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Joint Statement by Eternal Rapture and the Star Fraction

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The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.10.13 17:19:00 - [1] Joint Statement by Eternal Rapture and the Star Fraction As of this announcement, the Eternal Rapture alliance declares that it will be adopting 'Not Red, Don't Shoot' rules of engagement (NRDS RoE) for the duration of the current campaign (Operation Terminus Est) and for the foreseeable future thereafter. Furthermore, the allied status of Eternal Rapture and the Star Fraction is now formalised by agreement of both entities such that any act of aggression on pilots of either organisation shall be considered an act of aggression on both organisations. To be clear, the Star Fraction will now respond with deadly force to any acts of aggression against Eternal Rapture pilots, as well as its own. Eternal Rapture will likewise respond to aggression against Star Fraction pilots. This announcement is to place in the public record that Eternal Rapture and the Star Fraction now operate a unified RoE. The Star Fraction remains committed to its longstanding and consistent policy of never shooting neutrals and welcomes the adoption of this policy by its allies in Eternal Rapture. The Free Captains of Eternal Rapture and the Star Fraction The Star Fraction Communications Portal
Sinrath Caldari Reaper Industries Eternal Rapture	Posted - 2007.10.13 17:26:00 - [2] Eternal Rapture hereby sign and confirm this public announcement. On behalf of Eternal Rapture we are looking forward to fly under unification. - Wisdom is nothing, without perception. Ceo, PvP Corp.
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.13 17:38:00 - [3] Edited by: Rodj Blake on 13/10/2007 17:39:09 PIE Inc. will henceforth consider Eternal Rapture to be hostile and respond accordingly. Should Eternal Rapture wish to not be considered as targets of opportunity by us, they may contact me to discuss correcting their error. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Revan Neferis Amarr Bloodveil The Sani Sabik	Posted - 2007.10.13 18:39:00 - [4] Most sensible decision. I hereby confirm that The Sani Sabik and pilots flying under AzA Project will commmit to the standings set between our Organizations. Revan Alchemy for a New World Order .^.
Pulgor Independence Autarchy	Posted - 2007.10.13 19:26:00 - [5] So if you're not shooting the neutrals, and CVA's not shooting the neutrals. Then who will be shooting the neutrals now? Ushra'Khan?
Garreck Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.13 20:37:00 - [6] A worthwhile initiative by enemies of the CVA.
Telemicus Thrace Thrace Inc Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2007.10.14 01:47:00 - [7] Originally by: Pulgor So if you're not shooting the neutrals, and CVA's not shooting the neutrals. Then who will be shooting the neutrals now? Ushra'Khan? There are no neutrals. Anyone who profits from the slavery of my people is a target of war.
Raane Thyandar Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.14 03:10:00 - [8] They are not your people. They are ours and we have the piece of paper to prove it.
Pulgor Independence Autarchy	Posted - 2007.10.14 04:58:00 - [9] Originally by: Telemicus Thrace Originally by: Pulgor So if you're not shooting the neutrals, and CVA's not shooting the neutrals. Then who will be shooting the neutrals now? Ushra'Khan? There are no neutrals. Anyone who profits from the slavery of my people is a target of war. Not part of the solution, part of the problem! Excellent stance! You better shoot them up good too, since nobody else is shooting them and let me tell you. You need those neutrals to get shot or they'll get all uppity and start mining veldspar.
Amaron Ghant Caldari Ascent of Ages Dark Matter Coalition	Posted - 2007.10.14 08:04:00 - [10] Originally by: Raane Thyandar They are not your people. They are ours and we have the piece of paper to prove it. I don't believe it. I just laughed with amusement at a PIE post instead of laughing with disdain as usual.

Telemicus Thrace Thrace Inc Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2007.10.14 08:59:00 - [11] Originally by: Pulgor Originally by: Telemicus Thrace Originally by: Pulgor So if you're not shooting the neutrals, and CVA's not shooting the neutrals. Then who will be shooting the neutrals now? Ushra'Khan? There are no neutrals. Anyone who profits from the slavery of my people is a target of war. Not part of the solution, part of the problem! Excellent stance! You better shoot them up good too, since nobody else is shooting them and let me tell you. You need those neutrals to get shot or they'll get all uppity and start mining veldspar. Mine Veldspar for Slavers. Make weapons for Slavers. Haul fuel for Slavers. Bring in trade revenue for Slavers. Pay taxes to Slavers. There are no neutrals. If anyone wants to cease being shot they can leave Providence and conduct their business elswhere. As long as they conduct business under the Slavers they are very much part of 'the problem' and will be hunted down and killed.
Pulgor Independence Autarchy	Posted - 2007.10.14 09:31:00 - [12] Originally by: Telemicus Thrace Mine Veldspar for Slavers. Make weapons for Slavers. Haul fuel for Slavers. Bring in trade revenue for Slavers. Pay taxes to Slavers. There are no neutrals. If anyone wants to cease being shot they can leave Providence and conduct their business elswhere. As long as they conduct business under the Slavers they are very much part of 'the problem' and will be hunted down and killed. I suppose that would depend on a few things now wouldn't it. If your train of thought only stops at one station, then you may be cheating yourself out of insight. Suppose say, someone sold veldspar in Providence to the CVA and then turned the money gained to Ushra'Khan. Would they still be apart of the problem. (Although not the best example as Veldspar prices in Providence are rediculous right now. I would rather be shot then sell Veldspar there.) So please only take the principle of the example, not any external factors. Or what if someone buys the Veldspar and removes it from the regional economy. That Veldspar, if not taken to Amarr, may well be used to build your ships and given the price of Veldspar in Providence at the time. It may well be much cheaper and extend the financial viability of your cause. Are they part of the problem? Now of course you don't have time to conduct a survey and find out from everyone if this is or is not the case. You have job to do. However considering them to be 'collatoral damage' as opposed to 'part of the problem.' would be more correct in that case.
Selim Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.10.14 09:58:00 - [13] Originally by: The Cosmopolite Joint Statement by Eternal Rapture and the Star Fraction I'm confused Cosmo... Is this not standings enclosurism? It looks like it, at first glance at least...
Telemicus Thrace Thrace Inc Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2007.10.14 10:22:00 - [14] Originally by: Pulgor Originally by: Telemicus Thrace Mine Veldspar for Slavers. Make weapons for Slavers. Haul fuel for Slavers. Bring in trade revenue for Slavers. Pay taxes to Slavers. There are no neutrals. If anyone wants to cease being shot they can leave Providence and conduct their business elswhere. As long as they conduct business under the Slavers they are very much part of 'the problem' and will be hunted down and killed. I suppose that would depend on a few things now wouldn't it. If your train of thought only stops at one station, then you may be cheating yourself out of insight. Suppose say, someone sold veldspar in Providence to the CVA and then turned the money gained to Ushra'Khan. Would they still be apart of the problem. (Although not the best example as Veldspar prices in Providence are rediculous right now. I would rather be shot then sell Veldspar there.) So please only take the principle of the example, not any external factors. Or what if someone buys the Veldspar and removes it from the regional economy. That Veldspar, if not taken to Amarr, may well be used to build your ships and given the price of Veldspar in Providence at the time. It may well be much cheaper and extend the financial viability of your cause. Are they part of the problem? Now of course you don't have time to conduct a survey and find out from everyone if this is or is not the case. You have job to do. However considering them to be 'collatoral damage' as opposed to 'part of the problem.' would be more correct in that case. Policy was made clear quite some time ago. Anyone not wishing to be shot should leave Providence. Anyone wishing to fight the Slavers can negotiate standings. Anyone left is a target of war and chooses to be such.
Pulgor Independence Autarchy	Posted - 2007.10.14 10:26:00 - [15] So, collateral damage then. Although I won't negotiate any such standings I certainly wouldn't be dimwitted enough to run around a contested area in any manner that would permit me to be shot down by the Ushra'Khan. Although I suppose that's a luxury not afforded to employees of large corporations trying to raise their pay grade.
Telemicus Thrace Thrace Inc Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2007.10.14 10:34:00 - [16] Any spacefaring corporation has the luxury of choosing not to do business with Slavers in Providence. They are many ways to 'raise the pay grade' without resorting to supporting slavery.
Pulgor Independence Autarchy	Posted - 2007.10.14 10:40:00 - [17] Originally by: Telemicus Thrace Any spacefaring corporation has the luxury of choosing not to do business with Slavers in Providence. They are many ways to 'raise the pay grade' without resorting to supporting slavery. Oh I wasn't referring to you being piratical in any manner here. All military operations can carry collateral damage. Although your reasoning is still only having the train stop at one stop on the thought process, I went over that already. I was actually criticizing your targets, for if they're running such haphazard operations then they deserve to get shot.
Telemicus Thrace Thrace Inc Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2007.10.14 10:55:00 - [18] The train has been down the line and back. It now knows the the quickest way from A to B, which passengers to deny passage to and which stations are not worth stopping at.
Strikeclone The Steel Ravens	Posted - 2007.10.14 12:26:00 - [19] Down with empires, Long live the Star Fraction empire! Errr wait a minute.. Recruitment
Mebrithiel Ju'wien Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.10.14 12:54:00 - [20] Originally by: Selim Originally by: The Cosmopolite Joint Statement by Eternal Rapture and the Star Fraction I'm confused Cosmo... Is this not standings enclosurism? It looks like it, at first glance at least... Selim, of all people I'd have figured you'd understand; Star Fraction need fellow entities they fly alongside to adopt NRDS for a free community of Free Captains. The wouldn't be forcing their engagement policies on people... surely... Personal Library

Pulgor Independence Autarchy	Posted - 2007.10.14 17:01:00 - [21] Did you just say they needed to adopt mutual RoE to be free? That doesn't even make sense.
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.10.14 20:27:00 - [22] Originally by: Selim Originally by: The Cosmopolite Joint Statement by Eternal Rapture and the Star Fraction I'm confused Cosmo... Is this not standings enclosurism? It looks like it, at first glance at least... How does it resemble standings enclosurism? Two entities have mutually agreed, with no coercion of any kind, that it is best to operate an NRDS RoE. The friendship of these two organisations with one another is not contingent on both adopting NRDS RoE. The fact of these two organisations working together is not contingent on both adopting NRDS RoE. Each is free to end the arrangement without penalty. The Star Fraction does not insist on others adopting NRDS RoE but we certainly welcome it when they do. Moreover, it allows us to consider formalising allied status to the extent of a free and mutual defence agreement, as seen here. The simple fact is that Eternal Rapture see the benefits of NRDS RoE and wish to formalise allied status to the extent that they will support our pilots and we will support their pilots in the case of unprovoked aggression by others. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Communications Portal
Archbishop Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.14 20:35:00 - [23] Quote: The simple fact is that Eternal Rapture see the benefits of NRDS RoE and wish to formalise allied status to the extent that they will support our pilots and we will support their pilots in the case of unprovoked aggression by others. So they "see the benefit" of supporting the Star Fraction much as the residents of Providence have lived in peace and choose to "see the benefit" of supporting the current way of life there. But wait... you accuse CVA of oppressing others by offering the "benefit" of a pirate free region of space to live in peace... What is that "benefit" you're offering again? It seems you've turned into exactly what you've stated you oppose Cosmo by hinging "benefits" for people with actions. . If I didn't know you better I'd think you were abandoning your cause when it's inconvenient. Archbishop PIE WEBSITE & FORUMS
Tatania Apparition	Posted - 2007.10.14 21:16:00 - [24] I've never seen two groups of people who like to hear themselves talk so much.
Nek Tuomatta Advanced Combat Machines and Equipment Stellar Economy Experts	Posted - 2007.10.14 21:26:00 - [25] Originally by: Tatania Apparition I've never seen two groups of people who like to hear themselves talk so much. So good. You are now reading my sig! Originally by: Gaius Kador Nothing surprises me as to the lengths Star Fraction will go to push their propaganda on the public masses.
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.10.14 22:15:00 - [26] Edited by: The Cosmopolite on 14/10/2007 22:20:11 Originally by: Archbishop Quote: The simple fact is that Eternal Rapture see the benefits of NRDS RoE and wish to formalise allied status to the extent that they will support our pilots and we will support their pilots in the case of unprovoked aggression by others. So they "see the benefit" of supporting the Star Fraction much as the residents of Providence have lived in peace and choose to "see the benefit" of supporting the current way of life there. But wait... you accuse CVA of oppressing others by offering the "benefit" of a pirate free region of space to live in peace... What is that "benefit" you're offering again? It seems you've turned into exactly what you've stated you oppose Cosmo by hinging "benefits" for people with actions. . If I didn't know you better I'd think you were abandoning your cause when it's inconvenient. Archbishop Once again you seek to twist my words and smear us. Stop pretending to have any respect for me, Archbishop. I can see you simply don't. The Star Fraction and Eternal Rapture have determined that each others interests are served by working together. Eternal Rapture has decided that its interests are further served by adopting an NRDS RoE. The Star Fraction has, given that Eternal Rapture are now an NRDS entity, decided that we can formalise our relationship to the extent of responding to aggression against one another as if it were aggression against our own pilots. The benefits are those that are recognised by both partners in this freely-entered into agreement. Our ability to operate is mutually reinforced and enhanced by this agreement. As to our view of CVA's policies in Providence, we don't oppose them because they happen to shoot pirates, we oppose them because they seek to turn the region into a province of the Amarrian Empire. We oppose them because they necessarily, as imperialist paramilitaries, seek to limit the freedoms of those who fly in that region. We oppose them because they have arrogated to themselves the 'right' to dictate who shall use the resources of this system or that system. We oppose them because they have shown hostility against anyone who seeks to promote freedom and they, by whatever means, have caused others to attack us without provocation by inaccurately characterising us as pirates when we are nothing of the kind. Eternal Rapture have voluntarily and freely chosen to limit themselves to an NRDS RoE. If they decided not to keep to this we would wish them well and still work with them. Yes, we would no longer shoot those who shot at them because we could no longer operate a unified RoE. It's all very simple and the fact that people spend so much energy trying to cast this openly announced and freely-agreed arrangement as some kind of 'abandonment' of the cause of freedom is extremely telling. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Communications Portal
Archbishop Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.14 23:30:00 - [27] Quote: We oppose them because they necessarily, as imperialist paramilitaries, seek to limit the freedoms of those who fly in that region. We oppose them because they have arrogated to themselves the 'right' to dictate who shall use the resources of this system or that system. The only "right" I'm aware of the CVA seeking to infringe upon in that region of space is the right to piracy. Given their long history of anti-pirate patrols and their open-space policy to peaceful travellers it's clear they're not limiting anything. In my many travels down there to Providence I've always seen the CVA as a kind and generous protector of the region not as some overbearing oppressor of individual rights. Unless you happen to be a pirate in which case they will oppress your rights. Hmmm... They limit pirates, you have pirate allies, you fly with pirates, pirates fire on everyone but you, you want to remove CVA so pirates can take over the region as they already have stated they would. I'm sure it's just a coincidence. Archbishop PIE WEBSITE & FORUMS
Archbishop Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.14 23:34:00 - [28] Quote: Stop pretending to have any respect for me, Archbishop. I can see you simply don't. If I had no respect for you I would be bringing up a particular "jibe" you mentioned earlier. What I have no respect for is hypocrisy and propoganda. I merely shine a light onto the evidence at hand and let people draw their own conclusions. I do appreciate the fact you're the only one who actually answers questions instead of tossing insults about as some others do. You have my respect for that. Archbishop PIE WEBSITE & FORUMS
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.10.15 02:53:00 - [29] Originally by: Archbishop If I had no respect for you I would be bringing up a particular "jibe" you mentioned earlier. What I have no respect for is hypocrisy and propoganda. I merely shine a light onto the evidence at hand and let people draw their own conclusions. I do appreciate the fact you're the only one who actually answers questions instead of tossing insults about as some others do. You have my respect for that. And yet every time you attempt to sleazily manipulate and twist his words to your own torturous perceived "advantage" you demonstrate all the more that rational discussion is simply lost on your sort and we should all have likely condemned such interaction to the dustbin of history a long time ago. There can be no rational discussion with people like yourself that lie so many times and so compulsively that you have entirely lost sight of the shoreline in a lake of self-deceit. Fundamentally the Ushra'khan have it right with "die slaver die" in your case. Whats the point of spending additional effort in communicating with a creature with neither backbone nor pride nor honour? People are coming to realise the truth of this. Star Fraction is recruiting
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.10.15 04:14:00 - [30] Originally by: Archbishop The only "right" I'm aware of the CVA seeking to infringe upon in that region of space is the right to piracy. Given their long history of anti-pirate patrols and their open-space policy to peaceful travellers it's clear they're not limiting anything. Ignorance, senility or sheer bare-faced mendacity? The conflict with ISS over a portion of the region that was being peacefully developed by that organisation gives the lie to any suggestion that the CVA does not seek to dictate how space in Providence is used. The recent re-organisation of Providence according to a CVA plan is only the latest example of a clear pattern of the CVA using force to dicate to others where they should live and what resources they should exploit in that region. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Communications Portal



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