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Who do you want to represent you on the CSM?

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Breha Organa	Posted - 2008.04.16 06:41:00 - [31] Pet peeve #431: Decimal point values are missing on tech II and capital ship bpos. This may seem like a tiny matter, but if your character is into manufacturing, then this is one of the big ones. So... friends, this isn't about politics. It's about fixing the finer points of the game for everyone. The small things, and the big things. I just included this one as an example of the issues that drive some of us crazy. Breha
El'Niaga Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2008.04.16 07:10:00 - [32] I don't plan to vote. I don't see it as a useful nor productive undertaking. If it is used to make game changes then the slice is to small to be a true representation of the players. As such the danger becomes that they'll make some radical change like the SOE focus groups suggested for SWG in 2005 and it'll be in worse shape after the changes. If it produces no game changes then its just a PR move.
Sqalevon Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.04.16 08:47:00 - [33] Originally by: Rodj Blake I will be voting for Hardin. He's the right man for the job. Has Hardin stated any plans yet? Or will he Ctrl-C/Ctrl-V the ships and modules forum into his campaign flyer ? I know he's pretty good at pushing agendas but I have no idea what his agenda will be.
Breha Organa	Posted - 2008.04.22 20:39:00 - [34] By the way, I have expressed an opinion about BACON on this thread. Want to know my opinion on other matters? Go to my campaign site and post a comment... or ask here.
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2008.04.22 20:50:00 - [35] Originally by: Breha Organa Edited by: Breha Organa on 17/04/2008 06:13:51 Pet peeve #431: Seemingly random materials increase on tech II and capital ship bpos when making them in quantity. This may seem like a tiny matter, but if your character is into manufacturing, then this is one of the big ones. So... friends, this isn't about politics. It's about fixing the finer points of the game for everyone. The small things, and the big things. I just included this one as an example of the issues that drive some of us crazy. Breha Well no, it is about politics. CSMs will not be glorified bug0hunters and unpaid developers- CCP will still be deciding what happens to the game, in terms of new content and old fixes. The CSM role is all about representing the people and their views to CCP. Seeing as "politics" comes from the word "people" (well, "citizen", anyway) and essentially means "one's policies", I'd say that you should start thinking politically. I, for one, only want CSM's who are capable of understanding their role as a democratic voice for the players, and not CSM's who think they can go about getting bugs fixed. ------ Originally by: Dark Shikari The problem with killing Jesus is he always just respawns 3 days later anyways.
Jenny Spitfire Caldari LoneStar Industries Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2008.04.22 21:03:00 - [36] Soembody who don't swaear, don't give CCP a hard tiem and have manners.
Radcjk Caldari Dark Star LTD Atrocitas	Posted - 2008.04.22 21:13:00 - [37] Personally, I'm gonna go for Jade Constantine. I don't know any of the candidates personally, and have never heard of half of them and thats fine. But looking over the candidates and various opinions they have, this is as close as to what I want to see in a candidate. Just have to find his opinion on bacon, heh.
Liza Minnelli	Posted - 2008.04.22 21:30:00 - [38] Nobody, democracy does not work. Its a mob rule where 51% of the people can take away the rights of the other 49%. (and thats if everyone votes) Your lucky to get 75%(very high turnout)of the population voting and then it only takes 40% to win a majority. let the devs dev and the players play. Im sure if they read the forums they hear every improvment idea and whine already. 1 person representing the whole population is not a fix.
Segge Bolled Caldari Dirty Sexy Pilots New Age Solutions Amalgamated	Posted - 2008.04.22 21:39:00 - [39] Edited by: Segge Bolled on 22/04/2008 21:39:50 Originally by: Templer Relleg Originally by: Lady Sheiba Originally by: LaVista Vista You will see that most of us carebears, also have pvp alts who are quite active Proof or stfu Hai guys, whats going on here? Ah! Like a bloody masked dance around here!
Breha Organa	Posted - 2008.04.23 17:35:00 - [40] Originally by: Radcjk Personally, I'm gonna go for Jade Constantine. I don't know any of the candidates personally, and have never heard of half of them and thats fine. But looking over the candidates and various opinions they have, this is as close as to what I want to see in a candidate. Just have to find his opinion on bacon, heh. Jade and I responded in the same thread... and have slightly different views on the BACON issue. There still are a few weeks to go before voting starts, and I sincerely want to represent you... as I see issues concerning you... I will attempt to voice opinions on them here. However, since I am an active player myself, I do not always have time to check all the threads. If there is an issue you need all the candidates to address, please reply to this thread.
Breha Organa	Posted - 2008.04.23 18:00:00 - [41] Originally by: Patch86 Well no, it is about politics. CSMs will not be glorified bug0hunters and unpaid developers- CCP will still be deciding what happens to the game, in terms of new content and old fixes. The CSM role is all about representing the people and their views to CCP. Seeing as "politics" comes from the word "people" (well, "citizen", anyway) and essentially means "one's policies", I'd say that you should start thinking politically. I, for one, only want CSM's who are capable of understanding their role as a democratic voice for the players, and not CSM's who think they can go about getting bugs fixed. I agree... which is why I addressed the BACON issue. Do you have an issue in mind you would like to know where I stand on? CSM does have the ability to bring possible "bugs" to the attention of CCP... but we also make recommendations to improve gameplay and settle any injustices that occur. I am in a rather unique position, since my character is part-time industrial as a miner and manufacturer, and part-time combat player. I have defended POSes in low sec space, hunted pirates (hostiles), and no matter what side you are on... if your player does combat, I seek to make the game challenging but fair. Tactical advantage is part of what makes EVE enjoyable for the players. So... if you happen to be a Carebear and whine about getting your Hulk destroyed, I will not be sympathetic unless you can demonstrate a legitimate injustice in the game. I have a 23-year-old daughter who also is active in EVE, and her character is a full-time Carebear. I will take her thoughts into as much account as I will a member of Goonswarm or BOB. (By the way... I'm 43 and 100% female. I am, as it is said, WYSIWYG)
Zev'Nar Carebear Salvagers Incorporated	Posted - 2008.04.23 19:07:00 - [42] I'm paranoid enough with EVE to think that most the candidates are goon alts/spys. You can't really trust anyone in EVE so how are you supposed to be able even chose a candidate?
Breha Organa	Posted - 2008.04.24 06:31:00 - [43] Hope this helps... there are several people who know me in game other than those in my own corporation, Sentinels of Justice Tactical Command. Our corp website will give you an idea of what I'm about. Granadan and Reschef of Species8472, Kartock Maar of Harbingers of Sarrow, Chancellor Martock of IBKW, all of these players have fought alongside me trying to defend the freedom of peace-loving corps in low sec Devoid region. On the receiving end of my guns are people such as Firkragg, Nexa Necis of TRAPS, and Tevion Lacroix of Dirty Deeds Corp. I can build you a Nighthawk for the price of a bpc plus the materials (I have blueprints for the component parts) at no profit to me... IF your corp seeks peace and promotes those who defend liberty in Empire. Do these things matter for a member of the CSM? Well, it tells you more about the kind of individual I am... even though I am fair toward all players, and do not seek to give any advantage to one side or the other. One thing is absolutely true... I cannot be bought, and my honor is more sacred than profit. Talk to the people who know me.
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N. Insurgency	Posted - 2008.04.24 08:04:00 - [44] At the moment, probably Jade Constantine.
Verone Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.04.24 11:16:00 - [45] Originally by: Sqalevon Originally by: Rodj Blake I will be voting for Hardin. He's the right man for the job. Has Hardin stated any plans yet? Or will he Ctrl-C/Ctrl-V the ships and modules forum into his campaign flyer ? I know he's pretty good at pushing agendas but I have no idea what his agenda will be. The thing is, everyone's talking about CSM candidate's "plans" and what they want to do and see in Eve, and that's completely what the CSM is NOT about. It's about the people elected as representatives getting the COMMUNITY'S issues, ideas and plans across to CCP, not their own. Regardless of what people think, or how CSM members want to see Eve turn out, you shouldn't be voting for people who say "hai guys, i got all these leik, grate ideass!11" You should be voting for people who can put YOUR points across to CCP in the most direct, structured and simple fashion. That's what the CSM is about, not about which candidate has the coolest ideas for new content. Pretty much why my 4 votes will be going to Hardin. No piles of ideas of his own, no "hay gais, i want this in Eve" trying to impress people, no massive drawn out walls of text, just someone who loves the game and the community for what it's already become, and someone you know has the common sense and good nature to get the point across to CCP. Your point, not his. >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW - EVE FICTION <<<
fuze Gallente InfoMorph Services Ltd	Posted - 2008.04.24 11:46:00 - [46] Just read that out of 64 candidates there is only 3 of em birds. It shouldn't matter but if any of them has a solid story I'll consider voting.
Jade Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.04.24 12:15:00 - [47] Well IÆm going to have to disagree with you profoundly Verone. I think you arenÆt alone in this misconception about the role of the CSM representative though, and itÆs useful to refer to the text of the PDF presentation made available to everyone on the subject. Quote: ôAll Representatives have equal right to raise topics during CSM meetingsö Judgement is needed, and its very fair for the eve populace to know what kind of topics the candidates are knowledgeable and enthusiastic about. If you are a fan of small unit PVP or capital ops or covert gameplay you want to know you have a rep on the council with the knowledge and passion to advocate these issues at the council level. Quote: ôA dedicated electronic forum will be provided for voters to formally present issues to CSM Representatives. Because this is a ôgathering placeö where topics deemed important to societyàö You need to see how your CSM rep handles public debate, you need to see how discussion is handled, how advocacy occurs, what makes the candidates mind work and how he or she behaves in the process of decision-making. Quote: ôThe burden of demonstrating the legitimacy or urgency of the issue rests with the voters themselves. A good idea will generate momentum all on its own, and it is the task of the CSM to not only track these discussions, but to engage the populace as much as possible in the interest of sustaining that momentum until the issue is brought to closure.ö Again you need CSM candidates who are good with the public, who can stimulate discussion and promote knowledge of issues with good writing and imaginative presentation. Quote: ôUsing their own judgement, Representatives will have the power to mark topics as they deem necessaryùnamely by gauging which issues voters are generating the most debate about.ö There's that judgement thing again - CSM reps need to understand the community and accurately assess "hot issues". Quote: "... topics brought up by the Representatives themselves, issues marked for resolution are considered by the CSM for determination on whether or not they should be brought before the CCP Council. After each CSM member presents their opinion to support or disprove a motion, the matter is brought to vote; a majority rule passes the issue for escalation." Ultimately the CSM decides which issues go to Iceland. This is 5/9 majority voting. The eve public have a right and responsibility to know how those candidates are likely to vote on important issues. Its entirely fair for people to ask all candidates "what would you vote on BACON?" for example, since its candidate preference that will decide whether these issues are escalated. Quote: "All topics which pass the CSM Representative vote must be answered in person by the CCP Council during the meeting in Iceland stating clearly what the issues are, why they are important to the EVE society, and what course of action(s) are sought to bring ôsatisfactoryö closure to them." This is the point. The Decision-making process is critical. Its not enough for a candidate to just say "trust me I'm X" they need to tell the eve populace why they should be trusted and what their interests are. Quote: "Before CSM Representatives arrive in Iceland, the CCP Council will deliberate on as many issues as possible and prepare preliminary judgements. Following a formal presentation by Representatives upon their arrival, ruling will be announced, along with mandatory, detailed explanations of judgement rationale, and an outline for future action, if appropriate. From here, the table is opened for discussion: it is possible, based on the counterarguments of the Representatives, that CCP will rescind the original judgement in lieu of this debate." Debating skill, charisma, passion, convincing arguments and an eye for the big picture. These are neccessary talents. The Eve public has a right to know whether candidates possess these things.
Poreuomai Minmatar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2008.04.24 12:23:00 - [48] Originally by: Rodj Blake I will be voting for Hardin. He's the right man for the job. That's almost as surprising as my intention to vote for zoolkhan.
Jade Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.04.24 12:24:00 - [49] Originally by: Verone The thing is, everyone's talking about CSM candidate's "plans" and what they want to do and see in Eve, and that's completely what the CSM is NOT about. Its from these "plans" we get to see how a candidate thinks - what he or she is passionate about, how he or she handles public debate. If a candidate is putting nothing out there to discuss now then how are we supposed to know they'll be any good at the actual job in the CSM role where they are supposed to be engaging and energizing public debate on key issues? Quote: It's about the people elected as representatives getting the COMMUNITY'S issues, ideas and plans across to CCP, not their own. Well they've got to be good with the community Verone, they need to show an ability to engage with and stimulate discussion and excitement and passion. People with "no ideas" of their own tend to be a bit dull - thats the hard truth of it, and the CSM representative council needs some fire and spark to get things rolling. Quote: Regardless of what people think, or how CSM members want to see Eve turn out, you shouldn't be voting for people who say "hai guys, i got all these leik, grate ideass!11" Thats your opinion mate. The text of the CSM document suggests otherwise. Engage and stimulate and energize the community. That stuff takes good ideas, it takes passionate involvement and vision of the big picture. Quote: You should be voting for people who can put YOUR points across to CCP in the most direct, structured and simple fashion. That's what the CSM is about, not about which candidate has the coolest ideas for new content. Again its your bias Verone. You don't like long texts or detailed ideas, fine. Some people do. Some things aren't "simple" and can't be represented in half a dozen words. This is a complex multifaceted game world we're talking about here, not a game of "pong"
Intigo Amarr Art of War	Posted - 2008.04.24 12:26:00 - [50] Jade is making a good case for himself so far.
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N. Insurgency	Posted - 2008.04.24 13:02:00 - [51] Originally by: Liza Minnelli Nobody, democracy does not work. Its a mob rule where 51% of the people can take away the rights of the other 49%. (and thats if everyone votes) Your lucky to get 75%(very high turnout)of the population voting and then it only takes 40% to win a majority. let the devs dev and the players play. Im sure if they read the forums they hear every improvment idea and whine already. 1 person representing the whole population is not a fix. "It has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried." - Winston Churchill CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Hardin Amarr Epitoth Fleetyards Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2008.04.24 13:30:00 - [52] Originally by: Verone Pretty much why my 4 votes will be going to Hardin. No piles of ideas of his own, no "hay gais, i want this in Eve" trying to impress people, no massive drawn out walls of text, just someone who loves the game and the community for what it's already become, and someone you know has the common sense and good nature to get the point across to CCP. Your point, not his. Thank you Verone. With regard to those people calling for candidates to create detailed manifestos let me repeat what I stated on Scrapheap yesterday: ====================================== I do not have, nor claim to have, an indepth knowledge of all aspects of this game. I do not believe many (if any) of the candidates can honestly put their hand on their heart and say that they do. Ask me what I think should be done to improve market tools or make life easier for manufacturers and I would simply look at you blankly - Why? - because that is one aspect of the game in which I have not really participated and can therfore claim no specific expertise. When political parties put together 'manifestos' they normally do so using dedicated working groups made up of experts and people with interest in specific policy areas. However in this process we are all standing as individuals. Yes, we all have our fields of expertise - some more than others - but it would be both foolish and stupid for each of us to try and create some all encompassing manifesto when in some areas we really wont have a clue what we are talking about! Not only that but it would be hideously long and I doubt that many people will want to wade through 62 manifestos. My main hope is that the 9 people who get elected to the council represent a cross section of EVE society (and therefore represent as many styles of gameplay as possible), are willing to respect each others views and expertise and have the commonsense to simply shut up, listen and learn sometimes - and THEN make informed decisions. Whether that is realistic or not we shall have to wait and see - but I have always been an idealist to some extent! Also I would like to point out that if you do have specific questions I (and others) have been making efforts to answer those on our own individual blogs/websites - which also offer voters a good general sense of what each candidate stands for and how they want the game to develop. ====================================== As I have said on my blog http://hardinfaq.blogspot.com my prime motivator for taking part in this process is to improve this game which I love! Obviously my decision making will be influenced by my experiences playing this game but I believe that those candidates who wish to express an opinion on every single matter under the sun are already demonstrating a small minded attitude. Maybe my approach is 'dull' but the fact is that I will approach every issue with an open mind - LISTEN to the arguements and then make a decision primarily based on what is in the interests of this game long term. Obviously I will be influenced by my own experiences in the game and I will feed my own opinions into the decison making process however I will not go into those discussions with a "THIS IS HOW WE SHALL CHANGE THINGS AND WE WONT ACCEPT ANYTHING ELSE" attitude. While many of you are aware of an 'interesting' history between Jade and I that does not mean that I will be automatically opposed to his (or anyone else's) suggestions/proposals. However, I will be striving to ensure that a sense of BALANCE is maintained and that the CSM is not dominated by forceful individuals who have simply been elected to psuh their own agendas and playstyles at the expense of everyone else's. ----- Alliance Creation/Corp Expansion Services Advert
Tzar'rim Reckless Corsairs	Posted - 2008.04.24 13:30:00 - [53] I'd vote for Verone but since he didn't run my vote will go to Hardin. I'm looking for a stable candidate who doesn't shout "look at meh!" or write 17 paragraphs while evading the actual point of a discussion.
Tzar'rim Reckless Corsairs	Posted - 2008.04.24 13:31:00 - [54] Originally by: Verone Originally by: Sqalevon Originally by: Rodj Blake I will be voting for Hardin. He's the right man for the job. Has Hardin stated any plans yet? Or will he Ctrl-C/Ctrl-V the ships and modules forum into his campaign flyer ? I know he's pretty good at pushing agendas but I have no idea what his agenda will be. The thing is, everyone's talking about CSM candidate's "plans" and what they want to do and see in Eve, and that's completely what the CSM is NOT about. It's about the people elected as representatives getting the COMMUNITY'S issues, ideas and plans across to CCP, not their own. Regardless of what people think, or how CSM members want to see Eve turn out, you shouldn't be voting for people who say "hai guys, i got all these leik, grate ideass!11" You should be voting for people who can put YOUR points across to CCP in the most direct, structured and simple fashion. That's what the CSM is about, not about which candidate has the coolest ideas for new content. Pretty much why my 4 votes will be going to Hardin. No piles of ideas of his own, no "hay gais, i want this in Eve" trying to impress people, no massive drawn out walls of text, just someone who loves the game and the community for what it's already become, and someone you know has the common sense and good nature to get the point across to CCP. Your point, not his. Bingo
RuleoftheBone Minmatar Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.04.24 13:39:00 - [55] I am gonna write-in Verone and Chribba. If it steals votes from others-tough cookies and good riddance . "Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way" General George Patton USA
Tommy TenKreds Animal Mercantile Executive	Posted - 2008.04.24 13:53:00 - [56] I will most likely be voting for Jade Constantine. Jade has consistently won my attention, respect and even admiration whenever his has presented his vision of Eve. Goumindong also presents an excellent platform, making many insightful points about how Eve can be improved. But, sadly, he strikes me as abrasive, argumentative and too preoccupied with minutiae. I also expect he will be elected anyway, through Goon block voting. Oz is a nice chap, with a great deal of experience. But he doesn't seem to have much to say one way or another (sorry Oz). Serenity Steele has contributed a ridiculous amount to Eve, both in content and reputation. But he really seems to be all about 'da bizness' and doesn't seem to display a coherent far-reaching vision for Eve. Torn Soul is a massive carebear IMO, who just wants a BIG finger in another pie. Who have I forgotten? Max Torps is best of the rest I think. From a personal POV I would have liked to see Entity stand. Just my opinions feel free to ignore.
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.04.24 14:32:00 - [57] Originally by: Tommy TenKreds Goumindong also presents an excellent platform, making many insightful points about how Eve can be improved. But, sadly, he strikes me as abrasive, argumentative and too preoccupied with minutiae. I also expect he will be elected anyway, through Goon block voting. I am not a goonswarm Candidate in that regard Vote Goumindong for CSM
LaVista Vista Conservative Shenanigans Party	Posted - 2008.04.24 14:34:00 - [58] Originally by: Tommy TenKreds Edit: Lavista Vista is a solid vote for the sensible, thinking carebear. I have greater concerns than the economy of Eve though. I agree, not everybody would, or should, care about the economy of eve. The recent changes on the market are extremely good for the average eve-player who wants cheap stuff. Yet a few markets have been highly volatile lately, which means these prices have been going up. But at this point, prices are stabilizing very fast. But i agree with the above poster. Jade is an ideal candidate to represent the PvP side of the game. I'm yet to see Jade talk about industry matter, which is sad. But he makes up for that with his good arguments and good manners in discussions. So if i wasn't running myself, i would 100% vote Jade.
Tommy TenKreds Animal Mercantile Executive	Posted - 2008.04.24 14:34:00 - [59] Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: Tommy TenKreds Goumindong also presents an excellent platform, making many insightful points about how Eve can be improved. But, sadly, he strikes me as abrasive, argumentative and too preoccupied with minutiae. I also expect he will be elected anyway, through Goon block voting. I am not a goonswarm Candidate in that regard Well you should be. You're clearly their best candidate. Bandures > tommy you like a cowboy harry )
LaVista Vista Conservative Shenanigans Party	Posted - 2008.04.24 14:37:00 - [60] Originally by: Tommy TenKreds Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: Tommy TenKreds Goumindong also presents an excellent platform, making many insightful points about how Eve can be improved. But, sadly, he strikes me as abrasive, argumentative and too preoccupied with minutiae. I also expect he will be elected anyway, through Goon block voting. I am not a goonswarm Candidate in that regard Well you should be. You're clearly their best candidate. He's the only goonswarm candidate who i have seen actually post on the forum. So i agree, GS should go for you as their candidate. But oh well, their loss, eh?

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