| Pages: 1 :: [one page] |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Rhak Amharr
Minmatar
Metafarmers
   |
Posted - 2008.01.22 14:17:00 -
[1]
Hi,
I'm not sure if this idea has been proposed before, the search function is just awful (Proposal 2: new search engine). Couldn't find it in the commonly proposed ideas either, so here we go.
I think we all agree on one thing: Learning skills are the worst (or at least among the worst) thing that ever happened to Eve. We all might have our favourite nerf - NOS/Damps/whatever - but learning skills were wrong from the beginning.
The problem with removing them from the game is that it would lead to a lot of (totally justified in this case) whines on losing training time and/or skillpoints. Since the learning skills are in-game, this is not avoidable. My proposal tries to reduce the amount of lost training time to a reasonable degree.
- Give a flat +8 (or +10, or whatever seems best) to every attribute on every character
- For each learning skill (except Learning) trained to V (and only to V), give an additional point to the attribute affected by that skill.
- For Learning trained to V (and only V), give an additional 0.2 to every attribute.
This way, everyone "loses" 10-14 days of training time (the time it takes for all learning to IV), except those who did not train the learning skills in the first place, but they are currently more or less penalized by lower attributes anyway, so it pretty much will break even. I didn't do the math on it though.
The ones who did train learning skills to V will get a slight advantage (1 or 2 additional attribute points), but they also spent a good amount of training time on that, so I think it's reasonable.
Any comments/suggestions?
Rhak
P.S.: I did not train any learning skill to V, I have them pretty much all at IV except charisma and advanced learning for Memory/Willpower, so I don't really benefit from the additional attribute points. Just wanted to point that out to at least avoid 1 type of flames. :)
|
BtHatch
Boli Me Kurc
|
Posted - 2008.01.22 14:23:00 -
[2]
There were many propositions for this...
from another thread
CCP : "we hate that we added the learning skills in the game, and we will never do any such things again, but the djin is out of the bottle, so we can't squeeze it back in completely".
Linkage
-
I have nothing to hide.
|
Rhak Amharr
Minmatar
Metafarmers
|
Posted - 2008.01.22 14:30:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: BtHatch
There were many propositions for this...
Yes, but all proposals I ever read were about just giving a flat +10 on every attribute, which would of course put a lot of people into really losing training time, while my proposal (which I haven't seen before) tries to minimize the lost training time aspect, but ofc it doesn't get rid of it completely.
But anyway, if this has already been suggested and turned down, ignore this please.
Rhak
|
Fortuna Cournot
Caldari
RONA Technology
RONA Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.01.22 16:00:00 -
[4]
They added a feature before to give new characters 800k skillpoints. This change was more drastic then your proposal. I think any change here would be okay, but only if the training time and skill book money is refunded.
If i would had all skills at level 5, i would have no problem if all people are treated like level 4 or 5. But nobody should have an advantage in having not wasted time in training it that high. The second aspect is refunding money.
------
ineve.net Character Skill Showroom
My EVE Link Collection |
Buyerr
|
Posted - 2008.01.23 12:54:00 -
[5]
that's the worst idea i have ever read on removing learning skills...
NO don't let some have extra attributes that is impossible then to get for any one else..
but i do agree remove learnings give +10 all attributes and let people redistribute the sp amount with a calculator for other attributes if used for things that don't have same attri req
I declare war on stupidity |
Siri Blue
Gallente
Arachnea Phoenix Battalion
Phalanx Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.01.23 12:57:00 -
[6]
I like long-term games where you have to put effort into to archieve things.
CCP already made it so much simpler to start out...
I am sad.
Re-Introduce Non-ISK-Mission rewards, please. |
Kerfira
University of Caille
|
Posted - 2008.01.23 13:15:00 -
[7]
Since they reduced the requirements for the advanced learning skills from basic 5 to basic 4, there hasn't really been a problem.
The problem was caused by the big gap between training the last step of the basic skill, and training the first 3 steps of the advanced. That has now been corrected.
The OP is trying to invent a problem that doesn't really exist....
Originally by: CCP Wrangler
EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
|
ViolenTUK
Gallente
Vindicated Exiles
101010 Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.01.23 13:50:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Rhak Amharr
I think we all agree on one thing: Learning skills are the worst (or at least among the worst) thing that ever happened to Eve. We all might have our favourite nerf - NOS/Damps/whatever - but learning skills were wrong from the beginning.
Learning skills are one of the best ideas that have been introduced to eve. They will teach you patience and forward planning and reward you with a significant boost if trained correctly. Anyone can learn learning skills so anyone who wants to gain a learning advantage which will pay off in the hours, days, weeks, months and even years to come anyone can benefit. The great part of learning skills is that given an amount of time they always pay off.
Originally by: Rhak Amharr
The problem with removing them from the game is that it would lead to a lot of (totally justified in this case) whines on losing training time and/or skillpoints. Since the learning skills are in-game, this is not avoidable. My proposal tries to reduce the amount of lost training time to a reasonable degree.
Are you serious? People wouldnĘt just whine they would cancel all their account if something this stupid ever happened.
Originally by: Rhak Amharr
- Give a flat +8 (or +10, or whatever seems best) to every attribute on every character
- For each learning skill (except Learning) trained to V (and only to V), give an additional point to the attribute affected by that skill.
- For Learning trained to V (and only V), give an additional 0.2 to every attribute.
This way, everyone "loses" 10-14 days of training time (the time it takes for all learning to IV), except those who did not train the learning skills in the first place, but they are currently more or less penalized by lower attributes anyway, so it pretty much will break even. I didn't do the math on it though.
The ones who did train learning skills to V will get a slight advantage (1 or 2 additional attribute points), but they also spent a good amount of training time on that, so I think it's reasonable.
I find this very difficult to accept. You should know by now that learning skills are the premise for training for virtually all eve pilots. No-one want to see a change anything like this.
www.eve-players.com |
Illioe
|
Posted - 2008.01.23 16:37:00 -
[9]
Originally by: ViolenTUK
Learning skills are one of the best ideas that have been introduced to eve. They will teach you patience and forward planning and reward you with a significant boost if trained correctly. Anyone can learn learning skills so anyone who wants to gain a learning advantage which will pay off in the hours, days, weeks, months and even years to come anyone can benefit. The great part of learning skills is that given an amount of time they always pay off.
I find this very difficult to accept. You should know by now that learning skills are the premise for training for virtually all eve pilots. No-one want to see a change anything like this.
Learning skills are the premise for training because they have to be - maximizing training time is important because everything takes so long. The problem is, if a new player wants to get into EVE and maximize their time, they have to spend the first two months playing with nothing but rookie skills while they train learning for efficiency. This makes actually playing EVE secondary to training to play EVE, which should never be the case.
I've already trained my learning skills, and I would love to see this change. It might be "wasted" training time on one character, but it's saved training time on any new ones.
|
Xindi Kraid
Caldari
|
Posted - 2008.01.23 16:45:00 -
[10]
I think the learning skills are the most important skills that exist. Not only to they reduce training time but they have a real world application. They teach you patience and emphasize investments with future payouts as opposed to the instant gratification that is rampant in today's society
--Bird of Prey: Forum God
1. War
2.
3. Profit |
Arcayan
|
Posted - 2008.01.23 20:53:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Illioe
...they have to spend the first two months playing with nothing but rookie skills while they train learning for efficiency.
People like you annoy me to no end.
I'll bet you always tell new players to spend the first two months training all learning skills up to max.
Maybe you should tell them to spend the first 8 days training basics to 4 and advanced to 3 and then focus on combat/industrial skills for the next two months, and then get the remaining learning skills.
Learning skills aren't the problem, veterans who give rookies misleading information are the problem.
|
ViolenTUK
Gallente
Vindicated Exiles
101010 Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.01.23 20:56:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Arcayan
Learning skills aren't the problem, veterans who give rookies misleading information are the problem.
Hear Hear
www.eve-players.com |
| |
|
| Pages: 1 :: [one page] |