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[IPO] Magma Holdings Group

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Feronia Gallente Magma Industries	Posted - 2008.01.27 22:35:00 - [1] MAGMA HOLDINGS GROUP OFFERING for sale of 75,000 existing shares The Offering will commence on Monday 28 January 2008 and is expected to close at the latest on Friday 1 February 2008, unless earlier terminated at any time on 30 January 2008. The price of the shares will be 150,000 Isk per share. Orders must be submitted in game to NORTIA, CEO of MAGMA HOLDINGS GROUP. Shares will be sent within 24 hrs after the allocation rules have been published. DISCLAIMER : BY SUBSCRIBING TO THE MAGMA HOLDINGS GROUP IPO YOU ACKNOWLEDGE THAT YOU HAVE READ, UNDERSTOOD AND AGREE TO THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS MENTIONED IN THE PROSPECTUS AND THAT IN CASE OF A CORPORATION SUBSCRIPTION YOU FULLY REPRESENT YOUR CORPORATION. The IPO prospectus can be found here.
Feronia Gallente Magma Industries	Posted - 2008.01.27 22:39:00 - [2] Some background: Magma Industries is a well established corporation and has been active in capital ship production in the last 3 years. Recently we made the full transition to Jump Freighters. Most of our members involved in production and in the Board of Directors are playing well over 3 years. This means we have a lot of experience in running large scale production and have obtained reasonable market knowledge. Things to consider before investing: Firstly, weÆre not selling new shares. The shares up for sale are existing shares owned by the shareholders. All corporation assets have already been privately funded about 2 months ago. We donÆt really need your money. The corporation will run just the same without public money. So why are we going public ? ItÆs something we want to try. We lately saw the public offerings slowly divert from shares to low profit bonds . With our small IPO we try to promote the true nature of risk capital and hope this will encourage other corporations to do the same. Most public offerings are only looking for money. They donÆt really care how much shares every investor gets. This usually results in only those investors , who happen to be in the right time zone or reading the forum at the right time, will end up with shares. We do care about giving everyone a fair chance to invest. That is why this IPO will work with a subscription period of minimum 2 days, and maximum 4 days in which investors can subscribe. In the event of over-subscription distribution rules will be published. We donÆt want to make the rich even richer, so these distribution rules will mostly benefit the small investors . Keep in mind all subscriptions are limited to 5,000 shares per investor, so donÆt order more. We also believe in having a solid base of investors. With this in mind we have decided to set a priority allocation for Institutional Investors. Are considered institutional investors: banks or Mutual Funds, preferably publicly funded so we can reach an even larger investor base. How to invest: We strongly advice to read the complete IPO prospectus. All details how to subscribe are explained there. The subscription period will start today at midnight EVE-time. All subscriptions before the start and after the closing will be disregarded but fully refunded.
Kushion Anti Sweden Defense Force Galactic Research	Posted - 2008.01.27 22:58:00 - [3] An excellent writeup. However, I didn't see anything about projected returns... would you care to comment on that? -- Taggart Transdimensional corporation - \| Capitalism \| Objectivism \| 0.0 \| No taxes \| No mandatory ops \| Join channel TAGGART for more info \|
Feronia Gallente Magma Industries	Posted - 2008.01.27 23:31:00 - [4] The Jump Freighter market is still in full development. While the profit at this moment might be very healthy, its very hard to predict the future returns. In the end the normal supply-demand rules will apply. Of course we did several studies about our costs and profitability, but because Jump Freighters are still an emerging market we decided not to give any estimations about future returns. Its risk capital for a reason However, we plan to build between 8-10 Jump Freighters a month.
Shadarle	Posted - 2008.01.27 23:44:00 - [5] I find it a bit dubious to invest in anyone who openly states that they don't need anyones money but they are asking for it anyhow. Tanking Setups Compared Stacking Penalty / Resists Explained
Kwint Sommer Incoherent Inc Otaku Invasion	Posted - 2008.01.27 23:58:00 - [6] Before they were introduced Kirjava and I seriously considered going into Jump Freighter production at the rate of 4 a month and ultimately decided against it. Since I've seen several sell for 6.5B and even more fail to sell at 7.5B plus a huge number of freighter BPO's being purchased I personally feel like I dodged a bullet. At 6.5B there's barely a gaurantee of profit (it depends on how invention goes) and I just don't feel there is room in the market for an additional 8-10 a month. At least as far as the public market is concerned that would represent upwards of a 100% increase in availability of something that isn't selling well now and will likely have decreased demand in the future. Sure you can argue that people who can afford them, want them but don't have the skills yet but even if that's true it will only buy you a few months of decent demand before everyone that can justify the 6+billion cost has one and the whole point is that when used properly these things never die. I see you're only trying to raise 11B which would imply that you aren't buying the Freighter BPO's yourself which is a good move in so far as the BPO's are liable to crash in value and you'd probably never be able to sell them at NPC price, however, Freighter BPC's cost a small fortune at the moment and that will likely cut your already small profit margin even lower. Your offering was very well written except for the parts where you demonstrate that you can turn profit, by which I mean those parts didn't exist. Further, I have serious doubts about the Jump Freighter market, so serious that after a month of researching it and making plans with other producers that I decided not to into it. Personally, I'd bet this pays out about 4% dividends and destroys any chances of every making a meaningful profit from the JF's, which as someone who uses a Jump Freighter and may buy another at some distant point in the future is fine by me but you won't see me investing in it. Good luck with the new business. 5% Mining & Manufacturing Implants
Ambo 2nd Outcasters	Posted - 2008.01.28 08:38:00 - [7] I'm afraid I have to agree. It's all very well written and presented (except for the lack of a sales/profit forecast. Even a 'We don't know but if we sell x per month, divs will be this much. If we sell y per month, divs will be that much, etc'). However, I don't like the look of the JF market I just don't see there being enough dempand for these things to sustain decent profit margins. Bear in mind than the primary users will be 0.0 alliances and most of these groups will probably just build them internally rather than buying them. Also, perhaps I'm being dense here but if the shares are already owned by the shareholders, does that mean you are effectively broking a sales deal here? If so, I'd be interested in hearing from the shareholder(s) about the performance so far and thier reasons for selling. Good luck. -------------------------------------- Trader? Investor? Just want to track your finances? Check out EMMA
Feronia Gallente Magma Industries	Posted - 2008.01.28 09:48:00 - [8] I know you're all fishing to get a profit forecast. But at this time its impossible to predict the future returns. They'll probably be in the range of 0 % to 20 % (worst/best case scenario). That is the best I can do. I understand your concerns about the Jump Freighter market. Maybe our expectations about the future demand are overrated. Maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong. The future will tell. I'm still by far the biggest shareholder and the shares offered in this IPO are mine. The reason to sell is to provide me more liquidity assets and of course to be able to launch this IPO. The released liquidity will be used to build up a stock of materials so our production will be less vulnerable to market speculations. Because this is a new business line, made available after the Trinity patch, and sales are just starting, there isn't any performance to report.
Trading Bunnz Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.01.28 13:23:00 - [9] I like the concept and have been considering a similar style of offering myself for a while. This is aimed at being a true IPO, rather than a venture capital request and something I'd like to see much more of in the market. In this particular instance tho, there is ZERO historical performance information of the private company available, which doesn't give investors the tools necessary to make their decisions. As well, significant facts are missing from the prospectus which makes this nothing other than "reverse venture capital" raising. At the moment, its an unproven, untested, unperforming company you have founded, that you are offeringto the public. You built a production network, put together the resources, and now want to sell a portion of that risk to liquidate assets. Some key questions need to be answered first: Listed Subscribed Capital @ 150b - Detail this please, where does this figure come from? Historical Performance - Where is that? You state you are an existing corp, you have been together/playing for years, but all you are exposing to the public here is an untried venture. Board of Directors - Who are they? As a potential investor, I most definetly have a right and desire to know. Statement of Accounts - Justify your value of 150k/share please Source of shares - Where did these 75,000 shares come from? At one stage, I was confident they were your personal shares, but then you talk about using the capital for company purposes and then i read the board approving the sale of these shares as capital raising? Clarify for me please.
Level4 Red Frog Investments Blue Sky Consortium	Posted - 2008.01.28 15:30:00 - [10] Edited by: Level4 on 28/01/2008 15:31:54 This might be of interest to you, Originally by: CCP Oneiromancer We are currently testing some boosts to the jump freighters on our internal servers; the changes should be available for testing on Singularity later this week. * all jump freighters are getting a 25% base cargo capacity increase. * all jump freighters are getting a 10% bonus to shield, armor and hull hitpoints per Jump Freighter skill level. * the speed bonus has been changed to a 5% agility bonus per racial freighter skill level. * the fuel needs reduction has been increased from 5% to 10% per Jump Freighter skill level. There will be a devblog about these changes soon, so please give your feedback there. also: The max production runs on jump freighter blueprints has been increased from 1 to 10 and max skills will mean +50% cargo capacity compared to the current numbers. So you'd have: Anshar: 351.562 m3 Ark: 344.531 m3 Nomad: 337.500 m3 Rhea: 367.968 m3 You also get -50% fuel consumption with max skills. join channel "Profit".

Feronia Gallente Magma Industries	Posted - 2008.01.28 16:14:00 - [11] Very interesting news. To answer some earlier questions: The corporation was privately funded 2 months ago. The start capital raised was 150 bill. At start the assets did consist of 6 % minerals, 17 % advanced materials, 37 % BPO's and 40 % cash. The historical performance refers to earlier private funded capital ship ventures. While they do give us some advantages in managing these kind of operations, the figures are irrelevant for this IPO. Its a new product, a new business, so it is an untried venture. I'll ask the Board of Directors if they want to disclose their names. The share price is based on pure corporation assets. You're right. The shares up for sale are personal. While the corporation will benefit from having a larger stock of materials, its not really necessary for the continuation of our production, so this larger stock won't be a part of the corporation assets. Having more liquidity will give me the opportunity to buy enough materials with my own personal funds and sell them to the corporation when needed. It gives me a chance to buy at the right time and will make my life much easier.
YouGotRipped Gallente Ewigkeit Galactic Research	Posted - 2008.01.28 16:34:00 - [12] Please note that this is very likely to be a well written scam. Do not invest until further notice.
Mephistocles Red Frog Investments Blue Sky Consortium	Posted - 2008.01.28 16:49:00 - [13] Originally by: YouGotRipped Please note that this is very likely to be a well written scam. Do not invest until further notice. The basis for this statement is?
SiJira	Posted - 2008.01.28 16:55:00 - [14] Edited by: SiJira on 28/01/2008 16:54:57 Originally by: Mephistocles The basis for this statement is? where is the security or history? Trashed sig, Shark was here
Shadarle	Posted - 2008.01.28 17:09:00 - [15] Edited by: Shadarle on 28/01/2008 17:09:45 Originally by: Feronia You're right. The shares up for sale are personal. While the corporation will benefit from having a larger stock of materials, its not really necessary for the continuation of our production, so this larger stock won't be a part of the corporation assets. Having more liquidity will give me the opportunity to buy enough materials with my own personal funds and sell them to the corporation when needed. It gives me a chance to buy at the right time and will make my life much easier. Wait a second, so this isn't shareholders (plural) issuing more shares as you said in the original post... it is you personally issuing shares. BIG difference. I don't think you're gonna get any support if you don't have the rest of your partners come forward to discuss this as well. Do they even know you're doing this? Originally by: SiJira Originally by: Mephistocles The basis for this statement is? where is the security or history? Lack of security or history does not a scam make. I agree this is fishy, but there is absolutely no way to say this is a scam right now. Anyone doing so is showing a complete disregard for their own reputation as there simply are not enough facts to make such a claim. Tanking Setups Compared Stacking Penalty / Resists Explained
Bad Bobby Ugly Toys Zzz	Posted - 2008.01.28 17:16:00 - [16] I've run the through the maths for producing and selling JF's and I'm uncomfortable with the level of profits you would have to make in order to give me the return I would require for this investment. Since insufficient information has been provided to sway my opinion on this matter, I couldn't possibly invest. I'm also suspicious of the method by which shares are being issued. The only reason I can see for such a method is to hide the amounts being invested in order to allow an effectively infinite amount to be taken. I'm seriously tempted to call shenanigans on this one for that reason alone.
SiJira	Posted - 2008.01.28 17:22:00 - [17] Edited by: SiJira on 28/01/2008 17:22:59 Originally by: Shadarle Lack of security or history does not a scam make. neither does it make a good investment Quote: I agree this is fishy, but there is absolutely no way to say this is a scam right now. Anyone doing so is showing a complete disregard for their own reputation as there simply are not enough facts to make such a claim. i hope you arent referring to me i answered why yougotripped might come to that conclusion Trashed sig, Shark was here
Kazuo Ishiguro House of Marbles Zzz	Posted - 2008.01.28 17:48:00 - [18] As a first step, it would help if you could post the identities of the characters that are going to be used to invent/build the JFs, along with a link to an api-verified ineve.net profile for each character (like this one), and have them confirm by posting in this thread. My research services Spreadsheets: Top speed calculation - Halo Implant stats
YouGotRipped Gallente Ewigkeit Galactic Research	Posted - 2008.01.28 17:53:00 - [19] Feronia since it's YOUR PERSONAL venture we're talking about why drag the corp into this and not provide more info about yourself? You've joined the corp 3 days ago am I correct? Since then you have risen to the rank of director which means you're an alt or best friend of someone. Is the CEO your alt too? Since you're relying so much on the corp production assets how about have your corp members post here that they know about this IPO. I certainly hope that this is not an inactive corp (even with some history in production) + your active alts. Who will handle the production? Api key needed to certify that the skills for building JFs are there. What exactly are those 150 bills worth of assets? Prove you can achieve what this IPO is all about. Why so many shares? Why JFs? This is starting to look more and more like a scam. What difference will 11 bills make in addtition to 150 of which 60 are cash? You've certainly put a lot of effort in writing this to state that you can do without the additional funding. Half of your IPO plan is just stuffing. Considering what my fore posters said even if you manage to prove this is not a scam you'll find it very hard to get investors.
Shar Tegral	Posted - 2008.01.28 18:07:00 - [20] I have to put in a word here as the authenticity of Feronia has been questioned. I can not tell you if this is the same Feronia from 2004 (though it is very likely) but I remember Feronia well. Back then she, and magma industries, used to publish a mineral price index. It was a competing list against the one I supported at Eve Guardian. Feronia was a part of Magma back then and was quite active in many things over the years. Feronia used to be in market discussion before there was a Market Discussion specific forum. In essence, Feronia is an old timer. I've never had any financial dealings with Feronia. I can't say if Feronia sold off the toon or not. I'm just pointing out that Feronia used to be part of Magma long ago so the return is little or no surprise. In fact, the welcome return to Magma only indicates that it is likely still the same Feronia. There, argue the validity of the plan. Not the person as there is nothing to argue about there.

cosmoray	Posted - 2008.01.28 18:15:00 - [21] Firstly, very well written IPO. Secondly the devil is in the details. The IPO itself doesn't really say anything, expected returns, name of corp, etc... Thirdly communication. Your answers to questions seem to be different to the information in the IPO. Which brings me to these questions: 1. Why do you need more money when the IPO has 150B in assets? 2. What history & reputation have you got. Having your corp mates post here and vouch (Shad's definition with standing)for you will go a long way to setting up credability. 3. A screenshot of a good portion of the assets would help a lot more. If you are a director a screenie of a corp hangar is pretty straight forward or the corp wallet for that matter. 4. Why is this loan personal and not for the corp? 5. Is your corp happy that you plan to make money off their IPO? Do they need a middle man? Answers please. I don't think you will get much action until you answer these and a good portion of the questions above. Communication is KING!!!
SiJira	Posted - 2008.01.28 18:22:00 - [22] Originally by: Shar Tegral I have to put in a word here as the authenticity of Feronia has been questioned. I can not tell you if this is the same Feronia from 2004 (though it is very likely) but I remember Feronia well. Back then she, and magma industries, used to publish a mineral price index. It was a competing list against the one I supported at Eve Guardian. Feronia was a part of Magma back then and was quite active in many things over the years. Feronia used to be in market discussion before there was a Market Discussion specific forum. In essence, Feronia is an old timer. I've never had any financial dealings with Feronia. I can't say if Feronia sold off the toon or not. I'm just pointing out that Feronia used to be part of Magma long ago so the return is little or no surprise. In fact, the welcome return to Magma only indicates that it is likely still the same Feronia. There, argue the validity of the plan. Not the person as there is nothing to argue about there. the plan is madness it would be nice if feronia could prove its the same feronia Trashed sig, Shark was here
Minerva Vulcan Caldari The Nexus Foundation Endless Horizon	Posted - 2008.01.28 18:30:00 - [23] Originally by: SiJira the plan is madness it would be nice if feronia could prove its the same feronia A search of the character selling forum might help that. There's also the possibility the character could have been given away to a friend or sold outside the EULA, of course, but it's a good place to start. _______________________________ I need new voices in my head, To speak my secret evils with. I need new lovers in my bed, To be my friends and special pets.
DA MONSTER	Posted - 2008.01.28 19:13:00 - [24] Edited by: DA MONSTER on 28/01/2008 19:13:51 I can confirm that it's THE Feronia. While you may have concerns regarding the IPO, you certainly shouldn't have ANY concerns about the person or corp running it.
Gallactica Gallente The Funkalistic	Posted - 2008.01.28 19:52:00 - [25] As one of the directors of the IPO and former CEO of Magma industries i can personally vouch for Feronia - having been in-game friends with her pretty much since starting playing eve back in 2003. If you check the forums you will see that Fer has been heavily involved in the production and sales of capital ships for a very long time. Magma has always been a freelancer corp at heart but some of its members got involved in making the ships, be it by manufacturing the components, or by mining the minerals for the people who made the components. If you also look at the numbers of some of Fer's sales on the EVE-ON forums, you will also see that she doesnt have any reason to try and scam anyone out of any isk (hopefully some of the figures there will convince you that she isnt short of isk!) Yes there is a risk in investing your isk, but having known Fer for as long as i have, i know she will give 110% to make it work.
YouGotRipped Gallente Ewigkeit Galactic Research	Posted - 2008.01.28 20:11:00 - [26] Edited by: YouGotRipped on 28/01/2008 20:12:14 Well now, this changes things. The OP is a risk taker willing to share the risk. All aboard!!! ---- jokin
Kushion Anti Sweden Defense Force Galactic Research	Posted - 2008.01.28 20:28:00 - [27] Check out Feronia's contract history. Something tells me someone like this isn't going to try and scam a piddly 11b isk... really, doing research before calling scam helps. -- Taggart Transdimensional corporation - \| Capitalism \| Objectivism \| 0.0 \| No taxes \| No mandatory ops \| Join channel TAGGART for more info \|
SiJira	Posted - 2008.01.28 20:29:00 - [28] this looks like it will be very successful in an average market Trashed sig, Shark was here
YouGotRipped Gallente Ewigkeit Galactic Research	Posted - 2008.01.28 20:51:00 - [29] Edited by: YouGotRipped on 28/01/2008 20:53:32 Originally by: Kushion Check out Feronia's contract history. Something tells me someone like this isn't going to try and scam a piddly 11b isk... really, doing research before calling scam helps. Last contract was in Dec, she joined the corp 3 days ago. While it is also true that cap sales are not doing well right now, I was not entirely convinced that this char has not been purchased recently from the original owner. But that is irrelevant now, as someone else pointed out the only concern should be the profitability of the plan.
Shar Tegral	Posted - 2008.01.28 21:43:00 - [30] Originally by: Shadarle So basically anyone that had called this a scam was way too hasty? I agree. Now, now. He no more needs your help extracting himself from his rash and foolish statements then he did rushing out there to make them. So stop trying to drag him back in... he might make more of them and I do so hate seeing people toss mud on their own face.



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MAGMA HOLDINGS GROUP

OFFERINGfor sale of 75,000 existing shares

OFFERING
for sale of 75,000 existing shares