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The Monk
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Posted - 2004.01.28 11:03:00 -
[1]
Edited by: The Monk on 28/01/2004 11:12:18
Edited by: The Monk on 28/01/2004 11:11:25
Can someone explain the concept of Optimal range of weapons and the Falloff. And how it co insides with the ammo types please. Its just that my observation suggest that the damage is completely random no matter what range your at 
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RagnarH
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Posted - 2004.01.28 11:10:00 -
[2]
sry m8, not me 
This char is perm banned on forums :S |
Baldour Ngarr
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Posted - 2004.01.28 11:20:00 -
[3]
Maximum possible range at which you can hit = optimum + falloff.
Maximum range at which you are *most likely* to get good hits = optimum.
Different types ammo have different range bonuses (some are high-range, less-damage, some vice versa), once those types are loaded, show info on your guns will show the new optimal and falloff ranges.
And, of course, guns that track veeeeerrrrrryyyy sllllooooowwwwwllllyyyyyy might not be capable of landing a square blow for maximum damage, even thought they're just on the optimal range. That bit you'll have to work out for yourself; I'm an industrialist. 
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"Soon" is an ancient Icelandic word meaning "some time before the next Ice Age." |
Kunming
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Posted - 2004.01.28 11:27:00 -
[4]
BTW u can also change ammo/lens while in space so it is a good idea to load a long range ammo/lens and if the target gets to closer range u change to the short range ammo/lens.
Just in case u didnt know this...
Intercepting since BETA |
Sphalerite
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Posted - 2004.01.28 11:29:00 -
[5]
I'm not a total turret expert, but this is my understanding of turret physics. (tracking set aside for the moment)
From a range of 0 out to your current optimal range, your damage is consistant. That is, your glancing hits from 100m out are the same as from you optimal range. Once you go beyond your optimal range, your damage will drop steadily down to near 0 at the end of your falloff range.
Ammo modifies your optimal range from -50% to 60% of the guns base range. The higher the range of the ammo however, the lower its damage will generally be. This should, ideally, give each ammo a range where it will perform better than all others for that gun.
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Shevar
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Posted - 2004.01.28 11:34:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Shevar on 28/01/2004 11:35:20
Perhaps its all nice and correct but thanks to the wonderfull invention of tracking it all changes a bit...
If you got crap tracking guns (big arties for example) its smarter to actually fire somewhere in your falloff since your guns need less tracking then, thus giving a higher damage over time (dot).
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-The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs
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The Monk
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Posted - 2004.01.28 11:41:00 -
[7]
Ok let me give an example say use a 425mm Rail gun. I load it with Hybrid L. I get a Optimal of 29Km and a Falloff of 23Km, does that mean I will get the best possable hits between 29Km and 23Km and any other range is bad?
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Sphalerite
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Posted - 2004.01.28 11:45:00 -
[8]
If would depend on what you are shooting. If you're going after a stationary or slow battleship, anywhere between 0 and 29km will give you about the same damage, where as if your shooting some speed freak in a rifter, you'd much rather have them at 30 to 45 away than orbiting you close in.
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Alynthir
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Posted - 2004.01.28 12:04:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Alynthir on 28/01/2004 12:09:47
 Quote:
Ok let me give an example say use a 425mm Rail gun. I load it with Hybrid L. I get a Optimal of 29Km and a Falloff of 23Km, does that mean I will get the best possable hits between 29Km and 23Km and any other range is bad?
Monk,
Darkwolf in our corp has done a lot of testing on this and the best that can be determined is this:
Using your example above, you get a higher chance of getting a 'wrecking' hit at around 29km, but you should still get decent damage out to the combined distance of 52km. I've tested this with all the different large weapons and this seems to be correct.
The problem that I have is I think we are missing a stat like Minimal Effective Range. It's well known that as ships close in, the big guns crappy tracking means that they won't hit for squat. In our combat trials, I've run circles around a Megathron in my Punisher with six 425's mounted just happily scrambling him while my mates pounded him to structure.
It sure would be nice if we had a line that told us, "Within this distance, you better deploy the drones or have blasters!"
_____
CLS Civil Affairs Bureau
"Permanent = Today's Plan."
Training: Noob Instructor Level 5  |
Falbala
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Posted - 2004.01.28 12:22:00 -
[10]
It has been a big headache to me, I have a 150mm gun with 6km optimal and 6km falloff when loaded with anti matter and it hits at 18km.
So, now, when I want to know what a gun does, I head to a Serpentis Base, warp at 50km, target one and starts to fire coming closer. Then I can switch ammos and try different guns and see what are differences...
Of course, a fight against better opponents than Serpentis Smugglers makes things harder, so don't expect to hit a 35k at 18km if your gun did it on a smuggler....
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bUBbLeS
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Posted - 2004.01.28 12:29:00 -
[11]
Quote:
Ok let me give an example say use a 425mm Rail gun. I load it with Hybrid L. I get a Optimal of 29Km and a Falloff of 23Km, does that mean I will get the best possable hits between 29Km and 23Km and any other range is bad?
kk here goes
ignoring tracking for the moment..
you beast damage potenetial is 0-29km
damage falls off evenly from 29km to 52km (23km falloff)
so at 0-29km if you did 100 damage a hit at 40km (50% of falloff 29+11km) you should do 50 damage
BUT
tracking greatly affects that
if you gun tracks slowly and the target is moving fast, it will reduce the damage a lot
if you are using a fast tracking gun and you and the target are not moving at all tracking would not affect damage at all.
hope that helps you ebil pi3-rat
cAKe!
Julius ceaser : "operor vos volo MCCCXXXVII laganum bUBbLeS?"
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Nwalmaer
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Posted - 2004.01.28 12:40:00 -
[12]
Quote:
so at 0-29km if you did 100 damage a hit at 40km (50% of falloff 29+11km) you should do 50 damage
No, but you will have only 50% chance to hit. If you hit, you hit as good as you would within your optimal range.
It might not be linear though, alot in this game isn't.
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The Monk
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Posted - 2004.01.28 12:50:00 -
[13]
All sounds very random to me. They should just give guns a proper range stat like for example Bubble Gun 1 Has range 3Km to 30Km or something like that. And have the optimal stat in between like at 12Km. Just an idea because atm its just stupid.
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Dracule
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Posted - 2004.01.28 12:54:00 -
[14]
just remember that if you use ammo/crystals that reduse your optimal range and then try to hit at you current optimal range you will get more misses but usually do more dmg each shot.
Use ammo/crystals that increes your optimal range and then try to hit a target at your current optimal range you will hit more often but do less damage each shot.
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bUBbLeS
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Posted - 2004.01.28 13:10:00 -
[15]
Quote:
Quote:
so at 0-29km if you did 100 damage a hit at 40km (50% of falloff 29+11km) you should do 50 damage
No, but you will have only 50% chance to hit. If you hit, you hit as good as you would within your optimal range.
It might not be linear though, alot in this game isn't.
nope thats incorrect
i can see the damage improve from my 1400's as a target closes
the tracking affects the "quality" of the hit
the falloff gives the base damage
at 75km my 1400mm with EMP hits for about 290-310 on an average hit
at 50km this has increased to 360-380
at my 34km optimal its 400-420
i have found that increasing the tracking gives better chance for "well aimed" and "excellent" and "perfect" hits
Julius ceaser : "operor vos volo MCCCXXXVII laganum bUBbLeS?"
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Silverlancer
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Posted - 2004.01.28 13:19:00 -
[16]
Lets say optimal is 20k.
Falloff is 7k.
Max range is 27k.
Minimum is 13k.
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Nwalmaer
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Posted - 2004.01.28 13:44:00 -
[17]
Quote:
nope thats incorrect
Well I constantly hover around half my falloff but still hit as good as in my optimal, just that half the shots are misses. EMP * damage mod gives me 416 unresisted damage. According to your theory I should hit for 208 unresisted at half my falloff, which I don't.
I have no proof though, it's just how I feel it works.
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Nwalmaer
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Posted - 2004.01.28 13:45:00 -
[18]
Quote:
Lets say optimal is 20k.
Falloff is 7k.
Max range is 27k.
Minimum is 13k.
That is wrong. Falloff has nothing to do with minimum range. The only factor that affects at which range you will stop hitting people at is your tracking speed (unless you and your target is stationary).
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