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Revolution Rising
Venture Research and Resources
New Eden Research
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Posted - 2008.02.25 02:57:00 -
[1]
I've taken a look around and found several tutorials for invention and various t1 production tutes, However I've not found any decent cost analysis for t2 blueprint invention nor any really good tutorials on "best practices" for making money through t2 invention or production.
It also occurs to me to ask about anyone's observations regarding the invention market and good money-makers if I were to diversify down this path. A year ago hulks were 500m each making a pretty decent profit, and while this has been nerfed somewhat, I'm sure there are other good paths to go down. Any help along these lines would be great.
Thanks
RR.
VRR Homepage
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Kazuo Ishiguro
House of Marbles
Zzz
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Posted - 2008.02.25 08:16:00 -
[2]
Let's suppose I know of some items that are highly lucrative to invent, or I have a market where I hold a near-monopoly on these items. Why would I want to tell a potential competitor about them?
All the information you need to make an informed decision is already publicly available, but don't expect anyone else to make it any easier for you.
My research services
Spreadsheets: Top speed calculation - Halo Implant stats |
Daerkannon Shimmerscale
Gallente
Paxton Industries
Paxton Federation
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Posted - 2008.02.25 15:45:00 -
[3]
Not to mention that the calculations for what is profitable and the best way to invent something are non-trivial and the result can change depending on what you're inventing.
First we start with your basic invention costs: the BPC(s) (one run or max run?) and datacores. Now you have to figure out which decryptor to use, if any, and balance the success rate vs. the number of runs vs. the material level of the final BPC.
To add to all of that confusion we still don't know what the actual success rates to expect are for invention (although there is some good and likely very close values out there).
All that being said there are a couple of spreadsheets floating around that try to do this for you, and I believe Eve Meep has some of that functionality as well (but I don't know what they use to figure success rates).
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Honest officer, the dwarf was on fire when I got here!
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William Ortega
Grave Diggers
Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.02.25 18:23:00 -
[4]
Since you are in a research corp, I'll assume that you have access to copy lines and a POS.
Some good practices for you:
*When trying to figure out your costs and what to charge for your product, consider using the "average" cost of invention. You may have had a few lucky streaks and may be tempted to pass along these savings, but in the long run you'll be taking a hit due to streaks of losses.
*Go into module invention/production first. You'll be making less money than if you went into ship production but your start up costs will be less and your chances to go bankrupt due to a series of losses on invention will also be less. (do NOT go into BS or capital invention. Success rates on those are low enough that 10+ loss streaks are quite likely. You need very very deep pockets to ride out the uncertainty and start making money on the averages)
*Make sure you have enough start up capital to run 5+ manufacturing lines for whatever module/ship you make. Invention/manufacturing of t2 IS NOT a "cheap way to make ships/modules for yourself". People who try to do this just to supply themselves with cheap ships and work on a small scale invariably walk away dissappointed.
*Make spreadsheets, use the ones floating around, use eve meep,... whatever you can. Remember if you do both invention and manufacturing you can use non-obvious decryptors and even if you take a hit on invention you can recoup your losses in the manufacturing phase.
*Diversify... a lot. The market these days is like an eel... always shifting. I am switching my primary module yet again in a few weeks as the profit margins grow slim.
-Willy |
DOC PIC
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Posted - 2008.02.25 19:08:00 -
[5]
As others have posted.. Sorry but you will get very few easy answers you are looking for.. Invnetion is what trading used to be in 03-04.., a highly hush hush operation. People are reluctant to give out their secrets to a potential competitor.Is like hey bud where you get your stuff from and how much, I am opening a shop next to you.
As all further tech will be playr driven, you will find there will be less players willing to give out the more indepth inormation.. And to be brutally honest, we worked at finding this stuff out, I have been doing invention since day 1 so why should I hand over all my hard work to you?
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Etanna
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Posted - 2008.02.26 12:24:00 -
[6]
 Originally by: William Ortega
*Go into module invention/production first. You'll be making less money than if you went into ship production but your start up costs will be less and your chances to go bankrupt due to a series of losses on invention will also be less.
I totally agree. This is where I started with just 10mio isk and a few bpos.
Originally by: William Ortega
*Make spreadsheets, use the ones floating around, use eve meep,... whatever you can. Remember if you do both invention and manufacturing you can use non-obvious decryptors and even if you take a hit on invention you can recoup your losses in the manufacturing phase.
*Diversify... a lot. The market these days is like an eel... always shifting. I am switching my primary module yet again in a few weeks as the profit margins grow slim.
Again, I can't agree more. Use whatever tools other people are supplying. I got hold of an Invention spredsheet and so far that has proved to be "nearly" spot on, rate wise. I have also developed a spreadsheet which gives me an overall price which it costs me to produce, then I can see what I can sell it at and determine profit margins. As William Ortega has mentioned, the market is always fluctuating. I'm constantly changing prices in line with the market but I always make sure I don't go any lower than my cost to invent/produce.
Best thing to do is study the market place. See whats hot, whats not. You'll never get anywhere if you don't.
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