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Where is EVE-Online.. when did it become like all the other PVP games?

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Serwincent jr Caldari Gemini Sun	Posted - 2008.02.03 23:55:00 - [1] This game is not what its used to be. When i started is was an charming game with nice and helpful dev's and CCP workers. But be aware that is just on the surface. Form where i stand as a non-PVP player, this game is getting more a game for PVP players, if you ar going to be a PVP player, you dont need to read any more. I dont know how many ppl that er plying the game for PVP or not, but i know that its many players like me that is getting the feeling that the game DEV's are doing more for the PVP parts than they do for the rest of the player non-PVP ppl. Large corps and alliance's is getting some fawors form CCP and the workers there than others. They are destroing the game and diggeing a big hole in the ground for EVE Online. They alwasy modfying the game with pathes that changes the game play getting more and more hard to enjoy. New and old ship is getting changes with pathes so they almost dont fitt anywhere in the game, only as an easy target for PVP players. Green space (safe zone) its more hostile than red space, but in Greenspace you cant use the real war machines, it must be more space dust ther so the ship stop working. The protection forces in green space like Concord and diffrent race forces is gettign smaler and weeker. Ti seems the ist becoming the bad guys(PVP-players) game. Theres no room for non PVP playes in the game any more, nowhere to be safe, nothing to do safly. Well they say they have do alot for Traders, Miners, Builders and Missions runners. they have done that to but it comes with a price. You cant do any of this things without getting run over by PVP players easyer. Thay say that that the they have added more stuff to the game, so ppl have more to do, like exploration, complexes, Missions and invention, code breaking and so on. But i have not seen that they have dont something just for the non PVP players. Like i see it they just feeding the PVP players with more things to shot at and play with. It have been nice if other non-PVP player coming forward and say what they think of the game. Regards Serwincent
Sixtina KL The Shoop Group	Posted - 2008.02.03 23:58:00 - [2] gb2wow, kthxbye. __________________________________
Larg Kellein Caldari Agony Unleashed Agony Empire	Posted - 2008.02.04 00:02:00 - [3] Meh, Eve was always a pvp game, not sure where you've been hiding.
Ursula LeGuinn Versus Gloria Omnis	Posted - 2008.02.04 00:03:00 - [4] I haven't done a lot of PvP yet, as I'm still an EVE-toddler, but here's a question for you: What is the point of playing this game, if you never go out and engage in PvP? I mean that sincerely. EVE's content's all right, but in and of itself, it's not enough to keep me playing for more than a few months. If you're 100% carebear, what is your ultimate goal? Run missions in a CNR for four years, buying faction and officer mod upgrades when you can afford them? Get an ultima-Hulk and mine continually, creating an ever-fatter wallet for yourself? It seems to me that 75% of the appeal of this game goes out the window if there isn't any conflict. ________________
Dirk Magnum Spearhead Endeavors	Posted - 2008.02.04 00:04:00 - [5] Edited by: Dirk Magnum on 04/02/2008 00:05:05 There never was anything to do safely. Used to be that even Concord couldn't stop High sec griefers on a rampage. If people didn't destroy things in combat you industry guys would be out of a job. It wouldn't take nearly as many of you to support mission runners as it does to support the various war machines in motion throughout every sec level. I have never been attacked in high sec ever (a few brief war decs excluded), and it's where I've spent the large majority of my time in Eve. I realize that freighter ganking is the big thing, but that's just symptomatic of industrialists not avoiding 0.5 systems and not using escorts.
Yllse	Posted - 2008.02.04 00:06:00 - [6] I never willingly participate in PvP and yet I find so much more to do in Eve than ever. Missions: always more and now you can share mission rewards so there real incentive for ganging up on them. Salvage, exploration, more-better ships for PvE, invention making T2 available to any who want to build or own. Yes, there are places to be safe, stay in the stations but suicide ganking in high sec seems down. In fact, high sec is as safe as ever and there is so much to do without ever leaving 0.5+ space. And as a pure carebear I realize that most people are not either PvPers or PvEers but most people indulge in activities that fall into both realms. Doing something to improve any aspect of the game means CCP is improving the game for all sorts. For everyone.
Serwincent jr Caldari Gemini Sun	Posted - 2008.02.04 00:15:00 - [7] See the balance in the game now and how it was 3 years ago. It was room for both. And it can still be, and i know CCP and the dev's whant it to. And you i am a carebear, so what? as long as i play the game, and making my self a target for PVP ppl. istn that way pvp players like to play? But it must not be unbalanced, then the fun goes away. Cant you see that`???
Dirk Magnum Spearhead Endeavors	Posted - 2008.02.04 00:18:00 - [8] A combat ship versus and industrial ship is always going to be unbalanced. A PvP setup versus a mission setup may be unbalanced. Given Eve mechanics there is no way to make a perfect balance between anything, which is fine. Unpredictability is this game's strongest selling point imo.
Nkomo Lightbearer	Posted - 2008.02.04 00:22:00 - [9] And he kindly crossposted his whine here just in case any new players missed it. What a sweetie
Serwincent jr Caldari Gemini Sun	Posted - 2008.02.04 00:22:00 - [10] Originally by: Dirk Magnum A combat ship versus and industrial ship is always going to be unbalanced. A PvP setup versus a mission setup may be unbalanced. Given Eve mechanics there is no way to make a perfect balance between anything, which is fine. Unpredictability is this game's strongest selling point imo. Well you realy did understand what i was talking about. realy, grats to you. Nice kip going.
Serwincent jr Caldari Gemini Sun	Posted - 2008.02.04 00:28:00 - [11] Originally by: Nkomo Lightbearer And he kindly crossposted his whine here just in case any new players missed it. What a sweetie Well we all can do something wrong, sorry abot that, i was told to post it here instead, aften it was posted the other places
Dirk Magnum Spearhead Endeavors	Posted - 2008.02.04 00:34:00 - [12] Well it's just when someone complains about too much PvP and then calls themselves a carebear and talks about things being unbalanced, it's hard not to assume given a lack of other context that the person perceives the PvP ships to be unbalanced compared to carebear ships.
Sophal	Posted - 2008.02.04 00:36:00 - [13] Originally by: Sixtina KL gb2wow, kthxbye. THIS
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2008.02.04 00:51:00 - [14] are you the one that got ganked today?
Tei Ming	Posted - 2008.02.04 01:27:00 - [15] Originally by: Serwincent jr This game is not what its used to be. When i started is was an charming game with nice and helpful dev's and CCP workers. But be aware that is just on the surface. Form where i stand as a non-PVP player, this game is getting more a game for PVP players, if you ar going to be a PVP player, you dont need to read any more. I dont know how many ppl that er plying the game for PVP or not, but i know that its many players like me that is getting the feeling that the game DEV's are doing more for the PVP parts than they do for the rest of the player non-PVP ppl. Large corps and alliance's is getting some fawors form CCP and the workers there than others. They are destroing the game and diggeing a big hole in the ground for EVE Online. They alwasy modfying the game with pathes that changes the game play getting more and more hard to enjoy. New and old ship is getting changes with pathes so they almost dont fitt anywhere in the game, only as an easy target for PVP players. Green space (safe zone) its more hostile than red space, but in Greenspace you cant use the real war machines, it must be more space dust ther so the ship stop working. The protection forces in green space like Concord and diffrent race forces is gettign smaler and weeker. Ti seems the ist becoming the bad guys(PVP-players) game. Theres no room for non PVP playes in the game any more, nowhere to be safe, nothing to do safly. Well they say they have do alot for Traders, Miners, Builders and Missions runners. they have done that to but it comes with a price. You cant do any of this things without getting run over by PVP players easyer. Thay say that that the they have added more stuff to the game, so ppl have more to do, like exploration, complexes, Missions and invention, code breaking and so on. But i have not seen that they have dont something just for the non PVP players. Like i see it they just feeding the PVP players with more things to shot at and play with. It have been nice if other non-PVP player coming forward and say what they think of the game. Regards Serwincent Ive been here since Beta 1. That was well over five and a half years now. This game has always been PvP - intense.
Barlaka Amarr Thermopile Systems	Posted - 2008.02.04 02:32:00 - [16] Originally by: Serwincent jr "When i started is was an charming game with nice and helpful dev's and CCP workers." It still is "Green space (safe zone) its more hostile than red space..." The scumsucker is located at Gelfiven... Get out of the Gelfiven,Teonusude and Gulfonooi systems it's target rich empire (green space) space. I'd hunt there too if i was Piwate. "Theres no room for non PVP playes in the game any more, nowhere to be safe, nothing to do safly." See above. "It have been nice if other non-PVP player coming forward and say what they think of the game." I am a mostly non-PVP and i think is a charming game with optional face shooting. B Catch the bullet or carry the gun The choice is yours [REMOVED IMAGE]
Kyra Felann Gallente Noir.	Posted - 2008.02.04 02:36:00 - [17] This has always been primarily a PvP game. CCP has said as much. If you don't like it, go back to WoW.
Marcus TheMartin Gallente Tuxedo.	Posted - 2008.02.04 02:38:00 - [18] Nerf highsec, Boost lowsec! LOW REWARDS IN LOW RISK SITUATIONS!
Athyrial	Posted - 2008.02.04 02:45:00 - [19] Perhaps your thinking of EVE the wrong way Don't conisder PvPers as PvPers. Think of them as just one more random AI bot trying to get the best of you. But seriously EVE without player interaction and player conflict is Microsoft Excel with a monthly fee. Unless all your hard work actually means somthing its nothing more than numbers on a spreadsheet. e.g. If there was no PvP in EVE then 0.0 would be littered by player outposts , it would be like player housing, the EVE endgame would be to have your own station and then what ? A station is meaningless unless there is always the risk you can lose it, same goes for everything in EVE is there is no risk there is no EVE If you want to play a game with no risk I suggest you quit EVE put 14.99 in a bank each month track it on a spreadsheet and chat with your old corp on Teamspeak while they play EVE. This way your risk free investment grows no chance of losing it to a PvPers and you still have the social aspect
Ikasu Gallente The Durandal Organization	Posted - 2008.02.04 02:46:00 - [20] Originally by: Ursula LeGuinn I haven't done a lot of PvP yet, as I'm still an EVE-toddler, but here's a question for you: What is the point of playing this game, if you never go out and engage in PvP? I mean that sincerely. EVE's content's all right, but in and of itself, it's not enough to keep me playing for more than a few months. If you're 100% carebear, what is your ultimate goal? Run missions in a CNR for four years, buying faction and officer mod upgrades when you can afford them? Get an ultima-Hulk and mine continually, creating an ever-fatter wallet for yourself? It seems to me that 75% of the appeal of this game goes out the window if there isn't any conflict. I argue to differ. Eve is NOT for Pvp, not in ship vs ship sense. The good thing about Eve is that you can play it any way you want with any goal. What's you goal in pvp? There is none, blow **** up. If your a 0.0 goer you can take space and build a goal, but flying around and griefing has no ultimate aim. Playing the market and carebearing, however, can have the goal of riches and rewards as you stack your wallet to do epic win related things. Personally, I run anti pirate, but before lately I was almost completely mission runner, and I enjoyed it. I dislike it when people try to tell others how to play. Eve is not for pvp, it never has been, never will be. To the OP, your wrong. Concord got a boost several months back making them much better then they were before, you thing it's dangerous you should have been around during the freighter ganks. Stay in the right high sec and carebearing is easy, heck, I use to stay in .5 without even a scratch. Sounds to me like you just got unlucky with something.
Kyra Felann Gallente Noir.	Posted - 2008.02.04 03:24:00 - [21] Originally by: Ikasu I argue to differ. Eve is NOT for Pvp, not in ship vs ship sense. The good thing about Eve is that you can play it any way you want with any goal. What's you goal in pvp? There is none, blow ** up. If your a 0.0 goer you can take space and build a goal, but flying around and griefing has no ultimate aim. Playing the market and carebearing, however, can have the goal of riches and rewards as you stack your wallet to do epic win related things. Personally, I run anti pirate, but before lately I was almost completely mission runner, and I enjoyed it. I dislike it when people try to tell others how to play. Eve is not for pvp, it never has been, never will be. I guess you should inform CCP of that. "We're complex, we're open ended, we're fully PvP oriented** and you can lose six months work in a second." Here is a link to the interview. There are a few things to do in Eve besides PvP (remember trading and even mining are forms of PvP), but the game is primarily PvP based. The PvE part of the game (missions, killing NPCs, exploring) is such a tiny part compared to the rest of the stuff you can do that to argue that it's not mainly about PvP is to be in denial.
Haakelen Gallente United Forces Black Star Alliance	Posted - 2008.02.04 03:24:00 - [22] Is it that time of the week already?
Rawr Cristina Caldari Cult of Rawr	Posted - 2008.02.04 04:01:00 - [23] EVE used to be MUCH harsher for less PVP-oriented players than it is now and there wasn't very much you could do PvE-wise (bar Mining) IF you think that this game is wavering over to the side of PvP over PvE then you haven't played very long
Maraude Fury Minmatar Shadow Of The Light Scorched Earth Directive	Posted - 2008.02.04 06:09:00 - [24] Originally by: Kyra Felann Edited by: Kyra Felann on 04/02/2008 03:26:38 Originally by: Ikasu I argue to differ. Eve is NOT for Pvp, not in ship vs ship sense. The good thing about Eve is that you can play it any way you want with any goal. What's you goal in pvp? There is none, blow ** up. If your a 0.0 goer you can take space and build a goal, but flying around and griefing has no ultimate aim. Playing the market and carebearing, however, can have the goal of riches and rewards as you stack your wallet to do epic win related things. Personally, I run anti pirate, but before lately I was almost completely mission runner, and I enjoyed it. I dislike it when people try to tell others how to play. Eve is not for pvp, it never has been, never will be. I guess you should inform CCP of that. "We're complex, we're open ended, we're fully PvP oriented and you can lose six months work in a second." Here is a link to the interview. ...the core of the market is the competitive players. EVE is a PvP game**. But I want to note that this doesn't simply mean people running around shooting each other like in Counter Strike. People are competing against each other on many levels. For example, huge infrastructures competing in manufacturing efficiency and market actions. Here is that interview. There are a few things to do in Eve besides PvP (remember trading and even mining are forms of PvP), but the game is primarily PvP based. The PvE part of the game (missions, killing NPCs, exploring) is such a tiny part compared to the rest of the stuff you can do that to argue that it's not mainly about PvP is to be in denial. I wrote something similar up, saw this, and deleted my post. What She said.. Every aspect of EVE is PVP or PVP based, or focus's on PVP. If you don't like it, go to WOW. Which is a big comback on these forums, but in reality, WOW is the same thing. The lvl grind to 70 or whatever the top is, is just a prelude to the pvp aspect of the game. MMO's in general ALL focus on PVP. Meaning players competeing against other players. It doesn't have to be competition as in combat pew pew yarr.. hell, Chess is a PVP game. Dictator: Scorched Earth Directive Alliance Lets Burn It All Down
Dezzereth Two Swords Guild	Posted - 2008.02.04 06:39:00 - [25] OP, get together with this guy - could be a fun discussion. /me gets the popcorn. The more people, the more viewpoints. EVE was always PVP oriented, and it was never a safe place after you undocked (Yulai anyone?).
Tobias Sjodin Ore Mongers R0ADKILL	Posted - 2008.02.04 08:11:00 - [26] Originally by: Marcus TheMartin Nerf highsec, Boost lowsec! LOW REWARDS IN LOW RISK SITUATIONS! QFT "Bring back the pain."
Vabjekf	Posted - 2008.02.04 08:23:00 - [27] I never understood why people assume that pvp means you can just attack anyone. I used to play a game, a long long looong time ago. Long before EQ or even UO. It was an online rpg, it had pvp. What pvp meant was that you could attack other players, not that that was what you where supposed to do full stop. Reality is pvp. You can get a gun and go attack anyone you see if you wanted to. You dont though. This game was supposed to be a space/empire simulation. People playing it like counterstrike are doing it wrong.
Kastar Paragon Horizons Intergalactic Brotherhood	Posted - 2008.02.04 08:59:00 - [28] Hmmmm I'd even dare say eve isn't a PVP game anymore. It's becoming "I have more friends to bring than you"-online. There's no more room for skill and tactics. When you try, you either find a bigger blob or your screen not loading anymore There's certainly room for non-pvp'ers. I'd say more than ever. Fact is that eve is getting more and pore bi-polar. On one hand you have the diehards that still swear by fleetfests in which their screens don't load for 15 minutes, they die and wake up in a station without knowing what happened. On the other hand there's the many folks in highsec getting richer and richer and not doing anything with their riches except gather more riches. -----------------------------------------------
Gamesguy Amarr D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.02.04 09:16:00 - [29] Edited by: Gamesguy on 04/02/2008 09:16:50 Originally by: Vabjekf I never understood why people assume that pvp means you can just attack anyone. I used to play a game, a long long looong time ago. Long before EQ or even UO. It was an online rpg, it had pvp. What pvp meant was that you could attack other players, not that that was what you where supposed to do full stop. Reality is pvp. You can get a gun and go attack anyone you see if you wanted to. You dont though. This game was supposed to be a space/empire simulation. People playing it like counterstrike are doing it wrong. No what you want is arena pvp, go play guild wars if you want zero loss arena pvp. Empire sim you say? Ok, eve simulates a galaxy where there are vast unexplored lawless space where there are no rules. And guess what? Human nature takes over when this is the case. No, you DONT want a true "simulator", because this would mean that you would accept that people would act exactly the way they do in eve whenever law and order breaks down or is nonexistent. Look at areas of Africa where the law is nonexistent, people are commiting genocide against each other, and roving bands of soldiers loot, rape, and kill whatever and whoever they want. Kinda similar to lowsec/0.0 doesnt it?
Vabjekf	Posted - 2008.02.04 09:37:00 - [30] Originally by: Gamesguy No what you want is arena pvp, go play guild wars if you want zero loss arena pvp. How is that arena pvp? The fact that people are playing this game like it IS one big arena is what im complaining about. Quote: Empire sim you say? Ok, eve simulates a galaxy where there are vast unexplored lawless space where there are no rules. And guess what? Human nature takes over when this is the case. No, the world HAS been like this before, and everyone does not just go around pewpewing eachother. When you passed someone else on the road, you where wary because they could attack you. You did not just club every passing stranger over the head. Quote: No, you DONT want a true "simulator", because this would mean that you would accept that people would act exactly the way they do in eve whenever law and order breaks down or is nonexistent. When law and order break down people do not go out ganking each other for fun or killmails. A few people do perhaps, and those people quickly get killed if they become too big of a problem. Quote: Look at areas of Africa where the law is nonexistent, people are commiting genocide against each other, and roving bands of soldiers loot, rape, and kill whatever and whoever they want. Kinda similar to lowsec/0.0 doesnt it? They are doing that for ideological reasons, or rather because they have an ideological excuse to do it. Not just because they 'can'. And no, they don't kill whatever or whoever they want. They kill specific people. If this game was like reality it would be much like it is now. Only concord/the empires/whatever would hunt down and eliminate people who are too big of a problem. The problem is that since there is no perma death the small problem keeps coming back, over and over. And no, im not asking for permadeath. Im asking for people to stop playing for kill/death ratios or just because they feel like it. Being careful about how you deal with people because they could kill you = good Knowing that everyone will attack for no reason = bad.

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