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Grapez
Sky Net Industries
Pure.
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Posted - 2008.05.19 05:07:00 -
[1]
A large problem with cloaking stems from the cloaked pilot's ability to gather as much information about his surroundings while giving as little information about himself to others in local. This manifests itself primarily in two very different instances: 1.) when ratters cloak at any sign of a local spike and 2.) when people place alts in hostile systems and have them AFK while collecting intel, often for days or even weeks at a time, without giving the other pilots in the system a chance to counter.
I am proposing a change to the cloaking mechanics that alleviates these problems. It cripples the metagaming potential for cloaks while preserving its tactical and strategic abilities.
When someone is cloaked, that person's local chat window is closed. It will only open when the cloak is deactivated. It will close when the cloak is reactivated.
This addresses the two above issues. For the cloaking ratter, he cannot see when it is safe to uncloak and continue ratting. It is a risk vs. reward tradeoff; the cloaked ratter never knows when it is safe to continue ratting (risk), but he gains an important tool for evading hostiles (reward). For the AFK, cloaked intel gatherer, he cannot passively monitor local. He must uncloak to see local. Even if he only momentarily uncloaks (for a minimum of 30 seconds, given the current reactiviation delay on cloaks), it gives the others in the system a chance to probe him out. Again, this is a risk vs. reward tradeoff. The intel gatherer must expose himself to the possibility of being probed out (risk) in order to gather intel on the system (reward).
None of this changes the fundamental use of the cloaking device. Pilots in covert ops frigates and force recon cruisers can still gather vital intelligence in hostile systems. Ratters can still cloak when they are in danger. What this does do is force the cloaker to take on more risk in order to complete these very rewarding tasks.
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Grapez
Sky Net Industries
Pure.
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Posted - 2008.05.19 05:07:00 -
[2]
A large problem with cloaking stems from the cloaked pilot's ability to gather as much information about his surroundings while giving as little information about himself to others in local. This manifests itself primarily in two very different instances: 1.) when ratters cloak at any sign of a local spike and 2.) when people place alts in hostile systems and have them AFK while collecting intel, often for days or even weeks at a time, without giving the other pilots in the system a chance to counter.
I am proposing a change to the cloaking mechanics that alleviates these problems. It cripples the metagaming potential for cloaks while preserving its tactical and strategic abilities.
When someone is cloaked, that person's local chat window is closed. It will only open when the cloak is deactivated. It will close when the cloak is reactivated.
This addresses the two above issues. For the cloaking ratter, he cannot see when it is safe to uncloak and continue ratting. It is a risk vs. reward tradeoff; the cloaked ratter never knows when it is safe to continue ratting (risk), but he gains an important tool for evading hostiles (reward). For the AFK, cloaked intel gatherer, he cannot passively monitor local. He must uncloak to see local. Even if he only momentarily uncloaks (for a minimum of 30 seconds, given the current reactiviation delay on cloaks), it gives the others in the system a chance to probe him out. Again, this is a risk vs. reward tradeoff. The intel gatherer must expose himself to the possibility of being probed out (risk) in order to gather intel on the system (reward).
None of this changes the fundamental use of the cloaking device. Pilots in covert ops frigates and force recon cruisers can still gather vital intelligence in hostile systems. Ratters can still cloak when they are in danger. What this does do is force the cloaker to take on more risk in order to complete these very rewarding tasks.
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Endrain
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Posted - 2008.05.19 05:26:00 -
[3]
Dissagreed. How the heck can someone collect intel while afk in the first place. And two if you did that there would be alot less of a reason to use cloaks there for gathering intel and hiding.
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Grapez
Sky Net Industries
Pure.
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Posted - 2008.05.19 05:48:00 -
[4]
Yeah, the phrase "collect intel while AFK" is flawed.
 Originally by: Endrain
And two if you did that there would be alot less of a reason to use cloaks there for gathering intel and hiding.
What do you mean by this? That people would just drop cloaks entirely for intelligence gathering purposes? That wouldn't happen, since they afford the pilot so much safety.
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Thunderbird Anthares
Crimson Star Empire
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Posted - 2008.05.19 06:03:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Thunderbird Anthares on 19/05/2008 06:03:29
"Dont try to fix something that isnt broken."
epic quote
P.S. i dont use cloaking ships
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When you get to the end of your journey,everything that really matters is the journey itself. |
Deadeye Devie
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.05.19 12:39:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Grapez
A large problem with cloaking stems from {a}the cloaked pilot's ability to gather as much information about his surroundings while giving as little information about himself to others in local. This manifests itself primarily in two very different instances: 1.) when ratters cloak at any sign of a local spike and 2.) when people place alts in hostile systems and have them AFK while collecting intel, often for days or even weeks at a time, without giving the other pilots in the system a chance to counter.
I am proposing a change to the cloaking mechanics that alleviates these problems. It cripples the metagaming potential for cloaks while preserving its tactical and strategic abilities.
When someone is cloaked, that person's local chat window is closed. It will only open when the cloak is deactivated. It will close when the cloak is reactivated.
This addresses the two above issues. For the cloaking ratter, he cannot see when it is safe to uncloak and continue ratting. It is a risk vs. reward tradeoff; the cloaked ratter never knows when it is safe to continue ratting (risk), but he gains an important tool for evading hostiles (reward). For the AFK, cloaked intel gatherer, he cannot passively monitor local. He must uncloak to see local. Even if he only momentarily uncloaks (for a minimum of 30 seconds, given the current reactiviation delay on cloaks), it gives the others in the system a chance to probe him out. Again, this is a risk vs. reward tradeoff. The intel gatherer must expose himself to the possibility of being probed out (risk) in order to gather intel on the system (reward).
None of this changes the fundamental use of the cloaking device. Pilots in covert ops frigates and force recon cruisers can still gather vital intelligence in hostile systems. Ratters can still cloak when they are in danger. What this does do is force the cloaker to take on more risk in order to complete these very rewarding tasks.
oooookay.....to point {a}the idea of cloaked espoinage IS the cloaked pilot's ability to gather as much information about his surroundings while giving as little information about himself to others.....so in trying to address this issue, you are fundimentally removing its purpose...its similar to saying that a sniper cant use telescopic sights or a long ranged presicion weapon as it keeps him hidden and a long way away.
further issues....
1.) the reason for cloaks IS to hide, and so if that means cloaking at the siugn of possible danger....then its being used as intended.
2.)AFK cloakers are an issue as far as using space for other players.....not an issue in so much itsself, and tbqfh when ur cloaked u cant do anything, and sitting there hr after hr looking for 1-2 possible targets travelling through 1 system out of thousends......its a longshot but u nerf this, u basically nerf the whole of the point to this intel tool.
my answer is either leave it as it is....its fine as it is......or if it must be changed, make local a participation channel only...meaning if you speak your avater appears, if not active after 5 mins of speaking, it dissapears.
just my 2 isk......
Whoever appeals to the law against his fellow man is either a fool or a coward. Whoever cannot take care of themself without that law is both. |
Zirconium Blade
Ass Pounding Space Monkeys
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Posted - 2008.05.19 13:09:00 -
[7]
I think a better idea would be to force local to minimize while uncloaked.
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Sir Substance
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Posted - 2008.05.19 13:51:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Zirconium Blade
I think a better idea would be to force local to minimize while uncloaked.
so it can only be used for communication when you are cloaked?
gee, you though that one though, genius.
/sarcasm
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Marcus Gideon
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Posted - 2008.05.19 15:43:00 -
[9]
People still bickering about AFKers and their usage of Cloaks?
Guess it's time...
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Joe Starbreaker
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Posted - 2008.05.19 18:17:00 -
[10]
Maybe the cloak should drain capacitor, if only ever so slowly, meaning it couldn't be left AFK and run for hours. 20-30 minutes should be enough.
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[insert signature here] |
Sir Substance
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Posted - 2008.05.19 23:11:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Joe Starbreaker
Maybe the cloak should drain capacitor, if only ever so slowly, meaning it couldn't be left AFK and run for hours. 20-30 minutes should be enough.
see, i always thought it would. i was surprised when it didn't
have it drain your cap recharge per second + 5% or something.
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Hellaciouss
Genco
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.05.19 23:57:00 -
[12]
Sov 3 System scanners should be able to scan down cloakers to within 45km but takes a long time to scan. A high skilled prober should be able to scan down a cloaker to within 45km and there should be a bomb that decloaks any ship within 50km of the pulse blast.
Cloaking ratters and AFK cloakers dealt with. If the cloaker isn't afk then they will obviously see the bomber warping in and dropping the bomb, which will give them enough time to align to wherever and uncloak and warp before the bomb goes off or just warp off if they can warp while cloaked.
Sadly CCP will never do anything about AFK cloakers. We'll have to continue to deal with that ******** issuse.
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Marcus Gideon
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Posted - 2008.05.20 01:49:00 -
[13]
Everyone is welcome to participate in the other thread on AFK players and the misuse of Cloaks.
A lot of arguments have already been raised, a lot of points made, and overall a lot of thought spent on this same topic.
Why repeat ourselves for the sake of being heard, when everyone can collaborate and find a mutually satisfying compromise.
AFK is an issue. And Cloaks are an issue. But they are not the same, nor are they without resolutions.
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