fly 1 as I am Amarr and that wouldn't go very well flying an enemy ship now would it? I like the BC's the way they are, keep thier high slots/med slots/low slots, keep medium/heavy guns on them.
Siigari Kitawa Gallente The Aduro Protocol	Posted - 2007.06.19 10:09:00 - [19] Originally by: Vdub2002 lol! myrm is the best bc in game souly because of the drones and ammount of weapons it can hold, it is out of line with all the other battle cruisers. QFT minus spelling errors. _________________ Burn.
Vrabac Amarr Shadowed Souls The Cartel.	Posted - 2007.06.19 10:20:00 - [20] Originally by: Vdub2002 As from wiki-Although technical specifications varied, all battlecruisers shared a similar role specification. They were designed to hunt down and outgun smaller warships or merchant ships, and outrun larger warships that they could not outgun. This idea was mainly conceived by British Admiral Jackie Fisher who believed "speed is the best protection". by traditional standards a battlecruiser is a lightly armored ship using battleship sized weapons. The battlecruisers in eve use cruiser classed weapons, with more armor/shields, but not much faster than a battleship. where would ccp go wrong if they were to reclass bc's as heavy cruisers (not to be confused with heavy ASSAULT cruisers) and adding more ships as battlecruisers. this would not only add more ships (who doesnt want new ships) but give the current battlecruisers a more defined role. as it stands a battlecruiser has no chance (except command ships) against a battleship, which in reality shouldnt be the case. Yep, I remember being very dissapointed when I figured out a battlecruiser here is what in traditional navy is called a heavy cruiser. Even a description somewhere, not sure if in game or on web site, indicated the battlecruiser in EVE is what it was in reality. Not to mention ships like Prophecy being described as "slightly smaller, more mobile artillery support". Slightly... yeah. BC should be in every way comparable to a battleship, including size, with somewhat less armor (I suppose hitpoints in our case and maybe no tanking bonus) and more speed. Maybe one day we get them.
LMAAAOOOO	Posted - 2007.06.19 10:23:00 - [21] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Originally by: Vdub2002 lol! myrm is the best bc in game souly because of the drones and ammount of weapons it can hold, it is out of line with all the other battle cruisers. QFT minus spelling errors. But it's gallente
Juwi Kotch Gallente VIRTUAL LIFE VANGUARD Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2007.06.19 10:58:00 - [22] That's true, EVE's Battlecruisers are in fact Heavy Cruisers. I like the idea to add a new T1 ship class (for a change) with true Battlecruisers in the meaning of light battleships. Slightly improved shield, armor, and hull compared to a Cruiser, speed and sig radius between Cruisers and the present "Heavy Cruisers" aka Battlecruiser, and the capability to carry battleship sized weapons and modules. Juwi Kotch JOIN NOW, KLICK SIG!
Caios Caldari Unified Refining Federation Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.06.19 13:02:00 - [23] This is EVE, not Real World Blue Water Navies Online. I mean, our "interceptors" are "frigates" the size of commercial airliners and we can fit the same ammo rounds into 180, 220 and 420mm guns, among other things. Just take the CCP version and run with it.
Vrabac Amarr Shadowed Souls The Cartel.	Posted - 2007.06.19 13:27:00 - [24] Originally by: Caios This is EVE, not Real World Blue Water Navies Online. I mean, our "interceptors" are "frigates" the size of commercial airliners and we can fit the same ammo rounds into 180, 220 and 420mm guns, among other things. Just take the CCP version and run with it. As much as your point is valid, using that exact logic we could have ships modelled to look as purple elefants and defend it saying it's EVE, not reality so it's ok. I don't see this idea as a whine, it's just a suggestion and some of us like it, comparison to real naval formulation is legitimate since names and general ideas derive from it as well as descriptions of the ships indicate something other than what we have in the game. Again, it's a suggestion.
Nian Banks Minmatar Berserkers of Aesir	Posted - 2007.06.19 13:37:00 - [25] Heavy Cruisers and Battlecruisers are one and the same, they are large war ships designed to have traits that battleships have but are faster and more agile, Germany had bs armour and cruiser guns, Britain had bs guns and cruiser armor. They both were the opposite but the same. Its also worth noting that the british battlecruises had a shorter life expectancy and so were less effective in real combat in comparison to the german battlecruiser. We should also remember that the reason there are a few different names for them is mostly due to translation and naming conventions. Now if we were to make a new battlecruiser class, I would love to have a cruiser tank with a few bs sized guns. Mmm
Vrabac Amarr Shadowed Souls The Cartel.	Posted - 2007.06.19 13:50:00 - [26] Originally by: Nian Banks Heavy Cruisers and Battlecruisers are one and the same No.
Nasair	Posted - 2007.06.19 13:53:00 - [27] Oh dear we did make a few silly decisions in ship design for WW2, dreadnaughts with poor hatch proceedures and cloth to hold the gunpowder? One shot kill dreadnaught yay
punnani	Posted - 2007.06.19 17:13:00 - [28] Play Navyfield MMORG. There you can enjoy the historically accurate battlecruisers and mighty battleships of the WW2 era.
Ehranavaar	Posted - 2007.06.19 17:31:00 - [29] Originally by: Vdub2002 Edited by: Vdub2002 on 19/06/2007 09:07:04 but the battle cruisers place is next to a battleship, not with the cruisers and friggies. man a bc proper place is to stay away from battleships which can hurt it. their job was to raid and to destroy the other sides raiders not to stand in the line of battle.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United Cult of War	Posted - 2007.06.19 17:36:00 - [30] Well, what about destroyers? they were mainly out on the seas to hunt down submarines. I don't see any "destroyer" type modules for cov-ops hunting So yeah, i have a problem with being serious, but it's the almost smallest problem i have.

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