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Carrier Nerf quietly re-introduced

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Nobler Caldari Orion Ore International Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.11.05 17:51:00 - [91] Laughs at all the devs posting in this thread as alts. Anway. Guess just take away the maintaince bay on the carrier. 4 accounts ending November 22nd...
Aurinkokuningas	Posted - 2007.11.05 17:53:00 - [92] Originally by: Nobler 4 accounts ending November 22nd... Likely more than 4 other players not cancelling because they can enter low sec without having to deal ****ers with solowtfpwnmachines.
Nobler Caldari Orion Ore International Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.11.05 17:58:00 - [93] Originally by: Aurinkokuningas Likely more than 4 other players not cancelling because they can enter low sec without having to deal ****ers with solowtfpwnmachines. [:roll: Carriers are not solowtfpwnmachines. in a 1 vs 1 fight I hope that a well fitted carrier would come out on top of a battleship, maybe even in a 3 vs 1 (even it just sat there and tanked the damage). Carriers can be killed rather easily. This thread is not about the fracking fighter nerf, it's about putting ships w/ ammo and supplies in them and delivering them to their destination. You should be banned for trolling and posting not contructive comments in this thread...oh wait your Amarr never mind.
William DeMeo Gallente the united	Posted - 2007.11.05 18:12:00 - [94] Originally by: Fswd Edited by: Fswd on 27/10/2007 12:08:10 Edited by: Fswd on 27/10/2007 12:07:56 Edited by: Fswd on 27/10/2007 12:07:23 There are freighters for hauling stuff. The function of carriers is to carry fighters, not stuff. In some way, this can even be regarded as an exploit, like how miners use jet-cans. Then why the hell are the nerfing how many fighters they can launch? Make your mind up or stfu. Yarr
Ludwig Wittgenstein Minmatar Minmitar Scorpion Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.11.05 18:43:00 - [95] The carrier nerf is uncalled for at this time. It is not necessary and will further move this game towards the fate of others that did not listen to their player base. The developers have not learned the lessons that others have in games such as SWG that ended up being a dead ghost town when changes were made that made the game one fit for a two year old to play. As a carrier pilot that have spent billions of isks training and securing my ship, I do not want any changes made. As a former SWG player, I know the power of the customer to walk away to another game when changes are made such as this one which is not in the interest of players that have been playing for years. Dont make the same mistakes as star wars galaxies and retract changes that are capricious and not useful to the players that have dedicated time and isks to making this game what it is today!
Occara	Posted - 2007.11.05 18:54:00 - [96] Originally by: Druadan Let's not forget the last carrier logistics nerf, when they stopped us using GSCs in the holds of our ships in the carrier ship bay. They snuck that through to the test server, hoping we wouldn't notice, and then ignored all the outcry it caused. They didn't even bother to stonewall us... they just ignored us. If it's on EIB, it's up for discussion. If it's not, and we have to make our own thread in Game Development, we're screwed. That's the way it is, and it's not acceptable. Are you smoking too much ***** or something? There is no obligation for the devs to ask you in order to change ANYTHING. You pay to play this game. You do not pay for the game to be made to suit you. If you don't like the way it is, you quit. What is up with the sense of entitlement that some people have from spending tiny amounts of money monthly on a service?
LUH 3471	Posted - 2007.11.05 18:54:00 - [97] Edited by: LUH 3471 on 05/11/2007 18:55:53 Originally by: Ludwig Wittgenstein The carrier nerf is uncalled for at this time. It is not necessary and will further move this game towards the fate of others that did not listen to their player base. The developers have not learned the lessons that others have in games such as SWG that ended up being a dead ghost town when changes were made that made the game one fit for a two year old to play. As a carrier pilot that have spent billions of isks training and securing my ship, I do not want any changes made. As a former SWG player, I know the power of the customer to walk away to another game when changes are made such as this one which is not in the interest of players that have been playing for years. Dont make the same mistakes as star wars galaxies and retract changes that are capricious and not useful to the players that have dedicated time and isks to making this game what it is today! listen to this man ccp for he is speaking the truth stop hurting yourself ccp pls
Jones Maloy Minmatar Unified Naval Command	Posted - 2007.11.05 19:13:00 - [98] ahem add the cargo bay volume to the ships total volume. indy will take up X space, where X = the ship's volume + cargo bay volume. same for containers. no more packing 2000m3 of cargo into a 50m3 container. same should go for ships. (i haven't played in a few years so things might have changed) the above will: allow carriers to store ships with ammo and moduals in and on them. prevent carriers from carrying too much cargo by nesting ships. fixes the problem without changing anything else. that is the ideal solution. feedback appreciated, because nothing will get done without talking about it. ----- copy and paste from other thread for those too lazy to read it. --- WCS Nerf yes i'm still angry
Sebastien LeReparteur Minmatar SpaceTravelers Freelance Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 19:32:00 - [99] Edited by: Sebastien LeReparteur on 05/11/2007 19:36:12 Edited by: Sebastien LeReparteur on 05/11/2007 19:34:04 Here we go again! Carriers the new evil of the month... There is no problems with the Mother ship in low sec or the Lag created by drone... What is wring is just that carrier ARE USED FOR LOGISTICS. Oh wait now you are saying that carriers should not do POS logistics but only field combat logistics? Only sounds to me as a massive boost to titan owning Alliance, they can jump around those freighter without any troubles thus effectively boosting supply lines.
Nobler Caldari Orion Ore International Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.11.05 20:28:00 - [100] Edited by: Nobler on 05/11/2007 20:29:45 Edited by: Nobler on 05/11/2007 20:29:13 Originally by: Sebastien LeReparteur Only sounds to me as a massive boost to titan owning Alliance, they can jump around those freighter without any troubles thus effectively boosting supply lines. According to this thread, Alliances will no longer be able to use Titans to jump a Freighter around. Linky
Bomber1945	Posted - 2007.11.05 20:28:00 - [101] This is impossible. I mean if they do this then it will be impossible to move POS fuel. Some of us in smaller corporations out in omist Will basically be shut down. So unless you are in a huge alliance witch can move obelisks down the pipe from Empire. It will be impossible to enjoy the advantages of having a tower. Like invention, moon mining, and so on. So much for eve of allowing people to be aspireing. 0.0 will just be a place for those who've already won the game to prevent anyone else from having success. Unless CCP make the jump freighter just as good and accessible as carriers. In which case don't nerf the carriers in the first place!
ChaosOne Caldari DarkStar 1 GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.11.05 20:49:00 - [102] Currenlty on sisi, No ship with maintence bay can have goods in the hold of stored ships except charges (ammo) frieghters have had there mass increased x10, they can no longer use jump bridges due to the amount of ozone used/ able to be stored in the jump bridge hold. A knock on effect has been that they can no longer warp long distances. Agility has been increased x 10 to offset mass. T2 freighters are estimated at being in the price region on 3.6bil to build (excluding buying the new t2 component bpo's) and the cost of inventing which leads to ----- 6 week copy time for a 1 run oblisk bpc, 64 mechanical enginering and 64 starship enginering. Unknown what the % chance of inventing success is.
Sebastien LeReparteur Minmatar SpaceTravelers Freelance Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 20:49:00 - [103] Yeah! Just when we decide to try out 0.0, POS and all... Carrier Nerf!! Cause we don<t you to have fun. We need you to send insane amount of time in worthless skills so pilots get so tied up to a freaking hauler logistics ships! What a freaking deal!! We struggle to get a POS and a carrier together but NO!!! Now you need a freaking ship 4 or 5 times the value of the LOGISTIC capital to do logistics.
Kate Atlantis	Posted - 2007.11.05 20:58:00 - [104] Originally by: Occara What is up with the sense of entitlement that some people have from spending tiny amounts of money monthly on a service? You must be a CCP Employee. Only a CCP employee would think in this realm of customer service. Most people actually have to work to have money to play EVE-Online. Some of us, have to commute to work everday, sit in boring traffic, and then once we are at work, we have to put up with stupid people, sometimes employees sometimes customers. I'm not sure what country you are from if you are indeed not a CCP employee, but over here in the U.S. we have to treat customers like gold or we loose our jobs, unless one happens to work for the Government. So back to your "spending tiny amounts of money monthly on a service?" Obvsiouly it's not a service because we don't get refunds when it's down. It's a game, and as with most games out there you get friendly support, more times than not in less than 24 hours, and a fracking game manual. And to some people it may not be a tiny amount of money, as "tiny" is not an engineering term it has no set value associated with it. Also if you market the game to U.S. customers you will find that people in the U.S. want everything they can get for their money, and you have to deal with the whines and complaints too.
Viqer Fell Minmatar Trinity Nova KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.05 21:01:00 - [105] I spoke to Zulupark at the fanfest and he cleared up my misconceptions carriers can carry ships that have both ammo and boosters in their holds just not modules themselves. the ship maint bay is now 1m and the Bs size got reduced. All in all i am not too bothered about the changes now and a lot happier with the way things will move forwards. cheers zulu, hope you enjoyed the beer Click here to visit our site
Nobler Caldari Orion Ore International Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.11.05 21:03:00 - [106] Originally by: Viqer Fell I spoke to Zulupark at the fanfest and he cleared up my misconceptions carriers can carry ships that have both ammo and boosters in their holds just not modules themselves. the ship maint bay is now 1m and the Bs size got reduced. All in all i am not too bothered about the changes now and a lot happier with the way things will move forwards. cheers zulu, hope you enjoyed the beer So carriers can fit a battleship in the bay? That almost makes up for it.
Alski Gallente Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.05 21:05:00 - [107] Originally by: Viqer Fell I spoke to Zulupark at the fanfest and he cleared up my misconceptions carriers can carry ships that have both ammo and boosters in their holds just not modules themselves. the ship maint bay is now 1m and the Bs size got reduced. All in all i am not too bothered about the changes now and a lot happier with the way things will move forwards. cheers zulu, hope you enjoyed the beer That makes it seem like the change is kinda final. Mmmm... logistics hell comeing to a server near you soon! If you'll excuse me now i think i'll go blow up some of our own POS's - (combat) Patch belonging to CCP hits your drones, wrecking their liberty and freedom.
Nhi'Khuna e X i l e Atrum Tempestas Foedus	Posted - 2007.11.05 21:08:00 - [108] It's funny, I agree with the carrier pilots TBH, as one who isn't at the moment. Carriers do fill a role for smaller corporations to go out into 0.0 and make a name for themselves through being able to haul logistical equipment for pos setup, etc etc. Otherwise this is relegated to large corporations that will be able to afford the jump freighters (obscenely expensive imho). I just really don't see the issue in keeping them the way they are. They never posed an issue to me and I've run into my fair share of carriers. With the exception of the occasional low sec pirate using his carrier on gates (Coughs: Ginger...) it's really quite easy to get away from these things. Sure, they are big, they are nasty, but generally they can't get on your ass quickly enough to take you out if you are actually paying attention to the screen. Anyhow, carriers are a pretty big component of the game now, at least out in 0.0 and if you take something like this away I sure hope the devs think about replacing it with something more cost effective than the jump freighter... I mean really, how accessible are those going to be for the next year?
Tobias Creed Minmatar Draconian Toymaker Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 21:13:00 - [109] I have a solution, at least to the problem with carrying ammo. just have whatever is in the cargo bays of any ships in the carrier take up space in the carrier's cargo bay. I doubt you'd need more than 3,500 M^3 of ammo, and you could still launch fully loaded. This also keeps carriers from being used as haulers
Ja'kar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2007.11.05 21:13:00 - [110] Edited by: Ja''kar on 05/11/2007 21:13:49 Sorry I don't fly carriers but am glad they cannot carry cargo-also I hope Alliances get smaller as a result! I would also hope that these new freighters cannot jump through low sec!
Draygo Korvan Merch Industrial	Posted - 2007.11.05 21:21:00 - [111] Originally by: Aurinkokuningas Originally by: Nobler 4 accounts ending November 22nd... Likely more than 4 other players not cancelling because they can enter low sec without having to deal ****ers with solowtfpwnmachines. How will nerfing logistics of that carrier ganking people in lowsec make those 4 people keep playing the game. Hint: It's not Hint again: logistic capability has nothing to do with combat capability. Also the arguement that the logistic nerf of carriers will help smaller entities get a bite of 0.0 space is laughable at best. The arguements will not hold in reality. Instead it will probably make it much more difficult to carve a little spot of 0.0 for yourself. --
Sebastien LeReparteur Minmatar SpaceTravelers Freelance Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 21:22:00 - [112] Edited by: Sebastien LeReparteur on 05/11/2007 21:23:02 Originally by: Ja'kar Edited by: Ja''kar on 05/11/2007 21:13:49 Sorry I don't fly carriers but am glad they cannot carry cargo-also I hope Alliances get smaller as a result! I would also hope that these new freighters cannot jump through low sec! Maybe then we can call this game something else then Eve... I have no trouble with modification to the carriers, but the new planned modifications only makes existing Alliances stronger actually. More POS Cyno Net for the shorter Jump ranges.
Ja'kar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2007.11.05 21:28:00 - [113] Sebastien LeReparteur Hey could you explain your points a bit more I don't get what you mean Thanks
Yggdrassil STK Scientific Black-Out	Posted - 2007.11.05 21:35:00 - [114] Ok, actually gonna post something that I've never ever came close to posting before. This change will effectively take away the fun in the game for me. It will leave the boring stuff on a select few in my alliance, and force multiple freighter trips 40-50 jumps one way per week. I do not want to play a game where I got to use 5-6 hours "work" a couple of times each week where you half the time don't see a hostile, and the other half you got to log off freighters due to hostile sightings. Perhaps some think that those freighter ops are fun, I don't. Having POS'es up is basically a MUST, there is no choice, if you want to hold stations out in 0.0. I seriously hope these changes aren't coming in, cause missioning bores the **** out of me and isn't an option anymore - multiple freighter ops per week will do the same. When you don't have fun in a game anymore, you look elsewhere for something that IS fun... Yggdrassil
slip66 Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.11.05 21:36:00 - [115] Originally by: Rawthorm Originally by: ArmyOfMe this is one nerf that dont bother me much since we are getting new freighters as well. taking away a few roles from the carriers to make them better in other areas doesnt sound to bad imo Until a dreadnought force of yours needs ammo and stront taken with it on an offensive and you have to manualy pilot a dozen haulers down to the war zone :p Why cant you use the jump freighters? To replace them in this role? Originally by: StOrM ViPeR Theres a skill called surgical strike in game I've learned that it actually stands for Band of Brothers
Sebastien LeReparteur Minmatar SpaceTravelers Freelance Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 21:40:00 - [116] Edited by: Sebastien LeReparteur on 05/11/2007 21:46:21 Edited by: Sebastien LeReparteur on 05/11/2007 21:42:40 Edited by: Sebastien LeReparteur on 05/11/2007 21:41:59 Originally by: Ja'kar Sebastien LeReparteur Hey could you explain your points a bit more I don't get what you mean Thanks To curb the lost of space, they introduced a new capital ship called the Jump Freighter, mostly as useless in 0.0 as the original guy except it as a jump range but smaller then the Carrier 4 or 5 vs 6.5 (something similar). While big alliances can afford a Jump Freighter, whit the additional extra POS to make those Cyno tower network. Btw jump freighters are 4 or 5 times the price of a carrier with a ZERO survivability... Big alliances can afford a few if not dozens, the small guy will quit after loosing is. I short shaft those small alliance that now new to spend 4 times the initial investment or to those risky transport runs... Now mind you I am for a nerf of some kind, what about module that represent that ship array or the corp hangar? I would prefer to "FIT" a hauler carrier, a battle carrier, or a logistics carrier. Possible modules: fighter hangar Corporation hangar Cargo Hold refitting array The carrier is indeed an Swiss Army knife, the poor man's... MothaShip, Rorqual, titan and the new Jump Freighter are the real tools.
Empire marketslave	Posted - 2007.11.05 21:50:00 - [117] Originally by: slip66 Originally by: Rawthorm Originally by: ArmyOfMe this is one nerf that dont bother me much since we are getting new freighters as well. taking away a few roles from the carriers to make them better in other areas doesnt sound to bad imo Until a dreadnought force of yours needs ammo and stront taken with it on an offensive and you have to manualy pilot a dozen haulers down to the war zone :p Why cant you use the jump freighters? To replace them in this role? because they will probally cost 5 bil and takes close to 2 month extra trainning time
milinkoee Bastage Incorporated THORN Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.05 22:00:00 - [118] I like this change, as I don't feel carriers should be taking the place of haulers/freighters. I miss the days where bestowers might drop valuable cargo in low sec. YAAARRRRR!!!!!! Bastage, Inc. Worst Pirates Ever!!!
Nhi'Khuna e X i l e Atrum Tempestas Foedus	Posted - 2007.11.05 22:21:00 - [119] Quote: because they will probally cost 5 bil and takes close to 2 month extra trainning time Yup looks like a less for more situation kids... How awesome does that sound?
SiJira	Posted - 2007.11.05 22:31:00 - [120] Originally by: milinkoee I like this change, as I don't feel carriers should be taking the place of haulers/freighters. I miss the days where bestowers might drop valuable cargo in low sec. YAAARRRRR!!!!!! you need to come find me and ill show you YAAAARRR ____ __ ________ _sig below_ devs and gms cant modify my sig if they tried! _lies above_ CCP Morpheus was here Morpheus Fails. You need colors!! -Kaemonn [yellow]Kaem

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