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Petrus Blackshell Rifterlings 537	Posted - 2012.02.23 16:38:00 - [1] - Quote ... Or a Tengu, to be more precise. See, I am in Minmatar FW, and like to hop into Amarr missions and say hi to the people there. When it's a bomber, or a battleship, or even a Dramiel, I can handle it. However the Tengu (and to a lesser degree, its HML cousins the Drake and Cerberus) has me stumped. I have considered a variety of ships, and none of them seem to offer very good chances of solo-ing a Tengu. They can either catch and tackle it but not kill it, or they can tackle and kill it, but can't catch it, or they can catch and kill it, but not without it killing them first. I am trying to find a T1 or T2 setup that can do this. I have considered: Sacrilege: probably has the best shot, but can't shut down Tengu tank, and its DPS is a bit low. Curse: can shut down Tengu's tank and speed, but can't kill it before Tengu kills the Curse. Vagabond (and all Minmatar T2): Tengu destroys the Kinetic hole. Deimos (and Ishtar): decent shot if it catches the Tengu, but it would be a tankfest as they are resistant to each other's damage. Less so with Ishtar (Amarr drones, eh?) but still. Lachesis (with damps and long point): No damage is funny. Hurricane: likely can't destroy Tengu tank before it loses its poor HP. Cyclone: with an anti-Kin resist and an active tank... Possibly? Drake: slow, lacks good tackle, and has wrong damage type with little damage(at least until the "nerf"). Harbinger: Right damage type and good damage, but way too slow. Armageddon/Typhoon/Dominix: heavy neuts can shut down Tengu, but can these BSes catch one? This has always bothered me about HML boats. There is no clear "weakness" to exploit in them. Maybe I'm missing something obvious, though. What do you think? How would you hunt a missioning Tengu down solo? Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers. US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join us. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel.
Fredfredbug4 Kings of Kill EVE Animal Control 50	Posted - 2012.02.23 16:59:00 - [2] - Quote Get a friend to either handle neuting or tackling. Lean more towards the nuet side though. Part of a Tengu's tank is it's afterburner. Put the nuets on him and the afterburner will turn off. Then you should be able to tackle him and the Tengu will die in no time. If you must go solo you could try a nuet dominix. Bring some webbing drones to close the gap and neut him so he can't run his tank or warp out. Then close the gap, put a web on him and use your regular combat drones to finish the job. You might also want to consider one of the Tier 3 battlecruisers. If you can get right in your optimal the heavy DPS will break the Tengu's tank. Most tengu's I've seen tank anywhere from 500 to 700 DPS. So with a Tier 3 BC overcoming that you might be able to kill him. The downside is that you will need to kill him before your thin layer of protection goes under. Your best bet would to try and get some intel on this Tengu before hand. Perhaps use a cheap frigate to warp in and try to figure out as much as you can about the tengu.
Petrus Blackshell Rifterlings 537	Posted - 2012.02.23 17:09:00 - [3] - Quote I'm trying to go at this solo. Far more of a chance for the Tengu to get cocky and try to take me on that way. I suppose playing drone games with the Domi can work. What about a Typhoon, though? I don't have Gallente Battleship trained yet T3s could work, but the trouble with them is the Tengu is naturally resistant to the Talos' and Naga's damage types, so I would have to either use an Oracle (which would never hit the Tengu ever in tackle range), or a Tornado (which is paper-thin). Maybe I'm just stuck with needing to use two people: one to rush in in an Enyo, Ishkur, Curse or something, and the other to follow up with the cavalry of high DPS. Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers. US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join us. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel.
Fredfredbug4 Kings of Kill EVE Animal Control 51	Posted - 2012.02.23 18:30:00 - [4] - Quote Petrus Blackshell wrote: I'm trying to go at this solo. Far more of a chance for the Tengu to get cocky and try to take me on that way. I suppose playing drone games with the Domi can work. What about a Typhoon, though? I don't have Gallente Battleship trained yet Tier3s could work, but the trouble with them is the Tengu is naturally resistant to the Talos' and Naga's damage types, so I would have to either use an Oracle (which would never hit the Tengu ever in tackle range), or a Tornado (which is paper-thin). Maybe I'm just stuck with needing to use two people: one to rush in in an Enyo, Ishkur, Curse or something, and the other to follow up with the cavalry of high DPS. I guess a Typhoon could work, though I don't know much at all about Minmatar battleships. Well if you can get a super high alpha on the Tornado you may have a shot. If you can get through the shields the Tengu pilot will either have to shoot at you and die to mission NPCs or sentry guns (if he tries to warp to safety) or warp out right away. I guess you would probably need another person to get the highest success rate. Another thing you could try is to possibly wait and see if the Tengu pilot went AFK thinking he is safe in his mission site. Then blow him up. Though if the pilot is remotely intelligent that won't happen.
Ana K Viziam Amarr Empire 17	Posted - 2012.02.23 20:17:00 - [5] - Quote Help me understand some things. You said you're in faction warfare, so the Tengu pilot would also need to be in faction warfare for Caldari for you to legally attack him without CONCORD intervention, correct? I don't think you're trying to suicide gank, but others in your group may do just that if they help you and are not in FW?
Ahrieman Heretic Army Heretic Nation 56	Posted - 2012.02.23 20:29:00 - [6] - Quote I don't fly a nano phoon but with the split projectiles/missiles you could fit a nano phoon and use those extra highs for neuts. Not a half bad idea for doing this on the cheap. Curse is a logical choice for going after one of these, unfortunately as you pointed out, it doesn't really have the dps :( This is when I start thinking of the Ashimmu....it's not cheap and it has its weaknesses, but still.... Sig tanking is the new black
Petrus Blackshell Rifterlings 546	Posted - 2012.02.23 20:33:00 - [7] - Quote Ana K wrote: Help me understand some things. You said you're in faction warfare, so the Tengu pilot would also need to be in faction warfare for Caldari for you to legally attack him without CONCORD intervention, correct? I don't think you're trying to suicide gank, but others in your group may do just that if they help you and are not in FW? Correct. Tengus are running FW missions and I hate it and I want them to die because they are dirty Amarr slaver dog scumsuckers. E: Expanding on this. They use Tengus as they: are fast areable to passive (or active) tank Minmatar explosive damage do kinetic damage, which is the second best damage (after exp) to deal against Minmatar rats are not range-dependent are hard to catch (sometimes even covert) In Minmatar FW missions, people usually use bombers and distance-tank, but that is unfeasible in Amarr missions because the Minmatar rats use missiles in addition to autos/arty. Ahrieman wrote: I don't fly a nano phoon but with the split projectiles/missiles you could fit a nano phoon and use those extra highs for neuts. Not a half bad idea for doing this on the cheap. Curse is a logical choice for going after one of these, unfortunately as you pointed out, it doesn't really have the dps :( This is when I start thinking of the Ashimmu....it's not cheap and it has its weaknesses, but still.... Hmm.. Ashimmu. Neuts? Check! Tackle? Lol 90% webs. Check. DPS? Ehh... with the neuts acceptable. Speed and tank? Mutually exclusive for Ashimmu, and it doesn't rock at either of them. Not to mention it has low Kin resist (that's why I was looking at T2 ships a lot). If the Tengu decides to not shoot me it might work, but I don't want to lose an Ashimmu finding out if this works, and don't know anyone who would be willing to have me test it on them on Sisi. Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers. US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join us. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel.
Kneebone K-H Light Industries 3	Posted - 2012.02.23 20:55:00 - [8] - Quote Battle Rook? Gila? NOS equipment old school dual rep Ishtar? Either way you need to web the Tengu and get them to slow down. Use mission agro to your advantage. By slowing them down you incresae the DPS they take from the stuff already shooting at them. That is really the key to taking out a missioning Tengu.
Nam Dnilb Universal Frog 1	Posted - 2012.02.23 20:56:00 - [9] - Quote Neuting Legion with drones subsystem?
Petrus Blackshell Rifterlings 546	Posted - 2012.02.23 21:03:00 - [10] - Quote Kneebone wrote: Battle Rook? Gila? NOS equipment old school dual rep Ishtar? Either way you need to web the Tengu and get them to slow down. Use mission agro to your advantage. By slowing them down you incresae the DPS they take from the stuff already shooting at them. That is really the key to taking out a missioning Tengu. Battle Rook might work... I need to get that Caldari Cruiser to V. It's really slow, though, and its damage is not all that. Plus, with 3 T2 Caldari jammers a max-skilled Rook only has 76% chance to jam every cycle -- one missed cycle and it's toast. Gila wouldn't work because it would have less tank than the Tengu, with similar damage (though maybe with Praetor IIs it could do more?). Nos/rep Ishtar loses its tank as soon as the Tengu's cap runs down enough, resulting in a quick death... Or so I expect. Sorry to sound like a jerk and shoot down ideas. Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers. US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join us. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel.
FlinchingNinja Kishunuba Bellum Esca 93	Posted - 2012.02.23 23:31:00 - [11] - Quote another Tengu?
Petrus Blackshell Rifterlings 548	Posted - 2012.02.23 23:50:00 - [12] - Quote FlinchingNinja Kishunuba wrote: another Tengu? a¦á_a¦á And let me guess, I can use supercaps to kill supercaps, right? Nam Dnilb wrote: Neuting Legion with drones subsystem? I suppose this would work better than the Curse because of the enormous extra tank. It doesn't have the Curse's speed, though. Maybe this would work, since Legion is underrated? At any rate, I can't fly any T3 cruisers yet, so I'm looking for something T1 or T2 to do. Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers. US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join us. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel.
Dalts Amarrian Retribution 9	Posted - 2012.02.24 00:11:00 - [13] - Quote Of course you are the enemy, etc etc blah blah, but I think the ship you are looking for is the Sleipnir...
Mike712 Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 39	Posted - 2012.02.24 00:15:00 - [14] - Quote Tempest is the obvious choice. [Tempest, PvP Tempest] Damage Control II Armor Kinetic Hardener II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Gyrostabilizer II Gyrostabilizer II 100MN MicroWarpdrive II Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Warp Disruptor II Stasis Webifier II Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution 800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L 800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L 800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L 800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L 800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L 800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L Heavy Energy Neutralizer II Heavy Energy Neutralizer II Large Trimark Armor Pump I Large Trimark Armor Pump I Large Trimark Armor Pump I Vespa EC-600 x5 Warrior II x5 Fast locking, a bunch of DPS, ECM drones to break his lock, heavy neuts to cap him out and disable his prop mod/hardeners. Regards, Mike712 The BattleClinic Team
Diesel47 Sons of Retribution Malice Alliance 4	Posted - 2012.02.24 00:22:00 - [15] - Quote Command ship best choice.
Katherine Starlight Apex Tech Xenogenesis Alliance 30	Posted - 2012.02.24 00:27:00 - [16] - Quote Kill them with irony, use a blaster Tengu.
Tamiya Sarossa Hedion University Amarr Empire 164	Posted - 2012.02.24 04:00:00 - [17] - Quote Typhoon, Tempest, or armor-cane. I've done it with all three. Mission tengus are no problem if they're active tanked with two nuets on them (medium or heavy), and a buffered tengu will still die to a Tempest before you pop. For the phoon/armor-cane, toss on a kinetic hardener, overheat it, and you've got a stress-free kill on buffered or active tanked tengu. Catching wise, fit disruptor for initial point (you've got ganglinks right?) and then double webs on cane or phoon (tempest is fine with point/tank/cap booster and nuets because you can keep up fine and want to hold range to avoid tracking problems anyway) - run with AC's on the phoon for proper damage application and some Praetors (or Acolytes in the cane, isn't it nice that Amarr drones are good for something?) and you've got a dead Tengu. HM ships can be annoying because there's not obvious counter,but throwing on some damage specific hardners/nuets/and gank is usually enough to drop them with no problems.
loki energon Voodoo Children Workers Trade Federation 0	Posted - 2012.02.24 04:21:00 - [18] - Quote other than double neut, web phoon, which is a great idea BTW. my, vote goes to nighthawk its dmg bonus is universal, allowing you to hit the EM hole, speed and tank all around kick ass ship. kill em all.
Diomidis Pod Liberation Authority HYDRA RELOADED 38	Posted - 2012.02.24 06:31:00 - [19] - Quote If you cannot do it in a 2x med neut Cane, you are doing it wrong, and it's unlikely you will be able to do it in Tempests and/or Phoons. "War does not determine who is right - only who is left." -- Bertrand Russell
Wildest Cosmic Fusion 0	Posted - 2012.02.24 07:22:00 - [20] - Quote Try a Loki with 1 web ..it can kill a tengu easily if flown right...not at home atm so cant provide with a fit ..but i'm sure u can find quite a few on battleclinic
My Postman Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 27	Posted - 2012.02.24 11:00:00 - [21] - Quote I bet a Blaster Proteus can kill it if it can catch it. This might even be the only use for going for the Proteus.
Wacktopia Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group 194	Posted - 2012.02.24 11:04:00 - [22] - Quote Petrus Blackshell wrote: This has always bothered me about HML boats. There is no clear "weakness" to exploit in them. Maybe I'm missing something obvious, though. Neuting works pretty well. It will stop them moving, turn of shield booster [Tengu] and hardeners [Drake/Tengu]. After this they should die pretty easily. Vote Alekseyev Karrde for CSM7. -áhttps://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=67574 Get War Decs, Sov, Low Sec that works.-á
Petrus Blackshell Rifterlings 554	Posted - 2012.02.24 16:01:00 - [23] - Quote Thanks for the advice, guys! Hopefully my killboard will have a Tengu on it soon. I'm probably going to try armorcane, or if that doesn't work, Sleipnir or Absolution (though the latter seems a bit poor). Once I train large projectile guns I can try Typhoon/Tempest too. Keep the discussion coming, though! Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers. US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join us. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel.
Cedo Nulli Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 67	Posted - 2012.02.25 13:06:00 - [24] - Quote Not everything is ment to be a solo-sport. Hunting in packs is what the smart ones do.
Beat General Anarchist Industries Reborn Malice Alliance 1	Posted - 2012.02.25 15:15:00 - [25] - Quote Cedo Nulli wrote: Not everything is ment to be a solo-sport. Hunting in packs is what the smart ones do. Maybe OP wants to fly solo because that is fun to him. Maybe OP not noob and doesn't need blob to kill enemies.
Sjugar Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 20	Posted - 2012.02.25 15:19:00 - [26] - Quote This may just be an out of the box idea, but what about fitting a curse with 2-3 rocket launchers fitted with defender missiles? Would be interesting to test that on sisi. You need to keep your range though because otherwise they won't work.
Bumblefck Kerensky Initiatives 2898	Posted - 2012.02.25 15:45:00 - [27] - Quote ^^ Or they won't work because, you know, defender missiles just don't work full stop. OP, one word for you and your problem: Celestis. ---- CONCORD arrested two n00bs yesterday, one was drinking battery acid, the other was eating fireworks. They charged one and let the other one off.
Zanziba'ar The Gorath Corporation 41	Posted - 2012.02.26 02:03:00 - [28] - Quote I actually really liked "how to kill a mockingbird" anyway! Falcon and a hurricane? its probably just me but flying with friends is good. - Mulzvich "Zanziba'ar" Gorath
Petrus Blackshell Rifterlings 564	Posted - 2012.02.26 04:32:00 - [29] - Quote To those suggesting I fly with a friend: I agree, flying with a friend is quite nice, but not always a possibility. Particularly when I stay up AFK long nights until 3 AM, and nobody is online but bored mission-runners, I want to be able to make some fun for myself. Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers. US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join us. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel.

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