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Sopha Serpentia
Core Dynamics
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Posted - 2008.01.29 13:30:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Sopha Serpentia on 29/01/2008 13:35:17
Disclaimer: this is not a whine thread, Please if you wish to add to the Discussion please do so, don't flame or troll *looks at the report button*
WARS ARE LIKE RODEOS We go Round and Round and Roundà
While the game mechanics for empire wars at the moment are fine, the actual nature of Eve itself in empire does not support any kind of fun pew pew at all. This includes the manner in which stations operate, the way players encounter and interact with each other and even how trial accounts work all effect wars in empire negatively. Unless you or your enemies are inexperienced its almost impossible to have a fight, so what you get is group of players metaphorically flying circles around each other.
WHERE THE **** IS EVERYONE?
As it stands there are two main places to encounter people: Gates and Stations. All other places are simply noob graveyards, anyone watching local can easily see people enter the system and dock. Scan probing out safe spotters is the exception to this and in my opinion the only thing about empire wars that actually works and feels ôwarryö.
Gate ganks are rarely fun pew pew, they are boring, but appear at present to be the only way to get a definite encounter with your hated enemies. Unfortunately this more often than not is some poor smuck who it travelling alone and gets wtfpwned in 10 secs and hardly makes for a gratifyingly combat encounter.
Stations are probably the biggest yawn factor of Empire Wars and almost always end up as large periods of staring at space docking and undocking with a stopwatch set to 30 secs. This has to be fixed in regards to Empire Wars. ItÆs a great way to test your tank though.
OKAY, WHAT DO YOU SUGGEST?
So we need to get people together in space and out of stations! How do we do this?
We need the tools to fight empire wars just as 0.0 has its tools. Make these fictional devices rely on skills and equipment. But also make them FOR empire wars only. Also give us in empire something to fight over, if you donÆt have anything to defend the amount of encounters drops and we are back at gate camps again with time looking at markets in stations.
One could argue that mining operations would be a defendable resource, but mining takes such little time to arrange and prepare, people simple jump onto other characters to make mine defeating the point of having wars.
Nearly all-historical wars have been fought over territory or resources. In Eve the territorial disputes happen in 0.0. So we want something different. I suggest corps in empire be given access to cheap deployable items that passively generate income at a steady pace but require constant upkeep. Obviously these stations would have be profitable, but would keep with Eves risk verse reward credo. YouÆd still make more money going into low/null sec and setting up a POS.
The core idea here is 0.0/POS lite. Its taking the wars that happen in 0.0 but making them faster and more reliant on the existing empire mechanics of standing, exploration, agents and trade.
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Sopha Serpentia
Core Dynamics
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Posted - 2008.01.29 13:31:00 -
[2]
GIVE US STUFF TO DEFEND!
I know I know we have POSs already. But POSs are too much for everyone. IÆm suggesting a steeping stone. Like the system scanner is to exploration. P.O.S Lite. HereÆs a couple of ideas for POS lite just a crazy suggestion really! IÆm sure CCP thought of this stuff already but If empire wars are to work, then defendable resource points are going to be necessary. Everything here would be easy to detect on scan probes, send out a distress signal when attacked (this means players are likely to stay nearby rather than mass drop them all over space), about as tough as a battleship and only be deployable by corporations with the right amount of standing vrs system security.
Another possible game mechanic would be like the existing research agents. Randomly the station will encounter a ôproblemö that will require fixing, such as needing a certain amount of resources, this would be given via Evemail from a ôstation managerö a nameless agent that requires you to complete missions every so often (some could even be kill missions).
The Astrofarm(factory)
A deployable structure that lives in space and uses trade good to produce other trade goods. The mechanics would have to be worked out so that a small profit was always achieved. So for example: 10 wheat + 5 water + 5 oxygen + 20 livestock = 40 protien delicacies after 1 week.
The Lab
Like the about but requires trade goods to produce a tech 1 blueprint copy every week. Different grades of this could exist allowing for larger and better blueprints copies. This also is a slow work around for the large empire blueprint copy que for tech 2 industries.
The Strip Club
Works like a locator agent but feeds on commodities. For example: 10 exotic dancers +10 spiced wine+ 10 tobacco = 1 location query per week.
Franchise Mining Operation
Empire corps can deploy small scale mining ops at belts for corporations and transport the materials back to the corps stations for isk. The players NEVER get the ore properly; the mining op simply drops secure packages into a cargo hold. Which the player ferry everyday back to an agent for cash. These come in 3 grades and require players to invest some amount of money. 5-25-50 million. The return would be roughly 5% of the investment per day IF someone picks up the cargo and takes it back to the station. These stations wouldnÆt be very tough say as tough as a tanked battleship.
Franchise Survey Station
Like the mining ops except this has to be deployed in deep space. The players have been hired to deploy and maintain this. Each day this station is active the players corporation gains a tiny amount of faction standing. But requires maintenance trade materials like a starbase tower. Roughly 1 million isk of materials a week in return of a TINY amount of faction gain I suggest only one of these be deployed per system.
Limitations: All this stuff can be easily limited by Leadership/Deployable skills, in similar ways to Research and Lab skills. Perhaps a corporation has an installation limit based on its member count.
Defence mechanics: One way I thought of to give the defenders of this equipment would be the rallying call. Like POSs these installations could have a very resilient shield that can be brought down by hacking or force. But the shield takes 30mins to collapse. When the shield starts its 30 minute timer a mail is sent out to every corporation member telling of the impending disaster giving everyone time to rally and defend.
Attack Incentives: These installations all have a good chance of generating battleship level salvage. Also there is a small change that each installation drops a single piece of tech 2 salvage. There is also a chance youÆll get anything inside (wooo exotic dancers!)
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Sopha Serpentia
Core Dynamics
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Posted - 2008.01.29 13:31:00 -
[3]
GIVE US STUFF TO USE!!!
These tools are just suggestions, and yes I know some of these would just increase the amount of gate gankage that would happen, but on the other had it would allow us to have some real gate battles.
Warp Disruption Sentry
Deployed by interdictors but relies on the hacking skill. Sort of a warp disruption probe but it target up to 3 wartargets and warp scrambles them for 2 points. It has a very fast lock time (but wouldnÆt be able to catch a covert ops or recon ship before they cloak). This basically gives people a chance where point click and lag would fail. Also like all probes only 1 would be deployable within a certain radius this devices is also target able and destroyable.
Point Energy thingymy-bob)
A device that targets a ship and prevents if from using a stargate for whatever in game reason, perhaps It causes the ship to generate a false signal (hacking) or maybe it makes the ship slightly out of phase (science). Drawbacks would be its using a lot of cap in the users ship, is close range or can only be used with a specific ship type perhaps another use for a heavy interdictor. I also suggest a modular counter to this.
And finally the Hacking Tool(s)
I love the idea of hacking in this game. I think hacking should take a major role in Empire wars, simply because its Empire and brute force is not always advisable.
A new function for the hacking tool would be to hack stations and read the guest list to see if there are war targets inside or even what station they are in the starsystem. I think this would be cool.
Perhaps hacking a gate so it wouldnÆt allow war target to pass though for 120 seconds with a small chance you get a volley from the station sentry turrets for your trouble.
THATÆS IT
Well if you read this, congratulations. Its a big wall of text.
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Luna Nilaya
Ultrapolite Socialites
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.01.29 15:28:00 -
[4]
/signed
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Installing premium content... Deleting file: \boot.ini |
Isis Dea
Minmatar
Mark of Tali-Vorahk
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Posted - 2008.01.29 15:39:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Isis Dea on 29/01/2008 15:39:49
I like where this is going! 
Strip Club... lawls 
P.S. We should also be able to rename these structures.
___
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Terraisa Nichols
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2008.01.29 19:22:00 -
[6]
So very signed.
This seems like it would be an excellent stepping stone to full-on 0.0 warfare.
Ill add that I would love to see a way to shoot/hack/whatever lowsec stations to become the official corp/alliance of that station. Those in control wouldn't determine docking but perhaps they could get better refining bonuses and cheaper placement of market orders.
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Gordon Red
SteelVipers
YouWhat
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Posted - 2008.01.29 21:27:00 -
[7]
I agree that there is a need to change some mechanics (also in NPC 0.0!!!) to get real combats. All that remote repping BS at stations or gates (with non-logistics) are a pain in the ass!
The agro making and docking ability has to be changed somehow, but this is difficult, because it get easily out of hand. (like a module that hinders you to dock)
Your ideas are good - somthing to defend - but you can't defend such a fragile structure or spot 23/7. Especially if you are a small corp or mostly one time zone etc.
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.01.29 22:34:00 -
[8]
Non consensual PvP is different from Mandatory PvP.
If your only reason to declare war to someone is to get targets and they have no space assets you can threaten or established trade routes or activities you can target, it is your problem, not the target.
The target has all rights to try to make difficult for you to disrupt his activities, including going to other systems or regions or staying in station playing the market while giving you the finger.
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Emperor D'Hoffryn
No Quarter.
Vae Victis.
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Posted - 2008.01.30 00:35:00 -
[9]
you have some good ideas....defensible objectives that reward a party for "holding" it is not all that bad an idea...might work in factional warfare.
but empire wars themselves are fine. My corp declared war on another corp because they smacked in local, and a very fun war followed, with many good battles, and equal carnage on both sides, plenty of GFs in local, and in the ended up barely in my corps favor as far as kill death ratios are concerned.
You just have to pick your targets. If you pick a target that does not want to fight, why are you surprised when they avoid the fight?
as for the station problem, yea, it sucks, but as there is no way to check outside of station without undocking, undocking can not always be a 1-way trip, cause then station camping would only be MORE boring, as people would not even do tank tests.
Also, empire can be more dangerous than 0.0 against a competant foe...as with 200 in local, it is NOT easy to notice a new hostile in system. When you have 5 people in a system camping a gate, the new hostile that just jumped in is VERY obvious.
 Originally by: Meridius Dex
I could actually fit a Thorax WITH LASERS and get better DPS, better speed, better tank and - wait for it - better cap stability
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Gordon Red
SteelVipers
YouWhat
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Posted - 2008.01.30 11:42:00 -
[10]
Warfare not only in Empire as also in 0.0. :
- blob or be blobbed
- small nano attack commandos (quick in and quick out)
- station or gate games with remote armor reppers (it does not make agro)
(There is only POS-Warfare and even more blobbing that is mostly only for 0.0.)
Sad, but today in EVE there are VERY little fightings that don't fall under the mentioned ones. 
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