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Leneerra
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2008.06.02 23:27:00 -
[1]
ever since the introduction of faction ammo most t2 ammo has been useless
I admit there is a minor role for some ammos and a few still shine (range boosting ammo) but the entire market on them tanked
They simply need to be redone.
I admit that having them outdamage faction ammo would not be in line with ccp's desires for combat duration so damage is not an option
Having the penalty effects be applied for each system having loaded that ammo type realy gimps the ships with many hardpoints over the ones with less and an added dps bonus
So I would suggest a system that does not have have a penalty nor gives a major bonus to damage
t2 Missiles could for instance lower actual speed (NOT max) by 1 or 2% per hit making them indirectly support other weaponsystems and increas the time a target needs to get to warp (even prefent it if there are enough of you)
the rage version with more dage ofset witrh a greater target signature allows a ship to engate a larger opponent miore effectively without boosting its damage against the same sized ship class removing other penalties from these missile types (rocket, ham, torp, cap torp) might do it but they should outperform faction missiles against larger targets.
Retaining a form of precision missiles (light, heavy, cruise and the missing capital cruise) without penalties do deal with smaller sized ship a bit more effectively might work as well
For gunnery ammo:
the ranged version seem to work although I personally would prefer slighly less range and slightly more damage allowing t1 a part in sniping as well
the damage version tha5t reduces range and tracking without outperforming faction ammo by a good margin is a sick joke. either have it reduce rangge and increase damage and tracking (compatible with the general mechanic less range = more damage) or make them equivalent to short range ammo with an intresting side effect (for instance laser ammo make targets suffer more from heat (if used by the target), ballistic ammo give a chance to deactivate a module on the target ship (as if deactivated by the user). blaster ammo could reduce weapon sig radius slightly
or maybe other have better idears?
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Buck Starchaser
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Posted - 2008.06.03 00:28:00 -
[2]
Havent' really thought about whether it should be changed really... I just know that I don't like having to remember a set of variables for each ammo type I load and I don't use it. I go for the faction stuff because I can just buy it from the station without having to find some jerk that builds it or get it transported to me like it is with the T2. It hits as good and I don't have to think about added penalties. It's standard ammo with more juice.
So is T2 ammo broken? I don't know. Does it need to be a big improvement over T1? It probably is an improvement over normal T1 ammo already as it can do new tricks. Is T2 ammo suposed to be the best and make me a lot of money to build and sell it? Probably not. Go build T1 ammo and trade it for faction from your agent and sell that. More people prefer the faction stuff and that doesn't mean that T2 is broken.
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2008.06.03 02:19:00 -
[3]
I agree. conflag? that green stuff you mean x-ray right? You say its short range and high damage, so you mean amarr navy multifrequency? wait you mean to tell me there is tech 2 short range ammo 
the slight damage increase with penalties to tracking and cap use just make conflag not worth using. that and in most cases I would rather have more em damage then thermal damage, them caldari folk like to tank for guristas 
and manufacturing t2 ammo just sucks ass.... 2 weeks to build 40 scorch L, thats 10 runs with a pe -4 bpc. Really, thats not cool 
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ceyriot
Induseng Enterprises
R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2008.06.03 04:07:00 -
[4]
Def. needs a fix, and these are a few good ideas.
Faction Store - Killboard |
Allaria Kriss
Elipse Inc.
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Posted - 2008.06.03 06:13:00 -
[5]
With a few exceptions, T2 ammo is either a one-trick pony (Range ammo) or sucks outright (Most close-range ammo). Scorch and Javelin HAMs are the only two that I see regularly used over faction ammo.
Please make them better!
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The Hardman
Uncle Fester's Olde Tyme Barbershoppe
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Posted - 2008.06.03 07:47:00 -
[6]
Especially short range. Long range AC/Pulse ammo is basically fine.
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Irongut
M'8'S
Frontal Impact
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Posted - 2008.06.03 08:50:00 -
[7]
T2 ammo definitely needs some luvin.
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Join Frontal Impact Racing Team & feel the speed!
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Lord Fitz
Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2008.06.03 09:07:00 -
[8]
I wonder if CCP could make a chart of the % of each ammo type used with each gun. That would certainly point out what needs boosting. As it is alot of T2 ammo that was supposed to be 'situational' is 'to be used in no situation'. Even if the bonuses need to be lowered in exchange for no penalties, it's fairly obvious that much of the ammo is completely useless as is.
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Esmenet
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Posted - 2008.06.03 09:40:00 -
[9]
For once a good topic in this forum.
It would be ok if T2 ammo actually was situational like advertised, but so much of it is simply crap compared to faction ammo in all situations. The penalties of using it is usually too heavy.
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Venkul Mul
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Posted - 2008.06.03 11:19:00 -
[10]
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Cpt Fina
Mutually Assured Distraction
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Posted - 2008.06.03 11:26:00 -
[11]
Agree with the idea of overhauling t2-ammo. But not the specifics in this thread.
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Rooker
Lysian Enterprises
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Posted - 2008.06.03 17:49:00 -
[12]
Just undo the nerfs introduced in Revelations tbh. Don't see the point of Void if it's not going to hit anything or Javelin if you can't move.
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Let Us Avoid Systems Via Autopilot |
Euriti
Caritas.
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Posted - 2008.06.03 18:30:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Euriti on 03/06/2008 18:29:52
Things like Spike, Aurora and Tremor (For long range) and Null, Scorch and Barrage are nice and have their own niche.
Close range stuff has way too many penalties that make their effective DPS lower than faction ingame.
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Ulstan
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Posted - 2008.06.03 19:14:00 -
[14]
The penalties are a bit ridiculous and stack up way too fast. I agree that an overhaul of TII ammo would be great.
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Thirzarr
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Posted - 2008.06.04 09:38:00 -
[15]
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Toramii
Le Moulin Rouge
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Posted - 2008.06.04 12:27:00 -
[16]
Yes.
CCP ...
- Remove / revise the stacking penalties especially on short range variants
- Change damage modifiers to balance
- Investigate adding other effects to T2 ammo instead of damage
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Sovereign533
Anoint
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Posted - 2008.06.04 12:58:00 -
[17]
i almost NEVER use t2 ammo.
and i do like my share of sniper ships.
tech1/faction ammo benefits outweigh the penalties for t2 ammo.
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Wu Jian
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2008.06.04 13:11:00 -
[18]
I agree T2 ammo needs to be reviewed and redone. I'd like to see microwarp drive propelled missiles as the T2 variant. These missiles would scream across space but only fly for a couple of seconds (limited capacitor power in a missile). This alone isn't a solution but it would provide a marked difference between the missile tiers and more ideas are welcome.
"Failure is made of should haves," Teraptus. |
Cpt Striker
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Posted - 2008.06.04 13:46:00 -
[19]
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Rouque Vanderbuilt
Nuts and Bolts
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Posted - 2008.06.04 21:12:00 -
[20]
/signed
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hamster humpster
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Posted - 2008.06.04 21:43:00 -
[21]
good idea
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Mr Horizontal
KIA Corp
KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2008.06.05 11:22:00 -
[22]
I'd also like to add that T2 ammo needs to be boosted so it's actually worth inventing as well.
Director | www.eve-bank.net |
Blood Bathroom
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Posted - 2008.06.08 07:53:00 -
[23]
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Cordran Li
The Really Awesome Players
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Posted - 2008.06.08 18:27:00 -
[24]
Yep
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Reachok
Tres Hombres
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Posted - 2008.06.08 18:42:00 -
[25]
Agreed. It makes no sense that ammo should gimp your setup while only loaded. Firing said ammo may require extra inertial stabilization, or thrusters to offset the recoil.
I question why having and using T2 ammo actually is deemed to be a negative thing anyway. Most people I know shun T2 ammo due to the negative effects it has on ship performance and capacitor.
If performance while "in use" matched or exceeded faction ammo, or even T1 ammo, I think most people would use it regularly. My char can use T2 missiles, but opt instead to use T2 missiles for extra range for instance.
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Phantom Slave
Mozzaki United
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Posted - 2008.06.09 03:04:00 -
[26]
I only fly amarr, and our T2 crystals aren't horrible. My only request is to let the crystals stack after use. I know they're 'used' but if they could just be stacked that would be awesome.
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Trinity is beautiful! I love you CCP!!! |
Omber Zombie
Frontier Technologies
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Posted - 2008.06.09 03:43:00 -
[27]
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CSM 08 Blog | 1st Campaign Vid |
Bunyip
Center for Advanced Studies
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Posted - 2008.06.09 03:50:00 -
[28]
Not only gun ammo needs changed, but missiles as well. As the owner of a T2 Fury Missile BPO, I've been without much of a market since Faction Missiles came out.
/signed
-Bunyip
"May all your hits be crits." - Knights of the Dinner Table. |
Kyle Cataclysm
Blue.
Blue Federation
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Posted - 2008.06.09 12:36:00 -
[29]
Quake, Javelin, Gleam and many T2 missiles need much love. All other T2 ammos could be looked at, too.
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Shaitis
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.06.09 13:48:00 -
[30]
Why dont we add or replace T2 ammo with side effects like, decreasing speed, scrambling and similar, that would change whole game mechanics ;) and put some fresh air. Imagine missle that prevents your target to warp for 1 second, or missle that distrupt lock. Dont we have bombs like this with area effect ?
Anyway something should be done, aside some particular cases t2 ammo is useless.
"What is funnier ? 20 Matari slaves pinned to one tree or 1 Matari slave pinned to 20 trees ? |
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