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Davich MacGregor
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Posted - 2004.03.08 16:50:00 -
[31]
Do NOT remove highways. It will kill trade and return us to the days of tedious boring travel timesinks. A great way to turn people away from the game.
Stellar Products and Quality Resources
ticker: SPQR
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Pitt
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Posted - 2004.03.08 17:13:00 -
[32]
Yes, lets get rid of the highway's. When it first came out I thought it was an ok idea, but it has now outlived it's purpose. And I also like the idea of .0 space inbetween the empires. If they're going to increase the sentry gun range then there needs to be a trade off. Also great for RP since ppl that start in a races empire would stay there longer instead of raoming all over. Traders make big isk tradeing between empires and pirates will have a purpose.
Lack of preparation on your part does not constitute greifing on mine |
nether void
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Posted - 2004.03.08 17:35:00 -
[33]
I am a casual gamer and I say remove the gates. Realizm is so under-rated. It separates real games from "Oh I'm so impatient, I want everything now" games. People won't quit. It will give meaning to making journeys. Do something out of the ordinary. What we don't want is EVE to become repetition.
I don't see how removing them could ever be bad.
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nether void - since '97 |
Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.03.08 17:39:00 -
[34]
 Quote:
No way will they remove highways...
As said before it would kill the casual gamer but it would also have a knock on effect to the market mineral prices...
Erm - did you ever play when there weren't any highways at all?
The market was infinitely better with actually regional fluctuations, more money to be made, more diverse and worthwhile trading...
All those things would seem to help the casual gamer... indeed I know casual gamers who left specifically because the highways killed their localised ability to trade items/loot.
As such, given the history, I wonder on what you base your predictions?
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Thomdril Merrilin
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Posted - 2004.03.08 17:39:00 -
[35]
Quote:
Yes! Put back in hours of travel. Also throw in some 0.0 betwen so the pirates can have even more place to gank people. That'll make eve so much more fun... for the pirates.
yes lets lose players while we do it by charging them 1000 isk per jump in empire space!!
woohoo great idea if CCP want to hav the worlds smallest community on a MMORPG.
Empire space is fine... as it is 60-80 jumps to get from yulai to the edge of the galaxy.
as long there is no high end ores in empire i'm fine with the current system.
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Tribunal
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Posted - 2004.03.08 18:04:00 -
[36]
Quote:
When I do play, i don't want to have to sit for hours on end watching my ship travel through space.
amen
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Soareen
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Posted - 2004.03.08 18:28:00 -
[37]
i think that the basis problem is that time is the only limiting factor for travel .
Or time for us means time playing , and travel time means stupidly lost playing time .
At my own advice , CCP must think signifanctly about Jump Drives and fuel - not only in future , and not only for titans .
i invite you to go to the idea lab and check to find back some post related to this . and to speak about it in ur wishes for the next patches .
This jump gates are a very boring and irealistic way to simulate space travel .
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Traiben Mightius
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Posted - 2004.03.08 18:30:00 -
[38]
Quick n00b question... is the highway system just the spokes out from Yulai or is there more to it than that?
If it is just the spokes, I think charging a toll as you pass through a Yulai gate would be an excellent idea. Toll roads would make sense in the sense of Concord trying to raise funds. The autopilot should have an option to take the toll roads or not. Even eliminating them or just limiting them does not seem like that bad an idea... traveling to another region should be somewhat time consuming. The argument that it's going to eliminate n00bs is just a bit silly. Anyone who is going to drop this game because of the amount of time travel takes is going to drop this game eventually anyways. This is not a game for the impatient. 
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Aldelphius
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Posted - 2004.03.08 19:51:00 -
[39]
Wel, if the war ever happens, i would expect the gates to be shut down to waring neighbors. dont forget ccp can change sec status with a few keystrokes. i would imagine that waring nations would have lowerd sec between them, and that faction standing will matter then too.
Remember, its all coming SoonTM
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Lansfear
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Posted - 2004.03.08 22:22:00 -
[40]
Quote:
Do NOT remove highways. It will kill trade and return us to the days of tedious boring travel timesinks. A great way to turn people away from the game.
I have to disagree with this staement. Removing the highways will bring back the traders profession.
As of now there is no such thing as a trader when you only need travel 4 jumps to flood one deprived region of goods from an over abundent region. And for people who want to be real traders they'd love to have greater travel times for greatly improved profit.
And Morkt is right,
1. Back before the highways teir 3 frigates were close to 400k each. Thats an extremely nice profit for the casual ship builder.
2. Trading noxc across regions and making 40-60 isk profit off each unit can greatly benifit the casual trader that only needs to make one trip a day and be set.
3. An NPC hunter can find faction specific loot and sell it to a trader that can then transport it and sell if for even more money in a region that would not normaly drop such loot.
This would benifit the casual player vastly more so than the powergamer.
The idea of lowsec space lightly policed, for instance, no sentry guns and slow concord response, would provide areas of danger and profit and more importantly fun for people like Sara and Drunkenmasters kin, and people like me, who love to dodge them on a dayly basis.
Quote:
Please discuss
I ask this because we need to find a middle ground to bring back the lost professions that we have today in an acceptible way for the majority of the EVE population.
So, please discuss for and against.
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Tribunal
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Posted - 2004.03.08 22:39:00 -
[41]
Your number one point negates the number two point. Sure, people would be making more money, but everything would cost more. How would this help the casual player again? It wouldn't.
Quote:
The idea of lowsec space lightly policed, for instance, no sentry guns and slow concord response, would provide areas of danger and profit and more importantly fun for people like Sara and Drunkenmasters kin, and people like me, who love to dodge them on a dayly basis.
There are lots of areas you can go to get your "thrill". I see no reason why more needed to be added.
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Greyson Rogers
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Posted - 2004.03.08 23:05:00 -
[42]
I thought this topic was long dead and beaten to death..traders hate the highways, everyone else loves the highways. I remember when there was no highways....back in beta and before and yes people were stuck in basically 1 region. It took too much time to get anywhere. If you were on the border of the region it wasn't too bad as you could jump the regions to see the price. But if you were in the middle you had no idea what the price was. I still have to travel 54 jumps to go from empire space to my haunts out in the outer areas...
Removing the highway system would kill the casual player...would also kill the long term player because we really don't want to spend hours on end going from 1 end of the universe to the other.
The market system you so defend was broken even when there were no highways. There still was not enough fluctuation in most goods...and your profit on ship costs was npcs buying your ships. There still would have been a tendency for the prices to fall.
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Gan Howorth
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Posted - 2004.03.08 23:32:00 -
[43]
Remove highways..make it so you can view other regions prices.
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2004.03.09 00:22:00 -
[44]
Whoever said the casual gamer should be all over the map?
Plan ahead and migrate gradually.
Convert Stations
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Ris Dnalor
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Posted - 2004.03.09 00:27:00 -
[45]
BURN THE HIGHWAYS!!!.... Or just make the damn highway gates so that we can destroy them ourselves. :P
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Jump Drive Operation / Rank 5 / SP: 1280000 of 1280000
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Lansfear
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Posted - 2004.03.09 00:39:00 -
[46]
Quote:
Your number one point negates the number two point. Sure, people would be making more money, but everything would cost more. How would this help the casual player again? It wouldn't.
Please go into detail on why you think this and any ideas on how it can be resolved.
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Drutort
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Posted - 2004.03.09 01:00:00 -
[47]
its quit simple, you cant just remove the highways and keep the current travel time, that is just crazy, the only way is to create smaller highways and like others said that would take a few jumps at max 10 for safe ways, and a min of like 3 with low sec. i dont know how low sec they should be, it could be 0.5 its like 50% or so because neither empire can guarantee you full safety but if you are say one one side of the gate that you are friends you should be safe LOL IMO...
not sure if .4 or lower is a good idea though or we will see the same days again, i do say that there could be low sec few jumps they are low sec because they are close by and its like no mans land.
But as said allies should have high sec between the boarders, even close jumps but they should be above 0.5 thatÆs for sure.
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DREAMWORKS
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Posted - 2004.03.09 01:03:00 -
[48]
I dont agree and you can read my answer in one of the many topic's related to this subject.
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Fuujin
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Posted - 2004.03.09 02:29:00 -
[49]
Maybe not removing them completly (the travelling times would be killer....even though i prefered it this way back in the day) but atleast remove parts of it, it's way to easy to get anywhere nowadays.
or just introduce a hefty service fee for using the gates for major highways, a toll if you will :)
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The sword has to be more than a simple weapon; it has to be an answer to life's questions
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Jim Raynor
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Posted - 2004.03.09 02:35:00 -
[50]
EVE felt like a really big game before the highway system, not it feels very small.
I think we all want the convience of short travel times, but we all know the highway system is unrealistic and just caters to peoples laziness.
I'm guilty, I'd miss the highway if they removed it. I think it would be better for the game if the different empires were spread out a bit with low security regions inbetween them and travelling between the empires wasn't so instantaneous..
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ROBBLE ROBBLE |
Lansfear
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Posted - 2004.03.09 02:41:00 -
[51]
Quote:
its quit simple, you cant just remove the highways and keep the current travel time, that is just crazy, the only way is to create smaller highways and like others said that would take a few jumps at max 10 for safe ways, and a min of like 3 with low sec. i dont know how low sec they should be, it could be 0.5 its like 50% or so because neither empire can guarantee you full safety but if you are say one one side of the gate that you are friends you should be safe LOL IMO...
not sure if .4 or lower is a good idea though or we will see the same days again, i do say that there could be low sec few jumps they are low sec because they are close by and its like no mans land.
But as said allies should have high sec between the boarders, even close jumps but they should be above 0.5 thatÆs for sure.
I think this hits the solution best.
Create freeways that link regional boarders instead of Regional capitals. This satisfies near every persons point of view. Still keeps travel times short but not instant and will create a distinction between Empires.
Anyway we can get a question like this into a CSM?
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Hafthor
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Posted - 2004.03.09 03:07:00 -
[52]
Also there should be no flights directly from London to Washington. You should have to land in ReykjavÝk and spend a minimum of 100.000.isk while there.
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Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.03.09 03:16:00 -
[53]
Quote:
Quote:
its quit simple, you cant just remove the highways and keep the current travel time, that is just crazy, the only way is to create smaller highways and like others said that would take a few jumps at max 10 for safe ways, and a min of like 3 with low sec. i dont know how low sec they should be, it could be 0.5 its like 50% or so because neither empire can guarantee you full safety but if you are say one one side of the gate that you are friends you should be safe LOL IMO...
not sure if .4 or lower is a good idea though or we will see the same days again, i do say that there could be low sec few jumps they are low sec because they are close by and its like no mans land.
But as said allies should have high sec between the boarders, even close jumps but they should be above 0.5 thatÆs for sure.
I think this hits the solution best.
Create freeways that link regional boarders instead of Regional capitals. This satisfies near every persons point of view. Still keeps travel times short but not instant and will create a distinction between Empires.
Anyway we can get a question like this into a CSM?
If you can clear it up into a proper question - yes, I will raise/ask it. (But you'll need to phrase it properly, preamble, proposition, question etc - dont let em get away with a one word answer)
As i've stated on many occaisions though, I have always suspected that on the event of a pan=-empire war the higway conections between rival empires will be closed, leaving the internal empire highways to run.
If you think about it the reasons whould be obvious... especially if you consider why some regions are called "border worlds" and why abutting low-sec systems are where they are.
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Lansfear
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Posted - 2004.03.09 03:35:00 -
[54]
Quote:
Also there should be no flights directly from London to Washington. You should have to land in ReykjavÝk and spend a minimum of 100.000.isk while there.
This alone helps to prove the highways shouldn't exist the way they are.
You need to buy a plane ticket and get a passport.
Morkt I'll try to get a good question for you about this but I might need a little bit of help forming it(yeah ok alot of help)
Anyones welcome to help formulate a question to the devs on how the current highway system can be modified.
Whens my deadline?
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cashman
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Posted - 2004.03.09 04:08:00 -
[55]
Edited by: cashman on 09/03/2004 04:12:06
Quote:
Whoever said the casual gamer should be all over the map?
Whoever said the casual gamer shouldn't be all over the map? FYI: They are far from it. There are hundres of systems that has absolutely no visitors.
Stop being carebears! 
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Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.03.09 04:29:00 -
[56]
Quote:
Whens my deadline?
Next Monday - this week's lot have been sent off already.
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Fuujin
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Posted - 2004.03.09 04:58:00 -
[57]
Create a "passport" that you can earn for diffrent regions by doing a special missions for particular agents/corporations that give you access to particular highways :D
Kind of like getting access to the airship/chocobos in FFXI. It's a reward not a right :D
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The sword has to be more than a simple weapon; it has to be an answer to life's questions
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Achec
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Posted - 2004.03.09 05:36:00 -
[58]
!!!CASUAL PLAYERS!!!
causal players dont have time to devote to 40-50 jumps between places, that is just not a viable option for those who can't devote 4hs to travel time for every 30mins of play.
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Archemedes
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Posted - 2004.03.09 05:40:00 -
[59]
Reasons why closing the highways is not a good idea:
1) Prices are widely known throughout the galaxy. Everyone knows how much things cost, so even if the highways diasppeared people won't pay 8 million ISK for a Thorax in Amarr space, because the price is already well established and known. You don't have to actually read a price on the market when you can ask around, look on the web, or so forth...
2) Tech 2 BP distribution is still very rare. Buying a tech 2 item often means lots of travel as it is, it would be far worse without highways. Remember, there is NOT enough supply to support traders reselling tech 2 goods to other regions... so no highways means long trips, NOT the use of paid haulers.
3) The Empires are at peace and they trade a LOT. Of COURSE they would facilitate that trade by building highway gates. I (a Gallente) can go buy an Apocalypse battleship and fly it around... but I shouldn't be able to jump from Luminaire to Amarr?
4) 0.0 space is where the long travel and high profits are. Empire space is civilized and peaceful... so travel is quick and easy. Regional markets are irrelevant to a global economy, and that's what Empire space is. Nobody is going to get rich buying Nox for 220 in one region and reselling it for 280 in another... even if you COULD find that kind of profit on a regular basis (which is doubtful). You'd make FAR more money cutting a deal with a 0.0 corp and hauling low-end minerals out to THEM (since they mine high-end ores).
5) People already gripe that there's too much risk-free profit. Suppose removing the highway gates DID create regional price differences large enough to make trading worth it (which I seriously doubt, since hauling and reselling player made goods wasn't all that profitable BEFORE the highways existed)... travel from one empire to another by normal gates is STILL 100% SAFE!!! That means adding more no-risk, AFK-friendly ways to make money.
People who hate highways forget that we already HAVE regional markets: the 0.0 alliances. People out in 0.0 space would pay extra to get items without a long trip (they often have more ISK than they can conveniently spend anyway). So instead of petitioning CCP to remove the highway gates and inconvenience 95% of the players to make 5% happy, petition alliances to allow Empire-based traders to supply them. The alliances get to buy stuff without going back to the Empire, so they are happy. The traders get to make a profit, making THEM happy. The pirates finally get more haulers in 0.0 space, so THEY are happy. And bounty hunters can cruise trade routes looking for pirates, making THEM happy. Isn't that a better solution than making travel MORE boring in Empire space than it is now?
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Hematic
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Posted - 2004.03.09 07:49:00 -
[60]
I think they have compensated for the highways by slowing ships to a crawl as it is.
I don't think CCP will remove the highways because they are trying to push players to 0.0. By slowly homoginizing empire space and adding features to 0.0 this plan seems clear.
Soon enough mineral supplies will dry up in empire regions and people will truly be forced into 0.0. CCP is probably drooling over themselves that they have finally gotten most 0.0 regions with some sort of alliance control.
The next step is to literally force players into one of these alliances so that the entire pirate vs. carebear will die down and it will be alliance a vs alliance b etc...
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