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Viilaa Caldari OH Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 14:57:00 - [1] Why is it everytime you go to low-sec you always run into 6-12 people who have nothing better to do than sit at a warp gate and pod you ? Now I wouldn't mind losing my ship in a 1:1 action but when its 10:1 you have no chance whatsoever. Why must they pod kill you as well ? Why do people think this is fun ? I know several friends of mine who are very close to leaving the game because of this fact. I understand that the whole game is PVP but 10:1 is ridiculus. Is the game full of little teenage boys (Like WOW is) who measure their fun by the size of their epeen ? and think that killing off newbs (I have played for a month and still consider myself a newb) in frigates and cruiser with their T2 ships is a challenge and fun ? I just think its funny they all sit in their T2 ships and make fun of people who won't come into low-sec space when everytime we do they pod kill us with 10 of their buddies. Oh well.. I just got tired of this over the weekend and decided to whine some... Feel free to flame me or whatever you feel you need to do to make yourselves feel tough. I won't be quiting the game, but doubt I will go into low-sec space anytime soon again. Its just not worth losing a 6Mil Cruiser to 10 players in T2 ships when I'm just trying to complete a mission paying 50k. Thanks for listening... Viilaa
Daphne Oboe	Posted - 2007.11.05 15:18:00 - [2] Yeah, you definitely do not belong in EVE. What you just whined about is the whole point of the game. Sure, it's no fun to get smeared by 10 guys ganging up on you, but it IS fun to come back with 15 of your own friends and return the favor. 'Tis the way the game works, it would do you well to either accept it or be on your way.
Viilaa Caldari OH Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 15:20:00 - [3] Originally by: Daphne Oboe Yeah, you definitely do not belong in EVE. What you just whined about is the whole point of the game. Sure, it's no fun to get smeared by 10 guys ganging up on you, but it IS fun to come back with 15 of your own friends and return the favor. 'Tis the way the game works, it would do you well to either accept it or be on your way. So those of us newbs who don't have 15 friends should just quit the game then ? Viilaa
Saint Luka The Illuminati. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.11.05 15:23:00 - [4] That is a pretty harsh reply from #2, especially in the Q&A forum. Simple fact of the matter is, this game is hard and cold. If Low sec was a place it'd be compton, if you venture in expect to get low-jacked. -
Viilaa Caldari OH Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 15:39:00 - [5] Originally by: Saint Luka That is a pretty harsh reply from #2, especially in the Q&A forum. Simple fact of the matter is, this game is hard and cold. If Low sec was a place it'd be compton, if you venture in expect to get low-jacked. I guess I don't mind getting jacked with a little more fair odds... but I also understand that fair is relative to the winning side. I guess my biggest complaint is the need to always pod-kill... I see very few reasons to podkill.. Just me whining about losing all my implants I guess... and nothing personal to anyone I disagree / argue with... I do enjoy a good arguement at times (win or lose). Viilaa
Ogodei Ra	Posted - 2007.11.05 15:42:00 - [6] It is frustrating, but its the same in any game with pvp. Its a little tougher in Eve though because the warp gates make excellent choke points. In other pvp games its a little easier to get around the camps. In every other pvp game ive played you will run into groups of people running around ganking smaller groups and solo players. People dont like to lose, and the best way to not lose, is to have more people than the other guy. I joined with about 15 friends. They all wanted to pvp, but they all tried to go solo. They all quit after getting spanked all the time. Its a real shame because they could have been a real force if they simply grouped up. So dont quit. You have several options. First thing is you should scout out where you are going. Once you see how many bad guys there are, see if you can gather a bigger/stronger group than them. If you cant, dont go there. If you can, work out a plan to beat them. Same as any other pvp game. If you are solo, just avoid the bad guys or stay out of low sec. You can also look for a bigger and more established corp to join.
Louis Psypher Gallente University of Caille	Posted - 2007.11.05 15:51:00 - [7] I've only been playing for a month, and believe me, when I took a courier contract in to 0.0 and got smoked as soon as I left the jump gate I was pretty ****ed. But I think that's just the nature of the beast, and I've since stayed in mid to high unless I'm feeling punchy. I'm solo, waiting for some friends to start playing, and I'm having a good enough time not going in to 0.0, so I'm not too worried about it. I'll give it another go once I've got a crew and a decent ship.
Viilaa Caldari OH Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 15:58:00 - [8] Originally by: Ogodei Ra So dont quit. You have several options. First thing is you should scout out where you are going. Once you see how many bad guys there are, see if you can gather a bigger/stronger group than them. If you cant, dont go there. If you can, work out a plan to beat them. Same as any other pvp game. How do you scout out the area ? If you mean a shuttle it doesn't solve the problem of being pod-killed. Viilaa
Pirate Tom	Posted - 2007.11.05 16:00:00 - [9] Aye aye, it's the nature of the beast alright. The number one piece of advise anyone can give you about low sec is update your clone and make sure your ship is insured. You will get killed sooner or later. It's not about it being a challenge or fun. (hell, look at mining, that's neither and lots of people do it) If you jump into a low-sec system, your ship and your clone are forfeit. If you happen to come back alive think of it as good luck, and if you happen to get ganked, think of it as normal.
Viilaa Caldari OH Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 16:01:00 - [10] Originally by: Pirate Tom Aye aye, it's the nature of the beast alright. The number one piece of advise anyone can give you about low sec is update your clone and make sure your ship is insured. You will get killed sooner or later. It's not about it being a challenge or fun. (hell, look at mining, that's neither and lots of people do it) If you jump into a low-sec system, your ship and your clone are forfeit. If you happen to come back alive think of it as good luck, and if you happen to get ganked, think of it as normal. That, my friend, is a great analogy.. thanks. Viilaa

Shanur Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2007.11.05 16:03:00 - [11] The mods must be sleeping. This belongs in General discussions along with all the other non constructive whines. And what is it with all the threads about small desperately poorly organized corps these days? If you don't have a well skilled military wing as a corp you are dogmeat waiting to happen!. It's just a matter of time. And since by posting in this forum with your corp ticker enabled you pretty much openly declared that your corp has almost no people skilled in the way PvP works in this game, i expect the first war dec from a bully corp to pop into your CEO's desk within a week or so. Thank you for trying to run a corp like you would a vanity Guild in WoW. Next time, join a corp that organizes its operations and educates its members properly.
Cygnus Zhada Amarr Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.05 16:08:00 - [12] They do it because they can. Will you shout at a pack of wolves when they attack a single deer? will you yell at them for blobbing? It's very simple; there's strength in numbers and EVE advocates teamwork, accept that (actually embrace it, there's already way too many solo-geared MMO'S out there). The real question ofcourse would be; wth are you doing in low sec? Welcome to EVE Online: Press 1 for Caldari, PVE Online Press 2 for Minmatar, PVP Online Press 3 for Gallente, PWN Online Press 4 for Amarr, Lulz Online
Ard UnjiiGo The Bastards	Posted - 2007.11.05 16:11:00 - [13] Originally by: Shanur The mods must be sleeping. This belongs in General discussions along with all the other non constructive whines. And what is it with all the threads about small desperately poorly organized corps these days? If you don't have a well skilled military wing as a corp you are dogmeat waiting to happen!. It's just a matter of time. And since by posting in this forum with your corp ticker enabled you pretty much openly declared that your corp has almost no people skilled in the way PvP works in this game, i expect the first war dec from a bully corp to pop into your CEO's desk within a week or so. Thank you for trying to run a corp like you would a vanity Guild in WoW. Next time, join a corp that organizes its operations and educates its members properly. Are you posting with your main? If not stfu. Of course this belongs here. Yes, the guy is new. Yes he had a whine. It's easy to see from the replies he's mostly receiving and his responses that he's looking for help and open to ways to see this event more constructivley and learn how EVE is different then other MMOs. But then you come in here to the rookie forum and post on a likely alt some arrogant high-handed crap. Yeah...you win EVE . "the Yarr is strong with this one" -Azirapheal
Pirate Tom	Posted - 2007.11.05 16:13:00 - [14] Q.) wth are you doing in low-sec? A.) I heard about ph4t l3w+Z and ignored the obvious risk that the game and the forums constantly remind you of. I was drawn by the lure of easy isk. I thought to myself. "It's low-sec, everyone says its dangerous, so there'll be nobody there when I go." I don't get it. If low sec is so dangerous why are all those people there camping gates and stuff?
Shanur Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2007.11.05 16:18:00 - [15] Edited by: Shanur on 05/11/2007 16:21:16 EDIT: Yes this is my main. I rather remain a bit longer in the newbie corp than make the mistake of joining a corp that turns out to be a gross mismatch and permanently ruining my chances of joining a nullsec corp due to a dubious corp history. And since i currently have too little time to commit to a worthwhile corp and have some goals to achieve that would clash with my intended role in a corp, i am not looking just yet. If he had asked for help he would not have posted in that tone. He would have simply asked how he could avoid 10 man gatecamps. He is also venting his anger at gatecamping pirates. While i disagree with gatecamping as a source of income (ratting is more profitable and less boring), it is a valid way to play the game given the challenge of tracking down prey outside of gates. Who he should be mad at would be his corp, who clearly didn't teach him the basics of negotiating low sec. Any corp that recruits newbies has in my opinion the responsibility to train them in playing the game effectively and supporting them on their first steps. If they fail at that and get the newbie killed by pirates, it is their fault, not the pirates'. And yes, i am getting a bit fed up at the abundance of corps that think they won't be war decced just because they are small and still learning the game. Such people are better off joining an established corp or EVE Uni rather than follow a CEO who chooses to ignore the advice to not start a corp until you know how to defend against PvP.
Viilaa Caldari OH Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 16:21:00 - [16] Actually... Q) What are you doing in low-sec ? A) I had a mission sending me there... It was only .4 sec so I thought I would be relatively safe -- looks like I guessed wrong. I also went to 0.0 space and got ganked there but I went in a cheap frigate expecting it - just wanted to see 0.0 space. And all I saw was a warp disruption probe and 2 T2 ships blasting me to shreds... That I didn't mind... until they pod-killed me.. but oh well that was 0.0 space and to be expected. So is that the lay of the land ? Shoot first... shoot second ? Don't bother with ransom ? Don't allow pods to escape ? I am really just trying to understand the nature of the game - or at least the majority of the players - so I don't get too upset down the road and can settle in and have fun. Viilaa
Shanur Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2007.11.05 16:29:00 - [17] Yes. That is the lay of the land. The difference between 0.4 and 0.1 is just the value ofthe asteroids and the difference of the belt rats. The real difference is that 0.4 is low sec and 0.5 is high sec. Everyone that wants to shoot stuff up, doesn't like warp bubbles and capital blobs, or CONCORD interfering with their pew-pew will be in low sec. The only thing they think about when they see that the system borders a high sec system with a good mission agent is: Oh good! Lots of fat juicy mission ships being sent here by the agent there! So if anything, a border system is less safe than going deep into low sec (which is generally deserted). Missioning in low sec is a serious risk. One that is best done in an easy to replace T1 ship, or done with lots and lots of buddies covering your back (you can share credit for the turn in, letting them have a chunk of the LP the mission gave). You are a prime target for pirates that know many mission ships are fitted with expensive modules. As for ransom, at gates this is not always done due to the risk of reinforcements coming in during negotiations. Better they go for the quick kill and bag the modules. Ransoming will be more common by pirates that probe down mission pockets.
Viilaa Caldari OH Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 16:33:00 - [18] Originally by: Shanur Yes. That is the lay of the land. The difference between 0.4 and 0.1 is just the value ofthe asteroids and the difference of the belt rats. The real difference is that 0.4 is low sec and 0.5 is high sec. Everyone that wants to shoot stuff up, doesn't like warp bubbles and capital blobs, or CONCORD interfering with their pew-pew will be in low sec. The only thing they think about when they see that the system borders a high sec system with a good mission agent is: Oh good! Lots of fat juicy mission ships being sent here by the agent there! So if anything, a border system is less safe than going deep into low sec (which is generally deserted). Missioning in low sec is a serious risk. One that is best done in an easy to replace T1 ship, or done with lots and lots of buddies covering your back (you can share credit for the turn in, letting them have a chunk of the LP the mission gave). You are a prime target for pirates that know many mission ships are fitted with expensive modules. As for ransom, at gates this is not always done due to the risk of reinforcements coming in during negotiations. Better they go for the quick kill and bag the modules. Ransoming will be more common by pirates that probe down mission pockets. Ahh thanks... See end of whining... Just needed some information thats all... btw, why does everyone pod-kill ? To me that is personal attack to be repaid in kind, where ganking a ship is well.. only a ship that can be easily replaced. Viilaa
Ard UnjiiGo The Bastards	Posted - 2007.11.05 16:33:00 - [19] Edited by: Ard UnjiiGo on 05/11/2007 16:35:26 Originally by: Shanur EDIT: Yes this is my main. I rather remain a bit longer in the newbie corp than make the mistake of joining a corp that turns out to be a gross mismatch and permanently ruining my chances of joining a nullsec corp due to a dubious corp history. And since i currently have too little time to commit to a worthwhile corp and have some goals to achieve that would clash with my intended role in a corp, i am not looking just yet. So you're dressing down a guy for his corp when you've never been in one yourself? The OP posts something you describe as a non contructive whine then you proceed to make an unconstructive whine about newbs starting corps when you haven't been in one at all? The OP has been playing for a month and makes an unconstructive whine post (but hangs in to hear folks out and even owns in the thread title that he's whining). You've been playing over a year, never been in a corp, act arrogant and respond to the OPs initial whine with one of your own. The OP is a month old - what's your excuse? Edit - Thanks for being more constructive to the OP. This is the rookie forum and that's what belongs here from vets - not smack downs. "the Yarr is strong with this one" -Azirapheal
Ard UnjiiGo The Bastards	Posted - 2007.11.05 16:46:00 - [20] Originally by: Viilaa btw, why does everyone pod-kill ? To me that is personal attack to be repaid in kind, where ganking a ship is well.. only a ship that can be easily replaced. Viilaa Depends on who you talk to. Some folks do it because it's more personal and more costly to the victim (loss of implants) so it happens a lot during war decs or between corps that don't like each other at all. Some folks do it because they want to reach -10 sec status and be outlaws. Some folks do it just because they like the sound it makes. I do it when people refuse to pay ransoms. Actions have consequences . "the Yarr is strong with this one" -Azirapheal

Cygnus Zhada Amarr Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.05 16:59:00 - [21] There's no reason to have an emotional attachment to your pod. Destroying the pod is just a part of the whole killing thing, no more no less. Welcome to EVE Online: Press 1 for Caldari, PVE Online Press 2 for Minmatar, PVP Online Press 3 for Gallente, PWN Online Press 4 for Amarr, Lulz Online
Obidom Jax	Posted - 2007.11.05 17:33:00 - [22] One thing to remember who ever it was that killed you, you now have kill rights to smack them back I owe 2 gankers who attacked me in a megathron and Drake a delicious smackdown I now have them on buddy list so i can see when they come online just need to find a way of tracking them down then me and my backup are going to unleash a smackdown, me in my BC my friends in BS with shield transfers to keep my shields up All i got to do is use my warp inhibitor to jam them and blast the living crap out of them i am kind and value my Sec rating so i wont pod them But i will certainly have their loot for my corp PS if anyone can tell me how i can track someone across the cosmos to deliver the smackdown please let me know :)
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2007.11.05 17:55:00 - [23] Originally by: Viilaa Originally by: Daphne Oboe Yeah, you definitely do not belong in EVE. What you just whined about is the whole point of the game. Sure, it's no fun to get smeared by 10 guys ganging up on you, but it IS fun to come back with 15 of your own friends and return the favor. 'Tis the way the game works, it would do you well to either accept it or be on your way. So those of us newbs who don't have 15 friends should just quit the game then ? Viilaa Leave the troll to his bridge . It seem that for some player group ganking is all they want to do and find fun. And then they come to the forum and whine about the lack of targets. You have several problem that are born by your kind of play too. You are doing mission for a agent that give you mission in low sec, almost certainly it is a good quality agent and he send mission runner consistently to the same low sec systems, all accessible (if you follow the autopilot route) from the same low sec system that work as a entry point. So the ganker know that if they camp that system they get fairly often some mission runner that enter the system through a specific gate. So they can camp that gate and get a sufficient number of targets to make it worth for them. Some of them will have fancy stuff and that is a added bonus. So what you should do: 1) don't accept missions in low sec system bordering high sec, there is a good chance they are camped if they are a spot where mission runners often go. 2) if you want to accept a mission in low sec, look if there is an alternate rout to that proposed by the autopilot, look the starmap to see pod kills and ship kills in the last hour in the target system, and along your route. 3) if you are interested in running mission in low sec, look for areas of low activity with agents you want to use and move your centre of activity there. The more dangerous area isn't in deep low sec, but the border systems between high sec and low sec. (the same for 0.0, if you get in you can roam decently safe, but the entry system are very dangerous.) 4) find if the low sec system you are interested in has some kind of "defence force". some player group will organize vigilante activity against pirates, if you can get in the good graces of such group you can have a chance to strike back to pirates and some fairly safe system to operate in.
Viilaa Caldari OH Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 18:19:00 - [24] Originally by: Obidom Jax PS if anyone can tell me how i can track someone across the cosmos to deliver the smackdown please let me know :) Some agents can Find people for you if you will pay the ISK. I believe they will tell you the system they are currently in so it gives you a starting place Viilaa
Viilaa Caldari OH Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 18:20:00 - [25] Originally by: Venkul Mul Leave the troll to his bridge . It seem that for some player group ganking is all they want to do and find fun. And then they come to the forum and whine about the lack of targets. You have several problem that are born by your kind of play too. You are doing mission for a agent that give you mission in low sec, almost certainly it is a good quality agent and he send mission runner consistently to the same low sec systems, all accessible (if you follow the autopilot route) from the same low sec system that work as a entry point. So the ganker know that if they camp that system they get fairly often some mission runner that enter the system through a specific gate. So they can camp that gate and get a sufficient number of targets to make it worth for them. Some of them will have fancy stuff and that is a added bonus. So what you should do: 1) don't accept missions in low sec system bordering high sec, there is a good chance they are camped if they are a spot where mission runners often go. 2) if you want to accept a mission in low sec, look if there is an alternate rout to that proposed by the autopilot, look the starmap to see pod kills and ship kills in the last hour in the target system, and along your route. 3) if you are interested in running mission in low sec, look for areas of low activity with agents you want to use and move your centre of activity there. The more dangerous area isn't in deep low sec, but the border systems between high sec and low sec. (the same for 0.0, if you get in you can roam decently safe, but the entry system are very dangerous.) 4) find if the low sec system you are interested in has some kind of "defence force". some player group will organize vigilante activity against pirates, if you can get in the good graces of such group you can have a chance to strike back to pirates and some fairly safe system to operate in. Thanks for the suggestions.. I will try to keep them in mind. A lot of time I have 15 other things going through my mind that I forget some details.. Oh well.. play and learn right ? BTW, how much do Mercs cost for a simple gate clearing ? Viilaa
digital0verdose Caldari	Posted - 2007.11.05 19:07:00 - [26] Originally by: Cygnus Zhada They do it because they can. Will you shout at a pack of wolves when they attack a single deer? will you yell at them for blobbing? It's very simple; there's strength in numbers and EVE advocates teamwork, accept that (actually embrace it, there's already way too many solo-geared MMO'S out there). The real question ofcourse would be; wth are you doing in low sec? So Wolves attack Deer for joy and profit? Wow, someone call National Geographic and tell them that that survival theory is bogus. --------------------------------------
Vladimir Ilych Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2007.11.05 19:53:00 - [27] My 2 cents. Remember to use the map to check for camps by using ships / pods destroyed in the last hour.
Angel DeMorphis	Posted - 2007.11.05 19:57:00 - [28] Originally by: digital0verdose Originally by: Cygnus Zhada They do it because they can. Will you shout at a pack of wolves when they attack a single deer? will you yell at them for blobbing? It's very simple; there's strength in numbers and EVE advocates teamwork, accept that (actually embrace it, there's already way too many solo-geared MMO'S out there). The real question ofcourse would be; wth are you doing in low sec? So Wolves attack Deer for joy and profit? Wow, someone call National Geographic and tell them that that survival theory is bogus. Profit = Food, so yes, they attack deer for profit.
Modrak Vseth Veto. Academy Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.11.05 19:58:00 - [29] Edited by: Modrak Vseth on 05/11/2007 19:59:23 Originally by: Viilaa Ahh thanks... See end of whining... Just needed some information thats all... btw, why does everyone pod-kill ? To me that is personal attack to be repaid in kind, where ganking a ship is well.. only a ship that can be easily replaced. Viilaa Ard played it out pretty well. People do it for different reasons. If I get your pod I will USUALLY offer you a ransom. If I think backup is enroute or that someone else is going to ruin our fun I may just pop the pod or say "forget it" and scoop the loot and leave, depends on my mood. If I DO offer you a ransom and you refuse to pay, you get to wake up in a cloning vat. The idea is maybe next time you'll actually accept the ransom, or at least give a counter offer. Most pirates doing it for profit will be willing to haggle a bit for ransoms if the situation isn't too dangerous. Immediately blocking me (it's happened) will result in you instantly losing your pod though.
Captain Schmungles Caldari Freelancing Corp Confederation of Independent Corporations	Posted - 2007.11.05 20:51:00 - [30] A few things for you to bear in mind: 1. It's only a game. 2. You can use other map filters. "Number of ships destroyed in last hour" would be helpful for you. There's nothing that says that you can't wait to enter lowsec so that you don't die all the time. 3. Learn from your mistakes. Did you use map filters to see if the route was sort of clear? No. Did you go in something resembling a traveling fit? No. Finally, you should remember the definition of insanity: performing the same action under the same circumstances and expecting a different result each time. Try a different system (they aren't all camped), go with friends, maybe decide that you aren't skilled enough to roam in lowsec yet and hang out in highsec for a bit more. If you aren't learning from your defeats, then it really won't matter if it's a fair fight on paper. People who don't learn from their defeats will continue to lose because they will continue to make the same mistakes. And yes, it is your fault for getting blown away by a gate camp on the same gate every time. Welcome to eve



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