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ArgentSmoke
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Posted - 2007.08.01 01:36:00 -
[1]
Simple but elegant solution to both problems. Currently, I find it easier (and more profitable time-wise) to buy low end mins from the sweatshops than to mine it myself due to the constant griefing or the ore thieves. Whether they're 12-year olds with nothing better to do or working with the sweatshops is another discussion.
One way to cut the ore thieves out would be to allow the mining barges to refine mins on board. This would have several benefits:
1. Legit players would go back to mining in hi-sec without the grief caused by ore thieves, flipping cans etc.
2. Prices on low ends would decline, dropping the profit margins of the sweatshops.
3. It would entice many more miners into low-sec. Mining operations would be much simpler so more would do it.
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Menod Penter
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.08.01 01:40:00 -
[2]
Better solution... remove jet cans, it's time.
Have a Nice Day :)
Menod Penter - Mayor of Rens
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ArgentSmoke
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Posted - 2007.08.01 01:43:00 -
[3]
Removing jet cans would DESTROY lo sec mining. I don't know many miners who will travel several jumps from a refinery to a belt, mine, then jump back to refine with a full hold of ore.
And remember, this is a BoB game. Making mining easier will increase their target base which should make CCP very happy :)
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William Hamilton
Caldari
THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS....
R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.08.01 01:51:00 -
[4]
Change jet-can size to 100m^3, allow purchased cans to be anchored right next to eachother, and then use one of the many proposed solutions to can spam to prevent this form getting out of hand.
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Leighanne
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Posted - 2007.08.01 04:19:00 -
[5]
Long term miner here.
I have no problems with jet cans and have never had any of my ore stolen - solution to ore thieves - be smart find out of the way low population systems and simply move if they annoy you. Jita is not a good place to mine.
In response to the jet can issue - I don't think you can remove jet cans as a way of letting miners mine as this would cause horrific problems mining and trying to get the ore back to a station or something for refining - atm my hauler swings past every now and again and picks up an entire can and drops it at the station rinse/repeat. With GSC the hauler would have to sit around in the belt twiddling his thumbs while the barge creeps from can to can filling each one in less then one cycle of the lasers. Bad solution.
Good solution:
Either make a new set of cans - or us General Freight containers.
When repackaged they take up 1000m3 - when unpackaged or ejected into space hold a volume of 120,000m3. I don't even mind if they are not secure.
This means that you can't transport them unpackaged inside a ship to increase cargo capacity like e currently do with GSC - but freighters can still use them as they do now.
People will be less inclined to use jet cans because GFC are bigger and better ie: don't pop after 1-2hours.
They are expensive enough to make people not want to leave them behind - so hopefully we won't have can induced lag.
I do however see a major problem with this and that would be trying to collect them afterwards as once ejected from a hauler they would take up 120,000m3 and be impossibly to pick up with anything except a freighter - although maybe this is a good thing? Gives freighters another role beside high sec freighting? I'm not sure about this one - would definately give a benefit to macro mining.
I think miners definately need a solution to jet cans and I think I'd be hard pressed to find people disagreeing that technically jet can mining is an exploit and needs something done about it.
Of course the other solution would be to remove jet cans but make raw ore of all types take up 100x less space then it does now - allowing GSC to contain the same as or more ore then Jet cans do now.
I think option B is a more simple solution to the problem - but possbile there is a reason I can't think of as to why ore needs to take up such a huge volume?
- Leighanne
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cal nereus
Bounty Hunter - Dark Legion
Curse Alliance
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Posted - 2007.08.01 04:25:00 -
[6]
The possibility of ore thievery should not be removed. That is not a problem.
The problem is too many people putting themselves in an easy position to be stolen from. Each player has many easy and simple counter-strategies to prevent ore thievery. However, most players are either too lazy or simply don't care enough to save their own ore. If they don't care enough to prevent the ore thievery at a player level, why should they expect CCP to care about it either?
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Grismar.net |
Chainsaw Plankton
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Posted - 2007.08.01 04:42:00 -
[7]
mining in a small group helps out with the thieving problem a lot.
yes the hauler is pretty much just sitting there doing nothing, but your ore isn't disappearing.
and why would you want to refine the mins on board anyways?
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Haclya
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Posted - 2007.08.01 04:43:00 -
[8]
 Originally by: Leighanne
Long term miner here.
Good solution:
Either make a new set of cans - or us General Freight containers.
When repackaged they take up 1000m3 - when unpackaged or ejected into space hold a volume of 120,000m3. I don't even mind if they are not secure.
This means that you can't transport them unpackaged inside a ship to increase cargo capacity like e currently do with GSC - but freighters can still use them as they do now.
- Leighanne
Like the
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Ampoliros
Shadow Company
FreeFall Securities
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Posted - 2007.08.01 04:44:00 -
[9]
There's an ore-thieving problem?
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My statements are not those of my corp or of my alliance, nor anyone else I know. They are, in fact, solely mine and mine alone. Amazing! |
Haclya
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Posted - 2007.08.01 04:54:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Ampoliros
There's an ore-thieving problem?
No the system works good as it is whit out thefts eve will not be be eve.
Mine long time now it hardest when you new char because you have to stay in 1.0-0.8
systems to avoid the rats but after that is is begin be easer and you can defend you from rats.
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Tractormech
Caldari
Axe Gang
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Posted - 2007.08.01 05:58:00 -
[11]
Ore thieving is 100% preventable. Its not an issue.
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Leighanne
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Posted - 2007.08.01 06:04:00 -
[12]
I guess I'd be ok with the cans being unable to be picked up and simply have a 12hour timer on them - would sure save a lot of problems - just empty the can and forget about it it would take care of itself.
This would have to come with the caveat that the cans were pretty cheap and unlockable - therefore not secure - but with enough HP that griefers couldn't just wander along into belts pop the cans then warp out before anyone could do anything about it. GSC style HP plz. I price of about 10k a piece would suit me for a can like this - maybe even cheaper. Other then that I'd be happy with a can like this.
Ore can:
Volume: 120,000m3 (Packaged: 1,000m3)
Duration: 12 hours
Not secure
Build requirement: 5,000 trit
Reprocs into: 5,000 trit
Skill req: Anchoring lvl 1
Ore can T2:
Volume: 360,000m3 (Packaged: 1,000m3)
Duration: 12 hours
Not Secure
Build requirment: 10,000 trit
Reprocs into: 10,000trit
Skill Req: Anchoring lvl 4
Or something along those lines.
I think this is a reasonable solution to the precieved 'jet can mining problem' or 'billions of GSC problem' - but again I think they are both precieved and are not really problems that need immediate addressing - I'm quite content with jet can mining tbh.
Non stupid mining practises result in no loss of ore to thieves - and even if I did lose a can to a thief - I'd just pick up and move systems far far away (or send the alliance after them) - diddums I lose one can - that takes all of 20mins for me to mine.
- Leighanne
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Alis Aquilae
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Posted - 2007.08.01 06:46:00 -
[13]
There's a jetcan issue? 
/sarcasm
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Kerfira
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Posted - 2007.08.01 07:20:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Ampoliros
There's an ore-thieving problem?
Nope! No problem at all! People are using so many jet-cans that I'm rolling in stolen ore 
Oh, and there's no need for bigger can's either. The reason the cans are limited is that if you want to do mining on an industrial scale, you need an organisation to do so (i.e. some people to mine, some to haul).
Originally by: CCP Wrangler
EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
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Callthetruth
Caldari
Drunken Ratbags Inc
New Eve Order
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Posted - 2007.08.01 07:28:00 -
[15]
low sec mining is easily accomplished with a small or medium POS deployed in a quite corner of low sec. Setting up a refining array and then hauling the end minerals by industrial to a nearby station for sale. Its an elegant solution of course dreads could attack so u let the refined high ends pay for the upkeep and fuel
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mikerem
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Posted - 2007.08.01 07:28:00 -
[16]
While i agree that a larger secure can is needed (3900m3 just dont cout it when you mine in a Hulk), the seize should not exceed that of the current jet can.
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max bygraves
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Posted - 2007.08.01 09:03:00 -
[17]
The cheapest way to get minerals is to rob them.
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Lord MuffloN
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2007.08.01 09:14:00 -
[18]
Ore theivery should always be there, survival of the fitest, and about macro mining, well it's so hard to get rid of 'em, but last time I checked, CCP was doing a good job removing them, to bad they pop-up back so fast :\
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