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Ordon Gundar
Science and Trade Institute
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Posted - 2008.04.08 07:43:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Ordon Gundar on 08/04/2008 07:44:14
Two weeks into my EvE experience, and I am doing all right with NPC trading, running missions and the odd bout of ratting about the place, but my trawling of the Markets during my trade runs has left me baffled when it comes to PC trading.
How is it possible to make money selling to players on the market?
Surely this is an inter-region thing, for Industrials with enough cargo room and capital to make the 15 jumps worthwhile at low margin?
Or, is the only way to make money selling to PC`s in-region is to run ammo and armament into low-sec systems, at risk of gate-ganking by the unwashed hordes??
Or selling to contract?
My head hurts....!
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Robacz
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Posted - 2008.04.08 08:12:00 -
[2]
There is a sticky with some trading guides in this forum, but only thing you need to know: buy low, sell high. 
You don't have to move stuff between regions to make profits (you can and sometimes it makes you more ofc, but trading and hauling are two proffesions). What you need to find is item with high volume (a lot of them being bought and sold) and good difference between buy and sell prices. Then you setup buy order in some station where you can expect a lot of people selling thier stuff (typically local hub station, or station with quality agents) and wait until lazy people sell stuff to you.
And when you have the cheap stuff....you sell it! Via sell orders of course. Just place them on market and watch isk rolling in. The difference between player trading and NPC trading is that you are not using immediate market orders.
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Ordon Gundar
Science and Trade Institute
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Posted - 2008.04.08 08:18:00 -
[3]
Yes - as I thought, without going inter-region for low margin, you are actually relying on "silly orders" being fulfilled by lazy people to get the goods incredibly cheap. I think that going down this route would require me to train skills to be able to buy and sell remotely across the region, whilst finding something else to do while waiting for the money to come in!
Hello...Mr Agent? I`m bored....!
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EBANK Ricdic
Eve-Tech Savings n Loans
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Posted - 2008.04.08 08:20:00 -
[4]
The ultimate assistance you could recieve is as follows:
Don't buy off SELL ORDERS. They are there for people buying the product not planning to trade it. You need to use your own BUY ORDERS. As those orders fill you resell to your own SELL ORDERS..
This really is crucial. I would go as far to say almost every item on the market can turn a profit if following the above steps. Obviously the % of profit and calculation of profit over time will be determined based on competition, complexity (ie region wide buy orders) and circulation (choosing where to sell, quantities, etc)
Lets call them the three C's of Eve trading, copyright by EBANK ofc 
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Wieting Foyu
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Posted - 2008.04.08 09:38:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Wieting Foyu on 08/04/2008 09:39:51
Edited by: Wieting Foyu on 08/04/2008 09:38:40
 Originally by: EBANK Ricdic
The ultimate assistance you could recieve is as follows:
Don't buy off SELL ORDERS. They are there for people buying the product not planning to trade it. You need to use your own BUY ORDERS. As those orders fill you resell to your own SELL ORDERS..
TOTALLY disagree, If you know the going price you can buy off the sell orders then relist to make a profit. Lots of pilots throw an item they got for "free" on the market when they feel they aren't gonna get enough for the buy orders. So they list it way below the current selling prices.
A trader/manufacture might have a set profit they want so they just list for that mark up and leave it there without looking at it having to change it every 5 mins. Again buy and relist.
Lots of times a region is only a few jumps away, and in one region an item is selling 20-40 orders a day at 8m while 3 jumps over it is selling for the same volume at 12m. Again, again, buy and relist.
Doing this not only gets you the items faster than waiting for some lazy pilot, but also you didn't have to keep changing the buy order to keep up with other traders in that area.
The profit margin may be smaller.. but isk/hour would be greater when you have more items to sell. Just do the research and know when to hold em and know when to fold em.
Wieting Foyu
Foyu Investments
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EBANK Ricdic
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Posted - 2008.04.08 10:34:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Wieting Foyu
TOTALLY disagree, If you know the going price you can buy off the sell orders then relist to make a profit. Lots of pilots throw an item they got for "free" on the market when they feel they aren't gonna get enough for the buy orders. So they list it way below the current selling prices.
For someone new to the market I would not recommend they do it this way. It definetly can be successful (read: My R2R project, buying Strip miner II @ rens for 700k, selling at Jita for 1.3m) however you need to really know your products and pray someone doesn't beat you to the punch. Plus inter-region trading is only really possible with an alt, or a very large notepad.
Simple relisting as you suggest is perfectly fine as long as you know the product and it's market. A noob will take your advice, buy up 2000 basic damage controls from his entry level station at 9k, and try to resell them in a hub for 12k. Obviously this would never succeed (as the people selling 2000 in the station are the ones that bought 2000 in that station from buy orders)
Quote:
A trader/manufacture might have a set profit they want so they just list for that mark up and leave it there without looking at it having to change it every 5 mins. Again buy and relist.
Sure this sometimes works, or it can result in your orders never being filled, your capital sat idle not in use, and your valuable order slots being tied up in dud products.
Quote:
Lots of times a region is only a few jumps away, and in one region an item is selling 20-40 orders a day at 8m while 3 jumps over it is selling for the same volume at 12m. Again, again, buy and relist.
Not really noob friendly.
Quote:
Doing this not only gets you the items faster than waiting for some lazy pilot, but also you didn't have to keep changing the buy order to keep up with other traders in that area.
Doesn't this contradict itself? Don't modify your orders and you will get items faster than those that do?
Your points aren't necessarily wrong Wieting but they are very dangerous to attempt as a new character without market/product knowledge. Sure we have some graphs that can be used, but based on your advice there's nothing stopping the op seeing that Cap Recharger II's used to sell at 13m each (pre-invention), and buying up 4000 @ 3m, trying to resell at 13m. Obviously this is a radical example but can still easily be done by someone without enough understanding of the market.
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Wieting Foyu
Azteca Transportation Unlimited
Gunboat Diplomacy
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Posted - 2008.04.08 17:32:00 -
[7]
Yes you do have a point... My suggestions are more for those that have done their homework. But for the first timer jumping into the trading aspect, it might be a lil overwhelming trying to find your niche.
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