Pages: 1 [2] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
DigitalCommunist
Obsidian Core
|
Posted - 2008.03.22 22:20:00 -
[31]
The ship definitely has a role, and whether you consider it fun is a matter of perspective. I'm sure a lot of people might enjoy the idea of participating in the fleet battles that go down during POS ops, and still aiding the siege part greatly. Right now, most Dread pilots also have a second account doing other tasks. This is even more ex
And the whole idea is to give standard gangs/fleets the option to reinforce and/or destroy towers without going back, and organizing a Dread Op. Right now, any siege of online POS by small entities is met with great deliberation. You blurt out on ts "hey guys, lets shoot some pos while we're here" on TS and its the EVE equivalent of announcing you finger barn animals.
I don't care if you dislike the ship, or my implementation, but the pos-killing side of PVP needs to be made a *lot* more common.
If you have better ideas for doing that, without dramatic changes, lets hear em. _______________________________ http://epicwords.net/ |
Deva Blackfire
D00M. Triumvirate.
|
Posted - 2008.03.22 22:28:00 -
[32]
One question:
do you seriously think that implementing 1bil ship that does 2x more damage than normal BS vs pos (and is as fragile) will suddenly make everyone rush for poskills? Or is it going to be another "pimp bs" for rich which will see the battlefield once in a while (might be good for mission runners as secondary damage tho).
|
DigitalCommunist
Obsidian Core
|
Posted - 2008.03.22 22:47:00 -
[33]
1. It's not as fragile as a normal BS. Imagine Marauders with double hp/resist bonuses from gang boosts/titans. They would be the hardest tanked sub-capital ships in EVE.
2. Double damage is more than enough value, difference between 20 BS and 10BS, or 10BS and 5BS means a lot for taking on POS. That is my opinion though, and I wouldn't mind if it were increased to three times damage output. But I do think it should take 10-15min to build up at that point.
3. It may not rush individuals to go kill POS, but statistically you'll see the number increase as smaller gangs become viable, and larger gangs do it in far less time. _______________________________ http://epicwords.net/ |
Howling Jinn
Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk Amarr branch.
|
Posted - 2008.03.22 23:25:00 -
[34]
so whats stop people from getting 100 of these and go around nuking pos's at random?
|
DigitalCommunist
Obsidian Core
|
Posted - 2008.03.22 23:38:00 -
[35]
The same thing that's stopping people from getting 30 dreads and nuking POS at random: Nothing. _______________________________ http://epicwords.net/ |
Deva Blackfire
D00M. Triumvirate.
|
Posted - 2008.03.23 00:20:00 -
[36]
Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 23/03/2008 00:20:03 "nothing" is wrong answer. Id say: lack of balls to do so.
If you drop 30 dreads at pos - you will only knock it into reinforced. When you come to finish it off you can be sure owner saw this and will be ready.
And thats also part where "small gang warfare" using those BS fails to deliever. They will get blobbed and wiped out (so will small number of dreads).
|
Ravenal
The Fated Odyssey.
|
Posted - 2008.03.23 15:38:00 -
[37]
well, i for one like the idea... might not like the exact implementation of it.
But most def need another option to pos warfare than capitals or tons of bships. . |
Ravenal
The Fated Odyssey.
|
Posted - 2008.03.23 15:40:00 -
[38]
Originally by: DigitalCommunist
If you have better ideas for doing that, without dramatic changes, lets hear em.
Like I said before... implement a structure damage bonus. Apply it to these t2 bships and destroyers (tier 2 and t2 versions thereof maybe)
. |
DigitalCommunist
Obsidian Core
|
Posted - 2008.03.23 16:12:00 -
[39]
Edited by: DigitalCommunist on 23/03/2008 16:13:14
Originally by: Deva Blackfire Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 23/03/2008 00:20:03 "nothing" is wrong answer. Id say: lack of balls to do so.
If you drop 30 dreads at pos - you will only knock it into reinforced. When you come to finish it off you can be sure owner saw this and will be ready.
And thats also part where "small gang warfare" using those BS fails to deliever. They will get blobbed and wiped out (so will small number of dreads).
I don't understand why someone would lack balls if they don't have enough people to counter a blob. And most POS owners are not backed by any strong military force that's willing to defend them.
If you go shoot up the POS of a big alliance, sure you might get blobbed. But this whole suggestion is to allow smaller groups to settle POS disputes. Nothing on the large scale would be affected, so its meaningless to discuss.
We are talking 10-30 man gangs/corps here, which is like... the common size in EVE.. being able to get involved in a part of warfare they were previously unable to.
_______________________________ http://epicwords.net/ |
Anubis Xian
Vertigo One
|
Posted - 2008.03.23 16:36:00 -
[40]
Originally by: DigitalCommunist You missed the part where I said you first have to find a valid role before introducing more T2 ships. Both of your ideas would cripple combat in EVE.
People have said stuff like that since Interceptors.
I did come up with the roles and general ideas behind all current T2 BS before they hit the drawing board...I generate ideas like a fat man generates Methane...sometimes they smell just as bad.
Too bad I keep changing my public name...I also invented the current Sovereignty Level mechanics...tho my system went up to Regional and System Level 5.
Anyway, I've said that one line of T2 BS, should be Super Cov Ops (Black Ops). I've also said all BSes should be kicked down in hardpoints with damage compensaters to help with lag AND to give them even more versatility.
Perhaps the Tier 3 T2 BS should go something like this:
Mantorok (T2 Abbadon)
BS Bonus: 5% Dmg and Armor Resists
Advanced Battleship Skill Bonus: 20% Stasis Webifier Range and 10% Capacitor Capacity per level
Role Bonus: 100% Laser Damage Increase and +25% ECCM and Sensor Booster Effectiveness
8 Turrets (Can only fit 4 Large Lasers, the other turrets can be fit with mediums or smalls...it IS a Battleship afterall and the non Large Specific Bonuses would apply to them too) 0 Launchers (to avoid fitting Torps or Cruise with the Large Laser limitation)
Give it something like: 8/5/7 with Marauder level grid and there you go...the PvPer's Paladin.
Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
|
|
Slade Hoo
xPlaguex
|
Posted - 2008.03.23 19:07:00 -
[41]
I'd really like to have a Khanid Abaddon with Torps. I could adapt to any role that whould be assigned for this T2-Class. But gimme Torps!
|
El Yatta
Mercenary Forces
|
Posted - 2008.03.23 19:27:00 -
[42]
Edited by: El Yatta on 23/03/2008 19:35:28 Edited by: El Yatta on 23/03/2008 19:32:43
Originally by: DigitalCommunist The ship definitely has a role, and whether you consider it fun is a matter of perspective. I'm sure a lot of people might enjoy the idea of participating in the fleet battles that go down during POS ops, and still aiding the siege part greatly. Right now, most Dread pilots also have a second account doing other tasks. This is even more ex
And the whole idea is to give standard gangs/fleets the option to reinforce and/or destroy towers without going back, and organizing a Dread Op. Right now, any siege of online POS by small entities is met with great deliberation. You blurt out on ts "hey guys, lets shoot some pos while we're here" on TS and its the EVE equivalent of announcing you finger barn animals.
I don't care if you dislike the ship, or my implementation, but the pos-killing side of PVP needs to be made a *lot* more common.
If you have better ideas for doing that, without dramatic changes, lets hear em.
ACtually, I take it back. Everything you've posted here is right. EXCEPT - the bit where you said pos killing needs to be made more popular. You quite rightly say that people react badly to the suggestion of pos killing when they've been doing a roaming gang. Its NOT because they have to go back to base and get in dreads, and organise that.
its because the person who blurts out on TS "lets go kill pos" has suggested we (in whatever ships, dreads, bs, your suggestion t2 bs) sit for anywhere between 10 minutes and three hours (after all, you're mentioning corps of 10-30 here!) of shooting reactionless, valueless hitpoints. You then have to come back and do it again, often at three in the morning, and have no way until then of knowing if doing so has goten you a cool fight, or a chance to get yourself utterly massacred, or another unopposed HP grind. Thats the bit that is no fun - the entire process. That is why people really dont want to do it.
Many peple form 30 man PVP corps so they dont HAVE to do go through the tedious grind. I have actually yet to hear anyone say they wish more people would kill pos's for the sake of killing pos's, until you. I have heard literally dozens of people, friends and enemies, say that they ******* hate it though.
I was also going to say that IF we were to agree more pos killing was a good idea, especially with your given examples of 30 man pvp corp who, in a standard gang, notices a pos it wants to kill "while we're here" and does it, then your idea works great.
However, now I've thought it through more, it just doesnt. Your proposed ships has certain drawbacks (poor DPS when mobile) to prevent it becoming wtfpwnmobile. Sounds reasonable. But now you're suggesting despite their drawbacks and the rather extreme cost of doing so, a standard gang, roaming or camping, would have lots of these. I dont think so. They'd have to go back to base and get them (same as dreads) and put big fat piles of their isk on the line (same as dreads). They'd have to organise their gang and have players with maxed-out gang skills available (same as dreads, only out of reach for the average carebear/mid-grade corps who might actually have pos disputes for a reason other than shooty-ganky like ourselves).
At the start of your post you mention that most people would like to be able to do both helping out with the seiging AND the fleet battles that go on around a pos. Yes, but thats nothing to do with smaller corps, thats all about the bloody massive alliances again!
So, i dont like your ship/implementation, and I dont agree that the role for it IS necessary, because shooting a POS, let alone multiple POS, is NOT fun, EVER, UNLESS you get a fight out of it that is both challenging, low-to-moderate-lag and winnable, which doesnt happen most times, ESPECIALLY for the small groups, corps and gangs you want to open up pos warfare to.
_______________________________________________ Mercenary Forces |
drMile Kitic
Aliastra
|
Posted - 2008.03.23 19:51:00 -
[43]
how about working on game first, so it can be kind of playable before adding any more usless stuff?
|
Ravenal
The Fated Odyssey.
|
Posted - 2008.03.23 20:52:00 -
[44]
Originally by: drMile Kitic how about working on game first, so it can be kind of playable before adding any more usless stuff?
the "need" for large gangs is a playability issue . |
|
|
|
Pages: 1 [2] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |