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Extreme
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Posted - 2004.04.07 22:41:00 -
[1]
So how do we get compensated ?
We just start with a new faction back to zero ?
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Black January
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Posted - 2004.04.07 22:42:00 -
[2]
Read this thread:
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=71996
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Extreme
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Posted - 2004.04.07 22:45:00 -
[3]
Thats a discussion in there that has already being discussed.
Papa Smurf said on another thread that to have prÚ stock of ores and mineral is an exploit 
My question is HOW WILL WE GET COMPENSATED ?
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Feral
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Posted - 2004.04.07 22:45:00 -
[4]
Extreme, none of your ratings been affected. Mining agents were flawed, and have been disabled by the devs.
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Lord Terror
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Posted - 2004.04.07 22:58:00 -
[5]
I did 400+ mission to get me a Miner II BP, then CCP upgraded to Castor and all efforts were gone.
Now i have a good standing witht the minmatar mining faction and now all efforts done got terminated AGAIN.
If i want to do killmissions i would have chosen another faction.
Please lockdown researchagents too as most have prÚ stock of what they require from you as well !! 
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AbraKadaver
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Posted - 2004.04.07 23:01:00 -
[6]
When a minority exploit the system, its always the majority that lose out. So you have your fellow eve players to blame, hope they feel that it was worth it 
..:: Electro-shock therapy ::..
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Extreme
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Posted - 2004.04.07 23:01:00 -
[7]
"Please lockdown researchagents too as most have prÚ stock of what they require from you as well"
YOU MADE A GOOD POINT THERE !!
STOP THE R&D EXPLOITERS TOO, no more stocks on R&D !
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Feral
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Posted - 2004.04.07 23:02:00 -
[8]
 Quote:
Please lockdown researchagents too as most have prÚ stock of what they require from you as well !!
You appear not to understand the problem. Mining agents were deactivated as people were doing 5-6 or more missions a minute. The problem was not the prestock, it was the fact that no other mission type allowed this sort of mission completion speed.
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Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.04.07 23:04:00 -
[9]
Quote:
"Please lockdown researchagents too as most have prÚ stock of what they require from you as well"
YOU MADE A GOOD POINT THERE !!
STOP THE R&D EXPLOITERS TOO, no more stocks on R&D !
Well it would of been a good point if that's what they'd meant. As it is they didn't...but whatever floats yer boat i guess.
Grab yourself a mug of tea and go look up the names of those massively exploiting poksu mining agents in new caldari if you want somebodyto blame though. Wont take you long.
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Extreme
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Posted - 2004.04.07 23:06:00 -
[10]
Quote:
Quote:
Please lockdown researchagents too as most have prÚ stock of what they require from you as well !!
You appear not to understand the problem. Mining agents were deactivated as people were doing 5-6 or more missions a minute. The problem was not the prestock, it was the fact that no other mission type allowed this sort of mission completion speed.
So let them bring back the timebuffer between missions.
In the old days missions had a 15 minutes buffer.
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Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.04.07 23:09:00 -
[11]
nooooooo! Not 15 minutes!
The *point* has to be there must be a minimum desired timer on the part of CCP, an *ideal* minimal time (or whatever youw ant to call it).
On the working assumption that agents giving missions to kill ships in the same system is not an exploit then thats probably the quickest missiontype out.. and thats about 3 or 4 minutes I would have thought?
Anyway - there's your timer... n'estpas?
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Lord Terror
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Posted - 2004.04.07 23:17:00 -
[12]
400+ missions -> no Miner II BP (PrÚ Castor)
R&D agent level 3 -> researching since december 2003 still no BP offered
And now Mining L3 agents closed down without some kind of compensation
Makes me really wonder if i should continue playing Eve 
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Ooke
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Posted - 2004.04.07 23:19:00 -
[13]
how about something new, timers are a lame way of controlling people's activities.
why not specific astral objects that have to be mined ala the starter asteroid, like asteroids that have to be destroyed before they crash into station/planet/gate.
or resources other than just minerals? like O2, Uranium, Plutonium and Carbon. Make it so that only 20-40% at most are ore/mineral acquisition missions.
there are lots of ways to "fix" this without putting back a timer.
Ooke: May Contain Nuts |
Feral
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Posted - 2004.04.07 23:20:00 -
[14]
Lord Terror, 72k rp's and counting, and no BP. You arent alone.
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Extreme
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Posted - 2004.04.07 23:34:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Extreme on 07/04/2004 23:35:56
I think THIS is a solution:
I suggest:
When you turn down a mission you get a 15 minute penalty.
As long as you accept and accomplish a mission there's no (time)penalty at all.
Its CCP that will have to make a mix of missions; example: after max. 8 missions (wich can be done with prÚstock) the agent MUST give out a courrier mission.
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Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.04.07 23:42:00 -
[16]
Quote:
I think THIS is a solution:
I suggest: When you turn down a mission you get a 15 minute penalty.
As long as you accept and accomplish a mission there's no (time)penalty at all.
Its CCP that will have to make a mix of missions; example: after max. 8 missions (wich can be done with prÚstock) the agent MUST give out a courrier mission.
Its a good idea - but it still caters with bias to mining missions way over any other mission type. No other form of agent gives out so many insta-possible missions in the first place, and its that which is the crux of the issue.
Allowing 8 in a row and then even a 15 minute fail still leaves the average way above that of a nomralised agent who may only be ble to do 4,5 or 6 in an hour - maybe 10 or 12 if they were incredibly lucky with same-system kill missions and didnt loot anything.
I think the appreciation of the vast difference between number of possible missions for different types of agents is somewhat lacking. You just can do that many missions wiht other agent types.
Therein lies the imbalance. (imo)
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Sylia Masters
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Posted - 2004.04.08 00:48:00 -
[17]
One way to deal with mining agents is they want you to mine a particular astroid(s) for the minerals. A bookmark could be given, and off you go. Once the astroid(s) are poped you can then finish the mission. The astroid(s) could contain only set ammount of ore in them, and are spawned in the same way kill missions are spawned
Another way to deal with mining agents could be changing them so they are brokers of sorts. Sell them minerals and ore, and recive a certain amount of isk and standing increase (and a lower increase as standing raises). Perhaps getting discounst from that corperation on set items, or all items that corperation sells; in exchange for a lower then npc market value for ore/minerals sold to them.
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Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.04.08 01:04:00 -
[18]
Quote:
One way to deal with mining agents is they want you to mine a particular astroid(s) for the minerals. A bookmark could be given, and off you go. Once the astroid(s) are poped you can then finish the mission. The astroid(s) could contain only set ammount of ore in them, and are spawned in the same way kill missions are spawned
That is VERY good thinking indeed.
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Cirle
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Posted - 2004.04.08 09:10:00 -
[19]
Quote:
Edited by: Extreme on 07/04/2004 23:35:56
I think THIS is a solution:
I suggest:
When you turn down a mission you get a 15 minute penalty.
As long as you accept and accomplish a mission there's no (time)penalty at all.
Not acceptable, as then you punish the genuine agent runner who gets a random 24 hop delivery which they can not possibly complete, or a kill agent runner who receives an 85k cruiser kill mission when all they have is a low level cruiser or frigate; why should they suffer for not being physically able to complete a mission and so validly turning it down?
A variant on the timer theme would be a proportional variant which added an increasing delay between missions the faster you do them, averaging out at 10 missions an hour or so... however, all that would then happen is people would flit from mining agent to mining agent and return. You can't simply do the check as 'do they own this material here? yes, do not offer it then' as there are too many ways around the checking code, etc...
What might work is if you reject a mission you do not have a timer, or maybe a one minute one, but if you accept a mission then it triggers a five/ten minute timer. That way you would still be able to insta-mission, but only at a severely reduced rate. In theory the travel time between two stations should be a minute or so anyway, and thus even if you find a location with two agents in the same system you are running at a reduced rate.
Cirle |
Athule Snanm
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Posted - 2004.04.08 10:50:00 -
[20]
Quote:
Quote:
One way to deal with mining agents is they want you to mine a particular astroid(s) for the minerals. A bookmark could be given, and off you go. Once the astroid(s) are poped you can then finish the mission. The astroid(s) could contain only set ammount of ore in them, and are spawned in the same way kill missions are spawned
That is VERY good thinking indeed.
I agree completely. Combat missions are made more 'interesting' by adding more and harder ships - I think it's a lot, lot harder to think of non-combat missions that are both non-exploitable, scalable and vaguely believable. I'd love to see more ideas like the one above that think even slightly outside of the box and not just 'make the number of jumps longer' or 'increase the cargo size' which in effect make most missions like some sort of very slow torture for the most part. Even better I'd like to see strings of missions that depend on each other, maybe ones where you have multiple ways of completing them which have different end results (a bit like the science graduates missions, but more subtle).
_______________________________
Doomheim - EVE's only hygiene! |
Illia Pol
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Posted - 2004.04.08 12:31:00 -
[21]
Quote:
One way to deal with mining agents is they want you to mine a particular astroid(s) for the minerals. A bookmark could be given, and off you go. Once the astroid(s) are poped you can then finish the mission. The astroid(s) could contain only set ammount of ore in them, and are spawned in the same way kill missions are spawned
Very good idea. Nice job!
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Harisdrop
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Posted - 2004.04.08 12:51:00 -
[22]
I say 30 minute timer. The timer should be placed on all agents. This would stop those that decline to make it feasible money maker. Also when you have a basic mineral request have it at below cost to an agent so negotiations does not give you 30 isk per trit or 900 per nox. So all rewards for minerals would be items or bp. This fed the exploit.
The missions to destroy astroids would be cool. Maybe a mix where you have to destroy and have to get the minerals out of it and make it that at level 3 you have to have the refining skill of the astroid to get the proper amount of minerals. Having a 24 hour time limit would suffice and make the roid like 40k of plag or 200k of Veld.
Make sure mineral missions give no isk. This is major....
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Garsh ma it soo cool killing people in there space thingies |
Tanner Mirabel
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Posted - 2004.04.08 13:08:00 -
[23]
Im still not sure I get the idea of this being an exploit. Non of my agents have been locked down so maybe its something Ive not had experience of or maybe there is some side of it that Im missing.
I made my base at my main agents station for simplified logistics. As well as run missions I mine and I build so I always have large amounts of minerals in my hanger. If my agent asks me for minerals I give them to her. I don't see the difference in if Ive spent the time mining them before the mission or after Ive accepted it. I also don't see a difference in being able to do that and a mission asking for trade goods which could be bought (or already have) at the agents station. I know these are rarer than before but I do still get some
Another point would be if its an exploit to use goods you already have in your station would it be an exploit to see what the mission is asking for then going to get it before accepting the mission to ensure you get the time bonus. This seems to be more of an exploit to me.
Ive got to say the idea of spawning the roids that need mining is great, we need some more creative thinking like that to get these missions more interesting.
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Tanner Mirabel
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Posted - 2004.04.08 14:22:00 -
[24]
Ah, found the post below, now I see. I just get the occaisional mission for mins, didn't realise there were missions that allowed this.
Quote
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Just my two cents on the subject.
Recently a lot of people convo me to acquire one of my office in NEW CALDARI - MATIGU - Poksu Mineral Group. Offer was growing and growing .. finally I sold it for 50M and the reason why so many people want this office so much.
here after the log of the discussion (I Just erase the name of the buyer):
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Qinglong > k ... I take my cargo and go there
Qinglong > May be later when you have it you may explain me why so many people want this office ... I received 3 contact this week ??
****** > Sure ill tell you why i need it... when i get it
...<cut out of the subject>...
Qinglong > may be you may explain me why so many need an office here ?
****** > Well the reson is. that is a lvl 3 mining agent here
****** > We have about 10 members doing agent missions for him and we get about 250-500 mill per day
Qinglong > ok
****** > if you organize the agent group you can supply all ore and minerals in hangers and then they dont have to go out of the station
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250 to 500 M ISK by day ... I do not know if it is true or not ... the guy looks kind and serious about it ...
I think that winning so many in one day in 1.0 space probably change the balance of power in the area between corps which use the exploit and corps which don't ...
No wonder I can't get a good price on my Willpower implants anymore if the market was getting flooded like this.
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Sylia Masters
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Posted - 2004.04.10 17:24:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Sylia Masters on 10/04/2004 18:05:20
That is crazy :(
About my 2nd idea. CCP has the code to spawn roids for missions; the new character tutorial. CCP has the code that spawns NPCs at a 'random' spot in a system for kill missions. However I'm not going to say it's going to be 'easy' But perhaps they can use those.
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Jed Whitten
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Posted - 2004.04.10 18:45:00 -
[26]
Quote:
I say 30 minute timer. The timer should be placed on all agents.
Errr ... bad idea, mate, and I tell you why:
How about kill missions? I recently picked up working for an NPC corp which hand out lots of kill missions. My ship: Rifter with 2x280's and 2xlauncher, fitted with heavies, defenders and a few cruise missiles.
If the kill mission is in the same system, I finish it in under 3 minutes. If it is 1-2 jumps away, then 5-8 minutes.
Imposing a 30 minute timer on ALL missions would make agent running as boring as mining as you'd have to sit out ~20 minutes between missions. Not my kind of fun ...
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