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Pinpisa Jormao
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Posted - 2007.08.09 11:46:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Pinpisa Jormao on 09/08/2007 11:47:13
Roughly year ago I remember there being things jokingly suggested like getting every corp member to Jita and the self destructing or inviting concord etc to get the attention of CCP to some issues at the time BY THE MEANS OF LAGGING JITA!
I very clearly remember this being suggested every now and then, this was at the time when the Bookmarks were identified as the lag creator and were still around.
What has since happened? Bookmarks are gone, multiple performance patches / mission modifications and so on have come and gone, and Jita lags more and more often with LESS THAN HALF the amount of people (<500 vs ~1000 back then) there!
These days suggesting to lag Jita out as a protest would be laughed at since it's lagged out without any effort!
While copying bookmarks may have created some lag, whatever CCP has done to their dog..code has just made it more sick. Since they seem unable to identify the cause of the lag I would suggest that the reality has catched up and Stackless Python has proved that it can scale up in similar way as an application written by amateurs in a native language such as C - well up to a point and from there it just doesn't and you get all kind of synchronization issues and fixing them just adds more lag and complexity.
The original developer of Stackless Python gave up on it years ago and maintaining it is now up to handful, if that, of people at CCP. Maintaining doesn't mean the kind of fast paced development that happens on well supported platforms such as CLR/CCR. It was risky to go with Stackless and it paid off, for a while.
Conclusion
Leave now so you won't waste any more time with this unfixable game. You can use the Contracts to send me your isk and stuff. Remember to leave your corp before attempting to transfer your 20+ M SP characters.
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Ethaet
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.08.09 11:49:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Ethaet on 09/08/2007 11:49:08
Anyone who quits, can I have your stuff? 
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CONCORD Notice: Don't drink and fly. Drunken jumping can result in loss of ship through "navigational error". |
roadrage639
Caldari
The Cons
W A S T E L A N D
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Posted - 2007.08.09 11:50:00 -
[3]
Iff CCP keeps improving the lag in systems more people will just keep going there as the system can handle more, then the lag will start to get bad again. Really what they need to do on the massive tade hub like jita is make it so it only has 2 gateways and have a bypass system so people just passing through don't have to go through, and it's the exact same amount of jumps. They should also cap the system at 500 people so people start using some of jita's local systems.
It's impossible to get rid of lag as everything takes time to travel.
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If You Can't Kill It, Slap It!
The Man Who Runs Will Fight Again
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Goodlookin Gus
Gallente
Viking Research and Production
space weaponry and trade
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Posted - 2007.08.09 11:52:00 -
[4]
go to other systems close to jita then and sell stuff. it still get sold for even higher prices :)
High sec research service avalible.
join channel viking research for more info
Eve mail is an great game tool if i aint online |
Sheriff Jones
Amarr
Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United
Cult of War
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Posted - 2007.08.09 11:55:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 09/08/2007 11:55:24
I honestly don't know what to think of this, since every time, no matter the time, i fly to jita(even 4-4) and i get in, out, no hazzle, no problem 
Never experienced the "jita lag", except those times that every system and their neighbor come crashing down.
Then again the issue might be as to what is considered "severe lag" or "bad lag".
So yeah, i have a problem with being serious, but it's the almost smallest problem i have. |
Ethaet
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.08.09 11:57:00 -
[6]
 Originally by: Sheriff Jones
Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 09/08/2007 11:55:24
I honestly don't know what to think of this, since every time, no matter the time, i fly to jita(even 4-4) and i get in, out, no hazzle, no problem
Never experienced the "jita lag", except those times that every system and their neighbor come crashing down.
Then again the issue might be as to what is considered "severe lag" or "bad lag".
QFT. It takes a few seconds to load when I jump in, but that is it.
-----
CONCORD Notice: Don't drink and fly. Drunken jumping can result in loss of ship through "navigational error".
<a href="http://www.thenoobcomic.com/daily/strip265.html">Seems familiar?</a> |
Callthetruth
Caldari
Drunken Ratbags Inc
New Eve Order
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Posted - 2007.08.09 11:58:00 -
[7]
i think CCP look at lag threads now and go haha point and move on
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Pinpisa Jormao
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Posted - 2007.08.09 12:00:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Pinpisa Jormao on 09/08/2007 12:01:25
Sorry I should have been more specific.
I mean Jita 4-4 the station. Year ago it didn't take 10-30 seconds to move 1 item from hangar to cargohold when there was 800+ people. Today it did that with ~400 there (system, hard to say about station since it doesn't show the count).
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Sicil Fioet
Minmatar
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Posted - 2007.08.09 12:38:00 -
[9]
I think the lag in Jita has improved, but then i'm comparing the past months instead of a year. Often it is still horrible just nearing the downtime and almost always during peaks hours like weekend noons by european time. Otherwise, i thought it has been improving.
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Jennai
The Silent Rage
R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.08.09 12:49:00 -
[10]
Jita isn't even that bad now. try Motsu or whatever that huge isk farmer/mission runner system is, or any system with a large fleet in it. it took me two minutes to jump out of S-E yesterday, and the only thing that was happening there was ~80 support jumping out and ~200 battleships warping to a gate.
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Death Kill
Caldari
direkte
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Posted - 2007.08.09 12:52:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Pinpisa Jormao
Leave now so you won't waste any more time with this unfixable game. You can use the Contracts to send me your isk and stuff. Remember to leave your corp before attempting to transfer your 20+ M SP characters.
Posted with an alt. Damnit, OP is really me^^.
All isk my way please.
Caldari and proud |
Kagura Nikon
Minmatar
Guardians of the Dawn
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.08.09 12:52:00 -
[12]
Lag is far lower than it was. 1 year ago it took me 40 secodns to 1 minute to jump into JIta. Now it takes < 10 seconds.
If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough |
Xerpex
Ars ex Discordia
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Posted - 2007.08.09 14:10:00 -
[13]
Um lag is a lot better than last year. It has improved by miles... Plus nodes rarely crash these days.
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Akkarin Pagan
Minmatar
Raddick Explorations
Executive Outcomes
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Posted - 2007.08.09 14:18:00 -
[14]
As far as I am concerned, lag has improved mostly.
Except for the 200+ fleet battle I was part of, when I forgot to zoom out and lost my ship to a combination of lag and being shot at
Otherwise, during general play (and even on those very very rare occasions I have cause to go to Jita) I can't say I've noticed more lag until the latest set of patches introduced a load of new bugs for CCP to fix up at least. They should get it stabilized just in time to release the next patch, and bug the game again
Anyway, generally no lag complaints here
Akkarin
Hopefully the mods won't play with this one
<3 - Immy
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Agent Li
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Posted - 2007.08.09 14:23:00 -
[15]
While I would agree that Stackless Python is a joke, I don't believe it's the cause of the lag.
It's possible to write high performance code in Smalltalk, and that only has virtual threads, isn't multiprocess, and is interpreted bytecode.
C isn't the answer, if you don't know what you're doing.
I would be interested to see what analysis CCP has done to determine the cause (probably more than one cause) of the lag.
Oh, and Jita, even that station, seems to work better than it did last winter.
And I've noticed that Motsu and Saila are nowhere near as laggy as they were last winter.
Let's see some real data - and not anecdotal experience when we talk about lag and its causes.
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"Don't be afraid to take advantage of your enemy's weaknesses. Becasuse winning is everything after all." |
Tarminic
Black Flame Industries
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Posted - 2007.08.09 14:30:00 -
[16]
Yeah, I remember Jita lagging alot worse with 500 people in it last year than with 800 people in it this year. I think the OP's memories are a little off...
------------
Whiners - Unite!
Tarminic - 25 Million SP in Forum Warfare. |
Pinpisa Jormao
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Posted - 2007.08.09 18:27:00 -
[17]
There's 650 in Jita and I just got lag warped jumping in. Yeah I remember it being a lot worse for most part of last year but it has been better too atleast for the fitting ship part which got worse at one point. It didn't use to freeze randomly when dragging modules to ship etc.
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Jennai
The Silent Rage
R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.08.09 18:39:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Pinpisa Jormao
There's 650 in Jita and I just got lag warped jumping in. Yeah I remember it being a lot worse for most part of last year but it has been better too atleast for the fitting ship part which got worse at one point. It didn't use to freeze randomly when dragging modules to ship etc.
that's not a Jita/lag problem, I get that everywhere since a few patches ago. every time I put a module on, it stalls a bit and interrupts me trying to put the next one on, so I have to wait a few seconds after each module.
if I have the rightclick menu up, I can't select any options until the stall is over, and if I'm dragging a module when it hits, the module icon gets stuck where my cursor was and plays the "you are dragging something" sound until I get rid of it by making another drag attempt.
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Worsley
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Posted - 2007.08.09 19:16:00 -
[19]
The op sounds like a java fanboi.
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Nathomos
Minmatar
Crimson Fists
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Posted - 2007.08.09 19:45:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Nathomos on 09/08/2007 19:46:40
Only time I have ever experienced lag that is bad enough to take away the fun factor is in some extremely large fleet battles on my old char...but these kind of posts are just obnoxious flamebait anyway. I'm sick of all these people saying it's unfixable and unplayable, I have a ton of fun in this game and rarely experience issues...but with a concept this innovative in an MMO I am totally fine with the occasional unexpected downtime or lag in extreme sitauations, it's not like CCP is asleep laughing at us while we struggle, they are one of the few MMO developers that really keep in touch with their community and work with them. Jita isn't a lag problem for me either..
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Nicholas Barker
MASS
Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service
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Posted - 2007.08.09 19:55:00 -
[21]
now i'm not an expert, but i think without any doupt the reason behind lag is...
anyway, every few months we get a flavour of the week kind of thing on what causes lag and everybody spams the forum about said thing untill it gets removed (bookmarks (didn't do anything for lag but it fixed the amount of *****ing on the forums.)).
---
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Agent Li
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Posted - 2007.08.09 19:56:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Worsley
The op sounds like a java fanboi.
You don't have to be a java fanboi to know that stackless python bites.
------------------
"Don't be afraid to take advantage of your enemy's weaknesses. Becasuse winning is everything after all." |
heheheh
Singularity.
Fallen Souls
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Posted - 2007.08.09 20:31:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Pinpisa Jormao
Edited by: Pinpisa Jormao on 09/08/2007 12:07:42
Roughly year ago I remember there being things jokingly suggested like getting every corp member to Jita and the self destructing or inviting concord etc to get the attention of CCP to some issues at the time BY THE MEANS OF LAGGING JITA!
I very clearly remember this being suggested every now and then, this was at the time when the Bookmarks were identified as the lag creator and were still around.
What has since happened? Bookmarks are gone, multiple performance patches / mission modifications and so on have come and gone, and Jita (fitting ship at s 4-4) lags more and more often with LESS THAN HALF the amount of people (<500 vs ~1000 back then) there!
These days suggesting to lag Jita out as a protest would be laughed at since it's lagged out without any effort!
While copying bookmarks may have created some lag, whatever CCP has done to their dog..code has just made it more sick. Since they seem unable to identify the cause of the lag I would suggest that the reality has catched up and Stackless Python has proved that it can scale up in similar way as an application written by amateurs in a native language such as C - well up to a point and from there it just doesn't and you get all kind of synchronization issues and fixing them just adds more lag and complexity.
The original developer of Stackless Python gave up on it years ago and maintaining it is now up to handful, if that, of people at CCP. Maintaining doesn't mean the kind of fast paced development that happens on well supported platforms such as CLR/CCR. It was risky to go with Stackless and it paid off, for a while.
Conclusion
Leave now so you won't waste any more time with this unfixable game. You can use the Contracts to send me your isk and stuff. Remember to leave your corp before attempting to transfer your 20+ M SP characters.
What makes you think we are wasting our time ?
did you loose your new Bs and blame lag or something to make you feel bitter, maybe you just cant cope.
anyway, i like this game and i am not wasting my time.
While we are on the subject i wasted my time reading this rank thrad and posting in it .
nvm.
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Pinpisa Jormao
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Posted - 2007.08.09 23:26:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Jennai
Originally by: Pinpisa Jormao
There's 650 in Jita and I just got lag warped jumping in. Yeah I remember it being a lot worse for most part of last year but it has been better too atleast for the fitting ship part which got worse at one point. It didn't use to freeze randomly when dragging modules to ship etc.
that's not a Jita/lag problem, I get that everywhere since a few patches ago. every time I put a module on, it stalls a bit and interrupts me trying to put the next one on, so I have to wait a few seconds after each module.
if I have the rightclick menu up, I can't select any options until the stall is over, and if I'm dragging a module when it hits, the module icon gets stuck where my cursor was and plays the "you are dragging something" sound until I get rid of it by making another drag attempt.
Still they knew right away when that broke (I filed a bug report) and haven't done anything about it. If some spare time hobbyist can write Eve Fitting Tool which has no lag, the next step should be for CCP to give the source code to the client so it can be rewritten by the users to work properly as CCP seems wholly unable to do this. I'm not really happy that some macro people have everything work with press of a button, which is how it should work with space age computer technology, and us regular players have to wait for the lag to clear up or deal with it. With macros I believe you could just send a bunch of "fit this" fast to the server without having to wait for any update to see if it fits or not if your macro knows it fits. If someone made a macro that allowed me to save a ship fit and then with press of a button replicate that to multiple ships providing I have the items in the hangar, I'd have no issues in using that since at this rate it's 2010 before such feature makes it in if ever.
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Maglorre
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Posted - 2007.08.10 00:39:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Pinpisa Jormao
If someone made a macro that allowed me to save a ship fit and then with press of a button replicate that to multiple ships providing I have the items in the hangar, I'd have no issues in using that since at this rate it's 2010 before such feature makes it in if ever.
Ahh, yeah, right. Try this.
Ctrl-Left-Click to select all the items you wish to fit.
Right-Click one of the selected items and then click "Fit to ship".
Watch in amazement as all those modules are fitted. 
Alternatively, buy your stuff in Jita then go elsewhere to fit it.
But yes, it would be nice to be able to save different ship setups and then refit the ship by just selecting the setup you want.
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Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2007.08.10 00:48:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Agent Li
Originally by: Worsley
The op sounds like a java fanboi.
You don't have to be a java fanboi to know that stackless python bites.
Why does it bite?
No seriously, I know nothing. Whats wrong with it?
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Fanjita
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Posted - 2007.08.10 01:19:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Pinpisa Jormao
Edited by: Pinpisa Jormao on 09/08/2007 12:01:25
Sorry I should have been more specific.
I mean Jita 4-4 the station. Year ago it didn't take 10-30 seconds to move 1 item from hangar to cargohold when there was 800+ people. Today it did that with ~400 there (system, hard to say about station since it doesn't show the count).
ever thought it might be your computer? i dont have that problem there. now as for undocking at 4-4 jita :)
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