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Lagistical	Posted - 2007.08.17 17:52:00 - [1] I can afford to buy one and fit it nicely... Whats pro and cons of each?
Sauromugue	Posted - 2007.08.17 17:55:00 - [2] Stabber: Sounds badass, like you're stabbing someone. Rupture: Sounds lame, like your bowels ruptured. Stabber is faster, better anti-frig. Rupture is slower, but better anti-cruiser.
Centurion1	Posted - 2007.08.17 18:48:00 - [3] Rupture by far, plus i have a speed fit rupture that can do 2k m/s with crap skills and t1 gear.
Neena Valdi Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2007.08.17 19:11:00 - [4] Fitted for speed stabber with shield extender, HML's and 220 vulcans t2.
Vodun Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.08.17 19:32:00 - [5] Rupture is a good ship no doubt, but the stabber is so very fun to fly. Though you definately need t2 projectiles to make it worth it. The setup mentioned above with the 220 vulcan IIs is good. ---
Bentula	Posted - 2007.08.17 19:38:00 - [6] Stabber lacks range to really operate outside webrange, unlike the vaga it has 50% less falloff, less guns, less HP and less resistances. Rupture however is probably one of the best pvp cruisers you could fly, but to be honest the nosnerf has some impact on it. With 3 medslots on both ships neither can really afford fitting a cap injector. Rupture usually did fine with 2 med nos to run the tank, while the stabber used a passive shield hp buffer. With the noschange however those nos on the rupture would become unreliable. Basicly the rupture is now in the same condition the thorax was in, a closerange ship having to rely on its own caprecharge or abandon using a web. If i where in your shoes, i would go on the testserver and do some fights with both ships. Im mildly curious how using small neuts + hp buffer tank would work, and that fit would be my first try. Those small neuts hit almost as hard as heavy nos, true they hit both of you but you can prepare for that.
Father Weebles	Posted - 2007.08.17 19:42:00 - [7] Rupture is more of an in your face pvp ship. But it's not so good in 0.0 Stabber is better in gangs of stabbers Good for 00 "You leave anything for us?" "Just bodies."
Neena Valdi Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2007.08.17 19:44:00 - [8] With barrage and 1 falloff rig stabber can perform fine outside the web range. Of course it's not a vaga, but still is very decent.
Bentula	Posted - 2007.08.17 20:41:00 - [9] Originally by: Neena Valdi Edited by: Neena Valdi on 17/08/2007 19:55:48 220 vulcans and barrage = 2.7km optimal + 15km falloff. With 1 falloff rig you can get almost 20km optimal + falloff. Overdrive Injector System II Overdrive Injector System II Power Diagnostic System II 10MN MicroWarpdrive II Warp Disruptor II Large Shield Extender II 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II Heavy Missile Launcher II Heavy Missile Launcher II [empty rig slot] [empty rig slot] [empty rig slot] Will go 4km/s A stabber like that with full skills would do like 200dps, at 2.7km ... At more than 15km its damage would be utterly crap(this is min distance, overloading web brings it to 13km, 2km buffer to web is reasonable). Not to mention that it doesnt matter wether you fly 4km/s or 14km/s after your in scramrange, you have to drop orbitspeed anyway so your guns can track the target. But this is moot anyway since i doubt the op can use t2 ACs anyway, and without them a stabber is completly pointless especially with low gunnery skills. A rupture though can still work fine with just named guns since it doesnt rely on its t2 ammo as much.
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2007.08.17 20:49:00 - [10] My guess is that you want a ship for level 2 missions? Then the Rupture. --- Originally by: CCP Wrangler You're not supposed to feel like you're logging in to a happy, happy, fluffy, fluffy lala land filled with fun and adventures, thats what hello kitty online is for.
Neena Valdi Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2007.08.17 20:52:00 - [11] Originally by: Bentula A stabber like that with full skills would do like 200dps, at 2.7km ... At more than 15km its damage would be utterly crap Actually the dps will be about same at 17km too. Actually you gonna have troubles hitting something if you orbiting it at only 2.7km. You can take a look at Minmatard movies to see how it works in action.
Vitrael Warriors of the Einherjar Fimbulwinter	Posted - 2007.08.17 20:55:00 - [12] Originally by: Neena Valdi Fitted for speed stabber with shield extender, HML's and 220 vulcans t2. And cry when you need to used named shield extenders to make that fit. Stabber is pointless. Rupture FTW. -------------------- The day of the nos boat is over. The day of the frig is upon us!
Neena Valdi Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2007.08.17 21:13:00 - [13] Originally by: Vitrael Originally by: Neena Valdi Fitted for speed stabber with shield extender, HML's and 220 vulcans t2. And cry when you need to used named shield extenders to make that fit. Stabber is pointless. Rupture FTW. LSE 2 fits perfectly with PDS 2 and you will even have unused PG. Whats the problem? Rupture is not ftw because it is slow. If you want a slow cruiser try thorax instead.
IHurricane Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.08.17 21:39:00 - [14] Stabber by far, will allow you to escape almost any gatecamp. ---------------------------------------
Tsanse Kinske WeMeanYouKnowHarm	Posted - 2007.08.17 22:01:00 - [15] Originally by: Neena Valdi Rupture is not ftw because it is slow. If you want a slow cruiser try thorax instead. Stabber is fast, but Rupture isn't necessarily slow. http://www.scrapheap-challenge.com/viewtopic.php?t=7452 * * * In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. -Douglas Adams, writing about EVE
Drek Grapper Minmatar	Posted - 2007.08.17 22:54:00 - [16] Edited by: Drek Grapper on 17/08/2007 22:55:38 F**kin' forum ate it...nevamind. - Michael Schumacher won many a formula one race. Alot of the time he didn't win because he had a better car...he won because HE WAS A BETTER DRIVER and because he used SUPERIOR TACTICS.
Bentula	Posted - 2007.08.18 07:55:00 - [17] Originally by: Neena Valdi Originally by: Bentula A stabber like that with full skills would do like 200dps, at 2.7km ... At more than 15km its damage would be utterly crap Actually the dps will be about same at 17km too. Actually you gonna have troubles hitting something if you orbiting it at only 2.7km. You can take a look at Minmatard movies to see how it works in action. No no and no. Thats just BS sorry. At optimal + falloff you do 50% of your damage, at optimal + 2xfalloff you do basicly nothing. Thats just the math behind it, take a look at the playerguide under tracking if you dont beleive me. I know the minmatard movies and have all of them, bit of a movie collector. In these movies there is a. no overloading of webs, b. more often then not he goes way into webrange of opponents to get some extra dps. Also keep in mind that you have to catch people in belts in order for the stabber to work, at stations or gates people will just laugh at you and dock/jump. Stabber is nice in 0.0 because of survivability, but in empire a ruptures survivability is decent enough considering the price imho.
Phelan Lore Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.08.18 08:03:00 - [18] Originally by: Bentula Stabber is nice in 0.0 because of survivability, but in empire a ruptures survivability is decent enough considering the price imho. This is the truth. If you are only fitting T1 mods the rupture is probably always better. But if you can fit T2 and are in 0.0, the stabber is better. -
Neena Valdi Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2007.08.18 08:03:00 - [19] Originally by: Bentula Originally by: Neena Valdi Originally by: Bentula A stabber like that with full skills would do like 200dps, at 2.7km ... At more than 15km its damage would be utterly crap Actually the dps will be about same at 17km too. Actually you gonna have troubles hitting something if you orbiting it at only 2.7km. You can take a look at Minmatard movies to see how it works in action. No no and no. Thats just BS sorry. At optimal + falloff you do 50% of your damage, Sorry what do you smoking? Did you try to fly minnie ships or you a kind of guy who only read forums and guides and making conclusions based on what he read? No offense but you sound like this. Originally by: Bentula I know the minmatard movies and have all of them, bit of a movie collector. In these movies there is a. no overloading of webs, b. more often then not he goes way into webrange of opponents to get some extra dps. Overheated webbing range is 13km unless your opponent is using the faction web. Your optimal + falloff is 17km. Once again: try it in action. Originally by: Bentula Also keep in mind that you have to catch people in belts in order for the stabber to work, at stations or gates people will just laugh at you and dock/jump. Stabber is nice in 0.0 because of survivability, but in empire a ruptures survivability is decent enough considering the price imho. Who cares about empire anyways? Your rupture will be melt by first thorax you meet while the stabber can fight 2-3 opponents at same time.
Bentula	Posted - 2007.08.18 08:29:00 - [20] Originally by: Neena Valdi Originally by: Bentula Originally by: Neena Valdi Originally by: Bentula A stabber like that with full skills would do like 200dps, at 2.7km ... At more than 15km its damage would be utterly crap Actually the dps will be about same at 17km too. Actually you gonna have troubles hitting something if you orbiting it at only 2.7km. You can take a look at Minmatard movies to see how it works in action. No no and no. Thats just BS sorry. At optimal + falloff you do 50% of your damage, Sorry what do you smoking? Did you try to fly minnie ships or you a kind of guy who only read forums and guides and making conclusions based on what he read? No offense but you sound like this. Actually you sound like somebody who doesnt have the slightest clue about gamemechanics. I feel stupid just arguing about this, thats just really basic tracking mechanics every gunuser should know about. Its not even something thats up to discussion, just TRY it, you will miss 50% of your shots at that range, and that means you only do 50% damage. And yes i fully admit i dont fly the stabber, i fly the vagabond. Not even a vaga however has about the same dps at 17km as he has in his optimal.
Sidephex New Dawn Rising	Posted - 2007.08.18 08:36:00 - [21] Originally by: Neena Valdi [ [...]Your rupture will be melt by first thorax you meet[...] uhm... if the rupture pilot is a complete idiot, yes. otherwise: the thorax will have a very tough fight.
Neena Valdi Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2007.08.18 10:34:00 - [22] Originally by: Sidephex Originally by: Neena Valdi [ [...]Your rupture will be melt by first thorax you meet[...] uhm... if the rupture pilot is a complete idiot, yes. otherwise: the thorax will have a very tough fight. Blasters + ecm drones. Even 1600 plate rupture won't last long against neutron rax.
Neena Valdi Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2007.08.18 10:45:00 - [23] Originally by: Bentula Actually you sound like somebody who doesnt have the slightest clue about gamemechanics. I feel stupid just arguing about this, thats just really basic tracking mechanics every gunuser should know about. Its not even something thats up to discussion, just TRY it, you will miss 50% of your shots at that range, and that means you only do 50% damage. Sigh... Lets see... you are 10 months new player from a newb corp. You have been posting that you are flying: myrmidon, vaga and nighthawk. yeah, I guess i know why you have problem hitting target in a vaga 14-16 mil SP player from a noob corp who can fly caldari command ships, gallente BC's and a minie HAC's... There is non kills on kb's with you involved... yeah, I guess you are really pro and know everything about this game... from reading guides...
Centurion1	Posted - 2007.08.18 14:31:00 - [24] My rupture set up 4X 220mm vulcan auto Is (best named or t2 pref) 2x Arby assault ML Mids 10mn MWD I ( cant use t2 and its too expensive to put on a 6mil isk ship) 1x scram/web/damp(depending if solo or gang) 1x LSE2 (4120 sheilds with crap skills) Lows 2x nano 1x overdrive 1x i-stab 1x gyro goes 1999 m/s with crap skills (2 mil sp) and hits decently hard.
Zann ShadowWolf	Posted - 2007.08.18 15:58:00 - [25] Originally by: Neena Valdi Originally by: Vitrael Originally by: Neena Valdi Fitted for speed stabber with shield extender, HML's and 220 vulcans t2. And cry when you need to used named shield extenders to make that fit. Stabber is pointless. Rupture FTW. LSE 2 fits perfectly with PDS 2 and you will even have unused PG. Whats the problem? Rupture is not ftw because it is slow. If you want a slow cruiser try thorax instead. Hmm? Thorax? Slow? Lol? Thorax no slow if you fit it right. If you want slow get a MoA THATS SLOW
Neena Valdi Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2007.08.18 16:30:00 - [26] With proper fitting and implants even domi can go fast, but I am talking about normal setups. Fitting thorax for speed is stupid - least to say. Unlike stabber and even rupture to some degree.
Bentula	Posted - 2007.08.18 22:20:00 - [27] Originally by: Neena Valdi Sigh... Lets see... you are 10 months new player from a newb corp. You have been posting that you are flying: myrmidon, vaga and nighthawk. yeah, I guess i know why you have problem hitting target in a vaga 14-16 mil SP player from a noob corp who can fly caldari command ships, gallente BC's and a minie HAC's... There is non kills on kb's with you involved... yeah, I guess you are really pro and know everything about this game... from reading guides... Wow. Just wow. This is a empire alt that i made so i can check market prices in empire. I dont post with my main specifically to annoy and confuse people like you, because once you resort to calling out my age the only thing you show is your own. I was trying to be helpful because you lack understanding of basic gamemechanics like tracking and falloff, something that is afaik covered both in tutorial and playerguide, aswell as being discussed by people like naughty boy who made THE damagespreadsheet people use in this forum. But if you want to troll about my chars age, or my habit of posting with my alt(i do all my posts with this alt) just go ahead. Just be aware that its nothing but offtopic trolling. Argue my opinions or statements, disprove what i claim fact, but dont cry about my posting habits. P.S. Rupture is faster than thorax, web and keep at 9km and a neutron thorax will do pitiful dps and its nonexistant tank will die very fast. Maybe ecm get a early jam, maybe they dont, but its definitly not a sure victory for either.
VB Sarge	Posted - 2007.08.19 03:14:00 - [28] Wow talk about getting off topic, a little bit... anyways... Rupture for PVE Stabber for PVP No matter who I've asked, everyone says a Stabber is really only good when you get T2 weapons. As a low SP character, I'd suggest going with a Rupture for PvP unless you are targetting T1 frigs, then go with the Stabber. But I prefer my Rifter for PvP (until I get my AF) as it's easier on the wallet. Rupture: Pros - great T1 DPS, a lot tougher than the stabber, works well with AC or Arty Cons - slow as heck, sure you can get some speed on it, but you lose your tank Stabber: Pros - can get very very fast, good for hit and run operations, great Frigate killing Cons - pretty weak tank, and not very effective with T1 weapons against Cruiser + I've killed rat BS with under 1mil SP in a Rupture, and cruise through L2 missions. Had fun hunting frigates with the Stabber, just make sure to get the warp scram on the miners before they know you're there! Hope that helped some. -Sarge
VJ Maverick Caldari Maverick Specialized Services	Posted - 2007.08.19 04:10:00 - [29] Rupture isn't slow. It is slower than the Stabber but is still faster than most combat cruisers out there. Just like its bigger brother the Hurricane, the Rupture can generally outrun anything it can't outfight. With a double damage bonus, decent skills and good piloting, it will rip frigs and T1 cruisers to shreds, give inexperienced BC pilots a nasty surprise, and leave everything else in the dust. Originally by: Marquis Dean As with most threads in Ships & Mods, it ended up with Ryysa yelling at everyone.
Neena Valdi Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2007.08.19 11:31:00 - [30] Rupture can't outrun unless its fitted for speed and even then rupture speed nor agility aint as good as stabbers. 1600 plate rupture is almost as slow as not plated myrmidon.

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