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Vivien Sureflight
Phalanx Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.13 16:40:00 -
[1]
the basic idea is simple: select your gun, double-click in space, and have it shoot a round (one round) in that direction. This would enable jammed ships to shoot, though at greatly reduced effectiveness. If you want to hit a moving target, you have to lead it slightly. Chances are good you'd never hit anything, but as long as your shot passes within the target's sig radius, you hit. This would discourage stationary EW platforms, but keep just about everything else as is.
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Give a man some fire and he'll be warm for a day. SET a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life... |
Anubis Xian
Vertigo One
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Posted - 2008.04.13 16:50:00 -
[2]
Why not just abandon 'target and fire' entirely? I could handle that.
 Originally by: CCP Oveur
The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
Juggernauts |
Mithfindel
Argent Group
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Posted - 2008.04.13 17:11:00 -
[3]
You know that the signature radiuses are not really large? An Apocalypse is considerably longer than its signature radius, if I got the scale right. 3D image projected on the screen means that the "depth" direction is lost - how to treat the depth direction of the gu aiming vector? Also, how to keep the tracking property of guns? Is it possible to fire guns while the camera is focused on another ship? Hitting a stationary EW cruiser at 60 km with no matter how high screen resolution will be near impossible - while it might show up as a light pixel, its sig radius will be at most the size of the pixel. Even in the case of a hit, active-reaim-fire sequence would likely take that much time that destroying anything supported by a gang is impossible. (And adds a twitch element to a game that is not a twitch game).
In a varied fleet, there are multiple ways to defeat EW, including counter-EW, drones and FOF missiles.
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Reggie Stoneloader
Teikoku Trade Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.04.13 17:47:00 -
[4]
Might be neat to be able to run a hit or miss check based on a 5-degree directional scan, using the camera as an aim control. It could override ECM and also tracking, allowing you to maybe thake a ***** at that Crow or Vaga that's slinging around at 8km/s.
But in a more realistic sense, no. Twitch = bad.
Crusades: Security Status |
AdmiralDovolski
Gallente
N.A.S.A.
Skunk-Works
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Posted - 2008.04.13 17:55:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Mithfindel
In a varied fleet, there are multiple ways to defeat EW, including counter-EW, drones and FOF missiles.
why not just add FOF guns? make them equal to the lowest damage/range of their class (fof medium rail= dual 150mm)
Proud to be a skunk |
Vivien Sureflight
Phalanx Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.13 18:34:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Mithfindel
You know that the signature radiuses are not really large? An Apocalypse is considerably longer than its signature radius, if I got the scale right. 3D image projected on the screen means that the "depth" direction is lost - how to treat the depth direction of the gu aiming vector? Also, how to keep the tracking property of guns? Is it possible to fire guns while the camera is focused on another ship? Hitting a stationary EW cruiser at 60 km with no matter how high screen resolution will be near impossible - while it might show up as a light pixel, its sig radius will be at most the size of the pixel. Even in the case of a hit, active-reaim-fire sequence would likely take that much time that destroying anything supported by a gang is impossible. (And adds a twitch element to a game that is not a twitch game).
In a varied fleet, there are multiple ways to defeat EW, including counter-EW, drones and FOF missiles.
I'm fully aware that it would be almost impossible to hit anything at 60km. That's what targeting is for. The point is to enable non-caldari ships able to do something while jammed/damped. Your average mega, if jammed, can't really do anything. With blindfire, it could still shoot things--such as stationary BSs. Even though targeting would always perform better (and is required to use most EW) blindfire would enable jammed ships to have an effect on the battlefield.
Also, they can use the same vector system for firing as they use for freeform movement.
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Give a man some fire and he'll be warm for a day. SET a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life... |
Thargat
Caldari
North Star Networks
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.04.14 21:37:00 -
[7]
It's called ECCM
There's only one sig that matters... and that's Radius. |
Jason Edwards
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Posted - 2008.04.14 21:49:00 -
[8]
I dont like the idea. The recons are pretty sad as it is... if a jammed ship can still shoot you... why bother with jam?
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Vivien Sureflight
Phalanx Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.16 17:01:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Jason Edwards
I dont like the idea. The recons are pretty sad as it is... if a jammed ship can still shoot you... why bother with jam?
Umm.... Perhaps you aren't familiar with gang engagement...
If you're targeted by a Falcon, unless you're fitting some mad ECCM, you're going to get nearly perma-jammed. It isn't too hard to get a jam strength of 40+ out of one of those. When perma-jammed, you can do NOTHING except for hope your drones aggro someone or load FoFs (if you're lucky enough to have launchers). Blindfiring wouldn't really make recons able to be hit while their target is jammed (unless they're sitting still within 20km, as trying to hit a pixel at 60km would simply be too difficult). The only thing this would really discourage is the ECM taking up the last mid of more and more vexors nowadays (which happen to jam other cruisers with remarkable frequency). The bottom line is, blindfiring would allow people to fight those who are up-close and personal (because it's not too hard to hit a stationary BS at 5km). |
Opertone
Caldari
Simtech Productions
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Posted - 2008.04.16 17:15:00 -
[10]
why not energy pulse weapons which shoot in the area... just like big remote smart bombs...
special module for the dreadnoughts to allow the to catch the flies
i can't see how little interceptors can tackle a dreadnaught... what megacorp would ever build a dreadnaught not able to resist a tiny crow?
massive smartbomb pulse cannons which blow up everything in the radius... something in between the bombs and the samrt bombs... less powerfull than doomsday
it looks stupid to me that big ships can't have a special defence system against small ships
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Ragnor Dayton
Amarr
Personal Vendetta
Reavers.
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Posted - 2008.04.17 12:19:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Opertone
why not energy pulse weapons which shoot in the area... just like big remote smart bombs...
special module for the dreadnoughts to allow the to catch the flies
i can't see how little interceptors can tackle a dreadnaught... what megacorp would ever build a dreadnaught not able to resist a tiny crow?
massive smartbomb pulse cannons which blow up everything in the radius... something in between the bombs and the samrt bombs... less powerfull than doomsday
it looks stupid to me that big ships can't have a special defence system against small ships
You mean something similar to the wide area lasers in X2/3 (forgot what they were called) which had some major balancing issues - such as the pirate M5 (smallest ship class) being able to take out a station in X2.........
I do however agree that big ships need a special defense system against small ships.
What I would propose for this is a special turret mount that allows the fitting of multiple identical frigate sized guns and uses that weapons stats, called, say, Point Defense Turret, requiring a turret and high slot. So for example a cruiser gets a mount with 2 frigate size guns, a battleships with 4 and capitals 8.
For balance and practicality (would need another set of slots on the fitting interface) it is likely this would need to be limited to 1 or possibly 2 for capitals. |
Zhula Guixgrixks
Increasing Success by Lowering Expectations
Star Buccaneers
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Posted - 2008.04.17 12:30:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Zhula Guixgrixks on 17/04/2008 12:30:39
"it looks stupid to me that big ships can't have a special defence system against small ships"
Opertone, did you ever used small ships against bigger ships ? There are plenty of anti-frigate weapons. Beside
this flying a dreadnought without a proper support gang seems
not very smart.
" what megacorp would ever build a dreadnaught not able to resist a tiny crow?" A dread can easily resist a tiny crow, it just cannot kill it that easy. Its a MMOG , a megacorp should have enough pilots willing to provide some support.
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Vivien Sureflight
Phalanx Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.18 20:16:00 -
[13]
Any other comments?
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Give a man some fire and he'll be warm for a day. SET a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life... |
Hesod Adee
Xen Of Onslaught
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Posted - 2008.04.18 22:20:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Ragnor Dayton
I do however agree that big ships need a special defense system against small ships.
Ever heard of drones or smartbombs ? |
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