Pages: 1 :: [one page] |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Jaguar Dragon
Blood Association of Dragons Blood Alliance of Dragons
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 18:28:00 -
[1]
hi, lets clear up a myth that a t2 bpo is only worth 1 years worth profit. 1: all t2 bpo's that i have looked at and all of the ones i have for auction. are worth 7 times the 1 year worth. how you might ask. answer!!! you can make in adv lab with 5% copy implant 7, 1 copy 1 run bpc's in the same time it takes to manufacture 1 run of 5000 from the bpo.
so you make your 7, 1 copy 1 run bpc's and manufacture from them, and keep bpo in lab. so then your manufacturing from 7, 1 copy 1 run bpc runs in same time yuo would make 1 run from the bpo.
so a t2 bpo is worth 7 times the so called 1 years worth profit
so now i'm actioning 5 t2 bpo's all researched all up for auction at same prices.
NULL M is worth an avg of 1.5 billion per year off the bpo
SPIKE M is worth an avg of 1.5 billion per year off the bpo
SCOURGE PRECISION is worth an avg of 1.5 billion per year off the bpo
WIDOWMAKER PRECISION is worth an avg off 1.5 billion per year off the bpo
INFERNO RAGE is worth an avg of 1.5 billion off the bpo
so that makes them worth each 10.5 billion per year profit
each if being actioned
start bid: 5 billion reserve bid: hidden. all rl action reserves are normally hidden buyout: MAKE OFFER auction end date: april 6 sunday, gmt 16:00 5 min sniper rule bpo's located in Azer 6m1. Everyshore region personal contract will be setup within a couple hours or sooner to winner.
please name which t2 bpo your bidding on
NULL M ME/40 PE/13 SPIKE M ME/20 PE/15 SCOURGE PRECISION ME/20 PE/15 WIDOWMAKER PRECISION, ME/20 PE/15 this bpo is in lab till april 14 INFERNO RAGE ME 20 PE/4
|
Sister Fraggl
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 18:43:00 -
[2]
lol - for this price you wont sell only 1 of them - but n1 try with this explaination ^^
Btw 1b for the Scourge
|
Tolmon
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 18:45:00 -
[3]
u mean 5 b 1 of them? lol
|
Seleeena
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 18:46:00 -
[4]
last spike goes for 2bil buyout so i offer you 2bil buyout for null and 2bill buyout for spike
|
Tolmon
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 18:47:00 -
[5]
i offer you 2.2b buy out on spike and 2.1 on nnull
|
Jaguar Dragon
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 18:59:00 -
[6]
i don't care what or who sold what last time. those players sold for alot less than these bpo's are worth AND THERE WORTH 10.5 BILLION PROFIT PER YEAR. 7 times the profit from manufacturing from the bpo.
read my explanation in my post.
you think i'm supposed to sell for 1 years worth profit from the bpo, when you can produce 7 times that from using bpc's and using the game mechanics that are in game.YOUR NUTS LOL Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. |
Tolmon
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 19:04:00 -
[7]
wtf are you talking,
ok do you want to buy my rocket bpo at 6b?
|
el caido
School of Applied Knowledge
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 20:27:00 -
[8]
I hate being 'that guy' but ...
I'm very interested in the Null and Spike, but not willing to pay 5 billion for either. Drop me an EVEmail if they do not sell and you're interested. (free bump)
|
Estrith
Tech 1 Holdings Limited Tech Holdings Limited
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 20:28:00 -
[9]
so that makes my ishtar bpo worth 280b? lol anyone want to buy it ill insta sell it now for 280b :)
|
DeODokktor
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 23:56:00 -
[10]
I hate to be rude.. But CCP dont like this behavior on t2 prints so now that you have brought it to attention, then it will probably be changed.. Not sure if I should say well done or thump you..
I missed that early days, not that it really matters as it can be difficult to sell ammo..
Bringing such a thing to light probably de-values your bpo's now as other producers who havent been building from BPC'S will probably switch over, supply in game just went up by over 600% ;P
Some people really want ammo BPO's so I wouldnt fight back with them, I would just wait for the offers to come in..
And no, your not going to get 5 or 7 bn for a bpo just because it's bpc's make you that much worth of product every year..
but you set your own prices so good luck ;)..
|
|
byproxy
|
Posted - 2008.04.02 00:03:00 -
[11]
I'm glad you think t2 bpos are valuable - they are.
Quick lessons from the person behind this character:
- If you think someone is going to pay for 7 years of max production for a game that's been around really in its current form for like 4 years, you're crazy;
- If you think the market is ever going to pay the maximum revenue stream rather than the profit, you're crazy;
- If you think the market is ever going to pay what you think it is worth, you're crazy; however,
- If you think the market will pay for what it thinks it is worth, given the depreciating values of the risks of variable and non-guaranteed sales, fluctuating material prices, rule and game change risk (remember the introduction of invention - what about the bpos being downgraded one day out of those 7 years?) (what about reintroducing t2 bpo lotteries?), the time value of moving assets around and buying/selling materials, the change in both empire and 0.0 warfare, and about 10 million other variables, then you're not crazy.
People are not you. You might have optimized how to produce from a bpo. Great! One question:
Why are you selling it then if you're doing so well?
Ah! That's the rub, isn't it? There is a reason you're selling it, and that's why you also won't get maximum price. Maximum price is obtained from unsolicited offers. You are soliciting offers.
Enough about that. I'll give 2.3B for the spike bpo.
|
Terrador
Terradon Research
|
Posted - 2008.04.02 01:33:00 -
[12]
I agree with what he said :) and I do wander how long the copy times will remain so short.
That said, I'd give 2.5b for either the spike m or null m.
-Terrador
|
Jaguar Dragon
Blood Association of Dragons Blood Alliance of Dragons
|
Posted - 2008.04.02 01:58:00 -
[13]
thanks for the whiners, complainers and cryers. you have proved my point. all buyout offers below start bid of 5 billion are rejected. and i hope my post makes it to everyone in game, that at least for ammo t2 bpo's and i suspect most t2 bpo's . that the 7 bpc to 1 bpo, profits is the same. and if ccp does change the copy times thats great too. that will make t2 bpo prices increase not decrease. because the vast majority of players do not realize that there t2 bpo's are worth 7 times what alot of players have said there worth.
cheers, and keep complaining i'm not going to use the report button, just keep complaining and keep my post on page 1
|
DeODokktor
|
Posted - 2008.04.02 03:16:00 -
[14]
Actually I think the list is really small of (t2) what you can do that with.. it used to be that way with 100mn mwd II's and they changed it.. at current (even with skills + implant + pos) there's no t2 modules you can produce higher than the base rate + skills..
I havent look'd over all of the ammo, but I would imagine they dont all apply to the 7* rule your seeing on missiles.
If you go through the patch logs you'll see that CCP actually changed the max run on a lot of the ammo prints so
max run changes (goes up), copy time on the print stays the same, that means that copy time/run goes down.. as they took a lot of these ammo prints from 10 to 100, then they made them copy 10* as much..
Sooooooo, it's a new bug and your hoping to cash out while it looks good ;)..
Seeing as it's been around since before dec, then it might be here a few more months yet tho.
|
Jaguar Dragon
Blood Association of Dragons Blood Alliance of Dragons
|
Posted - 2008.04.02 15:58:00 -
[15]
i'm not talking about making max run bpc's. it's 1 copy 1 run, and you can get 7 of them in the same time it takes you to manufacture 1 run from the bpo. so while your now manufacturing from 7 copies, your making 7 more copies in the same length of time. and my guess is that ammo is like this because it's a consumable. in 1 lvl4 kill mission using medium ammo or hvy missiles, you'd likely go through 3000 rounds or more. and it takes 7 hours to manufacture medium t2 and hvy missile t2 ammo. my way is to make 7, 1 copy 1 run bpc's which with skills and implants with adv labs, takes 57 minuets for 1 copy 1 run. so you get 7 in 7 hours,
this is using skills and game mechanics that are perfectly legal. it's all about using your head. don't you think those that have been using t2 bpo's for along time know this. why is it that everyone thinks that a t2 bpo is only worth 1 years profit from the BPO ONLY. when you can make 7 times that.
whats the use of making a max run t2 bpc. when you can only manufacture 1 run in 7 hours
these bpo s as stated by alot of players all say the t2 bpo's are worth 1 years profit. that makes mine worth 10.5 billion a year each.
where does it say in the EULA or anywhere else claiming anything.
ccp has created things in this game. and it's not my fault or problem that alot of others don't know about it. and sell there t2 bpo's for far less than there worth.
my guess is that its the players who own alot of t2 bpo's who want this to be secret, they are the ones making the claim of only 1 year profit. so they can buy t2 bpo's real cheap. then use the 7 for 1 as i call it to get very rich.
the 7 for 1 works for all ammo and missiles as i see it for now. i do not know if it works for anything else.
so, with all thats been said and explained in detail,
my bpo's are worth 10.5 billion a year in profit, thats what they can produce.
if you want them minimum bid is 5 billion. i'll entertain a buyout of 8 billion. i'm interested in getting involved in something else in this game and it requires alot of money to do it. i need cash now. thats why i'm selling. i will not now or ever sell them for less. unless ccp makes changes to the game.
|
Bozl1n
Shiva Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2008.04.02 16:27:00 -
[16]
I think u be keeping ur prints m8
|
Artmedis Valben
Lobster of Babel
|
Posted - 2008.04.02 16:45:00 -
[17]
This is an unintended side effect of a change in the Trinity patch. It is very doubtful it will stay this way for long.
With Trinity patch the Missile BPOs where changed to be inline with other Ammo BPOs research times, copy and manufacture is no the same for all T1 prints.
Production limit was also upped from 10 to 100 on T2 ammo/missile BPOs in order to make T2 ammo/missile invention possible. Now they are invented with 10 base runs from max run T1 BPCs instead of 1 run.
Now since manufacturing times per run stayed the same, while copying was made 10 times faster it is now indeed possible to do as the op suggests, at least for a while.
But to do so you need 7 manu slots w/advanced science skills per BPO. And you need a monstrous amount of sell order slots to move that amount of ammo, or sit 23/7 at Jita adjusting prices 0.01 isk below lowest sell.
I agree they are valuable, perhaps even 10 bil for all 5. I'll offer 1,5 bil for the Widowmaker precision.
Selling: PERFECT PRINTS T2 SHIPS |
Gridwalker
Spartan Industrial Manufacturing SMASH Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.04.02 16:52:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Jaguar Dragon my bpo's are worth 10.5 billion a year in profit, thats what they can produce.
I've gotten in trouble for making a comment on a BPO in this forum even though I was asking questions about its location, so I'm a little hesitant to reply. But since you appear to be soliciting response, I hope the moderators will take that into consideration.
We have no doubt that your BPO can PRODUCE what you say it can. The problem is, can you SELL what you can produce? Profit involves selling, not stocking up millions of units of product that sit in the market tab not moving for six years.
For example, you claim your Inferno Rage Torpedo BPO is worth 10.5b isk in profit per year? Even if you can produce that much product, in my region exactly 25,137 units sold in March. There are currently 412,355 units for sale. That means that right now, there is enough product on the market to supply the demand for 16.4 months if no one builds any more.
In fact, a single invention job will produce a BPC capable of building 50,000 units of this ammo--nearly DOUBLE what sold in the entire month of March.
Things are a little brighter for the Spike M. It sold 696,853 units in March. There are only currently 735,128 units for sale, so supply is about equal to a month's demand. You'll probably sell a few--maybe two or three runs worth if you sell in the right spot.
My point is, supply generally outstrips demand on T2 ammo by a significant amount, so even if you can produce a billion units in six hours, you'll never sell enough to come anywhere close to the numbers you are projecting for "profit".
I have six T2 ammo BPO's, and considering the effort of producing them and how little profit I actually make off them--I still have stock from some I built last month, and they've all be in research for 4 weeks--I actually make better profits selling T1 ammo with minimal investment.
But if you can sell your BPO's at the price you're asking, I applaud you! I'm certainly not criticizing you or your price. Maybe someone has a great market, and they can't invent fast enough to keep up with their demand. For them, a BPO would be priceless.
And they are relatively scarce, so if anything they are worth something as a collector's item. If someone needs one of them to complete a set, your price may seem harsh but worth it to them.
I wish you the best of luck! And if you ever feel inclined to sell your secrets to selling the quantities these are capable of producing in today's market, I think THAT information would be worth quite a bit!
I might also be interested in a few max-run copies of each, just for my library. What would your asking price for such a thing be?
Regards,
-Grid
|
DeODokktor
Dark Templars The Fonz Presidium
|
Posted - 2008.04.02 17:08:00 -
[19]
I dont care if your talking about max runs or 1 run.. ccp have 2 values (that we will look at) on a blueprint for copy 1) max runs 2) copy time
Copy time is the time it takes to copy a full maxed run copy. CCP has changed the MAX runs from 10 to 100 WITHOUT changing the copy time. So your 7:1 ratio used to be 0.7:1
I will admit that it does fall within the CURRENT GAME MECHANICS but this is due to a bug that was introduced with the max runs getting changed (those changes happen'd from september up through november/december).
I cant say for a fact that ccp will modify the time, but as they have done it with EVERY T2 BPO BEFORE IT then I must assume they will make this change.
And yes, if you want to say 1 years profit * 7 is their worth, then that's fine, as long as CCP dont turn around and mod the blueprints tomorrow.
Seeing as you have brought this to light, and now bug reports have been filed then I am going to assume the fix will be sooner rather than later.
And I know you were talking about single run and not max run, but in case you werent wise enough to know it 1 run = run time/max runs (it's calculated when you view info).. so if you do 1 run, or 2 runs, or 10, or 50, or 100 runs.. your still going to end up with the same overinflated production figgure.
|
|
CCP Mitnal
|
Posted - 2008.04.02 21:25:00 -
[20]
The sales forum rules are quite specific in asking that discussion is kept to other forums, in this case Market Discussions.
Please note that within sales threads, one should only be asking a question or making a bid.
OP please do not try and stimulate debate to keep your thread on the front page. The next off-topic post will result in the thread being locked and any discussion posts after this will result in forum warnings.
Mitnal, Community Representative
EVE Online CCP Games Email/Netfang |
|
|
Jaguar Dragon
Blood Association of Dragons Blood Alliance of Dragons
|
Posted - 2008.04.02 22:09:00 -
[21]
i was not stimulating anything, only responding to those that were posting. and to make things clear i did not use the report button.
to make things clear that alot seem to think about t2 ammo bpo's is that, THERE IS A ERROR ON THE T2 BPO
it says: research copy time (you per single copy)
this is an ERROR
it should read
research copy time (you per single run)
this is causing alot of players to miss understand how i come up with my figure on making bpc's, 7, 1 copy 1 run bpc's in 7 hours.
so Mintal we were discussing how i can produce what i claim i can. these are legitimate questions of my post auction, as alot don't believe it.
your removing all the conversations that we have had was getting all to understand my claims of how i arrive at profit per year.
because from my point of view i'm the first to make these claims public. AND IT SEEMS CCP DOESN'T WANT THIS PUBLIC.
by your actions
|
Ki Anna
|
Posted - 2008.04.02 22:18:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Jaguar Dragon so Mintal we were discussing how i can produce what i claim i can. these are legitimate questions of my post auction, as alot don't believe it.
This is a sales forum, not a value discussion forum. If you want to discuss the value of T2 BPO's go to the Market Discusion forum. If you want a price check, use the appropriate forum.
Questions to be asked in this thread are not supposed to be in the form of a discussion, but should be pointed to the transaction. For example - my question: What are your intention if no offers are made for the starting bid of 5 billion? Will you tender lower offers in this thread? Will you reopen the action with a lower starting bid? Or will you withdraw your offer to sell them?
|
|
CCP Mitnal
C C P
|
Posted - 2008.04.02 23:12:00 -
[23]
If you have evidence of a bug or exploit, please bug report them here
What I asked for and apologies for any misunderstanding is that you do not try and justify your price in the sales forum. The sales forum rules located here are quite explicit that this is purely a market forum - the seller sets his/her price and the buyer bids on them.
Mitnal, Community Representative
EVE Online CCP Games Email/Netfang |
|
DeODokktor
Dark Templars The Fonz Presidium
|
Posted - 2008.04.02 23:52:00 -
[24]
Please remember that your CCP staff Allowing someone to sell something on the back of a BUG is wrong.
Please dont EDIT ME OUT for warning someone that they are buying into a BUG..
I have came across a few in my time and I am sure you wouldnt want me selling them on the forums..
|
Jaguar Dragon
|
Posted - 2008.04.03 00:03:00 -
[25]
to the poster that claims this is a bug .
your out of line here m8. Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. |
Krimsonblade
|
Posted - 2008.04.03 00:22:00 -
[26]
He is right though Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. |
byproxy
School of Applied Knowledge
|
Posted - 2008.04.03 03:09:00 -
[27]
Edited by: byproxy on 03/04/2008 03:10:25 Since all the previous bids were wiped out by the OP at 2008.04.02 01:58:00, I'll make these new bids:
2b for the null and 2b for the spike bpos.
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 :: [one page] |