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Insidi Us Amarr Suicidal Mercenaries Pure.	Posted - 2007.10.23 03:26:00 - [1] In my Criminology and Sociology comparative studies between different countries Denmark seems like such a paradise compared to the U.S.. Federal health care, low crime rate, and a positive view of the government are such foreign concepts to me. If anyone lives there or knows someone who does, are there any real downsides (besides relatively higher taxes, I'm guessing)? After I graduate with my degree in Criminology/Justice Studies this spring, my goal is to use it in any way possible in one of the Nordic countries (will work for CCP!), possibly Iceland or Denmark. I speak a little German, which might help getting a job along the southern edge of Denmark. Any tips from the locals? -------------
SoftRevolution	Posted - 2007.10.23 03:32:00 - [2] Edited by: SoftRevolution on 23/10/2007 03:36:50 They also tend to come top in quality of life surveys. Also, the Danes are statistically speaking the happiest people going which sounds dreadful if you ask me.
Ademaro Imre Caldari Eye of God O X I D E	Posted - 2007.10.23 03:58:00 - [3] Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 23/10/2007 04:09:40 Originally by: Insidi Us In my Criminology and Sociology comparative studies between different countries Denmark seems like such a paradise compared to the U.S.. Federal health care, low crime rate, and a positive view of the government are such foreign concepts to me. If anyone lives there or knows someone who does, are there any real downsides (besides relatively higher taxes, I'm guessing)? After I graduate with my degree in Criminology/Justice Studies this spring, my goal is to use it in any way possible in one of the Nordic countries (will work for CCP!), possibly Iceland or Denmark. I speak a little German, which might help getting a job along the southern edge of Denmark. Any tips from the locals? So - you get a degree in criminology - and try to find a place to live that you think has the fewest crimes? That like someone getting a degree in bridge building, then trying to find the place that has the fewest bridges, and the smallest need for bridges. Please go there, with your idiotic view of the US - you won't be much of a help here anyway - no matter what your degree is.
MorbidPenguin Hard Corp Brotherhood Of Steel	Posted - 2007.10.23 05:20:00 - [4] Edited by: MorbidPenguin on 23/10/2007 05:20:13 Let's not forget the incredibly beautiful women. Spent a year in Germany... still have dreams of the Scandinavian girls I met.... Oh, 'twas not to be...alas~ Join in-game channel Hard-Recruiting to get signed up.
SoftRevolution	Posted - 2007.10.23 05:23:00 - [5] Originally by: MorbidPenguin Edited by: MorbidPenguin on 23/10/2007 05:20:13 Let's not forget the incredibly beautiful women. Spent a year in Germany... still have dreams of the Scandinavian girls I met.... Oh, 'twas not to be...alas~ This. Sweden was like being surrounded by living Barbie dolls.
LaVista Vista Corporate Research And Production Pty Ltd Zzz	Posted - 2007.10.23 05:30:00 - [6] Edited by: LaVista Vista on 23/10/2007 05:30:35 Denmark is really nice. When i speak to people from the US, i realise how good Denmark REALLY is. Take a vacation over here(Hint: Do it when theres gankaton!!!), and go to the 3 major cities(Copenhagen, Odense and Aarhus). Depending on your type of person, you wanna go to one of those cities. Aarhus have a very rich academic and a good enviroment for young people(18-2x years). Odense is in general very nice(I live there) Copenhagen is big, and can be a bit meh. Or you can go and live on the country side in Jytland, where theres lots of cows and plain fields with grass. Thats a really nice sight. Originally by: SoftRevolution Originally by: MorbidPenguin Edited by: MorbidPenguin on 23/10/2007 05:20:13 Let's not forget the incredibly beautiful women. Spent a year in Germany... still have dreams of the Scandinavian girls I met.... Oh, 'twas not to be...alas~ This. Sweden was like being surrounded by living Barbie dolls. It IS true that Scandinavia have some really nice girls. But sometimes its just too much in Sweden. Being + swedish, i can attest to the fact that they are barbie dolls. Proud nublet of more public ISK than * CAP4U - The Plan
Morn Judith Caldari God's Of War	Posted - 2007.10.23 06:08:00 - [7] Originally by: Ademaro Imre Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 23/10/2007 04:09:40 Originally by: Insidi Us In my Criminology and Sociology comparative studies between different countries Denmark seems like such a paradise compared to the U.S.. Federal health care, low crime rate, and a positive view of the government are such foreign concepts to me. If anyone lives there or knows someone who does, are there any real downsides (besides relatively higher taxes, I'm guessing)? After I graduate with my degree in Criminology/Justice Studies this spring, my goal is to use it in any way possible in one of the Nordic countries (will work for CCP!), possibly Iceland or Denmark. I speak a little German, which might help getting a job along the southern edge of Denmark. Any tips from the locals? So - you get a degree in criminology - and try to find a place to live that you think has the fewest crimes? That like someone getting a degree in bridge building, then trying to find the place that has the fewest bridges, and the smallest need for bridges. Please go there, with your idiotic view of the US - you won't be much of a help here anyway - no matter what your degree is. Whoa. If you think the US is a great as certain people make it out to be, you've got to be one of the most ignorant people out there. Sure, the US pioneered many governmental functions of the free-world, but there is no way that we are in the top of the world when it comes to healthcare, education, crime, social classes, and just about anything else. I'm not saying we have it bad, but there are plenty of other countries that are doing much better things than we are. I mean, come on, if Canada is doing a better job with unemployment and healthcare, shouldn't that be a muther effin clue??? PS: Try not to be such a staple American next time. Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
Devoras2 Amarr KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.23 06:59:00 - [8] Try Norway We`re better then the danes! It's great being Amarr, aint it?
Emeline Cabernet Amarr DarkStar 1 GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.23 08:01:00 - [9] Originally by: Devoras2 Try Norway We`re better then the danes! qft and we are stinking rich
Plaetean Murder-Death-Kill	Posted - 2007.10.23 08:30:00 - [10] Edited by: Plaetean on 23/10/2007 08:37:12 Originally by: MorbidPenguin Edited by: MorbidPenguin on 23/10/2007 05:20:13 Let's not forget the incredibly beautiful women. le qft I'm actually in Denmark atm even though I live in the UK, but I have relatives out here so I spend quite a lot of my time in Scandanavia, and absolutely love it. EDIT: Though they've just introduced a law that states anyone wishing to move to Denmark has to speak the langauge to a sufficient level, and cannot have a criminal record. A FANTASTIC law in my opinion. Just important to know if you're thinking about moving. -----
Daedalus DuGalle Gallente University of Caille	Posted - 2007.10.23 08:53:00 - [11] Originally by: LaVista Vista Being + swedish, i can attest to the fact that they are barbie dolls. You say this as if it's a problem... Originally by: Chribba Buy me enough Smirnoff Ice at the fanfest and I might get too drunk and do a Britney with you
Silverized Murder-Death-Kill	Posted - 2007.10.23 09:37:00 - [12] Gothenburg are my favo city on the earth:) its pretty much in the middle of scanidavia. Lots of students and young people, as much party as you can wish for. lots of jobs, beautiful nature just outside the city... ------------------------------
Ilvan	Posted - 2007.10.23 09:51:00 - [13] Originally by: Morn Judith I mean, come on, if Canada is doing a better job with unemployment and healthcare, shouldn't that be a muther effin clue??? PS: Try not to be such a staple American next time. Don't forget the Canadian dollar, which just keeps getting higher.
Kirjava Lothian Quay Industries Zzz	Posted - 2007.10.23 09:54:00 - [14] You have sold the idea to me. Was planning on moving to Australia or New Zealand to be honest - will start looking for lessons in Danish, thankyou Originally by: CCP Morpheus Post with your alt.
tEvEy Genco Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.10.23 10:02:00 - [15] Go for sweden we are so much better than the other scandinavian countries
Wanna Kill Caldari Hybrid Syndicate	Posted - 2007.10.23 10:16:00 - [16] I live in Denmark, you are right, we do have one hell of a health-care system + protection etc - everything to make you feel safe really. This is, however, also our biggest problem at the moment in the eyes of an increasingly larger amount of people. The problem is, that with our kind of idiot-proof (you have to CHOOSE to be poor to be it, people who lives on the streets usually do it because they cannot comply with the rules in appartments) system, many people with problems go here. This means, that our old (and IMO REAL) danish culture is diminishing as we speak, because everyone who settles down take some of their culture with them. This means, that the political parties use much time and effort on debating this (imo) problem, and working against each others. It also means, that we have put down some pretty silly laws to prevent people from cheating themselves into Denmark, but which also prevents families from being together. Haha, I'm sorry to derail the thread from the happy-days, but I thought I'd add ''the darker side of the coin''. I'm all for exchanging ideas etc, and I love to spend my hollidays in foreign countries, but it can also become too much. It is nice and refreshing with new people, but when the danish people who was born here, and is going to die here, has to adjust our way of doing things in order to please people who come to our country because they could not live where they used to, then I think we're over the edge. As in the whole religious debate, I mean, please. But thats not for discussion here (please be aware that this is a kind of sensitive subject, and I'm sure there are danes out there who disagree with me ) ----------
DeMundus The Establishment Establishment	Posted - 2007.10.23 11:59:00 - [17] I live Denmark and there is noway I wanna trade, we do however have a lame multicultural policy but nothing bad... and we did have this incident with some cartoons - our humor is not well looked at but some religous ppl, but that aside, its all cool - we do have high taxes, but it no problem - I don't want it any diffrent, I dont have to pay for my university degree og health care. Oh and the chicks are amazing, haven't found better when I have been abroad, its always the chicks and the beer I miss when I'm out travelling. Abandon all hope But take care of teh cake!11 - Immy
Daedalus DuGalle Gallente University of Caille	Posted - 2007.10.23 12:09:00 - [18] I live in Australia. Who wants to swap for a while? Originally by: Chribba Buy me enough Smirnoff Ice at the fanfest and I might get too drunk and do a Britney with you
Mr Funkadelic Tenacious Danes Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.10.23 13:01:00 - [19] I like it here - i just dont like the 60% tax But i can live with it - aslong i get everything else for free
Insidi Us Amarr Suicidal Mercenaries Pure.	Posted - 2007.10.23 18:36:00 - [20] Edited by: Insidi Us on 23/10/2007 18:39:17 Originally by: Ademaro Imre So - you get a degree in criminology - and try to find a place to live that you think has the fewest crimes? That like someone getting a degree in bridge building, then trying to find the place that has the fewest bridges, and the smallest need for bridges. Please go there, with your idiotic view of the US - you won't be much of a help here anyway - no matter what your degree is. Chill, dude. Criminology is research-oriented, which can be done anywhere, as well as being workable in a law enforcement job. Right now, the only thing the US has going for it is its massive GNP; all quality of life surveys (like education, infant mortality rate, number of people in prison) America is almost always near the middle or bottom and the Nordic countries are always at the top. I have my view of what a good country is, and it comes from my studies, but some people don't like big government. That's cool, and I don't consider your view idiotic. It's just an opinion. For the Nordics here, what are the job fields that are "hot" right now? If you were moving to San Diego, where I live, I'd say anything biotech-related is a sure fire way to get a job. I'd even be a tourist cop if it got me over there. EDIT - I missed that post about having to speak the language, which is a good one in my opinion. Will having experience in German (5 years of study) help out learning the language, or will it might as well be from scratch? -------------
Sir Dancealot	Posted - 2007.10.23 18:47:00 - [21] Yes, that'll be a big help. The grammar is in many ways different (of course), but not as different as Danish grammar compared to English. If you can think logically, then you will have an easy time with the words too (many of the words have much in common - just spelled a little different) Originally by: Incantare Thread does not deliver. I was expecting a story, funny, surprising or otherwise interesting. Instead I got to read Kehmor's smacking. Awesome.
Wanna Kill Caldari Hybrid Syndicate	Posted - 2007.10.23 18:51:00 - [22] Edited by: Wanna Kill on 23/10/2007 18:51:09 Originally by: Insidi Us Edited by: Insidi Us on 23/10/2007 18:39:17 For the Nordics here, what are the job fields that are "hot" right now? If you were moving to San Diego, where I live, I'd say anything biotech-related is a sure fire way to get a job. I'd even be a tourist cop if it got me over there. On my main this time \o/ We are 'importing' (importing, as in, goods ) a lot of high-education people atm, especially doctors though (springs to mind). ----------
Insidi Us Amarr Suicidal Mercenaries Pure.	Posted - 2007.10.23 19:09:00 - [23] I think I'll focus on learning the language for now (I bought some "Teach Yourself Danish" and a 600 page Danish grammar book) and maybe contact a local consulate or embassy for some more info on jobs and emigration. Thank you everyone for your information! It seems like no matter which country I choose I can't lose. -------------
hattifnatt Gallente The Movement	Posted - 2007.10.23 19:27:00 - [24] Learning danish = Fail because they suck at pronouncing their own language Originally by: Nicholas Barker i tackled somebody in the middle of nowhere, and told them i wouldn't leave untill they stripped on web cam. Who wants the video?
Xen Gin The Dragoons	Posted - 2007.10.23 19:58:00 - [25] Originally by: Plaetean Edited by: Plaetean on 23/10/2007 08:37:12 Originally by: MorbidPenguin Edited by: MorbidPenguin on 23/10/2007 05:20:13 Let's not forget the incredibly beautiful women. le qft I'm actually in Denmark atm even though I live in the UK, but I have relatives out here so I spend quite a lot of my time in Scandanavia, and absolutely love it. EDIT: Though they've just introduced a law that states anyone wishing to move to Denmark has to speak the langauge to a sufficient level, and cannot have a criminal record. A FANTASTIC law in my opinion. Just important to know if you're thinking about moving. Ugghhh, We need this in the UK! I'm sick of people shouting 10 different languages at me in the shop, because I can't understand them.
Ademaro Imre Caldari Eye of God O X I D E	Posted - 2007.10.23 21:56:00 - [26] Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 23/10/2007 22:04:40 Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 23/10/2007 22:00:29 Originally by: Morn Judith Whoa. If you think the US is a great as certain people make it out to be, you've got to be one of the most ignorant people out there. Sure, the US pioneered many governmental functions of the free-world, but there is no way that we are in the top of the world when it comes to healthcare, education, crime, social classes, and just about anything else. I'm not saying we have it bad, but there are plenty of other countries that are doing much better things than we are. I mean, come on, if Canada is doing a better job with unemployment and healthcare, shouldn't that be a muther effin clue??? PS: Try not to be such a staple American next time. I didn't say the US was better, or the best. I just said his views on the US were idiotic. For example, the state where I live, is over 5 times the entire population of Denmark. It would be fun to compare geographic segments of populations in segments of 5 million people. The US does not airlift pregnant women to Canada to give birth. Because Canada lacks the facilities to provide a safe and healthy place for mothers to give birth, they do airlift mothers to the US. Score one for socialized healthcare. If Canada is doing such a great job - lets have a contest. Lets see who can get an MRI in Canada the fastest, an MRI for yourself, or an MRI for my pet dog.
Wendat Huron Stellar Solutions	Posted - 2007.10.23 22:19:00 - [27] Denmark is moving further and further to the right, wait a few years and you just might not be able to tell the difference. These forums are FUBAR, upgrade this decade!
Jago Kain Amarr Ramm's RDI	Posted - 2007.10.24 02:29:00 - [28] Originally by: Ademaro Imre Lets see who can get an MRI in Canada the fastest, an MRI for yourself, or an MRI for my pet dog. I for one welcome our new canine overlords. ___________________________________________________ The game will never be over, because we're keeping the meme alive.
An Anarchyyt Gallente Sublime.	Posted - 2007.10.24 03:53:00 - [29] Edited by: An Anarchyyt on 24/10/2007 03:52:57 Well, I'm already going to be living in Switzerland and never leaving. Originally by: CCP Wrangler Second, a gentile is a non jewish person
Cipher7 OldBastardsPub SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.24 05:37:00 - [30] Socialism works when you have an ethnic kinship. Socialism does not work in heavily multicultural societies, because the people feel no tribal kinship to each other and cheat the system. So what works in Denmark does not work in the USA. USA has an excellent system considering that our European-American population is hovering around %60 and dropping. It is still coasting on its momentum from the past, eventually it will sink into the muck and become just another third-world country. People seem to think a country has magic water. If you sneak in and drink, you become prosperous. Thats not how it works. Denmark is a nice country because it is full of Danes. You put another type of people in, the culture changes, it becomes a different country. Add %40 "other" to Denmark, lets see how nice it is then. Western civilization is dying. Read Pat Buchanan's book "Death of the West" Go ahead, keep importing third-worlders, lets see what happens to your beautiful Europe.
Darteis Elosia	Posted - 2007.10.24 09:59:00 - [31] Go live somwhere on the west coast in sweden and work in norway. You'll make a ton of money in norway but buying food, cigarettes, alcohol, chocolate and just living is done in sweden to a cheaper price. The real downside can be that people arn't always very talketive i guess. I would sometimes think "Oh my god do they have to greet everyone they don't know" or "Why don't they just shut the **** up?" about random people in california some times. Also alcohol is really expensive and you have to buy it in a monopolised store in sweden. The danish are much more relaxed and drink more i think. Denmark is good for that part and the people are perhaps in general more outgoing than Norsemen or Swedes, or so i belive at least. One joke we sometimes pull in Sweden which i firmly belive there is an once of truth goes the following; "The Danish pension system only works becuase most people die shortly before or after they start reciving it". You should go on vacation and check the countries out if you are interested. In Sweden you have the right to 4 weeks payed vacation every year Oh..and study the behaviour of Leif G.W Persson, one of swedens most know criminologists. He's on the telly every week.
Kastar Memphis Technologies Intergalactic Brotherhood	Posted - 2007.10.24 10:35:00 - [32] Originally by: Daedalus DuGalle I live in Australia. Who wants to swap for a while? I won't, you have downtime during primetime. /me runs off giggling -----------------------------------------------
qrac Caldari Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.10.24 10:36:00 - [33] Originally by: Darteis Elosia Go live somwhere on the west coast in sweden and work in norway. You'll make a ton of money in norway but buying food, cigarettes, alcohol, chocolate and just living is done in sweden to a cheaper price. qft. -------------------------------------------
Frenzei Gallente Brotherhood of Wolves	Posted - 2007.10.24 11:35:00 - [34] /me is Norwegian. 1. Swedish girls 2. Norwegian Girls 3...... have no experience with Danish girls... Norway has TAXes... Bills, you pay a LOT of TAXES... Though we have Free education up to 19/22 years of age depending on which education, free healthcare. Gasoline for example is made up of 70% taxes...... However, i'd never trade away Norway. Newbie, not n00b. Mining, Reprossecing and Producing.
Lunartikk Caldari Navy Runners	Posted - 2007.10.24 11:48:00 - [35] Quote: You should go on vacation and check the countries out if you are interested. In Sweden you have the right to 4 weeks payed vacation every year ugh Actually ive got 5 weeks payed
Hitaki Slasza EverCorp.	Posted - 2007.10.24 12:44:00 - [36] Originally by: Lunartikk Quote: You should go on vacation and check the countries out if you are interested. In Sweden you have the right to 4 weeks payed vacation every year ugh Actually ive got 5 weeks payed 5 in Norway Ive heard Michael Moore is currently or has recently worked on a documentary about US health care system. He planned to use Norway as a good example, but after talking to one of our politicians he found it too good. He didnt think the average US viewer would believe it, so he went for Cuba as a comparison instead^^ Still we whine eh. Alchohol is very expensive here, so we abuse Sweden. We have our own fair share of pretty ladies, so we leave the leftovers from sweden to the danes. Since they are in desperate need.
DeMundus The Establishment Establishment	Posted - 2007.10.24 14:48:00 - [37] Originally by: Hitaki Slasza Still we whine eh. Alchohol is very expensive here, so we abuse Sweden. We have our own fair share of pretty ladies, so we leave the leftovers from sweden to the danes. Since they are in desperate need. And the swedes abuse Denmark for alchol... and you can keep ur women - we are in no need Abandon all hope But take care of teh cake!11 - Immy
Kala Veijo Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.10.24 21:25:00 - [38] Cant go wrong with Finland I guess. Most adults understand English here, so language shouldnt be big problem. All scandinavian countries are excellent places tbh.
Frygok Minmatar Mean Anglo-Danes	Posted - 2007.10.24 23:59:00 - [39] Edited by: Frygok on 24/10/2007 23:59:06 The family of the nordic countries: Sweden is the firstborn, the big sister. Rules, rules, rules, never says or does anything remarkably controversial. Politically correct is almost everything, and is basically the straight A student. Denmark, is the second born, but the first boy. The radical of the children, trying to push the boundaries and break the rules, to much dismay of big sister. Is a smoker, drinker, is a bit meh regarding the future and just want to relax and have a good time, and can't understand other peoples need to comment on the lack of discipline. Parents wonder what on earth went wrong compared to the big sister. Norway is the youngest of the three, and is a spoiled brat. Not having the need to prove itself as a rule breaker or an angel, it goes on it's merry(and ignorant?) way, not really standing out in many ways, except for an outspoken fondness for itself. (Finland is the strange cousin from far away, and you never really know what it's doing) Note: Above is gross generalisations and made with a , nevertheless there are some truths in it.
Lilan Kahn Amarr The Littlest Hobos Insurgency	Posted - 2007.10.25 00:00:00 - [40] Originally by: Lunartikk Quote: You should go on vacation and check the countries out if you are interested. In Sweden you have the right to 4 weeks payed vacation every year ugh Actually ive got 5 weeks payed 6 weeks in denmark "Bringing Content to you 1 round of ammo at a time"
Cuebick Caldari The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.10.25 00:00:00 - [41] Originally by: Daedalus DuGalle I live in Australia. Who wants to swap for a while? I do =) You can move to Iceland and I can move to Australia.. I just can't wait to get out of here (not in a bad way, Iceland is great) to see the world and widen my horizon a little bit :) Go to university and whatever meet foreign hotties and so on
Lilan Kahn Amarr The Littlest Hobos Insurgency	Posted - 2007.10.25 00:17:00 - [42] Originally by: Cuebick Originally by: Daedalus DuGalle I live in Australia. Who wants to swap for a while? I do =) You can move to Iceland and I can move to Australia.. I just can't wait to get out of here (not in a bad way, Iceland is great) to see the world and widen my horizon a little bit :) Go to university and whatever meet foreign hotties and so on Why woud you leave when you got such lovely ladies on iceland? "Bringing Content to you 1 round of ammo at a time"
Morn Judith Caldari God's Of War	Posted - 2007.10.25 01:52:00 - [43] Originally by: Ademaro Imre Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 23/10/2007 22:14:12 Originally by: Morn Judith Whoa. If you think the US is a great as certain people make it out to be, you've got to be one of the most ignorant people out there. Sure, the US pioneered many governmental functions of the free-world, but there is no way that we are in the top of the world when it comes to healthcare, education, crime, social classes, and just about anything else. I'm not saying we have it bad, but there are plenty of other countries that are doing much better things than we are. I mean, come on, if Canada is doing a better job with unemployment and healthcare, shouldn't that be a muther effin clue??? PS: Try not to be such a staple American next time. I didn't say the US was better, or the best. I just said his views on the US were idiotic. For example, the state where I live, is over 5 times the entire population of Denmark. It would be fun to compare geographic segments of populations in segments of 5 million people. Only then could someone from outside the US get the bare idea how diverse the US is. The US does not airlift pregnant women to Canada to give birth. Because Canada lacks the facilities to provide a safe and healthy place for mothers to give birth, they do airlift mothers to the US. Score one for socialized healthcare. If Canada is doing such a great job - lets have a contest. Lets see who can get an MRI in Canada the fastest, an MRI for yourself, or an MRI for my pet dog. Well, first off Canada is a bad example (Just kidding!). I'd like to see a resource about the flying pregnant women to the US to birth, that's something I've never heard of and quite honestly sounds a bit far-fetched. What about the pharmaceutical companies controlling the FDA and thus the insanely high prices of prescriptions? What about the incredible instability of the economy? Now I'm not saying that the US is entirely bad, or that I'm not thankful for living here. But I feel the US began digging a hole for ourselves generations ago, and the next few generations are going to be the ones to pay for it. But fundamentally, in my opinion, calling anyone else's opinion idiotic is extremely hypocritical. Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
Rutefly Amarr Freedom-Technologies	Posted - 2007.10.25 06:51:00 - [44] Originally by: Devoras2 Try Norway We`re better then the danes! Denmark and Sweden have taken turns invading Norway over the last few hundred years trying to make it a better place. Not sure we succeded.. A few more tries might help.
Lazaroth Caldari Reaper Industries Eternal Rapture	Posted - 2007.10.25 07:20:00 - [45] Originally by: Frygok Edited by: Frygok on 24/10/2007 23:59:06 The family of the nordic countries: Sweden is the firstborn, the big sister. Rules, rules, rules, never says or does anything remarkably controversial. Politically correct is almost everything, and is basically the straight A student. Denmark, is the second born, but the first boy. The radical of the children, trying to push the boundaries and break the rules, to much dismay of big sister. Is a smoker, drinker, is a bit meh regarding the future and just want to relax and have a good time, and can't understand other peoples need to comment on the lack of discipline. Parents wonder what on earth went wrong compared to the big sister. Norway is the youngest of the three, and is a spoiled brat. Not having the need to prove itself as a rule breaker or an angel, it goes on it's merry(and ignorant?) way, not really standing out in many ways, except for an outspoken fondness for itself. (Finland is the strange cousin from far away, and you never really know what it's doing) Note: Above is gross generalisations and made with a , nevertheless there are some truths in it. Nailed it! total ace Laz Request a sig at Eve-gfx.com
killerdawg	Posted - 2007.10.25 08:37:00 - [46] ladies dressed for hot summers > ladies dressed for cold summers
Le Cardinal ECP Rogues The Reckoning.	Posted - 2007.10.25 09:13:00 - [47] Originally by: Frygok Edited by: Frygok on 24/10/2007 23:59:06 The family of the nordic countries: Sweden is the firstborn, the big sister. Rules, rules, rules, never says or does anything remarkably controversial. Politically correct is almost everything, and is basically the straight A student. Denmark, is the second born, but the first boy. The radical of the children, trying to push the boundaries and break the rules, to much dismay of big sister. Is a smoker, drinker, is a bit meh regarding the future and just want to relax and have a good time, and can't understand other peoples need to comment on the lack of discipline. Parents wonder what on earth went wrong compared to the big sister. Norway is the youngest of the three, and is a spoiled brat. Not having the need to prove itself as a rule breaker or an angel, it goes on it's merry(and ignorant?) way, not really standing out in many ways, except for an outspoken fondness for itself. (Finland is the strange cousin from far away, and you never really know what it's doing) Note: Above is gross generalisations and made with a , nevertheless there are some truths in it. Arf.. im norwegian, but learn ur history. The birth of nations: Denmark Norway Sweden Wether the small regions should be called sweden is a definition question. Norway: First king: Harald Hsrfage: Harald Hairfair: 872 Sweden: olof Sk°tkonung: Olof Treasureking/ Or Erik Segersall: 970/995 SO: Sweden is 100 years after Norway. Denmark is undisputable first. The 3 countriers created the kalmar union in 1300 something. Swedes werent happy with the agressive warfare of the danes and withdrew from the union. Norway remained together with The Danes for 3 or 4 centuries. Also refered to as the Dark Ages in norwegian history
Cown Caldari Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.10.25 09:14:00 - [48] Borned and live in Denmark. It sux ass tbh. Loads of confusing rules and a crappy police force.
Arcticblue2 Gallente Nordic Freelancers inc	Posted - 2007.10.25 09:22:00 - [49] Originally by: Le Cardinal Originally by: Frygok Edited by: Frygok on 24/10/2007 23:59:06 The family of the nordic countries: Sweden is the firstborn, the big sister. Rules, rules, rules, never says or does anything remarkably controversial. Politically correct is almost everything, and is basically the straight A student. Denmark, is the second born, but the first boy. The radical of the children, trying to push the boundaries and break the rules, to much dismay of big sister. Is a smoker, drinker, is a bit meh regarding the future and just want to relax and have a good time, and can't understand other peoples need to comment on the lack of discipline. Parents wonder what on earth went wrong compared to the big sister. Norway is the youngest of the three, and is a spoiled brat. Not having the need to prove itself as a rule breaker or an angel, it goes on it's merry(and ignorant?) way, not really standing out in many ways, except for an outspoken fondness for itself. (Finland is the strange cousin from far away, and you never really know what it's doing) Note: Above is gross generalisations and made with a , nevertheless there are some truths in it. Arf.. im norwegian, but learn ur history. The birth of nations: Denmark Norway Sweden Wether the small regions should be called sweden is a definition question. Norway: First king: Harald Hsrfage: Harald Hairfair: 872 Sweden: olof Sk°tkonung: Olof Treasureking/ Or Erik Segersall: 970/995 SO: Sweden is 100 years after Norway. Denmark is undisputable first. The 3 countriers created the kalmar union in 1300 something. Swedes werent happy with the agressive warfare of the danes and withdrew from the union. Norway remained together with The Danes for 3 or 4 centuries. Also refered to as the Dark Ages in norwegian history Besides we in Norway does not call the swedes big sister but "S÷ta bror" equal to something like little brother I suppose ? Have always been a competition between swedes and norway !!! as good neighbours they are Iceland are our cousins... And Norwegians does understand Danish (writing almost the same as danish), swedish (both spoken and written) and well to some degree ... some icelandic. See .. Norwegian is universal OH... and we are filthy rich. ---------------------------------------------- "When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things." 1 cor.
Arcticblue2 Gallente Nordic Freelancers inc	Posted - 2007.10.25 09:25:00 - [50] Originally by: Darteis Elosia Go live somwhere on the west coast in sweden and work in norway. You'll make a ton of money in norway but buying food, cigarettes, alcohol, chocolate and just living is done in sweden to a cheaper price. The real downside can be that people arn't always very talketive i guess. I would sometimes think "Oh my god do they have to greet everyone they don't know" or "Why don't they just shut the **** up?" about random people in california some times. Also alcohol is really expensive and you have to buy it in a monopolised store in sweden. The danish are much more relaxed and drink more i think. Denmark is good for that part and the people are perhaps in general more outgoing than Norsemen or Swedes, or so i belive at least. One joke we sometimes pull in Sweden which i firmly belive there is an once of truth goes the following; "The Danish pension system only works becuase most people die shortly before or after they start reciving it". You should go on vacation and check the countries out if you are interested. In Sweden you have the right to 4 weeks payed vacation every year Oh..and study the behaviour of Leif G.W Persson, one of swedens most know criminologists. He's on the telly every week. Norway have 5 weeks paid vacation every year, and if you are past like 50 or 60 you get an extra week... Also in Norway you have as a female atleast 1 year paid nursery leave (if you have babies), the father can take 1 month I belive it is to be home with the baby (paid ofcourse). And Norway win every year in the UN survey as the best country to live in ... ---------------------------------------------- "When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things." 1 cor.
Cown Caldari Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.10.25 09:38:00 - [51] Originally by: Arcticblue2 Originally by: Darteis Elosia Go live somwhere on the west coast in sweden and work in norway. You'll make a ton of money in norway but buying food, cigarettes, alcohol, chocolate and just living is done in sweden to a cheaper price. The real downside can be that people arn't always very talketive i guess. I would sometimes think "Oh my god do they have to greet everyone they don't know" or "Why don't they just shut the **** up?" about random people in california some times. Also alcohol is really expensive and you have to buy it in a monopolised store in sweden. The danish are much more relaxed and drink more i think. Denmark is good for that part and the people are perhaps in general more outgoing than Norsemen or Swedes, or so i belive at least. One joke we sometimes pull in Sweden which i firmly belive there is an once of truth goes the following; "The Danish pension system only works becuase most people die shortly before or after they start reciving it". You should go on vacation and check the countries out if you are interested. In Sweden you have the right to 4 weeks payed vacation every year Oh..and study the behaviour of Leif G.W Persson, one of swedens most know criminologists. He's on the telly every week. Norway have 5 weeks paid vacation every year, and if you are past like 50 or 60 you get an extra week... Also in Norway you have as a female atleast 1 year paid nursery leave (if you have babies), the father can take 1 month I belive it is to be home with the baby (paid ofcourse). And Norway win every year in the UN survey as the best country to live in ... Depends on your job, doesn't it? I have 6 weeks paid vacation.
Tariel Jace Minmatar	Posted - 2007.10.25 09:58:00 - [52] I emigrated to Sweden almost 4 years ago now from the UK and I have never regretted it. Although my poor fiance is at a loss about how to stop me butchering his beloved Swedish language, when I speak it.
Le Cardinal ECP Rogues The Reckoning.	Posted - 2007.10.25 10:03:00 - [53] Originally by: Arcticblue2 Originally by: Darteis Elosia Go live somwhere on the west coast in sweden and work in norway. You'll make a ton of money in norway but buying food, cigarettes, alcohol, chocolate and just living is done in sweden to a cheaper price. The real downside can be that people arn't always very talketive i guess. I would sometimes think "Oh my god do they have to greet everyone they don't know" or "Why don't they just shut the **** up?" about random people in california some times. Also alcohol is really expensive and you have to buy it in a monopolised store in sweden. The danish are much more relaxed and drink more i think. Denmark is good for that part and the people are perhaps in general more outgoing than Norsemen or Swedes, or so i belive at least. One joke we sometimes pull in Sweden which i firmly belive there is an once of truth goes the following; "The Danish pension system only works becuase most people die shortly before or after they start reciving it". You should go on vacation and check the countries out if you are interested. In Sweden you have the right to 4 weeks payed vacation every year Oh..and study the behaviour of Leif G.W Persson, one of swedens most know criminologists. He's on the telly every week. Norway have 5 weeks paid vacation every year, and if you are past like 50 or 60 you get an extra week... Also in Norway you have as a female atleast 1 year paid nursery leave (if you have babies), the father can take 1 month I belive it is to be home with the baby (paid ofcourse). And Norway win every year in the UN survey as the best country to live in ... Minimum 5 or 6 weeks for fathers, but u can also split the nursery period equally. In my case i might have to take 5 months because my wife just started her doctoral degree^^ Norway ftw And Norwegians pretty much habited Iceland, so u can thank us for having Eve. We can take donations of gratitude in isk ingame.
Arcticblue2 Gallente Nordic Freelancers inc	Posted - 2007.10.25 10:04:00 - [54] Originally by: Cown Depends on your job, doesn't it? I have 6 weeks paid vacation. Well a quick search at LO's pages (one of the major unions here in Norway) tells me that if you are not a member of any unions you are entitled by law at 4 weeks paid holiday, and if you are over 60 you can have 5 weeks and 1 day holiday. If you are a member of a union you are entitled to 5 weeks holiday and if you are over 60 you are entitled to 6 weeks holiday. Ofcourse other companies can make individual agreements I am sure of ---------------------------------------------- "When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things." 1 cor.
Devoras2 Amarr KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.25 10:41:00 - [55] Originally by: Rutefly Originally by: Devoras2 Try Norway We`re better then the danes! Denmark and Sweden have taken turns invading Norway over the last few hundred years trying to make it a better place. Not sure we succeded.. A few more tries might help. Hey Rutefly Long time no see. On topic: Yes, we have been "invaded" and been "exchanged" from Denmark to Sweden for the past 200 years. And made us better?? You guys merely abused and took advantage of us in every aspect. But heck, we`re doing 10 times better now after we succesed ourselves, being the spoiled rich brat in the family. Long live the oil resources and the constant whinage from big bro and sis, where we are richer then them combined ^^ It's great being Amarr, aint it?
Haakon Jarl Caldari direkte	Posted - 2007.10.25 12:01:00 - [56] Edited by: Haakon Jarl on 25/10/2007 12:03:10 Originally by: Rutefly Originally by: Devoras2 Try Norway We`re better then the danes! Denmark and Sweden have taken turns invading Norway over the last few hundred years trying to make it a better place. Not sure we succeded.. A few more tries might help. when did Denmark invade Norway? Oh thats right they didnt. Denmark on the otherhand tried to duke it out with sweden many times but got pwned over and over again. the only reason Denmark got its sweatty hands around Norway was because the plague killed 50% of the population and all the nobels and royals. And unclear sucession laws left it open for a Danish claim because the royals of Norway-Sweden-Denmark was all related. I mean look at Denmark, its flat, has no trees and its tiny. In it for the state
Le Cardinal ECP Rogues The Reckoning.	Posted - 2007.10.25 12:43:00 - [57] Originally by: Haakon Jarl Edited by: Haakon Jarl on 25/10/2007 12:03:10 Originally by: Rutefly Originally by: Devoras2 Try Norway We`re better then the danes! Denmark and Sweden have taken turns invading Norway over the last few hundred years trying to make it a better place. Not sure we succeded.. A few more tries might help. the only reason Denmark got its sweatty hands around Norway was because the plague killed 50% of the population and all the nobels and royals. And unclear sucession laws left it open for a Danish claim because the royals of Norway-Sweden-Denmark was all related. Partly right. Kalmar Union. All 3 countries joined, Sweden left after 100-150 years. Norway was stuck for 400 years^^
Ademaro Imre Caldari Eye of God O X I D E	Posted - 2007.10.25 15:12:00 - [58] Originally by: Morn Judith Well, first off Canada is a bad example (Just kidding!). I'd like to see a resource about the flying pregnant women to the US to birth, that's something I've never heard of and quite honestly sounds a bit far-fetched. What about the pharmaceutical companies controlling the FDA and thus the insanely high prices of prescriptions? What about the incredible instability of the economy? Now I'm not saying that the US is entirely bad, or that I'm not thankful for living here. But I feel the US began digging a hole for ourselves generations ago, and the next few generations are going to be the ones to pay for it. But fundamentally, in my opinion, calling anyone else's opinion idiotic is extremely hypocritical. Linkage I don't believe the drug companies control the FDA, its the other way around, the FDA hampers the drug companies delaying approval. Even with that said, everyone has access to the best medicine as soon as its available. And that may be why the cost of medicine seems high. I have never seen a comparison of what socialized healthcare doctors are allowed to approve. HMO's and insurance companies may not approve the brandnames, but they will approve the generic brands. And that is another issues with the FDA, many generic brands must be produced in the USA to guranttee safety. The US healthcare is under extreme pressure which is being ignored by politicians so one side can buy votes, and the other side can pay off friends by doing nothing about illegal immigration. 30% of the crime in the US is done by illegal aliens, and some 77 hospitals went bankrupt and had to be bailed, and 100 are ready to do it again providing free healthcare to people that can't pay - entirely illegal aliens, as the entire southwest US morphs into Mexico as 12% percent of their population drains the resources of the US. 40% of health care to US citizens are subsidized by the US government anyway. Because health care is not mandatory, many healthy people like me only carry catastrophic health care, because no one can be denied insurance when they do want some. If I get diagnosed with cancer. I can buy insurance tomorrow as if I had full insurance my entire life. Anyway - I still think his opinion is idiotic. I don't think any country is a "paradise" compared to the US. Take where I live. The last time a crime was committed in my township was when I set off illegal fireworks and some neighbors were concerned about what sounded like a warzone. Before that, someone in a car 6 months ago plowed over someone's mailbox. My township got rid of the police officers actually, and combined services with another township, which gives me an extra 10 minutes to clean up my pyrotechnics.
Haakon Jarl Caldari direkte	Posted - 2007.10.25 16:26:00 - [59] Originally by: Le Cardinal Partly right. Kalmar Union. All 3 countries joined, Sweden left after 100-150 years. Norway was stuck for 400 years^^ In 1349, the Black Death killed between 40% and 50% of the Norwegian population,[11] causing a decline in both society and economics. During this decline, it is probable that the Fairhair dynasty died out in 1387. Ostensibly, royal politics at the time resulted in several personal unions between the Nordic countries, eventually bringing the thrones of Norway, Denmark, and Sweden under the control of Queen Margrethe I of Denmark when the country entered into the Kalmar Union with Denmark and Sweden. Although Sweden finally broke out of the union in 1523, Norway remained in the union with Denmark for 434 years until 1814. So you see while Sweden left, there was no one left in Norway to decide anything hence Norway ending up in Danish hands for 400 years. In it for the state
Rialtor Amarr Yarrrateers Mass Destruction.	Posted - 2007.10.25 17:23:00 - [60] Originally by: Ademaro Imre Linkage I don't believe the drug companies control the FDA, its the other way around, the FDA hampers the drug companies delaying approval. Even with that said, everyone has access to the best medicine as soon as its available. And that may be why the cost of medicine seems high. I have never seen a comparison of what socialized healthcare doctors are allowed to approve. HMO's and insurance companies may not approve the brandnames, but they will approve the generic brands. And that is another issues with the FDA, many generic brands must be produced in the USA to guranttee safety. The US healthcare is under extreme pressure which is being ignored by politicians so one side can buy votes, and the other side can pay off friends by doing nothing about illegal immigration. 30% of the crime in the US is done by illegal aliens, and some 77 hospitals went bankrupt and had to be bailed, and 100 are ready to do it again providing free healthcare to people that can't pay - entirely illegal aliens, as the entire southwest US morphs into Mexico as 12% percent of their population drains the resources of the US. 40% of health care to US citizens are subsidized by the US government anyway. Because health care is not mandatory, many healthy people like me only carry catastrophic health care, because no one can be denied insurance when they do want some. If I get diagnosed with cancer. I can buy insurance tomorrow as if I had full insurance my entire life. Anyway - I still think his opinion is idiotic. I don't think any country is a "paradise" compared to the US. Take where I live. The last time a crime was committed in my township was when I set off illegal fireworks and some neighbors were concerned about what sounded like a warzone. Before that, someone in a car 6 months ago plowed over someone's mailbox. My township got rid of the police officers actually, and combined services with another township, which gives me an extra 10 minutes to clean up my pyrotechnics. What drives US Health care costs up is the government mandates/intervention. Insurance companies aren't free to compete on the open market. For example I can't buy HC insurance from Maryland if I live in a NY. There's no sane reason to not allow that. You're just destroying competition. The Government dictates very specific plans and layouts for insurance companies to follow, instead of just letting the market work things out. The end result is a company with close ties to government, which drives prices up. This can easily end up with corrupt institutions. When Government tries to dictate Healthcare it applies blanket rules across a varied group of people. The US is a very expansive territory, that can't be covered with blanket legislation. The market is more free to adjust with client demands. Also the private sector can offer a more divirse assortment of insurance to a wider range of people based on age, sex, location, etc. IMO, the market is the best option. I would also like to hold my own right not to own healthcare for myself. As I did not have healthcare by choice until recently. So in my mind, the goals of private healthcare are more to my liking. While currently the US healthcare system is broken, I don't think the ideal answer is a government solution for the US. ---- sig ---- He who pays the piper, picks the tune
Arcticblue2 Gallente Nordic Freelancers inc	Posted - 2007.10.25 17:49:00 - [61] Originally by: Rialtor Wall of text I'm not going to say that Norways healthcare system is the best, or better than US. In all fairness it probably is better in US than in Norway, however I do feel that whenever I have been needing their service I have got the help I needed too. We do however have some problems like ques to get proper threatment (ofcourse lifethreathning help goes before other), wich again mean that people are sometimes unnessesary long out on sickleave here (wich btw is like 90% of your normal payment (paid by the government). If you go more than one year on sickleave you get an offer to reeducate yourself (education with payment) to something you can do, sometimes it is the type of work or place that make you sick. Still I feel that sure it is not good that people have to wait for proper threatment but people in general does get taken good care of here. ---------------------------------------------- "When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things." 1 cor.
Insidi Us Amarr Suicidal Mercenaries Pure.	Posted - 2007.10.25 17:50:00 - [62] Dang, now I'm really torn between Denmark and Sweden. I'll learn whatever country's language I move to, because I think it's arrogant to make people speak English just because they "should" in the international sense. -------------
Rialtor Amarr Yarrrateers Mass Destruction.	Posted - 2007.10.25 18:09:00 - [63] Edited by: Rialtor on 25/10/2007 18:14:37 Originally by: Arcticblue2 Originally by: Rialtor Wall of text I'm not going to say that Norways healthcare system is the best, or better than US. In all fairness it probably is better in US than in Norway, however I do feel that whenever I have been needing their service I have got the help I needed too. We do however have some problems like ques to get proper threatment (ofcourse lifethreathning help goes before other), wich again mean that people are sometimes unnessesary long out on sickleave here (wich btw is like 90% of your normal payment (paid by the government). If you go more than one year on sickleave you get an offer to reeducate yourself (education with payment) to something you can do, sometimes it is the type of work or place that make you sick. Still I feel that sure it is not good that people have to wait for proper threatment but people in general does get taken good care of here. Just saying Universal Healthcare at a federal level in the US is not such a good idea. If some form of universal Healthcare system was to be provided it needs a state based approach. It would be just like if the EU decided to blanket HC across all it's members. It would totally ignore the individual needs of each particular country. That would be the analogy to doing HC at a federal level in the US. Norway is rather small and your HC system works for you. 1 because your country can adapt rather rapidly to the needs of a few. If you tried to enforce Norway's HC institution on the entire EU, you'd have problems. Things such as this should operate on a more local level. When you expand the HC system to that many people it becomes harder and harder to provide any changes to the system in a timely and effective manner. On the other hand things like national defense should operate on a federal level. Just for the sake of efficiency and to elminate redundancy. But Policing of Citizens should be provided at a local level. The point I'm making is that you have to look at each institution individually, gather it's specifications and determine which level to manage it. Edit: Just some food for thought. Take 2-4 people and decide where to go for lunch. No big deal, you can probably make concessions easily to one another. Now try the same thing with 10 people, you may find a common place to each, but the time it would take to make the decision would be costly. Such phenomenons exists on a political level as well. Try to pass a law in a state, like an indoor smoking ban. You could pull that off on a local level without "too" much fuss as they did in NY. However, you try to do that same change to 100s of millions of people and you have a huge issue on your hands. Being that it was no small issue in NY alone. ---- sig ---- He who pays the piper, picks the tune
Insidi Us Amarr Suicidal Mercenaries Pure.	Posted - 2007.10.25 21:14:00 - [64] I took a Health and Society class last semester, and the US health care system was its main focus, but there were comparative sections. The consensus of the class was that the US would eventually move to a "safety net" type of coverage controlled by the individual state, much like Canada does by province. There are just too many differences to make it a federal system, and my mention of it in my first post was misleading. California is leading the way with a state-run safety net system where employers either provide health insurance to its employees or pay a portion of their profits into a state fund that will go to pay for everyone else. Parts of it are debatable, but the overall system seems to have a good chance of working out. By safety net I mean a minimum level of coverage. England's health system is a safety net, because they provide universal coverage, but some of the richer citizens are fed up with queues and caps on what can be done (like only a million MRIs a year, no more) so they are buying private insurance to get better care. So better coverage is available if you're willing to pay for it, but I don't think you'll have cases of children dying because they went to the wrong hospital (where they were turned away for not being covered by the right HMO). About Sicko, the Michael Moore movie, it had some good and bad points. The example in France of the engineer and his wife (also an engineer or an assistant of some type) is not the typical story of that country. Like the UK, inner city/lower income residents (including immigrants) get poorer coverage. If Moore would have profiled a family like the ones in "La Haine" there might have been a different outcome. But overall it was a thought-provoking while mainstream-minded movie. -------------
Ademaro Imre Caldari Eye of God O X I D E	Posted - 2007.10.25 22:09:00 - [65] The US does have a safety net, "Medicaid," not to be confused with Medicare that is for the elderly and social security recipients. What you are describing is far more reaching than a safety net. Of course there is always a debate as to what to do do with the gray area just above the requirements for Medicaid. A large part of health care and income in US is socialized. If one were to combine social security administration, medicare, medicaid (in part financed and operated by states), the welfare agencies and other entities, it would be astonishing just how vast a one provider system is. That one provider, the US government, acts through all sorts of agencies.
Rialtor Amarr Yarrrateers Mass Destruction.	Posted - 2007.10.26 05:28:00 - [66] Originally by: Insidi Us By safety net I mean a minimum level of coverage. England's health system is a safety net, because they provide universal coverage, but some of the richer citizens are fed up with queues and caps on what can be done (like only a million MRIs a year, no more) so they are buying private insurance to get better care. So better coverage is available if you're willing to pay for it, but I don't think you'll have cases of children dying because they went to the wrong hospital (where they were turned away for not being covered by the right HMO). There's a fallacy that free healthcare exists. The term free healthcare is just a naming convention. Nothing is free, it's obviously paid for by all its citizens in the way of duties/taxes. The fact that they're paying for more healthcare kind of means they're paying double, while it is kind of transparent, it's pretty much the case. They nd up being double covered, maybe I'm wrong and there's a way to opt out, but I doubt it. I truly believe that an open free market for healthcare and insurance will eventually lead to lower rates for that population. It's odd that insurance rates go up and up as technology advances. It's one of the few if not the only industry where this is the case. ---- sig ---- He who pays the piper, picks the tune
Jolly OzzyJones Caldari Asur Heavy Industries	Posted - 2007.10.26 05:46:00 - [67] Being a dane myself, I wouldnt wanna trade with anyone Originally by: hattifnatt Learning danish = Fail because they suck at pronouncing their own language So true lol! Originally by: Frygok Denmark, is the second born, but the first boy. The radical of the children, trying to push the boundaries and break the rules, to much dismay of big sister. Is a smoker, drinker, is a bit meh regarding the future and just want to relax and have a good time, and can't understand other peoples need to comment on the lack of discipline. Parents wonder what on earth went wrong compared to the big sister. There it is! Also. Lol at all the scandinavians trying do the "we're better than you!" "No we are the best" "No WE are uber!!!11" But if you say you speak a little German, I would reckon that Denmark would be your best choice As the languages (minus grammar) is very much alike.
Insidi Us Amarr Suicidal Mercenaries Pure.	Posted - 2007.10.26 06:02:00 - [68] Originally by: Rialtor There's a fallacy that free healthcare exists. The term free healthcare is just a naming convention. Nothing is free, it's obviously paid for by all its citizens in the way of duties/taxes. The fact that they're paying for more healthcare kind of means they're paying double, while it is kind of transparent, it's pretty much the case. They nd up being double covered, maybe I'm wrong and there's a way to opt out, but I doubt it. Nope, they are "paying twice" which is why it's only for the rich or upper-middle class. Originally by: Rialtor I truly believe that an open free market for healthcare and insurance will eventually lead to lower rates for that population. It's odd that insurance rates go up and up as technology advances. It's one of the few if not the only industry where this is the case. Aside from robotics, not a whole lot of medical technology gets invented to make things more efficient, they are made to fill a gap. Other things get invented to cure ailments that didn't exist 100 years ago, like ADD, CFS, or anorexia (or Restless Leg Syndrome). They weren't "medicalized" behaviors back then. Plus now treatment is way more often for chronic diseases like cancer, and as people are able to live longer they are entitled to the medical care no one was old enough to need 50 years ago. That's why many people try and focus on prevention, which is classist. You can tell people to exercise more and eat healthy foods, but that takes time and more money. There's a reason why so many lower-class families eat fast food: It's cheap, it's filling, and it tastes good. Lower-income workers also do jobs that place them in hazardous situations, like black lung-infected coal miners or arthritic factory workers. Anyways, that's a crash course on your last point on rising insurance rates. BTW, Medicaid is not a safety net in the way I used it. I can't qualify for Medicaid because I make too much money, but I can't get private insurance because I have a pre-existing condition that used to be covered while I was on my Dad's plan. Once I turned the maximum age I was cut off, and I've been trying every few months for about two years now to get covered in case of catastrophe without luck. The number of uninsured US citizens is rising, and is about 20% right now. They don't have a safety net. ------------- RIP Constructive Criticism
Den enjen Caldari Red Dwarf Mining Corporation space weaponry and trade	Posted - 2007.10.26 06:11:00 - [69] uhm.... Can i have your stuff? -------------------------------------------- Wife builing baby level
Le Cardinal ECP Rogues The Reckoning.	Posted - 2007.10.26 10:22:00 - [70] Originally by: Arcticblue2 Originally by: Rialtor Wall of text If you go more than one year on sickleave you get an offer to reeducate yourself (education with payment) to something you can do, sometimes it is the type of work or place that make you sick. That is extremely simplified. A process of getting reeducation and financial support for it can take several years. If your sickleave is caused by physical or psychological problems u might end up with "yrkesrettet attf°ring". Dunno the english word for that and too lazy to search for it. You get financial help for a certain period of time and closer attendance from qualified personell within employment office. Their job is to help u find a job that can suit u.
Arcticblue2 Gallente Nordic Freelancers inc	Posted - 2007.10.26 14:34:00 - [71] Originally by: Le Cardinal Originally by: Arcticblue2 Originally by: Rialtor Wall of text If you go more than one year on sickleave you get an offer to reeducate yourself (education with payment) to something you can do, sometimes it is the type of work or place that make you sick. That is extremely simplified. A process of getting reeducation and financial support for it can take several years. If your sickleave is caused by physical or psychological problems u might end up with "yrkesrettet attf°ring". Dunno the english word for that and too lazy to search for it. You get financial help for a certain period of time and closer attendance from qualified personell within employment office. Their job is to help u find a job that can suit u. Yeah I went on sickleave for about 1 year before I went back to school and later over to work, where they at first paid like 75% (government that is) of my paycheck, next year they paid 50% and third 25% and after 3 years the workplace had to choose if they wanted me there or not. Still .. felt pretty "safe" and taken care of by the government ... that is ofcourse I also felt abit lost at times, they sometimes do not tell you what you are entitled to of benefits and you sort of got to either find out yourself or ask ****load of questions. ---------------------------------------------- "When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things." 1 cor.
DasDizzy	Posted - 2007.10.26 15:56:00 - [72] if choosing one of the scandinavian contries choose denmark, its the cheapest and the best of em
Rialtor Amarr Yarrrateers Mass Destruction.	Posted - 2007.10.26 17:26:00 - [73] Originally by: Insidi Us There's a reason why so many lower-class families eat fast food: It's cheap, it's filling, and it tastes good. Lower-income workers also do jobs that place them in hazardous situations, like black lung-infected coal miners or arthritic factory workers. I don't know what world you live on :), but fast food isn't cheap :). It's cheaper than a middle/upper class restaurant, but it's hardly cheap compared to raw ingredients you get from the super market. If you buy 1 meal per member, if you have a 5 person family, it's roughly about $6 average per meal. So that's $30 dollars. With $30 dollars you can probably buy enough ingredients to last 2-3 meals. Eating healthier does not cost more money than McDonalds. Fruits and veggies are cheap, Poultry and Fish are not un-affordable by lower class families. Prevention is the way to go as all groups can do it. However all groups cannot afford medicine, if they one day make the "all-you-can-eat" pill I'm sure the lower class couldn't afford it. But it should be a personal responsibility issue. However if Healthcare is socialized then it gives all funders (everyone) a right to complain about your lifestyle. Because the end result is all the funders having to pay for the irresponsibility of that person that does not practice prevention. That's why I'm fundamentally resistant to socialize medicine, the mere philosophy of it. It gives others a perfectly understandable position to interfere in other people's lives and request them to live in a certain fashion. While this is ok for some things (like following the law for example) I don't think people should be obligated to live a healthy life. If you want to eat like a monster, and smoke a cigarette, get smashed and pass out, imo that should be up to you. Under a socialized system, it's not really just up to you, everyone has a stake in your lifestyle at that point, because int he end you're going to drive up costs. That's the principle in which I hate socialized systems. At least if you had to pay for it yourself, the end result would be you trying to minimize your costs, and if you don't the costs are your own doing. In the end you have a choice live healthy or pay more. ---- sig ---- He who pays the piper, picks the tune
Insidi Us Amarr Suicidal Mercenaries Pure.	Posted - 2007.10.26 18:50:00 - [74] By cheap I don't just mean money, I mean time. It's hard to explain because the fact that you are posting here means you aren't a member of the underclass or working poor, and since I doubt you study sociology you're like many Americans who have almost no class awareness. I mean, one out of five children in this country are born into poverty. If you really think about it, that's a freaking depressing statistic, but it was news to me when I first learned it. There are 10,000 (!) foster children in San Diego alone. What hope do they have? No, not everyone can "make it" if they just work hard and apply themselves. That's called the Horatio Alger myth. Class mobility in America is no greater than in any other developed country, and some studies say its worse. People have these ideas about what makes our country great, but almost every statistic puts us equal or worse to other 1st world countries. We are not unique, or a shining beacon of humanity. Anyways, put yourself into the shoes of a single mother with two kids. You have to work two jobs to pay the bills, or accept welfare which now requires you to work a dead-end job like dish washing or bathroom cleaning, so you don't have the time to go to college. Your money goes to child care, your health care is probably covered by Medicaid, but between your two 8 hour shifts you have to prepare three meals and get some sleep so you aren't fired from your jobs where there's a line of other poor people waiting to fill any openings. You're stressed to hell and back, so you might substitute fast food for dinner every night, make your kids a weak breakfast and use the school lunch program (which uses crap food ingredients) to feed them the rest of the time. What's easier: taking an hour a week to buy fresh groceries and prepare a good meal every night (takes me at least a half hour to feed myself, a bachelor, with just spaghetti), or grabbing 2 happy meals and a combo meal for yourself on the way home from work? Besides, the US stands with South Africa as being the only two developed countries without a safety net health program. If almost every other country can provide universal coverage without feeling like their lives are being interfered with constantly by their neighbors or government (not saying it doesn't happen, it's just the same as it is here really) then it doesn't seem to be the worst thing in the world to have here. And make no mistake, we'll have it eventually. The 20% uninsured will grow in number, and they can vote. ------------- RIP Constructive Criticism
Rialtor Amarr Yarrrateers Mass Destruction.	Posted - 2007.10.26 20:36:00 - [75] Originally by: Insidi Us ... Well, nothing about the post mentioned it being time effective, which is a different issue. But I think it's faster to make your kids a sandwich than it is to wait in line at McDies. It's faster, cheaper, and healthier overall the much better solution for a poor household. A lot of the time spent in McDies could be spent making "spaghetti." As well as providing a better meal for your 2 precious children. And they are worth every single second you spend at work, and the 30 minutes you spend cooking them food. No one said parenthood and/or being poor was easy, and I commend the poor person that struggles to raise her kids by herself and provide for them. I actually donate to such charities that try to health the poverty situation in America. But if you give Fast food to your kids every night you're not a good parent. At that point your kids are more important than your own mental state, and you should struggle to make sure they get the best possible upbringing that you can provide. Those kids are your responsibility. And if that means taking a few hours to make a dozen sandwiches for your kids throughout the week then so be it. At the same time you're teaching your kids a valuable lesson. Probably the most important lesson that a parent can teach their child. The value of hard work and taking care of one's responsibility with self dignity and respect. And it's not that long that a single parent has to struggle that hard. Kids aren't invalids at some point you can teach them how to help you and make all your lies easier. There's nothing that brings more pride to a family unit than to struggle together and become self-reliant. The 20% number will grow if nothing is done to make the free market insurance company work. One of the main factors in the price of healtcare is in fact too much government interference with the free market solution. If the free market can provide things such as computers and cellphones at such a low price that just about anyone in America seeking one can afford it, then the free market can probably provide affordable Healthcare. They would also offer more forms of healthcare with more variety and tailored to specific types of people than the federal government could hope to achieve. ---- sig ---- He who pays the piper, picks the tune
Danton Marcellus Nebula Rasa Holdings	Posted - 2007.10.26 21:13:00 - [76] I'd not move here, winter or rather moist darkness is 10 months of the year with 2 months of summer, maybe. The only reason to move here is the women and I'd seriously suggest you move somewhere with a decent climate and import. Also Known As
Rikeka Amarr Eye of God O X I D E	Posted - 2007.10.26 21:40:00 - [77] I live in Argentina. Anyone care to trade for a few months?
Cipher7 OldBastardsPub SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.26 22:11:00 - [78] "poverty" means nothing in America as the standard of living is so high. I see people in the supermarket all the time paying for groceries with food stamps. They're not buying simple staples like grain or rice, they're buying Hot Pockets and microwave dinners and paying with their WIC card. When people are "poor" in America it means they can't afford an Xbox. The ones who live on the street are usually mentally ill. I would be in favor of sheltering them in jails but that would trample on their human rights so they sleep in subways. We do have homeless shelters for people to go and sleep. We have medicaid for people to get medical care. We have food stamps for the poor to go buy food. What more can we possibly do to help the poor?
Wendat Huron Stellar Solutions	Posted - 2007.10.26 23:10:00 - [79] Originally by: Cipher7 "poverty" means nothing in America as the standard of living is so high. I see people in the supermarket all the time paying for groceries with food stamps. They're not buying simple staples like grain or rice, they're buying Hot Pockets and microwave dinners and paying with their WIC card. When people are "poor" in America it means they can't afford an Xbox. The ones who live on the street are usually mentally ill. I would be in favor of sheltering them in jails but that would trample on their human rights so they sleep in subways. We do have homeless shelters for people to go and sleep. We have medicaid for people to get medical care. We have food stamps for the poor to go buy food. What more can we possibly do to help the poor? Socialized healthcare? These forums are FUBAR, upgrade this decade!
Rialtor Amarr Yarrrateers Mass Destruction.	Posted - 2007.10.26 23:30:00 - [80] Originally by: Wendat Huron Originally by: Cipher7 "poverty" means nothing in America as the standard of living is so high. I see people in the supermarket all the time paying for groceries with food stamps. They're not buying simple staples like grain or rice, they're buying Hot Pockets and microwave dinners and paying with their WIC card. When people are "poor" in America it means they can't afford an Xbox. The ones who live on the street are usually mentally ill. I would be in favor of sheltering them in jails but that would trample on their human rights so they sleep in subways. We do have homeless shelters for people to go and sleep. We have medicaid for people to get medical care. We have food stamps for the poor to go buy food. What more can we possibly do to help the poor? Socialized healthcare? I'll never understand why people think healthcare is such a huge deal for the majority of people. I've been to a doctor less than 10 times in my life. I've received all my shots from free clinics (which I agree should exist as disease prevention is paramount), but that's a far cry away from socialized healthcare. I was diagnosed with TB (dormant), just underwent that same free clinic's supervision. The care was great, not very long wait periods at all -- Free pills. So forgive my lack of emotion when I hear that people are un-insured in this country. I've been uninsured (by choice) for the last 6-7 years and it hasn't effected anything (except for having more money in my savings account) as I wouldn't have gone to the doctor anyway. And I'm not even completely "healthy", but I self-diagnosed my problems, and there's no cure anyway so no real benefit to going. Dental insurance was quite nice for kids, they get to have braces and things like that, but that's usually superficial. The only form of healthcare that's really a must have is accidental insurance coverage, maybe some short-term disability. If you're a father that would mean you have a decent job to which to provide for your kids, so getting insured isn't a big issue once you have a decent job. But for the majority of young single people, insurance isn't all that needed. It's a luxury. ---- sig ---- He who pays the piper, picks the tune
Cipher7 OldBastardsPub SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.27 03:55:00 - [81] Originally by: Wendat Huron Socialized healthcare? I think socialism is a great system in homogenous countries, where people share common ethnic ties. In multicultural countries people generally abuse the system because theres no tribal or ethnic solidarity, people are less willing to pay for the care of those they view as "leeching" off the system.
Aesgrim Northern Shadowrunners Dark Matter Coalition	Posted - 2007.10.27 18:37:00 - [82] I really like this topic :) However, I`m quite curious what people abroad (of any of the Nordic nations) think about us. Enough of this chestbeating from swedes, danes and norwegians. (We know we live a good life over here.) I want to have the opinions from the world outside of scandinavia. What do you think about the people? What do you think about the cities? Traffic? Nature? And so on. Empirical evidence implies that people loves to complain.
Ademaro Imre Caldari Eye of God O X I D E	Posted - 2007.10.28 03:11:00 - [83] Originally by: Insidi Us BTW, Medicaid is not a safety net in the way I used it. I can't qualify for Medicaid because I make too much money, but I can't get private insurance because I have a pre-existing condition that used to be covered while I was on my Dad's plan. Once I turned the maximum age I was cut off, and I've been trying every few months for about two years now to get covered in case of catastrophe without luck. The number of uninsured US citizens is rising, and is about 20% right now. They don't have a safety net. Get a lawyer. Its a federal law that insurance companies can not impose more than a 12 month waiting period, and no waiting period if you had prior coverage, or no breaks of more than 63 days. I just bought health insurance. $82/month $3,500 deductible while the insurance company pays 90% of just about everything until my 10% adds up to $3,500 with my max out of pocket bill of $1200. Its just $20/week for me. My car insurance costs more than that! (and if I have a wreck that is my fault , I have a $500 deductible per accident and they just raise the rates on me to make the money back in three years!) You can get catastrophic health care coverage for about $20-30 a month also. I would say all states have insurance plans for those that can not get insurance. In fact, I buy worker's compensation insurance coverage for my business from the state - its cheaper too. Totally different thing really, but states do offer things like that.
Ademaro Imre Caldari Eye of God O X I D E	Posted - 2007.10.28 03:19:00 - [84] Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 28/10/2007 03:23:31 Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 28/10/2007 03:21:47 Originally by: Cipher7 When people are "poor" in America it means they can't afford an Xbox. You mean an an Xbox, accessories, cable internet, 3 controllers and 60 games. This is what its like to be poor in the USA. and - click the chart, 73% of the poor, or poor families own a car. If that seems high, 42% own their home. The "poor" numbers are counted BEFORE welfare and any other assistance. Not after. In particular, click the chart on living space per capita that compares the US poor with high incomes families of other industrialized nations. Not to start a debate on incomes of nations, but the count of "poverty" numbers in the US is typically absurd.
Erik Pathfinder Caldari Pathfinder Systems	Posted - 2007.10.28 03:51:00 - [85] Edited by: Erik Pathfinder on 28/10/2007 03:51:08 @ Insidi Us, I'm a Dane, living in San Diego. If you would like someone to practice your Danish with, send me an in-game mail. I would be happy to correspond with you (e-mail or otherwise). --------------- Creator of The Correct Dread(tm) sig
Sean Dillon Caldari R.U.S.T.	Posted - 2007.10.28 10:20:00 - [86] Last time I was in Denmark I was a little kid and visited Legoland, that was very fun. I think the park is closed these days. The day after I took the boat to Oslo and spend a holiday in the fjords of norway, also a very beautifull region. If you like the cold weather and lots of rain every year, and an almost always white cristmass you should go live in norway or denmark
Le Cardinal ECP Rogues The Reckoning.	Posted - 2007.10.29 11:23:00 - [87] Originally by: Sean Dillon Last time I was in Denmark I was a little kid and visited Legoland, that was very fun. I think the park is closed these days. The day after I took the boat to Oslo and spend a holiday in the fjords of norway, also a very beautifull region. If you like the cold weather and lots of rain every year, and an almost always white cristmass you should go live in norway or denmark Im from Norway and i live on the wast coast. No white christmas here You have to go in the midlands or up north. Used to be much snow when i was a kid, but the climate has changed.
Jack Thurner Quam Singulari	Posted - 2007.10.29 11:43:00 - [88] Originally by: Ademaro Imre Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 28/10/2007 03:23:31 Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 28/10/2007 03:21:47 Originally by: Cipher7 When people are "poor" in America it means they can't afford an Xbox. You mean an an Xbox, accessories, cable internet, 3 controllers and 60 games. This is what its like to be poor in the USA. and - click the chart, 73% of the poor, or poor families own a car. If that seems high, 42% own their home. The "poor" numbers are counted BEFORE welfare and any other assistance. Not after. In particular, click the chart on living space per capita that compares the US poor with high incomes families of other industrialized nations. Not to start a debate on incomes of nations, but the count of "poverty" numbers in the US is typically absurd. They forgot to meantion all the trailer parks :P (thus it's not that expensive to own your own "house")
Der Komissar	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:42:00 - [89] I suggest Sweden's Malm÷. It has very rich culture.

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