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Zell Shadowcast The Greater Goon GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.19 21:14:00 - [1] Edited by: Zell Shadowcast on 19/12/2007 21:14:16 Is the conflict we experience now truly just a fight on a game, or is it more? Can the same be said for any conflict in history, that it goes beyond the individual desires and wants of the many, and boils down to simply one thing. Goon versus BoB. For who is to say what side is Goon, or what side is BoB? The victor? That would be such a bias estimate of the situation, and overall errored. What about the neutral? Can one truly be neutral? Does bias not exist even among those who claim to have no part in the matter? Take a look back at the beginning of the conflict, and who started it. For the aggressor is surely the BoB side right? But what if the aggressor saw BoB in its opponent? The conflict rages on, as do questions of who is truly BoB and who is truly Goon. I know I am on the side that has been branded both saviors and destroyers, Goon and BoB, awesome and BoB. But who can truly judge what side is right and what side is wrong in these matters? Does exploiting the game make one side BoB or does it make them Goon for their ability to use the game to their advantage, where their enemies have not. Fellow EvE players i open now to you the topic of discussion that effects basic human response, and yet has great impact in the virtual world we all inhabit and pay for. Goon versus BoB. Frankly my friend, nay my colleague in this conflict, dramaticus has mentioned the very noble and astute Zebra party in this conflict. While it is worthy of mention, the majestic Zebra is not the focus or the aim of my topic here today. And while the Zebra is as valiant an ally as any, it shall be left for another time and place of discussion. Do you have qualms about supporting one side or another, does a friend of yours support the opposite side? Frankly I know several people who are considered relatively high up in the opposing side, and I have reservations about talking to them about the current events as they are pitted against me in a desperate struggle. Desperate for their game and real life sensibilities and motivations. Desperate for the ability to be able to look themselves in the eyes and say they did the right thing. I will not degenerate this post with baseless accusations and heresay, only discussion on the base topic I have previously mentioned. I am even reluctant to mention the sides by name because i fear one side or the other may be vilified by the very mention of its name. Attaching false realities and responsibilites simply from name recognition would not be fair to me, or anyone else involved. We all know that multiple sides are invovled in this conflict, and it has to branch out from the very base "Goon" versus "BoB" now, with so many interests involved. And can the "BoB" really assist the "Goon" against other "Goon" or "BoB"? How do we keep the topic from becoming so confusing and convoluted that we lose track of the original goal and aim of our intentions? Anyone at all is able to participate in this discussion, I know that previously people not directly involved in the conflict were discourage and ridiculed for participating, but this is a topic that effects all our lives, and our very moral well being in eve, so all are free to discuss this topic. Who is really right? and can there be a right versus wrong in this situation? Who is invested so much that they would have others beleive that their stance is the opposite of what it is? Who would believe them once they are reveal to have ulterior motives? Quite a few revelations have been made this past week, and quite a few more stand to be made, all have heavy hitting implications for the argument, and all will be revealed in time, frankly I just hope that some people can live with themselves after they are made. So I will pose the question a final and heartfelt time, Goon versus BoB, can it truly be held up to our virtual worlds standards, and is it taking place today. I hope to open up a serious discussion on this very game and alliance related topic, thank you.
Illyria Ambri RennTech	Posted - 2007.12.19 21:18:00 - [2] Edited by: Illyria Ambri on 19/12/2007 21:18:28 /me watches respect-o-meter falling with each new spam goonie posted topic Is anyone actually reading them anymore? ------------ This is not War... This is pest control - Dalek Sek Here come the Drums!! - The Master Which is worse.. the Carebear or the pirate that whines about them?
Emolayshun	Posted - 2007.12.19 21:21:00 - [3] Originally by: Illyria Ambri Edited by: Illyria Ambri on 19/12/2007 21:18:28 /me watches respect-o-meter falling with each new spam goonie posted topic Is anyone actually reading them anymore? Apparently you are.
Doctor Tycho Caldari Arutha loyals	Posted - 2007.12.19 21:22:00 - [4] I agree with first reply, this is starting to get ridicolus..
Bodziu II Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.12.19 21:22:00 - [5] Edited by: Bodziu II on 19/12/2007 21:22:08 Some fun reading in mining time. Killing asteroid going faster if you read in the same time this forum :)
Local Her0 Minmatar La Mancha Corp	Posted - 2007.12.19 21:24:00 - [6] behave zell, u will get banned for spamming and then u gonna cry like alittle baby and you know it.
Illyria Ambri RennTech	Posted - 2007.12.19 21:27:00 - [7] Originally by: Emolayshun Originally by: Illyria Ambri Edited by: Illyria Ambri on 19/12/2007 21:18:28 /me watches respect-o-meter falling with each new spam goonie posted topic Is anyone actually reading them anymore? Apparently you are. If the OP is a goonie.. I stop reading Now I'm just starting to post random comments in the useless threads ------------ This is not War... This is pest control - Dalek Sek Here come the Drums!! - The Master Which is worse.. the Carebear or the pirate that whines about them?
Maitsu GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.19 21:35:00 - [8] Ban the OP? He posts something relevant in the right forum and all anyone can do is spam the topic? Why don't they ban all of you instead? Goons start not spamming and everyone else decides to start, I say ban the lot of you.
Marshall Deveroux Gallente GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.19 21:41:00 - [9] Zell, As many a wise man has once said, history is written by the victors. And why not? Victory over one's foes should have its spoils. Writing oneself into history as a great beacon of leadership directing a decisive conquest against an unsavory foe is more that just a spoil of war. I posit that this remembrance is the sole reason why any rational being would fight a war in the first place; to carve one's own name into the mantle of history, and place it amongst all those 'great men' whose path one has followed.
Victor Vision Central Intelligence Service	Posted - 2007.12.19 21:44:00 - [10] Originally by: Maitsu Ban the OP? He posts something relevant in the right forum and all anyone can do is spam the topic? Why don't they ban all of you instead? Goons start not spamming and everyone else decides to start, I say ban the lot of you. Chill. EVE War I-The Beginning - EVE History Wiki
Maitsu GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.19 21:47:00 - [11] Originally by: Victor Vision Originally by: Maitsu Ban the OP? He posts something relevant in the right forum and all anyone can do is spam the topic? Why don't they ban all of you instead? Goons start not spamming and everyone else decides to start, I say ban the lot of you. Chill. This is the kind of contentless post that belongs somewhere else.
Relyen Caldari Digital Fury Corporation Digital Renegades	Posted - 2007.12.19 21:53:00 - [12] Actually, the spam of threads is getting rather annoying. It was interesting the first day when all the **** went down. But now...not so. It'd be more interesting to get some updates instead of another 20 of these threads. Atleast for me at work :)
Dreadllama GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.19 21:54:00 - [13] This is a very interesting discussion and I for one applaud you for bringing this enlightening trend to our attention furthermore I feel it requires further study and therefor would like to say that we should have a lengthy discussion to explore this issue because it is very important and important things need to be discussed otherwise they might go undiscussed which we all know could have disastrous consequences to our sense of morality and also some other things that I forget the name of but are also important but even though I cannot remember the word maybe someone else will be able to tell me if I try and explain it anyway what do you call that thing where stuff is different from other things in intangible ways like sometimes you do a thing and someone else does a thing and even though it is the same thing one of you did it better or something like that one time I remember someone shot a bear or a snake or something with a gun and there was blood everywhere and people were all about thinking that maybe he should not do that sort of thing with children mucking about but then another time the pretty much same thing happened and people thought it was a good idea even though it was basically the same act maybe the circumstances were different but I do not really know for certain maybe one of you knows what I am talking about and I would certainly like to hear your opinions on the matter if you do or even if you do not because your feelings are important.
Victor Vision Central Intelligence Service	Posted - 2007.12.19 21:54:00 - [14] Originally by: Maitsu Originally by: Victor Vision Originally by: Maitsu Ban the OP? He posts something relevant in the right forum and all anyone can do is spam the topic? Why don't they ban all of you instead? Goons start not spamming and everyone else decides to start, I say ban the lot of you. Chill. This is the kind of contentless post that belongs somewhere else. A word is only contentless if you do not understand its meaning. EVE War I-The Beginning - EVE History Wiki
WrathOfOprah Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.19 22:04:00 - [15] Edited by: WrathOfOprah on 19/12/2007 22:04:16 Originally by: Illyria Ambri Edited by: Illyria Ambri on 19/12/2007 21:18:28 /me watches respect-o-meter falling with each new spam goonie posted topic Is anyone actually reading them anymore? Where would I go about purchasing one of these "Respect-o-meter" things you speak of?
LASER WATCHER GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.19 22:14:00 - [16] Originally by: Victor Vision Originally by: Maitsu Ban the OP? He posts something relevant in the right forum and all anyone can do is spam the topic? Why don't they ban all of you instead? Goons start not spamming and everyone else decides to start, I say ban the lot of you. Chill. I don't see how one-word spam is tolerated here, and yet be so rude to other people as well. _____
Victor Vision Central Intelligence Service	Posted - 2007.12.19 22:19:00 - [17] Edited by: Victor Vision on 19/12/2007 22:20:05 Originally by: LASER WATCHER Originally by: Victor Vision Originally by: Maitsu Ban the OP? He posts something relevant in the right forum and all anyone can do is spam the topic? Why don't they ban all of you instead? Goons start not spamming and everyone else decides to start, I say ban the lot of you. Chill. I don't see how one-word spam is tolerated here, and yet be so rude to other people as well. I do not see how multi-word spam and discussing of moderation is tolerated here. EVE War I-The Beginning - EVE History Wiki
Gneeznow Minmatar North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.12.19 22:47:00 - [18] Originally by: Victor Vision Originally by: Maitsu Ban the OP? He posts something relevant in the right forum and all anyone can do is spam the topic? Why don't they ban all of you instead? Goons start not spamming and everyone else decides to start, I say ban the lot of you. Chill. Vague and thinly veiled yet condescending comments like this do not belong in CAOD.
Victor Vision Central Intelligence Service	Posted - 2007.12.19 22:50:00 - [19] Originally by: Gneeznow Originally by: Victor Vision Originally by: Maitsu Ban the OP? He posts something relevant in the right forum and all anyone can do is spam the topic? Why don't they ban all of you instead? Goons start not spamming and everyone else decides to start, I say ban the lot of you. Chill. Vague and thinly veiled yet condescending comments like this do not belong in CAOD. Quite the contrary, dear friend. Why use many words when few, or even a single one can convey the message? EVE War I-The Beginning - EVE History Wiki
Dafuzz Gallente Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.12.19 22:50:00 - [20] Originally by: Illyria Ambri Is anyone actually reading them anymore? Yes, they are touching me deep in my soul. I just know they are doing it just for lil ol me <3 -- -If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, riddle them with bullets..
Gloomy Gus GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.19 23:05:00 - [21] Originally by: Victor Vision Chill. I feel that one-word posts without content would normally already be snipped for spam. Why is this case different?
Ungdall Minmatar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.19 23:19:00 - [22] Edited by: Ungdall on 19/12/2007 23:25:15 Originally by: Dafuzz Originally by: Illyria Ambri Is anyone actually reading them anymore? Yes, they are touching me deep in my soul. I just know they are doing it just for lil ol me <3 Fuzzy, we would do anything and everything in our power to make amends for what we have done in the past. However, for all our feelings of of sorrow, we feel we must continue our fight. It would be imprudent to cease now, for it is only when the c rack of the final shot has echoed to silence, that 0.0 will be at peace. Peace through War. Join Us. Become Us. Be Us. edit; silly filters, have they not a care?
Louis Lane Minmatar Imperium Holding corp	Posted - 2007.12.19 23:25:00 - [23] Originally by: Illyria Ambri Edited by: Illyria Ambri on 19/12/2007 21:18:28 /me watches respect-o-meter falling with each new spam goonie posted topic Is anyone actually reading them anymore? hi mr/mrs bob alt...
Victor Vision Central Intelligence Service	Posted - 2007.12.19 23:38:00 - [24] Edited by: Victor Vision on 19/12/2007 23:45:56 Originally by: Gloomy Gus Originally by: Victor Vision Chill. I feel that one-word posts without content would normally already be snipped for spam. Why is this case different? I feel sorry you feel so hostile towards me, when all I said was chill. I am sure in your heart you want to love me, so I will explain it all to you in great depth. As the OP said: "Anyone at all is able to participate in this discussion, I know that previously people not directly involved in the conflict were discourage and ridiculed for participating, but this is a topic that effects all our lives, and our very moral well being in eve, so all are free to discuss this topic." My opinion on the topic as well as on some posts is that members of the Goonswarm alliance need to chill. Thus the word chill was used. I am a forgiving and understanding person. So I in turn ask for forgiveness for overestimating some of the posters in this thread. In my arrogance I forgot some might not understand that the word "chill" does not just stand for being cold. As my defense I must state however, that a mysterious poster on CAOD, also known as "The Mittani" has used the phrase "Chill Brosef" before. As this has been the case, I mistakenly assumed that most members of Goonswarm were familiar with the word "chill". Now, to clear the fog: The word "chill" can also mean "keeping cool" or "being relaxed" about something. Ahhhhhhhh, members of Goonswarm will now say. That is what he meant! Now that this is cleared, we can continue to look at the context the word "cill" was used in. A dear poster in this thread got very upset about someones comment earlier in the thread. As a reply, I typed the word "chill", in an effort to make the enraged poster feel at ease with himself and the world. The word "chill" must also be seen in context with the OP. As the OP invited all to say what they think about the great war of Goons vs BoB, my reply to the OP is also: "chill" Meaning we should be relaxed and cool about the great war. If there is any further questions, feel free to ask. However I would be gratefull if I could recieve 100mil in isk per futher answer, to pay me fairly for my time. EVE War I-The Beginning - EVE History Wiki
Ungdall Minmatar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.19 23:41:00 - [25] Originally by: Victor Vision Originally by: Gloomy Gus Originally by: Victor Vision Chill. I feel that one-word posts without content would normally already be snipped for spam. Why is this case different? I feel sorry you feel so hostile towards me, when all I said was chill. I am sure in your heart you want to love me, so I will explain it all to you in great depth. As the OP said: "Anyone at all is able to participate in this discussion, I know that previously people not directly involved in the conflict were discourage and ridiculed for participating, but this is a topic that effects all our lives, and our very moral well being in eve, so all are free to discuss this topic." My opinion on the topic as well as on some posts is that members of the Goonswarm alliance need to chill. Thus the word chill was used. I am a forgiving and understanding person. So I in turn ask for forgiveness for overestimating some of the posters in this thread. In my arrogance I forgot some might not understand that the word "chill" does not just stand for being cold. As my defense I must state however, that a mysterious poster on CAOD, also known as "The Mittani" has used the phrase "Chill Brosef" before. As this has been the case, I mistakenly assumed that most members of Goonswarm were familiar with the word "chill". Now, to clear the fog: The word "chill" can also mean "keeping cool" or "being relaxed" about something. Ahhhhhhhh, members of Goonswarm will now say. That is what he meant! Now that you know what the word means, we can continue to look at the context it was used in. A dear poster in this thread got very upset about someones comment earlier in the thread. As a reply, I typed the word "chill", in an effort to make the enraged poster feel at ease with himself and the world. The word "chill" must also be seen in context with the OP. As the OP invited all to say what they think about the great war of Goons vs BoB, my reply to the OP is also: "chill" Meaning we should be relaxed and cool about the great war. If there is any further questions, feel free to ask. However I would be gratefull if I could recieve 100mil in isk per futher answer, to pay me fairly for my time. Friend, I am pleased by this clarification of your intent in the post you had made. It illuminates your beliefs on the subject at hand and I for one am pleased to see you have adopted our newly found ideas of posting. Welcome to Us. Become Us. Be Us.
Puncher hirr Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.12.19 23:43:00 - [26] Sister Christian Oh the time has come And you know that you're the only one To say O.K. Where you going What you looking for You know those boys Don't want to play no more with you It's true You're motoring What's your price for flight In finding mister right You'll be alright tonight Babe you know You're growing up so fast And mama's worrying That you won't last To say let's play Sister Christian There's so much in life Don't you give it up Before your time is due It's true It's true yeah Motoring What's your price for flight You've got him in your sight And driving thru the night Motoring What's your price for flight In finding mister right You'll be alright tonight Motoring What's your price for flight In finding mister right You'll be alright tonight (repeat) Sister Christian Oh the time has come And you know that you're the only one To say O.K. But you're motoring You're motoring -
taylor04 Caldari D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.12.19 23:45:00 - [27] always the same old noobs start the threads but makes good reading meaow!! BTW is it me or is The goons made up of chinese pictd chars
Reto The Last Resort	Posted - 2007.12.19 23:48:00 - [28] DUDE !!! wall of motherf*ing text. why do u even think that u can attract readers with this? Originally by:** s4mp3r0r "Hey man, you're mom has a cruise missile".
Neuraxis Aeon Extreme Addiction Atrum Tempestas Foedus	Posted - 2007.12.19 23:50:00 - [29] There are so many sayings that could be used, But one echos in my head that sums up the situation: To Kill a Devil you must become a Devil yourself! Now the Goons have become the new devil, and poeple will alway go against who ever is the strongest power, why do you think everyone dislikes the amercians!
Corphus The NewOrder	Posted - 2007.12.20 00:02:00 - [30] Originally by: Neuraxis Aeon There are so many sayings that could be used, But one echos in my head that sums up the situation: To Kill a Devil you must become a Devil yourself! Now the Goons have become the new devil, and poeple will alway go against who ever is the strongest power, why do you think everyone dislikes the amercians! from my understanding goons are not a strong pvp powerhouse like bob, mc, ra or a¦ nor an industrial mamoth like the former ascn so i dont think anyone will concentrate effort on them. the development in pb however is more interesting.
Nizomi Caldari Technopolis Ventures	Posted - 2007.12.20 00:06:00 - [31] Originally by: Marshall Deveroux Zell, As many a wise man has once said, history is written by the victors. And why not? Victory over one's foes should have its spoils. Writing oneself into history as a great beacon of leadership directing a decisive conquest against an unsavory foe is more that just a spoil of war. I posit that this remembrance is the sole reason why any rational being would fight a war in the first place; to carve one's own name into the mantle of history, and place it amongst all those 'great men' whose path one has followed. "The history is written by the victors" doesnt quite apply to a video game. You know, there is an actual reason why the history of real wars is written by the victors. It's because the losers are either dead or locked up.
Ungdall Minmatar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.20 00:37:00 - [32] Originally by: Nizomi Originally by: Marshall Deveroux Zell, As many a wise man has once said, history is written by the victors. And why not? Victory over one's foes should have its spoils. Writing oneself into history as a great beacon of leadership directing a decisive conquest against an unsavory foe is more that just a spoil of war. I posit that this remembrance is the sole reason why any rational being would fight a war in the first place; to carve one's own name into the mantle of history, and place it amongst all those 'great men' whose path one has followed. "The history is written by the victors" doesnt quite apply to a video game. You know, there is an actual reason why the history of real wars is written by the victors. It's because the losers are either dead or locked up. This is very true, for all our spouting of fine words and logic, we must remember that in this reality, none of us is ever truly gone until we decide to leave the community. Due to this never ending life, the fallen side of any conflict will lie, sit or stand by the sides and will never allow the victor to enjoy their spoils. They will do their utmost to taint the victory. This is one of the reasons it is so very important to be kind in your dealings, even with those whom you call your foe. For, though the battle is over, one party will still be tormented by what has passed, and those feelings will burn within them and will poison their hearts. In the interests of preserving the joy of everyone in EVE, we Goons ask that all treat all with love and respect. Love with Us. Join Us. Become Us. Be Us.
Orangir GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.20 00:54:00 - [33] Originally by: Nizomi "The history is written by the victors" doesnt quite apply to a video game. You know, there is an actual reason why the history of real wars is written by the victors. It's because the losers are either dead or locked up. You're absolutely correct, and the way I see it this is actually a good thing. I'm glad BoB will be able to talk about The Great War just as us members of the coalition will be able to. Both sides will be heard, and in the end I think we'll find that both sides had their hands forced and never really wanted the war to reach the bitter levels it eventually did. Hopefully BoB will be able to explain away the exploits and dirty tricks they used by pointing out that the coalition fought only when they had a 5 to 1 advantage. Hopefully the coalition will then point out that they used the 5 to 1 advantage simply to even out the SP difference between the sides. In the end, I hope it will come out that both sides did what they did because they were forced to, not because it's something they enjoyed doing. BoB cheated, the coalition fought with overwhelming odds, that much we already know. I hope we can get to know why both sides did what they did, not just how they did what they did. Wow, I said hope a lot in this post. I guess it just goes to show that hope is really all we need these days. - Orangir
Nero Winger Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.12.20 01:04:00 - [34] Zell you need medical threatment
Olloth Kenson The Greater Goon GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.20 02:26:00 - [35] Originally by: Nero Winger Zell you need medical threatment My, are you insinuating that Zell is an "R-tard"? I do believe this is your goal in this post and it is NOT the kind of smack-talk that I will tolerate. In fact, my Corporation officially declares war upon yours, enjoy your red standings.
Illyria Ambri RennTech	Posted - 2007.12.20 02:41:00 - [36] Originally by: Louis Lane Originally by: Illyria Ambri Edited by: Illyria Ambri on 19/12/2007 21:18:28 /me watches respect-o-meter falling with each new spam goonie posted topic Is anyone actually reading them anymore? hi mr/mrs bob alt... Oh my.. he called me a bob alt.. whatever will I do? Oh yes.. laugh at you.. cause you made a funny ------------ This is not War... This is pest control - Dalek Sek Here come the Drums!! - The Master Which is worse.. the Carebear or the pirate that whines about them?

ISD Santiago Cortes Caldari ISD Interstellar Correspondents	Posted - 2007.12.20 06:03:00 - [37] Locked Duplicate thread to the good v evil, goon v bob threads. forum rules \| mailto:[email protected]


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