Ever noticed that low-sec belts are pretty much devoid of any people. I visit them while roaming and to bolster my sec-status. I'm also hoping that someone may try to kill me there. But nothing happens. Even in Amamake you can happily kill BS rats (if it's not the top belt).

So low-sec dweller don't be so lazy and get off the gates/stations!

Low sec needs dedicated content not available in high or null sec. Make PI or booster production a low only activity. At least give it something.

About 6 months ago, I could roam the surrounding systems of Amamake in my Merlin, hopping from belt to belt... and I would find 5 or more targets/fights in a half hour of play time. Now, it's just not the same. Even the amount of frigate traffic in Amamake's belts is half of what it use to be.

I hope lowsec turns around soon.

I say we add null specific rocks that are better than certain rocks in null and high. THAT'LL show them all!

Yeah...!

why should anybody care about lowsec except lowseccers?

Did CCP organize 0.0 alliances? Maybe it is CCP made 0.0 corps, put POSes and jump-bridges, built outposts and grinded industry and military levels in 0.0??? Nope. 0.0 people made it all.

lowseccers can only kill and destruct. That's why you have nothing interesting for people to come to you. And you cry "CCP! CCP! CCP!"

why should anybody care about lowsec except lowseccers?

Did CCP organize 0.0 alliances? Maybe it is CCP made 0.0 corps, put POSes and jump-bridges, built outposts and grinded industry and military levels in 0.0??? Nope. 0.0 people made it all.

lowseccers can only kill and destruct. That's why you have nothing interesting for people to come to you. And you cry "CCP! CCP! CCP!"

why should anybody care about lowsec except lowseccers?

Did CCP organize 0.0 alliances? Maybe it is CCP made 0.0 corps, POSes and jump-bridges, built outposts and grinded industry and military levels in 0.0??? Nope. 0.0 people made it all.

lowseccers can only kill and destruct. That's why you have nothing interesting for people to come to you. And you cry "CCP! CCP! CCP!"

...
some meaningless whine
...

I see we're being trolled by nullsec residents. That's original.

You guys must be bored waiting for your next fleet to form up. Just tell that FC that 200 pilots should be enough, let's get going...

oops, sorry...

Forgot that you do what you're told. You have masters to answer to.

But he does have a point.

Why even bother with low sec? All I've ever seen there are blobs and gate camps (with the odd carrier thrown in) to make any activity in low sec a total waste of time. Massive risk, very little reward.

That's not to mention the sec hit should you actually fire first and kill someone.

And he's also right, you did this all yourselves. Sure, be a pirate and kill every carebear you see, just don't expect that pilot to be back anytime soon. Low sec remains a desolate waste land, gratz!

I am full ****** and can't play eve on my own, so I have to bot drone regions for isk to spend on ships I will never PVP in.

I always believed it should be the only area you can use to pull your sec status up from negative status. The logic being Concord don't monitor null sec so shouldn't be paying bounties out there, and criminal acts anywhere in empire should be acquitted by doing ones time fighting (NPC) piracy in low sec empire.

Benefits:
+ It's not counterable with the usual carebear whine "you just want more shinies to shoot", since it only entices criminals.
+ (very) Moderate nerf to suicide ganking as you have to make up for your crimes with some time spent in low sec, but introduces high sec 'PVP'ers to low sec.
+ 0.0 residents can't just hide in deep null to get their standings up in complete safety.
+ General increase of activity in low sec and a reason to go there (for some).
+ Those visiting to raise sec are obviously PVPers so greater potential for finding small engagements there, and not just 'trying to populate low sec with shiny PVE fit carebears'.

~ repeating myself now so will leave it at that.

I always believed it should be the only area you can use to pull your sec status up from negative status. The logic being Concord don't monitor null sec so shouldn't be paying bounties out there, and criminal acts anywhere in empire should be acquitted by doing ones time fighting (NPC) piracy in low sec empire.

Benefits:
+ It's not counterable with the usual carebear whine "you just want more shinies to shoot", since it only entices criminals.
+ (very) Moderate nerf to suicide ganking as you have to make up for your crimes with some time spent in low sec, but introduces high sec 'PVP'ers to low sec.
+ 0.0 residents can't just hide in deep null to get their standings up in complete safety.
+ General increase of activity in low sec and a reason to go there (for some).
+ Those visiting to raise sec are obviously PVPers so greater potential for finding small engagements there, and not just 'trying to populate low sec with shiny PVE fit carebears'.

I always believed it should be the only area you can use to pull your sec status up from negative status. The logic being Concord don't monitor null sec so shouldn't be paying bounties out there, and criminal acts anywhere in empire should be acquitted by doing ones time fighting (NPC) piracy in low sec empire.

Benefits:
+ It's not counterable with the usual carebear whine "you just want more shinies to shoot", since it only entices criminals.
+ (very) Moderate nerf to suicide ganking as you have to make up for your crimes with some time spent in low sec, but introduces high sec 'PVP'ers to low sec.
+ 0.0 residents can't just hide in deep null to get their standings up in complete safety.
+ General increase of activity in low sec and a reason to go there (for some).
+ Those visiting to raise sec are obviously PVPers so greater potential for finding small engagements there, and not just 'trying to populate low sec with shiny PVE fit carebears'.

~ repeating myself now so will leave it at that.

I see we're being trolled by nullsec residents. That's original.

You guys must be bored waiting for your next fleet to form up. Just tell that FC that 200 pilots should be enough, let's get going...
.

Pirates are great fun to shoot at. It's more challenging to catch someone when you can't bubble them. Being able to take gate guns AND hold the field against a larger force? awesome.

FW happens in low sec. So there's that. (for what it's worth I like FW. Small engagements FTW.) Also, no bubbles.

Also, there's no bubbles in low sec.

I don't like bubbles.

I DO like my implants.

/allmyopinionsyoudon'thavetoagreewithme.

yea... little bored.... :(

the real problems are:
1) most of CTAs is organized in time i'm sleeping or in office.... So CTA for me is such a rare thing.
2) we killed bot in next system to our and no one wants to visit us....

So yea.... forum pew-pew

I always believed it should be the only area you can use to pull your sec status up from negative status. The logic being Concord don't monitor null sec so shouldn't be paying bounties out there, and criminal acts anywhere in empire should be acquitted by doing ones time fighting (NPC) piracy in low sec empire.

Benefits:
+ It's not counterable with the usual carebear whine "you just want more shinies to shoot", since it only entices criminals.
+ (very) Moderate nerf to suicide ganking as you have to make up for your crimes with some time spent in low sec, but introduces high sec 'PVP'ers to low sec.
+ 0.0 residents can't just hide in deep null to get their standings up in complete safety.
+ General increase of activity in low sec and a reason to go there (for some).
+ Those visiting to raise sec are obviously PVPers so greater potential for finding small engagements there, and not just 'trying to populate low sec with shiny PVE fit carebears'.

~ repeating myself now so will leave it at that.

All right... I'm a gonna bite.

I have, only once, ever attacked a non-combat seeking ship in low-sec. And, in my defense, that pilot was ratting in Amamake 3-1, and I thought he was bait. When it turned out he actually was a new player ratting, I advised him on how to survive, reimbursed his ship, and gave him around 10m isk. Talked him into joining Eve Uni and he was there for about six months. Last I heard he's off in WH space now.

If I encounter two frigates dueling at a planet or belt, I remove myself from the field so they won't think I'll rush in to kill the victor before he can get repped up again.

The last gate camp I participated in was to secure the gates in Fountain while the Brutally Clever Empire set up shop. Think that was back in 2007.

Pluto's current sec status is (IIRC) 4.3. My other character's sec status is 5.0. Why? Because I have no alts, no boosters, no backup, no nothing. Perfect total solo fighter. That means I'm in smaller ships. Want to know who flies the smaller ships these days? Pirates. In two months I've engaged maybe two people who were not flashy... all the rest were pirates.

I give back loot to very younger pilots who lose against me. I never ask for any loot back.

I'm not anti-pirate. Actually, I love pirates; they are the most laid back people you'll ever find in this game.

I've a really nice fit for a Merlin (which I took from Habadasshoodoo or whatever his name is) which is capable of perma-jamming an attacking Rifter. I won't use it, because it seems cheap and a shoddy thing to do to a fellow solo roaming pilot.

I have never kited anything in this game. Stop. Read that again: I have never kited anything in this game. By god if I'm going to commit to a fight, I commit.

I have participated in duels where I could not break my opponent's tank, but was fast enough to pull away from the battle. However, it seems cheap to have a duel which does not end in someone's wreck, so I plunged back in and lost the ship.

I actually don't like duels... they feel artificial to me. That's why I never ask for one. I want to hunt, and I want to be hunted. If I'm facing two or three very young players, I'd rather they gang up on me than for me to engage them one on one.

And should you think I'm just the oddball out there, I do run into people just like myself. Not very often anymore, but it happens.


The reason I'm telling you this is: Your perceptions of lowsec are wrong.

This is actually one of the best ideas I have heard for helping low sec. I approve this message

It's a fantastic idea. But good luck getting null bounties removed. The whinage would be... shall we say, significant?

If there was an alternative to ratting for null sec dwellers to make isk directly from the space they hold, then I doubt there would be much resistance to this idea.

Holding space actually gains you very little reward but a ton of bills to be paid.

I always believed it should be the only area you can use to pull your sec status up from negative status. The logic being Concord don't monitor null sec so shouldn't be paying bounties out there, and criminal acts anywhere in empire should be acquitted by doing ones time fighting (NPC) piracy in low sec empire.

Benefits:
+ It's not counterable with the usual carebear whine "you just want more shinies to shoot", since it only entices criminals.
+ (very) Moderate nerf to suicide ganking as you have to make up for your crimes with some time spent in low sec, but introduces high sec 'PVP'ers to low sec.
+ 0.0 residents can't just hide in deep null to get their standings up in complete safety.
+ General increase of activity in low sec and a reason to go there (for some).
+ Those visiting to raise sec are obviously PVPers so greater potential for finding small engagements there, and not just 'trying to populate low sec with shiny PVE fit carebears'.

~ repeating myself now so will leave it at that.

+1 for Spank.

Also, why are gate guns (which are larger than BS guns) able to easily track a fast frigate? I think lowsec gate guns should have lowered tracking, allowing frigates more access to on-gate pvp.

Just a thought.

Because having interceptor tackle on lowsec gates would be broken?

@Smiling Menace:


I won't deny that stuff exists, but it can be worked around. Bait can be popped before the trap springs (or simply avoided... they're generally not too subtle). Camps can be seen on the map or run in fast frigs. Smartie-BS can be scanned from gate scanpoints. Blobs can generally be avoided by single pilots (we're far more maneuverable).

But I would not remove the camps, bait ships, blobs, pirates, or even those annoying ECM-using f**ks for anything. Because it's the challenge that makes lowsec fun. When I'm in lowsec I know, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that everyone wants to kill me. It's actually rather comforting... I don't have to worry about who my enemies are, they're listed right there in local.

Tonight I had to move exactly one (1) metric buttload of researched BPO's to an Empire hub. Eight jumps through lowsec. Five jumps through Empire. Guess which part I sweated? The lowsec portion was done in a standard fighting Rifter. The Empire leg done in a tanked battleship with sweaty palms. I was safer in lowsec!

I don't expect the true 'carebear' to ever come to lowsec. Like the Joker said, "Decent people shouldn't live here... they'd be happier somewhere else." But for those looking for some excitement, and I feel there are many in Empire who feel this way, lowsec is a great place to find some fun. (Jeeze... I saved the Damsel for three damn years and she keeps going back to that damn brothel!! WTF?!)

I believe Eve needs a PvP outlet that doesn't require the responsibilities of nullsec. Currently, unless you're willing to wardec innocent non-PvP'ers in Empire (which I'd never do) or can-flip miners (which I'd also never do) or suffer the artificial-ality of duels (is that even a word?), you go to lowsec for a good fight. That's what CCP needs to focus on when dealing with the area.

I remember when people used to suicide tackle in Rifters.

~snip~

The reason I'm telling you this is: Your perceptions of lowsec are wrong.

And awesome.

QFT

And GOD, I wish I saw you around Amamake when I was solo PvPing.

Would love some input on a crazy idea from the dedicated pirates if you guys don't mind. ('cause if anyone can find loopholes, it's pirates )


What would happen if gate guns were reduced in strength (applied damage) by a factor of 10? So, where a gate gun previously would have done 100 dps, it now does 10 dps. (I have no idea how much damage a sentry gun does right now, so that number was just plucked from thin air as an example.)

Then, the number of gate guns were increased dependent upon the security status of the system and the system next to it (the one the gate leads to).

So, on the Jel gate in Egghelende system, you'd have perhaps 12 sentry guns (remember, doing only a 10th of their current damage). This simulates Empire considering this gate important and thus more heavily guarded.

But, on a gate in an obscure .2 sec status system, which leads to a .1 system, you'd have maybe 2 gate guns. These could probably be tanked in a solidly-fit heavy cruiser like a Rupture or Vexor.

I've never participated in a gate camp in lowsec, so I have no idea how this would play out. But the goal is to 1.) make it difficult to permacamp Empire-to-Lowsec systems (i.e., the OMS camp where T3 cruisers are boosted to astronomical levels and can catch frigates and even shuttles occasionally), and 2.) shake up combat a bit by allowing some smaller ships types to engage on gates further from the 'watchful eyes of the law'.

Would it work? Or go haywire when the first clever pirate finds the Ultimate Loophole?

This and remove bounties from non NPC zerosec. That way the zerosec income will become mainly production and trade (as it should be) and move the mid level NPC bounties to lowsec. Take a hint from sleepers. No bounties, everything is in the salvage/loot.

returning people into HIGH-sec?

@Smiling Menace:

I believe Eve needs a PvP outlet that doesn't require the responsibilities of nullsec. Currently, unless you're willing to wardec innocent non-PvP'ers in Empire (which I'd never do) or can-flip miners (which I'd also never do) or suffer the artificial-ality of duels (is that even a word?), you go to lowsec for a good fight. That's what CCP needs to focus on when dealing with the area.

Give lowsec new original minerals which can be mined only there. Add those minerals to every T2 module or ship building requirements.

heres a funny thought. ever thing that low sec is bloby because of u null retards? ( o/ cva and friends i see u still cant do pvp without a hot drop ) the only conunter to this is to do the same and u wonder y we pirates blob. heres another thought, those pirates that blob like its null are not that good at pvp. ever solo them or fight in a small gang? yea they die. really fast.

as for reducing the dmg of gate guns for frig fights. thats just ********. frigs are for belts planets and places with no gates/ stations. it would only lead to faster lock times and death to nealry ever ship that jump into low sec. as much as i would like to **** cloaky haulers, it would make for a logistic horror. i would rather kill those cloakies on the undock with a dessy. it alot funnier to see gate guns shoot me and watch the prowler die at the same time.

gates guns doin more dmg? this solves nothing just means bigger camps with more snipe ships that leaves u with even more to complain about.
FW space. more blobs then null, but at the same token they also suck in small gang warfare. just a general opinion.

what do blobs mostly do if they want a kill. they titian bridge on to targets. i would like to say remove titian bridging from low sec but it would affect null sec in a negitive way in terms of moving ships quickly. but the last time i shot at a tempest in my tengu he hot dropped 30 some odd ppl to kill 2 ships that they failed to kill anyway.

it does make for more of a challenge tho, so i just laugh when they fail and to pull the kill and laugh when i pull a kill after gettin dropped by 30 ppl.
so wat needs to change? the player not the game.

I always believed it should be the only area you can use to pull your sec status up from negative status. The logic being Concord don't monitor null sec so shouldn't be paying bounties issuing sec rewards out there, and criminal acts anywhere in empire should be acquitted by doing ones time fighting (NPC) piracy in low sec empire.

Benefits:
+ It's not counterable with the usual carebear whine "you just want more shinies to shoot", since it only entices criminals.
+ (very) Moderate nerf to suicide ganking as you have to make up for your crimes with some time spent in low sec, but introduces high sec 'PVP'ers to low sec.
+ 0.0 residents can't just hide in deep null to get their standings up in complete safety.
+ General increase of activity in low sec and a reason to go there (for some).
+ Those visiting to raise sec are obviously PVPers so greater potential for finding small engagements there, and not just 'trying to populate low sec with shiny PVE fit carebears'.

~ repeating myself now so will leave it at that.

EDITED: I didn't mean to suggest removing null rat bounties, just the sec gain.

No, it wouldn't work. A cane with slaves can get nearly 100k ehp, and still fit a sebo, so unless gateguns were so badass they were a threat to gangs with that kind of EHP it would make very little difference.

Even then, you'd just see an increase in the number of camps with pimped out 200k ehp T3s and logistics support.

The "solution" to low sec gate camps and getting new players into low sec has never been about creating more rewards (if you are any good, low sec is already pretty damn profitable) it's about teaching new players to use scouts and only fly cloaked ships. At the moment an experienced player will only fly around in cloaked T3s, transports etc. In contrast noobs complain about getting ganked coz they just jumped in blind in a badly fitted battlecruiser.

I love the "move all L4s to Low!" crowd. All that means is that people will start chaining L3s and doing more explo and/or quitting. Carebears hate PVP (trust me, I know) and will avoid it at all costs. Nothing is going to force bears into low. They are generally bad at PVP and have no interest in getting better, especially the solo ones who have no interest in joining roams/PVP corps. I'm generally a carebear, but I'm pretty adventurous, I will go do lowsec explo, even some lowsec missioning, but I really hate getting ganked. I'm pretty terribad at PVP, but getting better would require putting a lot of effort into learning to do it better, and I would still get torched by gangs, as I don't have time for the 45 minute wait for a fleet.

In my lowsec travels, I have to agree with the earlier poster, I've gone days without seeing anyone but my fellow bears. I have found a general cool group of people out in low, but the raging "OMFG we are leet PVPars!" blobs just make us dock up or SS and logoffski. If you want more action in Low, lose the blobs. Otherwise the only fights you are going to get are with other blobs on the gate. No amount of hi-sec nerf will "force" bears into low, it has to be something to make them want to go there.

They do have that it is called faction warfare. You saying that tells me you never tried it thus you think that outlet is not available.

Well, you'll probably be seeing more AF targets soon. Sadly, their buff will thin out the already scant T1 frigs and cruisers. Until CCP revisits those expect long roams with few targets.

I did try it for a couple of weeks, but was shocked to find it seemed more about PvE stuff than PvP. There were big fleets running around, but I tend to prefer solo or micro-gang stuff. But all that was back in 2008, and perhaps things have changed.

In any case, Grog Drinker, in another thread, makes a very good point; signing up for any faction reduces your targets when compared to staying on the outside and engaging anyone looking for a fight.

And to be clear, when I say CCP should focus on lowsec as an area which should provide good fights, I'm not just talking about the pirate/solo game... I'd hope they fix the things with FW too. Anything that gets more combat-seeking, non-cap-flying, small-gang pilots into lowsec is a good thing in my book.

BTW you can use fw plexes to help you get decent fights in low sec. Just open them in a busy system and don't actually run them.(move away from the button) That way the rats won't attack you and you can fight others as they come in.

The best thing they could do to increase the number of t1 frigates is decrease the scan resolution of destroyers. It's foolish to take t1 frigates out when destroyers can lock you and 2 volley you so easilly.

You are the most worthless piece of **** I've seen in some time on these forums. You seem to be in complete ignorance of your total lack of understanding regarding, well, anything really.

To answer your first question, no CCP did not make the 0.0 alliances, but they did give you your sov mechanics, they gave you POSes, JB's, Outposts, and all the other things you have. Without CCP creating that content for you, you'd be sitting in space in your ship with nothing to do.

Sort of like low-sec.

Lets see, in low-sec we have....... Ice belts? Naw, can find those in high & null..... Medium level minerals? Naw... You can get that from drones (you should know this you ******* botting ******). Oh, I know, we have level 5 missions! That's pretty much about it....

And tbh, with incursions, who the **** wants to run level 5s?


Why don't you just concentrate on your botting and RMTing and leave the forum posting to those of us with some modicum of intelligence.

Can you do this even though you're not enrolled in FW?

Yes.

thats the whole point of dessies. its an anti frig ship. thats its role and it does it very well. plus if ur in a t1 or t2 frig u should be pickin ur targets not flying in with ur head chopped off. not hard to do.

Thats my point. Due to their high scan resolution you can't choose to avoid them.

If they decreased the scan resolution you might be able to pick not to engage a thrasher on a gate. But because the sensorboosted thrashers are practically instalocking you are screwed even in a t1 frigate.

I think the point of dessies is to kill off smaller ships. But I don't think the point is for them to be instalocking gate camp monsters that make it foolish to even try to roam in a t1 frigate. Just drop the scan res to be in the middle between frigates and cruisers so they can't catch frigates that are just trying to warp to the next gate.

This kind of boils down to "I want to be invincible". In a frigate that costs a few million. Seriously?

If you want that, fly a covert ops and hope you don't run in to a camp spiked with drones/cans.

{unbelievable stuff}

If they are already open you certainly can.

But I'm not sure if you can scan them. Just hit your on ship system scanner and see if some pop up. The busier the system the better.

Thanks. That sort of explains what I'd been seeing; a FW player goes to the Minmatar Command Thingie (ain't I technical and stuff), and soon after a beacon appears. He'll be at the beacon for a bit, then he'll leave and it will shut down.

Now I've never interfered with people running about doing FW (though I'm starting to question why I restrict my targets to such an extent), but I'd be curious in using the gate itself to constrain warp-in points. (That is, if the beacon acts like a deadspace complex and warping to it at any distance drops you on the gate at zero.)

Food for thought. Thanks again.

Low sec needs dedicated content not available in high or null sec. Make PI or booster production a low only activity. At least give it something.

IMO, this is low-sec's problem. FW and bubble-free PvP aside, there is nothing in low-sec that isn't available for less risk in hi-sec, or in greater quantity/quality in nullsec (and arguably with less risk if you're part of an alliance able to secure their space).

Give low-sec a critical resource that can't be found in Hi-sec, Null-sec, or WH space, and you can count on a population explosion in low. Not all of us carebears are afraid to live & play in low, but as things stand today, thereGÇÖs simply little or no reason to PvE there. The risk/reward ratio is simply better in every other area of space.