| Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
|
|
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Dee Vour
   |
Posted - 2007.08.07 16:48:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Dee Vour on 07/08/2007 16:49:48
Now there's absolutely zilch wrong with stealing from others -so long as you don't get caught. But also, so long as the getting caught factor exists.
Now i get my wrecks nicked in high sec by missions parasites and because i solo these, there's nothing i can do to identify who steals from me.
We all know mining has deterrents with locked cans and if you don't use these, then tough.
So why can't we have ways to identify people stealing from missions wrecks? How about a skills that makes us able to captures the thief's ID? That would make it a lot harder to steal from mission runners as collateral strikes have always been the best deterrent to naughtiness.
|
Tortun Nahme
Minmatar
Heimatar Services Conglomerate
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 16:49:00 -
[2]
how about not soloing a multiplayer game?
Real men fly Pink.
I've been living in your cassette, It's the modern equivalent, singing up to a Capulet, on a balcony in |
Dee Vour
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 16:54:00 -
[3]
My point isnt about what or not to do in this game; i believe anything can be done here, hence the beauty of this place.
No, my point is about BALANCE.
To each scam, the State usually finds ways to counteract. And my question is 'do you guys think there should be an appropriate -to the ethos of the game- way to respond to wrecks being nicked by thieves?'
|
Moria
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 16:58:00 -
[4]
if u have your overview to show -5 then then person that took it will be marked in local to you
|
Tsanse Kinske
WeMeanYouKnowHarm
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 16:58:00 -
[5]
 Originally by: Dee Vour
My point isnt about what or not to do in this game; i believe anything can be done here, hence the beauty of this place.
No, my point is about BALANCE.
To each scam, the State usually finds ways to counteract. And my question is 'do you guys think there should be an appropriate -to the ethos of the game- way to respond to wrecks being nicked by thieves?'
There are ways to do so. If you're mainly concerned with finding out who is taking salvage from "your" wrecks, why don't you just stick around the deadspace and find out? Or, if they're going to the effort of avoiding you, just grab a cloak.
* * *
In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.
-Douglas Adams, writing about EVE |
Brutor Shaun
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 18:14:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Tortun Nahme
how about not soloing a multiplayer game?
Congratulations for making the stupidest comment this forum will see in many months.
Hundreds, if not thousands, of people play Eve solo. We're the one's who don't suffer lag and CTD's in fleet battles!
Bookmark Idea - My skills
|
Ishtar Hathor
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 18:28:00 -
[7]
The problem is as I have found they can salvage your wrecks and they wonĘt get flagged so long as they don't steal the loot in the Wrecks, if they got flagged then hell most would be flying home in Pods.
They are completely safe in High sec and I have seen then take Battle Ship wrecks and salvaged them right in front of me and because their not stealing the loot just the salvage I can't do jack.
They don't become red flashy on me, which sucks, I think CCP should correct this so they do get flagged for salvaging your wrecks.
Though saying that I havenĘt done a mission in a month just canĘt be assed knowing that the wrecks will be salvaged by some guy or gal who canĘt do their own missions.
Maybe CCCP have changed this in one the last two patches?
But if they haven't then that mean's we still can't atke sweet vengence with out getting Concord on our back for taking down those that steal the salvage from your hard earned wrecks and leaving the loot behind.
|
bogir
War And Peace Construction
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 18:40:00 -
[8]
why are you guys just takeing the most packed places where ALL ohter are running missions -- i Run lots of missions and never had any warp out to me and steal my loot or salvage my weecks.. yes i dont run for the best agents out there - but i run in places where i have no lag and where thifes dont go due to not to many players to befound so they dont want to be there
|
Petrothian Tong
Gallente
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 18:49:00 -
[9]
as annoying as it is,
it is an intended feature....
CCP changed it so you DONT have to loot to salvage...
CCP wants Salvaging to be a profession... (yes, even if it ****es off people)
but yeah, CCP went out of their way to make it so that you can salvage other's wreck without looting (it used to be you have to loot, and get flagged)
so yeah... this goes under the "intended features" box...
annoying though.
put in an ECCM and dont use drones, it makes it alot harder for them to find ya.
-Siggi-
""PvP" isn't only direct person to person combat, it can be very indirect. Selling an item on the market which somebody buys from you is resulting in another guy not getting a sale." Oveur |
Neal Cassady
Mutually Assured Distraction
Molotov Coalition
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 18:52:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Brutor Shaun
Originally by: Tortun Nahme
how about not soloing a multiplayer game?
Congratulations for making the stupidest comment this forum will see in many months.
Hundreds, if not thousands, of people play Eve solo. We're the one's who don't suffer lag and CTD's in fleet battles!
but it's lonely out there...
|
|
|
Aille Pluthrak
Caldari
Racketeers
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 18:58:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Ishtar Hathor
They are completely safe in High sec and I have seen then take Battle Ship wrecks and salvaged them right in front of me and because their not stealing the loot just the salvage I can't do jack.
I do think that there are certain people in High Sec who would weep with joy if there were a way to become a red blinky to a mission runner when they salvage a mission runners wreak. They are looking for any excuse to blow the crap out of your CNR.
|
Altai Saker
Omniscient Order
Cruel Intentions
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 19:07:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Aille Pluthrak
Originally by: Ishtar Hathor
They are completely safe in High sec and I have seen then take Battle Ship wrecks and salvaged them right in front of me and because their not stealing the loot just the salvage I can't do jack.
I do think that there are certain people in High Sec who would weep with joy if there were a way to become a red blinky to a mission runner when they salvage a mission runners wreak. They are looking for any excuse to blow the crap out of your CNR.
http://www.omniscient-order.com/
Sahwoolo Etoophie is a noob!
Noob and proud -Sahwoolo
|
Zeke Novak
Dirty Underwear Gang Inc.
Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 19:09:00 -
[13]
Nothing wrong with it. Same as ore thieves, distance yourself from high traffic areas if you don't want to deal with it. Or better yet, have a friend follow you around in a ship with salvagers.
--
Reality.sys corrupt. Reboot Universe? (y/n/q) |
Tsanse Kinske
WeMeanYouKnowHarm
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 19:46:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Ishtar Hathor
The problem is as I have found they can salvage your wrecks and they wonĘt get flagged so long as they don't steal the loot in the Wrecks, if they got flagged then hell most would be flying home in Pods.
They are completely safe in High sec...
Well, only about as "completely safe" as you are running the mission, if that.
Problem is easily solved in LoSec, by the way. 
* * *
In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.
-Douglas Adams, writing about EVE |
3ll3
Gallente
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Electus Matari
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 20:16:00 -
[15]
It's all fine and dandy saying..Oh do it in low sec or
out of high traffic areas!
It doesnĘt matter if it high or low traffic area The
Salvage thieves are still there.
But as for low sec missioning yeah it's good if you
are able to handle low sec area's not every one can
hence why they do mission ruining in high sec rather
than low sec.
Ishtar has a good point about Salvage thieves being
flagged and yes it's an intentional part of the game
but they should all so flag those that steal salvage
from Wrecks just as you would if you stole loot.
The amount of time's I have had Battle Ships Salvaged
by thieves who then leave the loot and just smack
talk me trying to make me attack them and get blow up
by Concord so they can salvage my ship.
Now if they do this low Sec well let's just say those
that have lost there ships because of it 
However it all so means I have to work like a horse
to get My security levels back up again which is a
pain  worse is they can get kill rights and have
their corp come after you which I can say is not fun!
Verus Amare Vinceres Omnis |
Tsanse Kinske
WeMeanYouKnowHarm
|
Posted - 2007.08.07 20:39:00 -
[16]
People could avoid so much anxiety over this if they just would get it through their heads that loot and salvage are meant to have different rules, and that the salvage isn't their personal property until it's tucked away in their cargo hold.
* * *
In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.
-Douglas Adams, writing about EVE |
Dee Vour
|
Posted - 2007.08.08 17:00:00 -
[17]
What i mean is a lot simpler; stealing is... theft. Position.
wouldn't it be an interesting concept to being able to claim each kill as YOUR wreck? and thus making it your / your corp property?
this can easily be done with exxtra skills (OH NOOO  )
after all it is YOU who do the work killing those rats with all that the job implies in devotion.
After all, after a while mission running can get a little boring and doing it is testimony of somebody's dedication that you fulfil all the many parameters this game presents you with.
I say make even just looking into wrecks that arent yours a red flashing felony!
|
Tarminic
Black Flame Industries
|
Posted - 2007.08.08 17:04:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Dee Vour
What i mean is a lot simpler; stealing is... theft. Position.
wouldn't it be an interesting concept to being able to claim each kill as YOUR wreck? and thus making it your / your corp property?
this can easily be done with exxtra skills (OH NOOO )
after all it is YOU who do the work killing those rats with all that the job implies in devotion.
After all, after a while mission running can get a little boring and doing it is testimony of somebody's dedication that you fulfil all the many parameters this game presents you with.
I say make even just looking into wrecks that arent yours a red flashing felony!
Everything you said with the exception of looking in wrecks causing you to be criminally flagged already exists. Although it would be nice to see who has stolen from you, this might not fit well into the interface and would be a fairly low priority.
------------
Whiners - Unite!
Tarminic - 25 Million SP in Forum Warfare. |
PhantomVyper
Darkness Inc.
|
Posted - 2007.08.08 17:07:00 -
[19]
Now where have I heard this coment before?!? Oh wait, thats right! It was the same proposal the miners made to make ppl flagged when they stole from their cans.
CCP gave them this option, now miners whine that they are blown up by the "evul" ore thieves when they take back their ore or try to defend themselves... I'm guessing the same thing would happen if salvagers would be flagged as thieves, therefore I'm all for it!
|
Rafein
|
Posted - 2007.08.08 17:12:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Tarminic
Originally by: Dee Vour
What i mean is a lot simpler; stealing is... theft. Position.
wouldn't it be an interesting concept to being able to claim each kill as YOUR wreck? and thus making it your / your corp property?
this can easily be done with exxtra skills (OH NOOO )
after all it is YOU who do the work killing those rats with all that the job implies in devotion.
After all, after a while mission running can get a little boring and doing it is testimony of somebody's dedication that you fulfil all the many parameters this game presents you with.
I say make even just looking into wrecks that arent yours a red flashing felony!
Everything you said with the exception of looking in wrecks causing you to be criminally flagged already exists. Although it would be nice to see who has stolen from you, this might not fit well into the interface and would be a fairly low priority.
actually, it's just the loot inside the wreck that is the killing player's, the wreck itself is freely salvagable to anyone. Which is what he is complaiing about, people coming in and salvagin the ship, leaving the loot behind for him.
However, I have been reunning level 4 missions for ages, but I have only ever once seen someone in my mission, and that was the one mission 1 ran in Motsu.
|
|
|
LiquidTester
|
Posted - 2007.08.08 18:26:00 -
[21]
Edited by: LiquidTester on 08/08/2007 18:27:29
Cool, here is something I can do for money. What skills do I need to track down mission runners? How long would it take in a crowded mission hub? And to the OP, besides using the market and forum whining, this is the only interaction you have with other players in the game, that's what makes it an MMORPG. I look forward to interacting with you as I salvage your wrecks. Don't worry, I will only loot them when there is something valuable.
|
Rilder
Caldari
THC LTD
|
Posted - 2007.08.08 18:32:00 -
[22]
When someone comes into your mission and starts salvaging:
Step 1: Lock own Wrecks
Step 2: Blow up own wrecks
Step 3: ????
Step 4: Laugh as the mission salvager runs around despratly salvaging wrecks or just giving up.
Seriously if someones salvaging your wrecks, don't play the "But its good salvage" Card, if your not salvaging the wrecks your not getting the salvage so mise well deprive that salvage stealer of any profit also.
Visit my blog =)http://rilderslog.blogspot.com/ |
Cornucopian
Gallente
Dutch Omega
|
Posted - 2007.08.08 18:34:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Dee Vour
My point isnt about what or not to do in this game; i believe anything can be done here, hence the beauty of this place.
No, my point is about BALANCE.
To each scam, the State usually finds ways to counteract. And my question is 'do you guys think there should be an appropriate -to the ethos of the game- way to respond to wrecks being nicked by thieves?'
you should be able to set charges in a can. when its opened it blows up hella nasty, including all cans within range that also have charges.... you could set booby traps
-----------------------------------------------
"Yes... I sleep with my myrmidon. It's nothing to be ashamed of!" |
Bimjo
Caldari
SKULLDOGS
|
Posted - 2007.08.08 19:50:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Brutor Shaun
Originally by: Tortun Nahme
how about not soloing a multiplayer game?
Congratulations for making the stupidest comment this forum will see in many months.
Hundreds, if not thousands, of people play Eve solo. We're the one's who don't suffer lag and CTD's in fleet battles!
he is a regular useless poster so just ignore him
|
Dee Vour
|
Posted - 2007.08.09 11:47:00 -
[25]
Some ppl....
OK, get this buster. This isnt a whinge, this is a chat. And a good one at that where good ideas are shared. You sad nasty piece of work should work on your anger, maybe get laid of simply fart to release that excess gaz, instead of polluting a perfectly groovy flowing debat -lol i'm sure you're the lonely ugly guy that can never make friends and acts like a bi@tch coz u know they'd never let you in anyways coz you're wayyyy too stoopid!
to all the others, nice idas guys. yeah i too like the idea of being able to enter combat theatre cloaked and having to uncloack to deliver payload. and i really don't think it would be an overkill boat as 1) like that guy said earlier all it takes is 1 missile and bye bye kansas and 2) check the price of that boat for a frigate... not many will risk it on the battlefield.
But what a heck, if it never happens that they improve it, no biggie, we'll find other stuff to talk about 
|
Ladyah Liandri
A GmbH
|
Posted - 2007.08.09 12:12:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Ladyah Liandri on 09/08/2007 12:12:55
Maybe you didn't recognize it over all the flame but a fellow player already posted that you can adjust your overview to actually identify the ones who stole from you i.e. agressed you.
Check "Players with a standing lesser than -5" and move that setting to pole position. After that thieves will get a nice icon in local as soon as they do their job.
Sometimes it needs a relog to start working but then it's more or less reliable.
|
RaTTuS
BIG
|
Posted - 2007.08.09 12:41:00 -
[27]
Salvaging with a salvage module .. i.e. converting wreck to salvage materials does not flag you or agress you in any way ...
--
BIG Lottery, BIG Deal, InEve & RaTTuS Home
|
Ladyah Liandri
A GmbH
|
Posted - 2007.08.09 12:47:00 -
[28]
Originally by: RaTTuS
Salvaging with a salvage module .. i.e. converting wreck to salvage materials does not flag you or agress you in any way ...
And?
The OP's question was:
"So why can't we have ways to identify people stealing from missions wrecks?"
Or in other words: why do only criminals get a nice warning bundled with a timer and not the victims?
I think that's a fairly valid point.
|
Delusion 'Fel
Minmatar
Nefarious Ratiocinations
|
Posted - 2007.08.09 12:47:00 -
[29]
im predominantly a miner and a hi-sec player, so i appreciate my thoughts count for little really but....
I run missions from a little out of the way corner of the 'verse where there arent an amazing number of pilots, and those that are there are regulars. Most of them ive seen or spoken to in local chat and we all generally know where we stand.
Tbh ive never had a wreck stolen on a mission. I appreciate i rarely mission run, and even more rarely do anything other than L2's (i do maybe 3-4 L3 a session just for the standing, as im not a confident combat pilot)
When im mining, the local regulars know i dont care if they eat the wrecks my drones leave, and that they can help themselves to the loot.
On the flip side i know if i need help, i just have to ask for it in local and ill get a couple of folks head over straight away, and they then know theyre welcome to any wrecks they can get to.
When mission running, the minute there is a wreck ive got at least one wreck targetted, locked in a tractor and being salvaged and i make sure im always salvaging from something.
If i was to run into someone stealing my wrecks? Tbh i think a quick shout in local from me would see enough incoming aid from the people i know that the loot has only a few seconds to grab their loot and run (its a 0.5 system and not everyone is concerned about sec status)
Yeah id like to see who is pinching my wrecks, but to be perfectly honest, they are probably going to be able to run rings around me and ***** my egg before i start getting through their shields.
I think its a profession choice really. If you play at mining, you either go for a nice safe hi-sec spot, or learn to ninja-mine rarer materials in lo-sec, if you want pvp, go to lo-sec where its all the rage. The key thing is that you move to a "good spot" for that profession, get to know the locals and do what you do in an area best suited to your needs.
Is it so hard then to assume that maybe the best place to play at being a salvager isnt a busy system with well camped mission spawns? Go to a smaller system. Get to know the locals and build up a network of players who are happy to back you up, so that the rare times you do suffer a problem, someone can be there.
I mean seriously, every time i log in i see people moaning about how "over crowded" my home system is, and im sat there thinking... im flying 2 jumps to a system where i will be probably the only player there except for those flying through, i have all those missions/asteroids/belt rats/etc entirely to myself.
Then i wonder why on earth no one else has clicked on to the fact that the lack of competition makes it so much better.
As was correctly mentioned, a lot of people will just exploit this to get you to open up on them so they can pop your pod, in many cases youll probably end up becoming a wreck just from trying to protect one...... it just isnt worth the effort, especially when there are simpler, and safer, alternatives.
|
Bart Roberts
|
Posted - 2007.08.09 15:29:00 -
[30]
Where to begin? Mea culpa: I am a new convert to the mini-profession known as Salvaging. And yes, I also salvage mission sites. I have found it very easy to turn my hard-earned Exploration skills towards this new and exciting activity.
Now, the OP is in essence requesting that an activity that is currently legal -- the salvaging of wrecks, be they mission wrecks or otherwise -- be made illegal. (At this point it is worth emphasizing once again that we are talking about SALVAGING, not LOOTING.) From his POV salvaging someone else's wrecks is stealing. While I respect his opinion, the "law" says otherwise.
As most of you probably know, salvaging has not always been in the game. It was introduced with the first Revelations patch. Why did CCP introduce salvaging? We can speculate: to reduce lag due to wrecks, to provide extra rewards, to provide the raw materials for the rig-making industry ...
With regards to the last two points, surely this is why salvaging must remain legal? Looting from containers is not the only way to inject vital resources into the economy. Therefore, looting can be made illegal without damaging the economy.
But salvaging is the only way to inject rigging materials into the economy, other than going the (boring) NPC market route. The designers wisely foresaw that not enough mission-runners would bother to salvage their wrecks and insert those vital materials into the economy before their wrecks went "poof".
Therefore, anyone can salvage wrecks.
Oh, and about the extra rewards ... "quid pro quo"! It is a tough, PVP universe out there, so why should you get something (the extra ISK) for nothing? The destroyed ship is no longer in a position to put up a fight, so instead we have a form of non-combat PVP: if you want the salvage, you must race against your human opponent to get there first.
But wait! you say. I have to put in the extra effort, but what about the salvager? I'm sorry, but salvaging does require significant effort as well. Aside from the fact that a salvager needs to train up a number of skills and buy lots of pricey equipment, he/she also has to spend a lot of time sitting around staring at the stars, waiting for scan results to roll in. Sounds like fun, huh? Mining, anyone? And even when you find something, warping in to the result is not without its risks. I recently warped into a level 4 mission that was, unfortunately, still very much in progress. Goodbye flimsy destroyer with 6 salvagers, 2 tractors, assorted Tech 2 components and a hold full of salvage.
Those of you here who are complaining about salvagers are among the few, proud mission-runners who actually bother to salvage their wrecks. I salute you. And I can reassure you that if you do want to salvage your mission, the odds are on your side as long as you plan properly (i.e. don't use drones, have your own salvage boat nearby, have salvagers mounted on your mission ship, or have a buddy cleaning up behind you).
PHEW! To wrap things up, I don't believe that some sort of aggro flag, or even an alert of some sort, is called for. As a savvy mission-runner, it is your duty to *assume* that someone may swoop in for the pickings. Why not warp out, wait a minute or so, then warp back in? Maybe you'll catch a thief with his hand in the cookie jar and you can blast him. Or maybe you'll just see a law-abiding salvager named Bart Roberts, plucking out the salvage while leaving your loot behind.
|
|
|
|
|
| |
|
| Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |