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Chathos
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Posted - 2007.06.19 18:34:00 -
[1]
Hello guys. I used play EVe back in the day when it was fairly new and just started playing again.
Let me setup my scenario. I can play this at work and at home. I have a fairly laid back job, but still need to get work done. But while I'm at work I would like to make some money that doesn't require me to pay 100% attention to the game.
I was thinking I would buy an industry ship with huge cargo space. Buy some stuff at station 1 and then jump about 30 times and sell the stuff at station 2. Is this possible to make money this way?
This would allow me to keep EVE running in the background and allowing me to check in on it every 5 minutes or so to make sure eveything is fine.
Or, if this wouldn't work and make a lot of money, what would in my situation? Mining? But doesn't that still require a lot of attention?
Any advice is MUCH appreciated guys.
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Ikuu
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Posted - 2007.06.19 18:37:00 -
[2]
AFK hauling is generally a pretty bad idea, if you're carrying cargo that isn't worth 'much' you should be safe. But people will suicide kill you if you're carrying enough to make it profitable for them.
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Chathos
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Posted - 2007.06.19 18:48:00 -
[3]
I'm just looking to make some money that doesn't require my full attention while at work. Even if it isn't that much.
I guess my general question is, say I buy 2,000 of item X. Each item X cost me 1000 ISK. I then travel a lot, say 30-40 jumps (takes hours and hours, maybe the full work day). At the new station they are buying item X for 3000 ISK. I just made an easy 4 million ISK! But would this even work. Do the prices of items fluctuate that much? And if so, how would I know the best places to buy cheap and sell high?
Buy 2,000 Item X for 2,000,000 from Station A
Travel 5-6 hours
Sell 2,000 Item X for 6,000,000 at Station B
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Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2007.06.19 18:53:00 -
[4]
Trading is definitely a way to make money but not so obviously simple as you might think. There are good trade runs to be had but they are difficult to sniff out and many are alreay run by others. It has happened to me where you leave and by the time you arrive you find someone else has already filled the order leaving you with a cargo hold full of stuff.
I am not saying do not do it mind you. It is definitely a viable profession. Of course the bigger cargo hold you have the better the profit (small margin * a lot of stuff = profit). So ideally you do this in a freighter that costs over 1 billion ISK itself.
As the previous poster mentioned be can and often do suicide themselves on haulers. If your cargo is worth substantially more than their ship it is a simple math calculation for them and you'll come back to find your ship blown up and cargo gone. Even if you are sitting at your keyboard you may not be able to stop this but AFK you are particularly vulnerable (cannot even turn on defensive mods). So you really need to be careful about the value of your cargo so you are not a juicy target. Freighters can move about 1 billion ISK in goods without worrying much about suicide gankers. Haulers far less.
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Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2007.06.19 18:55:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 19/06/2007 18:53:47
 Originally by: Chathos
Buy 2,000 Item X for 2,000,000 from Station A
Travel 5-6 hours
Sell 2,000 Item X for 6,000,000 at Station B
4,000,000,000 (billion) in cargo will get you targetted and popped big time. Even in a freighter.
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Chathos
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Posted - 2007.06.19 18:55:00 -
[6]
Ok thanks for the advice guys.
I'm curious though, IF I decide to persue this profession, how is it done? When I search the market I'm limited to region, how do I know what I buy cheap in this region will sell for higher in another region?
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trueblue1872
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:05:00 -
[7]
Why don't you mine?
Get an indy and just leave it to mine. Lot easier and safer. You could also mine with strip lasers. They have a cycle of 3mins so if you check back every five and just stick it in a can and haul it every hour.
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Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:06:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 19/06/2007 19:08:25
Originally by: Chathos
Ok thanks for the advice guys.
I'm curious though, IF I decide to persue this profession, how is it done? When I search the market I'm limited to region, how do I know what I buy cheap in this region will sell for higher in another region?
Well, you can have a number of ALTs camped in various regions. When you log on you check prices on given items in each region and find something that looks like a good margin. Pay CLOSE attention to low sec destinations and (this got me a few times) hi sec destinations that require travel through low sec. A hauler/freighter in low sec is absolutely an invitation to getting popped and quick. Freighter especially, doubly, triply so. The very best margins are generally to be found with one end in low sec so do not get greedy or get a lot of friends to help guard you.
Note that NPC trade goods are re-occurring. So if you spot a lucrative run it should renew itself daily. Over time you can firm up a trade route and do it over and over. Do not ask others about good trade runs. They understandably guard them jealously.
Finding such trades can be a task...note that EVE allows you to download market data on a given item. With that you can input them into a spreadsheet and such.
You can also make use of http://eve-central.com/home/ which is quite handy. Of course the problem with that is it is hard to tell how recent certain pricing info is so there is a risk. You can use a tool there to upload market information to them so essentially they have done the work for you of handling the data but still a chore to download each item and then others may also make use of that info.
Mostly practice makes perfect and after a bit you'll get a sense of things.
Best of luck!
EDIT: Note there are many more options than I listed that get more advanced. For instance some items might have good margins but are scattered in small amounts all over. You might have to run around and collect a pile then move a big pile to sale the next day. Or you can put up buy orders for stuff at a low price and collect a bunch then sell for a high price. Can get more creative than that even but just to give you a sense that there can be more to this than at first glance.
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Ozzie Asrail
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:13:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Ozzie Asrail on 19/06/2007 19:13:20
Originally by: trueblue1872
Why don't you mine?
Get an indy and just leave it to mine. Lot easier and safer. You could also mine with strip lasers. They have a cycle of 3mins so if you check back every five and just stick it in a can and haul it every hour.
Strips don't fit on anything but a barge.
Hulk+gisti booster+2x expander+2x cargo rig will perma tank any spawn in 0.5+ and has 17500m3 cargo. Takes only about 1 min to change roids or dock and unload and will run afk for 15-30mins depending on skills and t1\t2 crystals.
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Chathos
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:24:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Ozzie Asrail
Edited by: Ozzie Asrail on 19/06/2007 19:13:20
Originally by: trueblue1872
Why don't you mine?
Get an indy and just leave it to mine. Lot easier and safer. You could also mine with strip lasers. They have a cycle of 3mins so if you check back every five and just stick it in a can and haul it every hour.
Strips don't fit on anything but a barge.
Hulk+gisti booster+2x expander+2x cargo rig will perma tank any spawn in 0.5+ and has 17500m3 cargo. Takes only about 1 min to change roids or dock and unload and will run afk for 15-30mins depending on skills and t1\t2 crystals.
Sorry, but I'm still sort of a noob. What does perma tank mean? Does that mean that guys can hit on me and nothing will ever happen? Like an everlasting shield?
And what is a hulk? Is that a nickname for a ship?
THanks again guys for the good advice. I think mining might be the better alternative due to how tough it is to get a stable and profitable trade route going.
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Asestorian
Minmatar
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:34:00 -
[11]
A Hulk is the largest Exhumer, a Tech II mining barge. They take a long time to train for and are quite expensive.
The perma-tanking thing is where you have a tank that is completely cap-stable (it will never run out of cap operating under its normal conditions) and will tank what it's supposed to tank 24/7 if required. This of course won't necessarily help you against players, but it's perfect for NPCs.
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Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:34:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Chathos
Sorry, but I'm still sort of a noob. What does perma tank mean? Does that mean that guys can hit on me and nothing will ever happen? Like an everlasting shield?
And what is a hulk? Is that a nickname for a ship?
Perma tank is a tank that you can run non-stop and never run out of capacitor. Generally things like shield boosters and armor reppers suck capacitor fast and in time you will "cap out" and the module will shut down. That is not good for what you want to do (can be fine however in many other instances).
This does not mean you cannot be killed. Just that your tank will always be on.
A Hulk is the best mining ship there is. Its high points are it mines faster than anything else and it can sport a pretty nifty tank. The lesser mining barges have almost no tank to speak of so if you are AFK and NPCs attack you may well die. A Hulk with an appropriate tank can sit under the guns of anything a 0.5 system will throw at it forever as long as its tank is running (and as mentioned above it can perma run its tank and mining lasers).
A Hulk is a somewhat lengthy process to train up for though and the ship itself is rather expensive (although a LOT cheaper today than it was just a few months ago...still expensive at around 150 million or so [I forget exactly]).
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Chathos
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Posted - 2007.06.19 19:38:00 -
[13]
Thanks for clearing that up guys. But yeah... that 150 million is a little more than what I have now (250,000) or will probably have in the near future. I just started playing again the other day but I'm loving it.
I just want to make some extra money during work so I can eventually buy this good stuff. :(
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Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2007.06.19 20:00:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Chathos
Thanks for clearing that up guys. But yeah... that 150 million is a little more than what I have now (250,000) or will probably have in the near future. I just started playing again the other day but I'm loving it.
I just want to make some extra money during work so I can eventually buy this good stuff. :(
Well...by the time you trained enough to use a Hulk properly (and it is more than just being able ot fly the ship but fit it appropriately too) you may well have the money to buy one. Be happy though...not 6 months ago Hulks cost around 600 million  .
Of course 150 million is just the start. Fittings will add a nice chunk to that as well but deifnitely doable.
However, before you embark on the training path for a Hulk be sure mining is something you think you want to be able to do and do well. If it turns out you hate it then it would be wasted training.
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Chathos
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Posted - 2007.06.19 20:06:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: Chathos
Thanks for clearing that up guys. But yeah... that 150 million is a little more than what I have now (250,000) or will probably have in the near future. I just started playing again the other day but I'm loving it.
I just want to make some extra money during work so I can eventually buy this good stuff. :(
Well...by the time you trained enough to use a Hulk properly (and it is more than just being able ot fly the ship but fit it appropriately too) you may well have the money to buy one. Be happy though...not 6 months ago Hulks cost around 600 million .
Of course 150 million is just the start. Fittings will add a nice chunk to that as well but deifnitely doable.
However, before you embark on the training path for a Hulk be sure mining is something you think you want to be able to do and do well. If it turns out you hate it then it would be wasted training.
Very true. I think actually for now I will just try my luck doing trades on the market. Even SOME money is better than none. I guess I'll just have to figure it out on my own.
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Ikuu
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Posted - 2007.06.19 20:13:00 -
[16]
If you want a Hulk, you could always just buy a GTC and sell it for ISK (you can get 130-170million), with the money you're making from all the mining you should be able to make that 130-170 million back relatively easily and then just use it to buy a GTC.
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Durn Loze
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Posted - 2007.06.19 21:10:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Durn Loze on 19/06/2007 21:12:30
This is very doable even from an early age. I started trading with frigates. Make sure to get cargo container if you can fit them as they increase your overall cargo capacity. (An odd thing that a cargo container that takes up 100 units in your cargo hold can hold 120 units in it. But take advantage of it)
I used then trade in very high priced items so that I could sink more money into them. I would find items that sell for 1 million in Jita and look for them in other areas where they sell for say 850,000 or 750,000 ISK in a remote system. (Try to make sure it isn't low sec.) That would net you 17.6% to 33% profit respectively. (ie. Buying at 750,000 and selling at 1 mil give you 250,000 profit on the original 750k investment.)
Find a place that has a few of these for sale at 750k and you can sink a couple million into one run. Sometimes I could only fit 3-5 of these large items in my hold but if it cost me 4 million to buy them and I made 33% profit on it, thats 1.32 million. I got good enough at this that at times I could sink around 5-14 million ISK in to 2 runs of items and make anywhere from 10%-50% profit doing these AFK runs.
The profit margins will vary as will the distance you have to fly. Usually the further out the cheaper. Also find a place where you can cross a market boundry. I used to do this between Jita and Caldari space a bit.
It's not the fastest way to make money but its easy to do AFK and less risky than AFK trading with a large cargo ship. I made my first 40-70 million in game that way as a newbie. I would be AFK a lot doing things around the house only jumping on to sell/buy or set a new destination. I didn't go AFK if I did decided to go through a low-sec system though which I risked very rarely. (I would sometimes hit a low-sec for a low priced item but I would get that on my outbound run when my cargo was empty and risked as little as possible, while paying as much attention as possible.)
Do keep in mind that you can still be suicide ganked but I doubt any people will find 2-20 million in odd parts in a frigate enough to be worth dying over.
Also consider getting cargo expanders as you can fit more into your hold. The one downside is as you scoop up the low priced items you have to find new goods or wait until more are on the market which can take a few days. I guess you can always expand this to multiple regional markets which will require even longer trade runs.
Oh and I had to hunt the markets a bit to find items where I could use this technique. Not all high price items lend themselves to this as the buy and sell prices are too close and not worth the time for the money you would make. My best were items I bought for 650,000 and sold for 1,100,000. Didn't happen a lot, but enough to make me some money when I was a newb. Just browse all the various items on the market and look for gaps in buy/sell of 100k or more.
Good luck
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Chathos
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Posted - 2007.06.19 21:22:00 -
[18]
Wow, thatnks for that post. Lightens things up a lot for me. As soon as the server goes back up I'm gonna start and see what I can do!
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