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Khan Soriano Beyond Divinity Inc Terra Incognita.	Posted - 2007.10.30 10:16:00 - [1] All Black Ops have a different bonus now 'multiplies the cloaked velocity by 125% per level'. What are your thoughts on their purpose now? For me it looks like some desperate attempt to justify calling them Black Ops (and using cloaking as skill prerequisite) but without making them overpowered ie. letting them fit Covert Ops Cloak. I still think that they should be able to fit them (COCs that is) but they should be lot more fragile while having about CS firepower or half of recon ships EW capabilities. That way they would be able to actually support the fleet they just jumped to another system (90% of them will be recons, since nobody uses Cov Ops anyway). ----- Arbitrator - Life & Death
Varrakk Chosen Path	Posted - 2007.10.30 11:51:00 - [2] They pretty much shot themself in the foot with this ships class. Allow the Covert cloak and ships is over powered. Disallow the Covert cloak and the ship is a joke. The jump drive battleship is a nice idea, but I think they approached it wrong.
Scimon Tinker	Posted - 2007.10.30 11:57:00 - [3] im very eager to see what ships will be allowed jump harmonics 2 and above so far all they have mentioned is that the recons classes are to have jump harmonics 2 pre enabled. This new covert jump portal is what this ship class is suposed to be mainly about so Untill then im pretty much just waiting and watching
Feng Schui Minmatar The Ninja Coalition	Posted - 2007.10.30 11:57:00 - [4] Step 1) Reduce the number of high slots to 4 2 turret slots, or 2 launcher slots. Step 2) Re-do the bonuses No damage bonuses, COCD bonus, and HAC / CS level tanking bonuses. Role bonus for Cyno field generation. Step 3) Reduce Drone bays: 25-50m3 Drone Bays Step 4) Re-do the role bonuses on the force recon ships to supplement the capacitor use on their primary systems (or a falloff bonus, in case of the rapier). Fixed. Now we have Black Ops battleships, that can launch cyno's, and warp to covert-cyno's. They can tank initial DPS while the Fleet arrives. They do almost no damage, but can tank like a mutha-fo.
ElCoCo KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.30 12:03:00 - [5] Eh? wth? Panther going 2k/sec cloaked? Just allow covert ops cloak but don't have the bonus to sensor recalibration time and all is ok (imho).
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2007.10.30 12:06:00 - [6] That's, uhm, weird. So what, does that mean they get 0.255*1.25=> +56.25% speed while cloaked at L5 black ops and with improved cloak ? Sounds about right tbfh. _ 1\|2\|3
Gner Dechast Gallente Flashman Services	Posted - 2007.10.30 12:26:00 - [7] Originally by: Akita T That's, uhm, weird. So what, does that mean they get 0.2551.25=> +56.25% speed while cloaked at L5 black ops and with improved cloak ? Sounds about right tbfh. Just out of my hat quickly, would +125% make the multiplier there as 2.25 ? Or am I full of it?
ElCoCo KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.30 13:03:00 - [8] Originally by: Akita T That's, uhm, weird. So what, does that mean they get 0.255*1.25=> +56.25% speed while cloaked at L5 black ops and with improved cloak ? Sounds about right tbfh. Um...If I remember from the bombers it's not like that. (since at lvl5 cov.ops = 125% bonus, they go faster cloaked than not cloaked) Or am I talking crap?
Buyerr	Posted - 2007.10.30 13:15:00 - [9] well it is a T2 BS! it is supposed to be overpowered against anything else in 1V1. and there lame excuses of T2 bs's is jsut a wasted of programming time. seriously it is a ship that will cost over 1 bill (it will cost the same or more then a carrier for crying out loud!!). it will die if it runs into two T1 bs's or into a small gang of "whatever". it have no kind of T2 firepower and the only "OMPF" is more like a "plif" because of their lag to use COC, which is ridicules because it defeats their entire purpose (which is moving behind enemy lines to jump other ships in without the enemy noticing it). so this is a complete failure. or almost... not to talk about that utterly useless excuse of a BS'S siezed HAC, the marauder... sigh they really got the nerf bat and started by the director and let every one have a swing right down to the garbage man :S
Cailais Amarr VITOC Fang Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.30 13:32:00 - [10] Allow it to use a Cov Ops II cloak and warp while cloaked. Its a half billion isk ship, but with sub T2 attributes. Lethal, yes - overpowered: no. C. Piratise Low Sec! or Eve on Hard Mode (idea)
Elendar Slacker Industries Exuro Mortis	Posted - 2007.10.30 13:36:00 - [11] yeah much better to just give it a covert cloak. without its going to be a joke of a ship whatever is done. the skill reqs on the covert cyno are too high to make it commonaly useable ---------------------------- There is no sig
Claska Amarr Ministry of War	Posted - 2007.10.30 13:46:00 - [12] Edited by: Claska on 30/10/2007 13:46:18 Originally by: Buyerr well it is a T2 BS! it is supposed to be overpowered against anything else in 1V1. Thats not strickly true, T2 ships are actuly more tehcnoligly advicned then there T1 counter parts, but there designed to fill a niche, for example HACs are meant to be Hi DPS and decent speed and agility, Dictors are meant to be able to stop anything from warping out IE. a larger more powerfull inty.
Maestro Ulv Phaze-9	Posted - 2007.10.30 13:55:00 - [13] It should fit Covert yes. Right now its more Grey Ops than Black as its impossible to go anywhere without being seen unless your already there... I'm not bored, I'm merely in the Queue.
maarud Knight of Anubis	Posted - 2007.10.30 14:02:00 - [14] Originally by: ElCoCo Originally by: Akita T That's, uhm, weird. So what, does that mean they get 0.255*1.25=> +56.25% speed while cloaked at L5 black ops and with improved cloak ? Sounds about right tbfh. Um...If I remember from the bombers it's not like that. (since at lvl5 cov.ops = 125% bonus, they go faster cloaked than not cloaked) Or am I talking crap? Yep, it's 2.25, 1.25. Maarud. Proudly a Ex-BYDI member <t20> i'd rather have a python in my pants than a sleipnir
Transcendant One	Posted - 2007.10.30 14:14:00 - [15] Originally by: Cailais Allow it to use a Cov Ops II cloak and warp while cloaked. Its a half billion isk ship, but with sub T2 attributes. Lethal, yes - overpowered: no. C. QFT
mama guru Gallente Corp 1 Allstars Insurgency	Posted - 2007.10.30 14:21:00 - [16] Originally by: Transcendant One Originally by: Cailais Allow it to use a Cov Ops II cloak and warp while cloaked. Its a half billion isk ship, but with sub T2 attributes. Lethal, yes - overpowered: no. C. QFT Triumvirate will nano these goddamn ships. Nerf its base velocity if you want a cov ops cloak. *signature removed - please email us to find out why (include a link) - Jacques([email protected]) EVE is like the "Fisherman's Friend" of MMOs. If it's too hard, you are too weak.
Khan Soriano Beyond Divinity Inc Terra Incognita.	Posted - 2007.10.30 14:50:00 - [17] Originally by: mama guru Originally by: Transcendant One Originally by: Cailais Allow it to use a Cov Ops II cloak and warp while cloaked. Its a half billion isk ship, but with sub T2 attributes. Lethal, yes - overpowered: no. C. QFT Triumvirate will nano these goddamn ships. Nerf its base velocity if you want a cov ops cloak. So nerf its speed and/or mass and/or agility when not cloaked and retain this bonus that it has now (its rather interesting one) but for the love of Emperor, give them the ability to fit COCs ----- Arbitrator - Life & Death
Dragon Lord Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.10.30 14:52:00 - [18] If im not mistaken, a 125% speed bonus multiplier while cloaked per level gives a 1.25^5 = 305.2% speed boost while cloaked at lvl5. If itÆs a 125% speed bonus per level them that means at lvl5 you will get a 625% speed bonus, so either way these ships are going to be very quick when they cloak, but id still prefer being able to use a covert cloak. Now if u relate this to actual speed: - If itÆs a multiplier bonus it with go 305% which is 3.05 times its base speed with lvl5 skill while cloaked. So if the ship has a base speed on 120m/s then it will get to a speed of 360m/s when cloaked. This is what I think it will do . If however itÆs an additive bonus and the 625% speed bonus is applied I believe it will work the same as the mwd bonus ie base speed + 6.25* base speed, so 120 + (120*6.25) = 120+750 so 870m/s, which would be very quick indeed. But I donÆt think the bonus implies this.
Kurt Phoenix	Posted - 2007.10.30 16:13:00 - [19] its 125% bonus after taking into account the big reduction you get from putting a cloak on, so its final speed isn't anything to shout about.
ElCoCo KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.30 16:40:00 - [20] Originally by: maarud Originally by: ElCoCo Originally by: Akita T That's, uhm, weird. So what, does that mean they get 0.255*1.25=> +56.25% speed while cloaked at L5 black ops and with improved cloak ? Sounds about right tbfh. Um...If I remember from the bombers it's not like that. (since at lvl5 cov.ops = 125% bonus, they go faster cloaked than not cloaked) Or am I talking crap? Yep, it's 2.25, 1.25. Yeah I got confused because on TQ atm the bonus for bombers is: "25% bonus to cloaked velocity per level " And now in sisi it is: "and multiplies the cloaked velocity by 125% per level"
Khan Soriano Beyond Divinity Inc Terra Incognita.	Posted - 2007.10.30 17:33:00 - [21] Originally by: ElCoCo Originally by: maarud Originally by: ElCoCo Originally by: Akita T That's, uhm, weird. So what, does that mean they get 0.255*1.25=> +56.25% speed while cloaked at L5 black ops and with improved cloak ? Sounds about right tbfh. Um...If I remember from the bombers it's not like that. (since at lvl5 cov.ops = 125% bonus, they go faster cloaked than not cloaked) Or am I talking crap? Yep, it's 2.25, 1.25. Yeah I got confused because on TQ atm the bonus for bombers is: "25% bonus to cloaked velocity per level " And now in sisi it is: "and multiplies the cloaked velocity by 125% per level" Yeah, seems like CCP is preparing some Cloakers overhaul. Now Cov Ops also have 125% bonus. Hopefully its just a start and Black Ops will join with all other Cloaking Specialised Ships (using COCs) ----- Arbitrator - Life & Death
Xequecal	Posted - 2007.10.30 17:43:00 - [22] If you give it a covops cloak it can't kill anything. Battleship scan resolution + 6 sec targeting delay means even a T1 fully expanded hauler will escape you.
ElCoCo KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.30 17:50:00 - [23] Originally by: Xequecal If you give it a covops cloak it can't kill anything. Battleship scan resolution + 6 sec targeting delay means even a T1 fully expanded hauler will escape you. It's not all about gatecamping you know How do cloaky recon cruisers kill stuff then?
Bellum Eternus Gallente Blood Corsair's	Posted - 2007.10.30 18:12:00 - [24] Originally by: Xequecal If you give it a covops cloak it can't kill anything. Battleship scan resolution + 6 sec targeting delay means even a T1 fully expanded hauler will escape you. Cloaking 5 will trim 3 seconds off that. If we could fit COCs, we'd at least have a reason to train cloaking 5. Bellum Eternus [Vid] L E G E N D A R Y [Vid] L E G E N D A R Y I I

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