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Hanilein
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Posted - 2004.04.30 09:28:00 -
[1]
So, CCP, make up your mind:
Nowadays more and more gatecampers are killing indies in empire space. Either you give the attacked the opportunity to strike back or you stop that killing.
ATM there is _no_ way to stop the pirates - they're using cheap alts and cheap ships.
I want to build a convoy with my mates to protect them and send those pirates to hell - but as in RL - the polices protects (nearly always) the bad guys.
CCP, give us gangs in which the player can protect each other!
________________________________________________ Balancing doesn't mean to equal every fitting, it means giving everybody the chance to encounter a fitting.
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Bsport
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Posted - 2004.04.30 10:09:00 -
[2]
yer if your ganged and in close range of each other. if a pirate tagets any gang members, each ship in the gang auto targets that ship. that would scare them --------
|~~~| I run out of money, so bunny has been | OIL | grounded down to make grease for my |____| rifter- poor bunny
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ClarCE
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Posted - 2004.04.30 10:22:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Hanilein So, CCP, make up your mind:
Nowadays more and more gatecampers are killing indies in empire space. Either you give the attacked the opportunity to strike back or you stop that killing.
ATM there is _no_ way to stop the pirates - they're using cheap alts and cheap ships.
I want to build a convoy with my mates to protect them and send those pirates to hell - but as in RL - the polices protects (nearly always) the bad guys.
CCP, give us gangs in which the player can protect each other!
Some options for gangs and convoys would be nice, especially as it is not an exploit to sensor dampen the sentry guns, or so I heard. It does seem a little one sided, and I saw a good comment by someone the other day, saying that Pirates camping gate in empire = strip mining veld in 1.0.
--'The Way is Shut'--
----------------------- Jenny...Get to the Chopper---Stick Around -----------------------
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Bonnie Parker
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Posted - 2004.04.30 10:29:00 -
[4]
Anyone who fires upon you in any sec space should be fair game for yourself, fellow corp mates, and gang members, for a set period of time (say 10 minutes).
That way corps can actually escort their haulers through empire space safe in the knowledge that they can actually DEFEND them without insta-gank NPC's ruining that aspect of the game.
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Aelius
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Posted - 2004.04.30 10:34:00 -
[5]
Ending all alts or applying huge deletion times will fix the problem. Selling Raven BPC ME20 3M at Yulai 1st Station |
Bonnie Parker
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Posted - 2004.04.30 10:36:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Aelius Ending all alts or applying huge deletion times will fix the problem.
And create bigger problems as a consequence.
Try again.
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Lao Tzu
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Posted - 2004.04.30 10:38:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Lao Tzu on 30/04/2004 10:39:39
Quote: Ending all alts or applying huge deletion times will fix the problem
A couple of weeks to delete an alt might do it, there's no good reason I can think of to need to delete alts often. Noob who screws up all his starting characters could always petion to have one removed.
edit: maybe a month, two weeks still leaves one alt a week and a main.
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Alexander Rahl
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Posted - 2004.04.30 11:23:00 -
[8]
This is a major nuisance and until ccp allow corp mates to assist in battles like this then it will remain a nuisance, but, the way around it is to have a BS escort when hauling valuables with sh transferers fitted so even a missile spam would have no chance of hurting the haulers ship.
Or just make insta jumps for common journeys.
----/ / /-----<[]>-----\ \ \---- Head of House Rahl Warleader of the Rahl Clans
"Death and Glory, Honour with Courage, Fury and Vengeance" - Chronicles of Rahl. |
Adriana
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Posted - 2004.04.30 11:30:00 -
[9]
Battles? Um, it's not a battle, it's one kestral x 4 cruise missiles = dead indi.
The problem is that a tiny little frigate can use great big battleship missiles.
NERF THEM!!!
or give industrials more hps to be able to withstand a single barrage from these ass clowns.
I know criminal flagging is supposed to occur...implement it already. make it so people can blow up the guy standing by in the hauler to loot your stuff after concord blows up the kestral atl in his disposable ship.
Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake. -Napoleon Bonaparte |
lash
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Posted - 2004.04.30 11:34:00 -
[10]
i think just giving indys more base hp would solve this problem and make everyone happy. People will get to keep their cruise missiles on their frigates, and indy pilots will get a very nice upgrade to a ship with paper thin armor as it is.
-------------- "You ever hear of the Seattle Seven? That was me. And, um, six other guys." |
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McWatt
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Posted - 2004.04.30 11:40:00 -
[11]
Edited by: McWatt on 30/04/2004 11:42:07 excuse me guys, but are you nuts?
i ve seldom read so much bull**** from so many ppl in so few posts!
high sec still not safe enough for you?
you can t be bothered to transport expensive stuff with another ship but your indy?
too complicated to stay at the computer and strap some equipment on your ship?
sorry, but loosers deserve to die!
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Lao Tzu
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Posted - 2004.04.30 11:56:00 -
[12]
btw: my post was aout me not liking alts, most idustrials can be equiped to resist a cruise volley from a kestrel.
You know the kessies are out there, you should know that it's not considered an exploit by CCP, so fit so goddamm sheild modules, armour get some ECM bursts, anything, other than bigcargo and go faster gear.
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Archemedes
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Posted - 2004.04.30 12:31:00 -
[13]
Considering my interceptor can (depending on the type of missile) potentially survive 4 cruises (it's an armor tanked Taranis blaster boat), I'm quite certain an Iteron 5 or Badger 2 could easily be rigged to survive a cruise missile attack. A couple 200mm armor plates and an armor explosive hardener would make you a VERY tough nut to c r a c k...
Still, there does need to be something done about throw-away alt pirates. Hopefully the criminal flagging that's being added will do the job, since at least then the character scooping the loot is also at risk (and the cops are RIGHT THERE since they just swatted the Kestrel )
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Amox
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Posted - 2004.04.30 12:39:00 -
[14]
Originally by: McWatt Edited by: McWatt on 30/04/2004 11:42:07 excuse me guys, but are you nuts?
i ve seldom read so much bull**** from so many ppl in so few posts!
high sec still not safe enough for you?
you can t be bothered to transport expensive stuff with another ship but your indy?
too complicated to stay at the computer and strap some equipment on your ship?
sorry, but loosers deserve to die!
Its not about being safe. Its about being able to defend yourself as well as your corpmates without concord killing you. The use of kestrel's to kill cargo ships is a risk free way to make isk. How can you defend that?
Your Tachyon Beam Laser I perfectly strikes Blood Oracle, wrecking for 722.3 damage. |
Javren Dei
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Posted - 2004.04.30 12:41:00 -
[15]
I hope the DEVS enable criminal flagging to solve this particular problem instead of some uber-nerf. The game does need risk - even in "safe" areas but it also need consequences. Criminal flagging will allow the victim (and corp mates) of such attacks to fight back and defend themselves for a short period of time instead of Concord teleporting in and blasting everyone, good or bad.
I think this is how the 'problem' of ore theives is going to be solved, so why not extend it to high-sec aggressors?
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Bad Harlequin
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Posted - 2004.04.30 12:45:00 -
[16]
Keep it civil please! -Zhuge Liang
You are in a maze of twisty little asteroids, all alike. |
Bad Harlequin
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Posted - 2004.04.30 12:52:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Amox
Originally by: McWatt Edited by: McWatt on 30/04/2004 11:42:07 excuse me guys, but are you nuts?
i ve seldom read so much bull**** from so many ppl in so few posts!
high sec still not safe enough for you?
you can t be bothered to transport expensive stuff with another ship but your indy?
too complicated to stay at the computer and strap some equipment on your ship?
sorry, but loosers deserve to die!
Its not about being safe. Its about being able to defend yourself as well as your corpmates without concord killing you. The use of kestrel's to kill cargo ships is a risk free way to make isk. How can you defend that?
it IS about being safe, tho. The kessie pilot's assets are perfectly safe, as is the indy friend of his coming to loot you, or say the 3-5 support ships shield transferring to the sentry-tanking BS. All these carebear "pirate" gankers are perfectly safe - the pilot essentially pays few hundred k isk fee to be able to gank indy pilots under CONCORD's nose.
And all the ganker cheerleaders talking about shield transfer units and armor plating and... are you nuts? New players start with 15,000 skillpoints, or thereabouts. Every mod you name requires SKILLS, and oft as not the weird ones require skills to even TRAIN the right skills... what you are describing is everyone must follow the same combat-oriented skill path, whether they're in 0.0 or 1.0, miner or fighter, to say nothing about how enthusasitc ANY paying player should have to be to devoting a few weeks to months of their paid time to training skills for the sole purpose of allowing these griefers to continue their lazy, 100% safe carebear ganking existance.
Shyeah okay sure. And from now on in order to fight effectively in 0.0 you must train Deep Core Mining to 5 and have ALL the research skills at max and do 5 agent missions a day.
You are in a maze of twisty little asteroids, all alike. |
Xavier Arron
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Posted - 2004.04.30 12:56:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Javren Dei I hope the DEVS enable criminal flagging to solve this particular problem instead of some uber-nerf. The game does need risk - even in "safe" areas but it also need consequences. Criminal flagging will allow the victim (and corp mates) of such attacks to fight back and defend themselves for a short period of time instead of Concord teleporting in and blasting everyone, good or bad.
I think this is how the 'problem' of ore thieves is going to be solved, so why not extend it to high-sec aggressors?
I agree, its crap atm that u cant fight back, even in 0.4>, due to peeps warping away to gates as soon as u turn up. If u attack a corp / gang member the corp /gang should be able to chase u down for at least the next hour (should be 24 imo).
Could even make it so criminal flagging will let any aggressor be ganked by locals for 15 mins, so heroic local peeps could come and help if they wanted to. Basically peeps should be able to police themselves.
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Lao Tzu
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:11:00 -
[19]
I can't see how crimainal flagging is going to change the suicide kessie 'rats, as they die to concord instantly, maybe you can hit the pod which will cost them a little more.
Sheild tanking at low sec. gates may change as people might get a chance to take out the support ships.
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cashman
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:20:00 -
[20]
Edited by: cashman on 30/04/2004 14:00:19
No flaming please -Zhuge Liang
You call that flaming? Why don't you go "work" the Crime and Punishement-room then.
McWatt: You're nothing but a carebear-pirate. Your oppinion is nothing but a pro-pirate view. All these alt-exploits (alt-war, alt-scouting, alt-pirating, ect) are only growing at the time, and its getting dumber and dumber.
____________________________________
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Ezra Vouland
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:20:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Ezra Vouland on 30/04/2004 13:23:22 "PVP is not ruining EVE. Piracy is. Ganking the helpless is. Pointless violence and vandalism is." vanBuskirk"
WTF.....
If this game is ever going to be a real immersion into a false reality then this crap has to stop...
If I kicked yer butt and stole yer lunch money there would be nothing you could do in real life. You could get the cops its a possibility. Just as its possible for concord to come gank the people who do combat in empire.
LIFE IS NOT FAIR... That is what makes all of us humans thrive so well and what defines this game.If everything was fair who the heck would wann play? You wouldn't be able to make money, be more powerful, and have fun.
If some d00d kills you in empire, suck it up, get enough skill points to do something about it, use an agent to find them in 0.0, and then proceed to seek revenge.
Stop EVE Communism
They call me trash... TrashGUY |
Bad Harlequin
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:23:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Ezra Vouland "PVP is not ruining EVE. Piracy is. Ganking the helpless is. Pointless violence and vandalism is." vanBuskirk"
WTF.....
If this game is ever going to be a real immersion into a false reality then this crap has to stop...
If I kicked yer butt and stole yer lunch money there would be nothing you could do in real life. You could get the cops its a possibility. Just as its possible for concord to come gank the people who do combat in empire.
LIFE IS NOT FAIR... That is what makes all of us humans thrive so well and what defines this game.If everything was fair who the heck would wann play? You wouldn't be able to make money, be more powerful, and have fun.
If some d00d kills you in empire, suck it up, get enough skill points to do something about it, use an agent to find them in 0.0, and then proceed to seek revenge.
Stop EVE Communism
i was wondering where bill o'reilly went
You are in a maze of twisty little asteroids, all alike. |
Ezra Vouland
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:26:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Bad Harlequin I was wondering where bill o'reilly went
Who is that
They call me trash... TrashGUY |
Maidel
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:31:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Ezra Vouland Edited by: Ezra Vouland on 30/04/2004 13:23:22 If some d00d kills you in empire, suck it up, get enough skill points to do something about it, use an agent to find them in 0.0, and then proceed to seek revenge.
Stop EVE Communism
No i think u are missing the point entirely - these ppl never go to 0.0 they are alts - when there sec rating gets too low they are simply recycled and replaced by a new one. the persons main character never gets affected, they are never even implicated they just collect a nice amount of money every time this happens. pirating in 0.0-0.4 is GOOD for the game, makes it fun, more risky and makes me think twice about how to go there and in what ship and is it really nessessary etc. Pritating in 1.0-0.5 is wrong because the pirate looses nothing but a 200k ship and he gains LOTS. PS if u can pirate in 1.0-0.5 WITHOUT using missile spaming alts - then more power to u and i think that is great (unless ur exploiting)
'Your Tachyon Beam Laser I perfectly strikes Sansha's Ravager, wrecking for 554.6 damage. - they do work occationally' |
Daald
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:53:00 -
[25]
Quote:
If I kicked yer butt and stole yer lunch money there would be nothing you could do in real life. You could get the cops its a possibility. Just as its possible for concord to come gank the people who do combat in empire.
If you killed somebody in front of the police, will the police allow your buddies to rob me? No they will not. They will declare it a crime scene and consfiscate everything. This game should allow for something to that effect in order to make it more realistic as you say. |
Zeltan Shadowhawk
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:53:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Zeltan Shadowhawk on 30/04/2004 14:02:35 I agree Amox.
Unfortunately there are ass clowns in game that exploit this bad design to their advantage, then call you a loser for complaining about it. Yes, McWatt, the word is loser, not looser.
Loose: Not fastened, restrained, or contained Lose: To be unsuccessful in retaining possession of; mislay
Try a little less flaming and a little more time proofreading.
It's completely lame to design a game this way. How realistic is it that someone would be carrying valuable cargo with a good armed escort, just to have someone attack the hauler and expect the escort to just watch?
People didn't say remove the risk. Oh no. They asked that the risk be UPPED. The huge reward the pirates in 0.5 to 1.0 space get is not matched with a risk factor to the pirate. You lamers that use this alt tactic want no risk and all the reward. The folks you're griefing are the ones taking the risk.
Nice try though. Come back and try again when you have thought things through fully... or when all the folks with at least half a brain and a sense of what's "reasonable" have left the game so no one is around to point out your mental deficiencies.
Originally by: Amox
Originally by: McWatt Edited by: McWatt on 30/04/2004 11:42:07 excuse me guys, but are you nuts?
i ve seldom read so much bull**** from so many ppl in so few posts!
high sec still not safe enough for you?
you can t be bothered to transport expensive stuff with another ship but your indy?
too complicated to stay at the computer and strap some equipment on your ship?
sorry, but loosers deserve to die!
Its not about being safe. Its about being able to defend yourself as well as your corpmates without concord killing you. The use of kestrel's to kill cargo ships is a risk free way to make isk. How can you defend that?
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Darmed Khan
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Posted - 2004.04.30 14:25:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Daald If you killed somebody in front of the police, will the police allow your buddies to rob me? No they will not. They will declare it a crime scene and consfiscate everything. This game should allow for something to that effect in order to make it more realistic as you say.
Sounds like a good idea to me!
Either that or modify the sentry guns so that they shoot down the missiles of the agressor.
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Mitchello
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Posted - 2004.04.30 14:41:00 -
[28]
Originally by: ClarCE
Originally by: Hanilein So, CCP, make up your mind:
Nowadays more and more gatecampers are killing indies in empire space. Either you give the attacked the opportunity to strike back or you stop that killing.
ATM there is _no_ way to stop the pirates - they're using cheap alts and cheap ships.
I want to build a convoy with my mates to protect them and send those pirates to hell - but as in RL - the polices protects (nearly always) the bad guys.
CCP, give us gangs in which the player can protect each other!
Some options for gangs and convoys would be nice, especially as it is not an exploit to sensor dampen the sentry guns, or so I heard. It does seem a little one sided, and I saw a good comment by someone the other day, saying that Pirates camping gate in empire = strip mining veld in 1.0.
actually so Far I've had the GMs tell me it isn't possible, so there is no exploit beucase no one can sensor dampen the sentry guns...accept I've seen it done...but then the GMs are always right...but then I've actaully seen it done...
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Raeff
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Posted - 2004.04.30 14:41:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Raeff on 30/04/2004 14:45:42
Originally by: Ezra Vouland Edited by: Ezra Vouland on 30/04/2004 13:23:22 "PVP is not ruining EVE. Piracy is. Ganking the helpless is. Pointless violence and vandalism is." vanBuskirk"
WTF.....
If this game is ever going to be a real immersion into a false reality then this crap has to stop...
If I kicked yer butt and stole yer lunch money there would be nothing you could do in real life. You could get the cops its a possibility. Just as its possible for concord to come gank the people who do combat in empire.
LIFE IS NOT FAIR... That is what makes all of us humans thrive so well and what defines this game.If everything was fair who the heck would wann play? You wouldn't be able to make money, be more powerful, and have fun.
If some d00d kills you in empire, suck it up, get enough skill points to do something about it, use an agent to find them in 0.0, and then proceed to seek revenge.
Stop EVE Communism
kinda makes ya wonder if some people dont think before they post .. nothing personal but your not making any sense .. all these posts about this topic are about all we want to do is be able to defend ourselves from an obvious game mechanics bug .. can it not be any clearer? i dont know how many times we have tried to explain it but people still seem to get "we wanna fly afk without any trouble from point A to B" when we are trying to say "we want to be able to defend ourselves from a game bug" .. do i have to type it in 14 other languages as well? maybe backwards and upside down? I pvp quite a bit, but i also mine to pay for ships and insure them and i haul that ore around to sell it(NEVER AFK) i dont want my minerals ripped out of my hand because of a game bug, i wanna be able to put up a fight or have escort ships that can actually defend me, but guess what, I CAN NOT
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Armin Chamberlain
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Posted - 2004.04.30 14:49:00 -
[30]
Give it up, some people are just too simple minded to understand the problem. Some of them, like McWatt just want to continue using this exploit, yeah I said it McWatt. |
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Rawne Karrde
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Posted - 2004.04.30 14:50:00 -
[31]
Man when i first heard about people using this cheap tactic, I thought that CCP would need to allow gang members to retaliate.. which by the way seems to work. The thing is that the sentry guns take care of the offenders and they do get blown up. I'm just wondering why knowing that this will occur, why people are still whining instead of making sure their indy can survive the barrage, then it would be a non-issue as the greifers would die the second they shoot and your indy would still be around... The other thought i had is why do people seem so intent on transporting valuable stuff in such ill equipped ships? My corp uses indy's to haul ore from the the fields and thats it. We build stuff where we refine, we use intercepters and battleships to move minerals from 0.0, as an interceptor with 2 mwds and as many warp core stablizers as with insta jumps can move 15k of megacyte or zydrine through a moo blockade, and does so several times a week.
This game is so full of whiners. I give props to CCP for not doing anything now, as they don't need to. Players just need to use the grey matter they have to implement an easy solution of their own which requires no nerfing of any ship.
Points to be learned
1). don't travel afk, if some kestral alt starts to lock you maybe you should warp out, or be using those afterburners to get to the gate asap.
2). As i tell the newer members of my corp, IF YOU DON"T WANT TO LOOSE IT, DON'T FLY IT, or in this case don't transport it in an indy that can be destroyed with a single barrage of cruise missles.
3). CCP is not your momma, so stop trying to pop CCP's ***** back in your mouth, as you can fix this on you own.
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Nyk0n
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Posted - 2004.04.30 17:56:00 -
[32]
why cant u attack back??
oh yea i member u moaned uber concord into existance in the first place
they good aint they
have fun with ur own creation
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Bad Harlequin
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Posted - 2004.04.30 19:59:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Nyk0n why cant u attack back??
oh yea i member u moaned uber concord into existance in the first place
they good aint they
have fun with ur own creation
you could never attack back, you idiot gang aggression has never worked right, you idiot you are a griefing carebear, you idiot have i left anything out, you idiot?
You are in a maze of twisty little asteroids, all alike. |
Amox
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Posted - 2004.04.30 20:20:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Ezra Vouland Edited by: Ezra Vouland on 30/04/2004 13:23:22 "PVP is not ruining EVE. Piracy is. Ganking the helpless is. Pointless violence and vandalism is." vanBuskirk"
WTF.....
If this game is ever going to be a real immersion into a false reality then this crap has to stop...
If I kicked yer butt and stole yer lunch money there would be nothing you could do in real life. You could get the cops its a possibility. Just as its possible for concord to come gank the people who do combat in empire.
LIFE IS NOT FAIR... That is what makes all of us humans thrive so well and what defines this game.If everything was fair who the heck would wann play? You wouldn't be able to make money, be more powerful, and have fun.
If some d00d kills you in empire, suck it up, get enough skill points to do something about it, use an agent to find them in 0.0, and then proceed to seek revenge.
Stop EVE Communism
Yea right..
Get a clue. By the time the victum gets enough skill points the players ganking would have gone through several alts and different corps. So who they gonna attack?
I look for CCP to swing the Nerf bat soon just like they had to do earlier to stop all the gate ganking. Only the alts that it would affect will just go away but the real players will have to suffer the changes.
Your Tachyon Beam Laser I perfectly strikes Blood Oracle, wrecking for 722.3 damage. |
Amox
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Posted - 2004.04.30 20:23:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Bad Harlequin
Originally by: Nyk0n why cant u attack back??
oh yea i member u moaned uber concord into existance in the first place
they good aint they
have fun with ur own creation
you could never attack back, you idiot gang aggression has never worked right, you idiot you are a griefing carebear, you idiot have i left anything out, you idiot?
lololololololol
Your Tachyon Beam Laser I perfectly strikes Blood Oracle, wrecking for 722.3 damage. |
Sekhen
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Posted - 2004.04.30 20:44:00 -
[36]
What about Shield hardeners?
Afaik the Badger MK2 has 5 med slots, and tons of CPU power. The others Indys might have more/less Meds, but anyway.
One EM and one Thermal hardener cant be that hard to put on? Or two EM, one Thermal and one Kinetic (wich I use on my Badger MK2 in Empire). Pared with a nice shieldbooster, and I'm set for pretty safe travel. And use less expanders and more armor mods.
Indys can be made pretty hard nuggets. Even for a little Frigate.
------------------------------------------------ If there is doubt, there is no doubt.
(\_/) (O.o) (> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world dominatio |
Hanilein
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Posted - 2004.04.30 22:24:00 -
[37]
Quote:
If some d00d kills you in empire, suck it up, get enough skill points to do something about it, use an agent to find them in 0.0, and then proceed to seek revenge.
Tell me how, mate. They're only active in 1.0 systems. Didn't you understand it? They kill in 1.0, they steal in 1.0, they sell the loot in 1.0, they are the perfect carebear pirates. Thats the F.
No tell me how to kick their butts.
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Hanilein
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Posted - 2004.04.30 22:39:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Rawne Karrde
Points to be learned
1). don't travel afk, if some kestral alt starts to lock you maybe you should warp out, or be using those afterburners to get to the gate asap.
2). As i tell the newer members of my corp, IF YOU DON"T WANT TO LOOSE IT, DON'T FLY IT, or in this case don't transport it in an indy that can be destroyed with a single barrage of cruise missles.
3). CCP is not your momma, so stop trying to pop CCP's ***** back in your mouth, as you can fix this on you own.
So now _you_ learn:
to 1) a)I'm an adult grown up - and if i pay for a game i dont want to sit hours in front of it and watch an indy with 100m/s. thats not _really_ thrilling. so sometimes i travel afk - and thats my personal risk. nothing to whine about.
b) Think about a kestrel, 5 km from the gate (and also from your indy), fittet with 4 cruise missiles and a pilot, who first (!) hits the F1/F2/F3/F4 keys and _then_ targets you. The CM's hits your ship faster than even a frig with two MWD's could accelerate. No chance for any indy, when two or three kestrels are waiting for you.
to 2) You are the one who transports 10.000.000 Trit in a frig??? GreatŠidea, really ...
to 3) CCP is payed to do their homework, that's the point.
I don't want the kestrel to be nerved - DONT DO THAT! What possibilities we have in great battles with these versatile ships! I love it and i like the CM's on it - and even some pirates in 0.0 are not the problem for me - but i want to strike back!!!!!! |
Dahlgren
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Posted - 2004.04.30 23:02:00 -
[39]
Edited by: Dahlgren on 30/04/2004 23:10:22 Do what I was doing, sit there with your kestral alt and nuke either the indy thats doing the pickup or if you dont want to die, the can that drops.
Enough people do that they may stop camping the highways. Kept me occupied while I couldn't use my main
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GM Rendo
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Posted - 2004.05.01 01:29:00 -
[40]
It seems that this will be fixed with the new criminal flagging system which the devs are introducing soon. Most likely only corp members and alike can access the cargo loot container that is left behind when the ship is destroyed. It hasn't been decided yet though. I also wouldn't bet on those kestrels being able to fire cruise missiles any longer so this problem pretty much should be history. Should fix this problem once and for all.
Ps. many interesting things coming soon
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Khali Nephtys
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Posted - 2004.05.01 02:37:00 -
[41]
Well it's always been a controversial issue the cruise missile frigate, real shame that they are ( probably? ) going to be nerfed now, but I can fully understand why.
Hopefully the new elite frigates will replace the kestrels as hard hitting missile boats, which is also fine in my book as well.
I find it amusing that these ehem [sarcasm] pirates [/sarcasm] blame the sentry gun changes, and concord etc on the ( Carebears ) empire traders and new players. Yet the only major changes to concord, sentries, and now missile frigates has been a response to actions of those of the pirate persuasion.
I just hope everyone remembers who is really responsible for all the changes when they next come to the forums blaming the ( Carebears ) empire traders and new players.
Khabs am pehkt...........seize the stars.
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Bozl1n
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Posted - 2004.05.01 06:15:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Bozl1n on 01/05/2004 06:18:03
http:/eve-coldfusion.com
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Mephisha
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Posted - 2004.05.01 09:16:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Aelius Ending all alts or applying huge deletion times will fix the problem.
I play only one char, and it is my opinion alts should not be in this game.
However
I think being given the possibility to defend yourself against this is a much better solution, and more in line with the spirit of this Alternate Life (as opposed to real life )
------------------------------------------------ I have seen carebears with claws and PvP-Lords hiding in high sec space. So AWAY with all those terms. We are ALL citizens of EVE. |
Chade Malloy
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Posted - 2004.05.01 09:36:00 -
[44]
I simply whish a freakin RED DOT next to the brackets/scanner name of a ship, which recently was involved in aggressive acts (=attacking another ship/supporting a ship that attacks another ship) and which shows me that i and everyone else inrange is free to attack this ship without penalty. There should be a timer on this dot, maybe 5-10 minutes, and in the last minute it should start to blink, so you know when you have to stop firing.
I think thats a simple solution and easy to implement.
(i post it in idea labs too as an extra thread for opinions on this)
Patience wins. |
Mad Bomber
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Posted - 2004.05.01 10:55:00 -
[45]
Kestrels, and cruise should remain. Un-nerfed
Fit shield extenders, armour mods, or CCP pls make indys alittle tougher
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TeeTee
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Posted - 2004.05.01 11:34:00 -
[46]
OMFG The indys already travel at a snails pace add armor mods and it will slow from a limp to a crawl and they will still kill u using kestrals. These noobs posting like they been playing the game for months need to learn the game before even thinking about posting like there technical wiz kids. I think CCP really dropped the ball on this EXPLOIT and all of us who lost items to the EXPLOIT should be reimbursed. The eploiters are not even real pirates as there is no way to fight them back , real pirates like a challenge not shooting fish in a barrel.
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Ankh
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Posted - 2004.05.01 11:37:00 -
[47]
Cruise equipped kestrels are EVE's E-boats, fast hit and run ships with a deadly payload.
The problem is that indies don't have appropriate defences. There should defensive modules (like 'chaff' generators) etc that can be fitted to indies, imho.
There are ways round the problem though. For example, using passworded cargo cans in your hold not only prevents your cargo from being scanned, it stops the pirate getting the goods if they do destroy your ship.
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Jimmeh
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Posted - 2004.05.01 11:49:00 -
[48]
Hauling precious stuff needs a bespoke solution, like the armoured vans used by banks in RL.
An Armageddon fitted with spanders in the low slots can carry over 2,000 m3. I don't think a Kestrel would even bother to lock it.
An Iteron 5 can fit a mwd for speed and still has 4 other med slots for protective modules like tac shields. At 700 m/sec, it can reach a jump-gate intact with hostile kestrels around.
True, these solutions cost more and take time to train the right skills, but if you are becoming a specialised high-value cargo hauler it goes with the turf.
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TeeTee
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Posted - 2004.05.01 11:49:00 -
[49]
Here we go again someone who acts like he knows what he is talking about. The password protected can no longer protects valuables unless it is ANCHORED. If the can is in your cargo hold full of valuables the exploiters will just sccop up the can repackage it at the station and all the valuables will pop out so now you just gave them an expensive can also. Yes the PW protected cans in the past would not be scoopable but when anchoring skill came into existance that went down the toilet. Bottom line is there is no effective defense or offense against the kestral cruise missle exploit and I dare say removing cruise missles from kestrals wont fix it either as the offenders will just bring extra corp members with more kestrals and heavy missles , so wot if they lose 4 kestrals instead of 2 they just killed your indy that had localhull 27% cargo expanders on them worth over 20 million each or maybe a cargo load of tech2 equipment. You know CCP knows what I just told you they just let this go on to build drama, at the expense of the victims.
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Lao Tzu
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Posted - 2004.05.01 11:55:00 -
[50]
Quote: OMFG The indys already travel at a snails pace add armor mods and it will slow from a limp to a crawl and they will still kill u using kestrals.
You only have to survive one volley, then CONCORD kill the kessie and you can crawl on in peace.
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FreeTofi
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Posted - 2004.05.01 12:01:00 -
[51]
The question must be this - Why does everyone moan about a problem without finding the simplest solution. i.e defend your indy with the slots that CCP gave them. It's soooo simple.
"The Sisters of Mercy"
"We know no fear"
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TeeTee
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Posted - 2004.05.01 12:02:00 -
[52]
Wrong it you wont survive they have a whole squadron of kestrals there if the firs2 dont kill you another 2 will open fire and traveling at a snails pace gives the other kestrals more time to open fire. I have interon 5 and U cant fit the correct size mwd on it and still use the other 4 mid slots because the correct SIZE mwd takes most all the power grid , sure you can fit an MWD 1 on it and get the same speed as you would with AB10 and lose power 25% cap and 25% sheild. There is no way currently to stop this EXPLOIT using the current game mechanics. The exploiters know this and are all over the highly traveled empire sectors in gangs reaping huge profits for very little lost , then transfer the profits to a main character. Either give indys a large increase in speed shields and armor or just accepts indys are only good for transporting minerals from a roid belt.
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Ankh
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Posted - 2004.05.01 12:03:00 -
[53]
/emote *sighs.
I use an Iteron V with mwd fitted, tac shields, secure passworded cans, and bookmarks. Yup, I never actually got to the point of having to try out the passworded thing. I regularly haul the highways and have never been ganked by kestrels.
You say I don't know what I'm talking about, so how come you got caught out?
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TeeTee
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Posted - 2004.05.01 12:12:00 -
[54]
Because I was under the impression this was an exploit and the offenders had been banned for it in the past. Beleive me if u have any decent expanders on your interon 5 and you travel in the popular highsector space lanes of the day you will be killed. Your cans wont be there either when you come back to retrieve them because they were not anchored. I think you should be more specific on the MWD size you are using because if its mwd 1 your are not gaining anything from it rather hurting your power grid for the other 4 slots. Use an AB10 instead.
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Ankh
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Posted - 2004.05.01 12:32:00 -
[55]
Iteron fitting as follows:
5x 10% powercore boosters in the low slots; 10MN mwd, shield booster, tac shield and 2x cap boosters in the med slots; nothing in the high slots. You need powergrid skills maxed out for this, of course.
Gives you 7,500 cargo (more if you use cans) and is capable of well over 700 m/sec.
Truth is I don't use the mwd on my regular runs, as i have the gates bookmarked and drop out of warp right in the jump-zone. This is probably the best line of defence against campers. But the mwd undoubtedly helps on less frequently used haul routes. Although you lose some shields with the mwd, the speed gain is 3-4x so you are exposed to danger for a much shorter time.
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Kr'Kal
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Posted - 2004.05.01 12:57:00 -
[56]
I actually doubt that crim flagging will help alot, just imagine some dumbass demanding ransom for not destroying your cargo . I think there's hardly anything to do about except that there should be a way to get rid of the missiles being fired at you, cause if one kestrel can't kill you anymore, two or three will.
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McWatt
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Posted - 2004.05.01 15:10:00 -
[57]
Edited by: McWatt on 01/05/2004 15:41:14 Edited by: McWatt on 01/05/2004 15:33:32
Originally by: Hanilein
Tell me how, mate. They're only active in 1.0 systems. Didn't you understand it? They kill in 1.0, they steal in 1.0, they sell the loot in 1.0, they are the perfect carebear pirates. Thats the F.
No tell me how to kick their butts.
best post ever. please read again what you wrote here, and you will fully understand the basics of the problem.
here are some hints: the question each pirate asks himself is: Now tell me how to kick their butts?
Tell me how, mate. They're only active in 1.0 systems. Didn't you understand it? They mine in 1.0, they produce in 1.0, they sell the loot in 1.0, they are the perfect carebears. Thats the F.
see?
Quote:
McWatt: You're nothing but a carebear-pirate. Your oppinion is nothing but a pro-pirate view. All these alt-exploits (alt-war, alt-scouting, alt-pirating, ect) are only growing at the time, and its getting dumber and dumber.
they are growing because combat has been nerfed into non-existance. yes, i agree, it s getting dumber and dumber!
i realy like the term carebear-pirate, btw.
Originally by: GM Rendo
It seems that this will be fixed with the new criminal flagging system which the devs are introducing soon. Most likely only corp members and alike can access the cargo loot container that is left behind when the ship is destroyed. It hasn't been decided yet though. I also wouldn't bet on those kestrels being able to fire cruise missiles any longer so this problem pretty much should be history. Should fix this problem once and for all.
Ps. many interesting things coming soon
intersting things? wtf?
* criminal flagging will fix what exactly?
* which corp members will be able to pick up loot only? hopefully the killers?
* cruises gone. wonderfull idea.
again, what fix, what s broken?
Quote:
Unfortunately there are ass clowns in game that exploit this bad design to their advantage, then call you a loser for complaining about it. Yes, McWatt, the word is loser, not looser.
i agree on the clowns being in game.
the only risks remaining in high sec space are suicide attacks and wars. if you follow the forums closely you ll notice that there is a massive campaign working to remove both.
i love you ppl claiming you want to "bring some risk to the pirates" and "some way to fight back". i even guess a few among you have honest intentions.
but it will end in massive afk travelling and even more bizarre abuses of the system.
again: suicide attacks are a direct effect of the piracy nerfs! (mainly security status bug, uber concord and a huge risk/reward imbalance)
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Redwolf
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Posted - 2004.05.01 18:39:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Bad Harlequin
Originally by: Nyk0n why cant u attack back??
oh yea i member u moaned uber concord into existance in the first place
they good aint they
have fun with ur own creation
you could never attack back, you idiot gang aggression has never worked right, you idiot you are a griefing carebear, you idiot have i left anything out, you idiot?
You forgot not to waste type on chicken alt posters
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McWatt
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Posted - 2004.05.02 09:12:00 -
[59]
Edited by: McWatt on 02/05/2004 09:14:12
Originally by: Redwolf
Originally by: Bad Harlequin
Originally by: Nyk0n why cant u attack back??
oh yea i member u moaned uber concord into existance in the first place
they good aint they
have fun with ur own creation
you could never attack back, you idiot gang aggression has never worked right, you idiot you are a griefing carebear, you idiot have i left anything out, you idiot?
You forgot not to waste type on chicken alt posters
hm. didn t he mainly forget to think?
or to mention the fact that before concord was transformed into the uber-deity it is today it was indeed possible to fightback?
or to notice that gang aggression not working (rather sad, btw) has little effect as the suicide ship will die anyway?
or that the real griefing is done by all the experienced players not leaving high sec ever, mining the ore of the noobs, renting the factory/research slots of the noobs and transforming the game into a clone of any other MMOG on the market.
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