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Answer to Isk Buying, Spectacular and Arbitrary Punishment.

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Naervic Gallente Brotherhood of the Shadows Momentum Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.20 21:45:00 - [31] Yes. Exactly. Spectacular and Arbitrary punishment is at the core psychological warfare. All of sudden the sin you've committed is now pasted on the front page, everything you've obtained in months of work is gone, and everyone knows who you are. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Valorem ([email protected])
Detrol Caldari	Posted - 2007.10.20 22:18:00 - [32] Edited by: Detrol on 20/10/2007 22:18:31 Originally by: Naervic Detrol... If someone buys a hundred million ISK and then a 100 million ISK is funneled to another character I believe the obviousness of the matter is quite apparent. That ISK would have to go somewhere, and I'm not saying to let the database make the decision, but I believe the human mind can see where the dots connect. If account 2 has a hundred million ISK then buy 10 rounds of ammo for 10 million each from another account, Logic states that something is not right here. But that's the thing.... when you know that the system you describe is active, who in his right mind would do it the way you describe? I'd buy something expensive with a 10 mil difference from my moneybuying account and do that a few times. Selling a battleship 10 mil below marketprice isn't that easy to spot. Especially if you're selling battleships to other people too.
Naervic Gallente Brotherhood of the Shadows Momentum Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.20 22:48:00 - [33] Originally by: Detrol Edited by: Detrol on 20/10/2007 22:18:31 Originally by: Naervic Detrol... If someone buys a hundred million ISK and then a 100 million ISK is funneled to another character I believe the obviousness of the matter is quite apparent. That ISK would have to go somewhere, and I'm not saying to let the database make the decision, but I believe the human mind can see where the dots connect. If account 2 has a hundred million ISK then buy 10 rounds of ammo for 10 million each from another account, Logic states that something is not right here. But that's the thing.... when you know that the system you describe is active, who in his right mind would do it the way you describe? I'd buy something expensive with a 10 mil difference from my moneybuying account and do that a few times. Selling a battleship 10 mil below marketprice isn't that easy to spot. Especially if you're selling battleships to other people too. Ah yes, perhaps but if multiple transactions are going to the same character that can stand out quite well. Perhaps if one had 3 or 4 accounts it would make it a pain, but then selling GTC's would be alot cheaper and less painless. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Valorem ([email protected])
Major Death Caldari Space Salvage Incorperated	Posted - 2007.10.20 22:51:00 - [34] ISK buyers should loses their characters. Losing ISK is pointless and not really a punishment. My original sig was 'Enjoy lag free play in a dynamic space MMORPG'. It was removed for lack of EVE content! ;)
Naervic Gallente Brotherhood of the Shadows Momentum Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.20 23:05:00 - [35] Originally by: Major Death ISK buyers should loses their characters. Losing ISK is pointless and not really a punishment. Ah but this is not an ISK loss, this a total rollback of months of work. SP is gone, items are gone, and ALL the ISK collected has been removed. Plus you're avatar, you're corporation, and your alliance gets plastered on the front page highlighted the fact you've bought ISK. Not only are you placed in a negative light, so is your corporation, and if applicable, your alliance. You can then expect to be thrust from your corporation and perhaps podded a few times over for the bad publicity. Maybe get podded by others who just really hate your guts for supporting ISK farmers... Plus I'd even list all your alts that are attached to that account so that you can't escape the shame there either. You've become a huge public spectacle, something no one would want to be. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Valorem ([email protected])
Acoco Osiris Gallente Sublime.	Posted - 2007.10.21 00:01:00 - [36] Originally by: Major Death ISK buyers should loses their characters. Losing ISK is pointless and not really a punishment. I would much rather lose ISK than SP. ANd rollbacks would take away lots of SP. ------------------------------ One more soldier off to war... And one Velator in my hangars.
Naervic Gallente Brotherhood of the Shadows Momentum Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.21 01:07:00 - [37] Originally by: Acoco Osiris Originally by: Major Death ISK buyers should loses their characters. Losing ISK is pointless and not really a punishment. I would much rather lose ISK than SP. ANd rollbacks would take away lots of SP. Yes, if it occurs a few months after the ISK buying incident thats millions of SP lost. You would be in essence... royally screwed in numerous ways and the daily laughing stock. Some good stuff. ;) Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Valorem ([email protected])
Suze'Rain	Posted - 2007.10.21 02:31:00 - [38] Originally by: Acoco Osiris Originally by: Nick119 How about CCP just IP bans a isk seller and buy so they will never come back?? Dynamic IPs, proxies, there are plenty of ways around IP bans. Every time CCP tries to ban ISK farmers, the ISK farmers find a way around it. Instead of a IP ban, I wonder if going all the way down to a hardware level, and using the CPU serial number id and blacklisting that would work...? AFIK, that would be one hell of a lot harder to workaround. might be a bit unpopular with the conspiracy theorists though... personally, I'd say hanging and drawing the buyers would be a good step to dealing with the problem of the sellers.
Naervic Gallente Brotherhood of the Shadows Momentum Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.21 14:47:00 - [39] Originally by: Suze'Rain Originally by: Acoco Osiris Originally by: Nick119 How about CCP just IP bans a isk seller and buy so they will never come back?? Dynamic IPs, proxies, there are plenty of ways around IP bans. Every time CCP tries to ban ISK farmers, the ISK farmers find a way around it. Instead of a IP ban, I wonder if going all the way down to a hardware level, and using the CPU serial number id and blacklisting that would work...? AFIK, that would be one hell of a lot harder to workaround. might be a bit unpopular with the conspiracy theorists though... personally, I'd say hanging and drawing the buyers would be a good step to dealing with the problem of the sellers. I'm really not sure there, but if you can ban the farmers that way and force them to get a new computer that would be pretty awesome... But till then.... Yep. Public hangings. =P Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Valorem ([email protected])
Reverend Revelator Elite Storm Enterprises	Posted - 2007.10.21 14:58:00 - [40] OPs idea is neat, but would be used as a weapon in a game like EVE. But hey, nice try. -- Dead People Laugh At The Murder Of Love --
Cyana Fox	Posted - 2007.10.21 15:05:00 - [41] Yes, lets ban more people so we have less people to play against. Even the mere threat of losing an account that way would persuade people not to want to play this game. All this talk of BAN BAN BAN is like smoking, it takes a few more days from Eve's life every time they rid a player of their game, since most the time it'll affect more than one account whether they own multiple accounts or a close group of friends. CCP will just lose money, their current punishments are fine. Besides, isn't naming and shaming against their privacy policies? Face it, not everyone in this game is honest some just break different rules ethical or technical, either way what difference does it make. A player is a player, so long as their playing it gives more targets...or lag...should we combat lag by banning people now? =p Funny idea, think it's just a bit too harsh and damaging to the overall game.
Naervic Gallente Brotherhood of the Shadows Momentum Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.21 15:28:00 - [42] Originally by: Cyana Fox Yes, lets ban more people so we have less people to play against. Even the mere threat of losing an account that way would persuade people not to want to play this game. All this talk of BAN BAN BAN is like smoking, it takes a few more days from Eve's life every time they rid a player of their game, since most the time it'll affect more than one account whether they own multiple accounts or a close group of friends. CCP will just lose money, their current punishments are fine. Besides, isn't naming and shaming against their privacy policies? Face it, not everyone in this game is honest some just break different rules ethical or technical, either way what difference does it make. A player is a player, so long as their playing it gives more targets...or lag...should we combat lag by banning people now? =p Funny idea, think it's just a bit too harsh and damaging to the overall game. I never said ban, I said rollback name them and shame 'em. But how can combatting the black market of illegal ISK be bad for this game? If ppl who are so sad as they have to buy ISK from farmers don't want to play... Fine, with me. Eliminating the number of buyers will help rid of us the ISK farmers who sit in belts mining 23/7 and the ones running missions 23/7, bringing in mass amounts of ISK into our economy and causing inflation. Farmers are not good for any game's economy, and anything that can be done to combat them is good for the game. And I don't see how naming character "Idiot XYZ" and writing an article about him is against anyone's privacy policy. And if so, its their game they can change that. They're not giving out his actual name, address, and phone number. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Valorem ([email protected])
Caligulus Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2007.10.21 15:41:00 - [43] Public shaming is only effective against those who actually care. It would work for some, but the more serious laundering schemes wont even flinch. ------------------------------------------------- ** Name ONE thing that your windows comp can do that my MAC cant ** Right click.
Cyana Fox	Posted - 2007.10.21 15:51:00 - [44] Edited by: Cyana Fox on 21/10/2007 15:52:45 I'm really not trying to troll or flame you, please don't take it that way. The idea of a rollback is pretty much a ban though, because you know that person would just quit the game. Why play a game where you are forced to 'wait' to skill up just to have it all taken away when committing an offense where stripping them of the amount of isk they bought is enough to kill a character anyways? Very few people actually recover from that as it is from those I've seen punished that way. They are already losing the RL cash they spent on isk they are now in debt with, why kill their gaming experience anymore than ccp already has? I said this in a different thread, but I'd rather those people stick around and feed ccp their RL $$$ so the server can stay up a little longer, that's me being selfish though. edit: from my experience over the past 6 months, prices in the market have dropped across the board for many items, ranging from ships to mods. I can't really agree with you inflation arguement since isk is so easy for the average, honest players to come by anyways. I made over 6bil killing one rat, how is that for fighting inflation =)
Hellspawn01 Amarr Shadow Rebellion	Posted - 2007.10.21 16:08:00 - [45] For those that didnt get it yet, GTCs are an income for CCP, buying ISK from ISK farmers is no income for CCP. Ship lovers click here
Malcanis High4Life SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.21 16:11:00 - [46] Originally by: Cyana Fox Yes, lets ban more people so we have less people to play against. Even the mere threat of losing an account that way would persuade people not to want to play this game. All this talk of BAN BAN BAN is like smoking, it takes a few more days from Eve's life every time they rid a player of their game, since most the time it'll affect more than one account whether they own multiple accounts or a close group of friends. CCP will just lose money, their current punishments are fine. Besides, isn't naming and shaming against their privacy policies? Face it, not everyone in this game is honest some just break different rules ethical or technical, either way what difference does it make. A player is a player, so long as their playing it gives more targets...or lag...should we combat lag by banning people now? =p Funny idea, think it's just a bit too harsh and damaging to the overall game. The people deterred would only be those who buy ISK. And I grudge every CPU cycle waste on those cheaters. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Malcanis High4Life SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.21 16:13:00 - [47] "Why play a game where you are forced to 'wait' to skill up just to have it all taken away" Not buying ISK gives 100% resist against this attack... ...you sound nervous, almost as if you have something on your conscience. Is there something you'd like to share with us? CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Argenton Sayvers	Posted - 2007.10.21 16:20:00 - [48] Edited by: Argenton Sayvers on 21/10/2007 16:24:40 I think this idea is great. Naming and shaming would finally get more people to cheat the proper way, through GTCs. This would increase supply and finally make them alot cheaper. Im already thinking about getting 10 more accounts, cheaper GTC prices will make it viable to get another 20. CCP do something and fight the ISK sellers, they are ruining my alt account farms by offering their ISK cheaper then the current GTC conversion rate. To anyone who is wondering: yes this post is half-serious, there are already good reasons to fund 10+ additional accounts via GTCs for every major player. Originally by: Malcanis Not buying ISK gives 100% resist against this attack... What if someone buys ISK, then gives them your Character Name? For someone who is playing Metagaming.online, you seem to be too sure of yourself.
Malcanis High4Life SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.21 16:28:00 - [49] Originally by: Argenton Sayvers Edited by: Argenton Sayvers on 21/10/2007 16:24:40 I think this idea is great. Naming and shaming would finally get more people to cheat the proper way, through GTCs. This would increase supply and finally make them alot cheaper. Im already thinking about getting 10 more accounts, cheaper GTC prices will make it viable to get another 20. CCP do something and fight the ISK sellers, they are ruining my alt account farms by offering their ISK cheaper then the current GTC conversion rate. To anyone who is wondering: yes this post is half-serious, there are already good reasons to fund 10+ additional accounts via GTCs for every major player. Originally by: Malcanis Not buying ISK gives 100% resist against this attack... What if someone buys ISK, then gives them your Character Name? For someone who is playing Metagaming.online, you seem to be too sure of yourself. What if someone traces your IP then hires russian mafia assassins to kill you? CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Argenton Sayvers	Posted - 2007.10.21 16:41:00 - [50] Edited by: Argenton Sayvers on 21/10/2007 16:41:22 Originally by: Malcanis What if someone traces your IP then hires russian mafia assassins to kill you? What if someone joins your corp, then posts confidential information from your corp forums in CAOD? Or calls your RL employer in an attempt to get you fired (to find out that your employer is actually your wife...) Oh wait... Anyway, fighting ISK sellers will help me get cheaper accounts, and i dont care about wether random guys having it easier to get you banned, so im all for it.
uNtOldPAIN Covert Nexus	Posted - 2007.10.21 17:08:00 - [51] Edited by: uNtOldPAIN on 21/10/2007 17:11:09 Edited by: uNtOldPAIN on 21/10/2007 17:09:18 I have an Idea... Here Goes Say someone buys isk. GM's are onto it and mark the Character(buyer) ship(s)(say equivalent to the isk bought) so they would have a global free for all. Anyone and everyone in the system would see this marker on the ship and be able to shoot the person without Concord interfering (high sec) or lose security status in low sec. In 0.0 I'm sure they would hunt you down. Basically you let the players *****the person and the person gets punished. Players get some justice. Win Win In game shame
Naervic Gallente Brotherhood of the Shadows Momentum Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.21 17:23:00 - [52] Originally by: uNtOldPAIN Edited by: uNtOldPAIN on 21/10/2007 17:11:09 Edited by: uNtOldPAIN on 21/10/2007 17:09:18 I have an Idea... Here Goes Say someone buys isk. GM's are onto it and mark the Character(buyer) ship(s)(say equivalent to the isk bought) so they would have a global free for all. Anyone and everyone in the system would see this marker on the ship and be able to shoot the person without Concord interfering (high sec) or lose security status in low sec. In 0.0 I'm sure they would hunt you down. Basically you let the players *****the person and the person gets punished. Players get some justice. Win Win In game shame I'm glad this thread has picked up a little, and I'm not the guy on every other post. =P Anyways. The idea behind Spectacular and Arbitrary punishment is more of a psychological component, have it highly visual and make it seem as if the full and mighty wrath of CCP has come down on an unsuspecting person who's bought ISK. Now how this is done can be obtained in numerous ways, but everyone has to know about it and it has to be something we're in awe of. Particularly it needs to be advertised real well, on the concord billboards, on the forums, and on the front page. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Valorem ([email protected])
citizen amarr33sd3g4	Posted - 2007.10.21 19:15:00 - [53] Just ban them.

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