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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2004.05.13 07:06:00 -
[1]
I'm not clear on where to place this post but...
I've reliable recreated this through kill missions for my agent. Whenever I deal with Angel Ambushers or Angel Predators (A common 3rd level mission grouping) I find myself having to create tactics for these two bugs:
- Light Missiles with effective 80km+ range
- Heavy Missiles with effective 110km+ range
Correct me if I am wrong but I don't think that there is any combination of skills, and tech II potentiality, that will extend the range of a light missile to 80km+.
Getting missions where I face 4-5 of these at any given time can be horryfing. (Haven't lost a ship yet - {crossed fingers}). And defenders are a small defense compared to npc fire rate and numbers invovled.
I've brought up this bug before and I have to say I'm rather disappointed that it continues to exist. (Lost a ship in January to this when backing away from an engagement... combat leaves no logs unfortunately for me "so sayeth GM's".)
Of course in other instances, with missile using rats, standard ranges apply.
Eve Guardian - Former Reporter
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Falbala
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Posted - 2004.05.13 07:10:00 -
[2]
I am reporting you for harassment Shar.
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2004.05.13 07:11:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Shar Tegral on 13/05/2004 07:58:58
 Originally by: Falbala
I am reporting you for harassment Shar.
I'm sorry... what harrasment?
Edit Note: I'm glad you decided to remove that delightful sig you were using my dear. Bad qoutes I must say. You should've picked something that didn't make me look so good... and you so bad. Ta-ta!
Eve Guardian - Former Reporter
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Lady Michelle
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Posted - 2004.05.13 07:25:00 -
[4]
You got to remember, NPC pirates use illegal hardware.
Just like you see a Pirate flying a maller class ship, shooting missiles.
They have illegal and "unknown" technologies, which gives them strong weapons, and vessels.
What you think is "Stock" light missiles, fired from a "stock" cruiser, can very likely be a very improved missile, in regards of range.
(I believe this was also describet in another post somewhere)
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- CEO and Founder of Cold North Industries.
I don't believe in conspiracies, they are nothing but a conspiracy to make us all believe everything is a conspiracy. |
Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2004.05.13 07:31:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Lady Michelle
What you think is "Stock" light missiles, fired from a "stock" cruiser, can very likely be a very improved missile, in regards of range.
(I believe this was also describet in another post somewhere)
I'd love to find that one myself. To me it sounds like balderdash. It is one thing to know that the NPC's never run out of ammo, run out of capacitor, and many other things but to have missiles that can go 2.5 to 3x what is out there?
Hmmmm... of course out of the hundreds I've killed I've never seen one leave me a missile or launcher remotely capable of reproducing such feats.
Of course I've never found a laser off of them that requires zero capacitor too... 
Eve Guardian - Former Reporter
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Lady Michelle
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Posted - 2004.05.13 07:37:00 -
[6]
Well, I can easily explain that. They explode with the ship.
Go Figure....
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- CEO and Founder of Cold North Industries.
I don't believe in conspiracies, they are nothing but a conspiracy to make us all believe everything is a conspiracy. |
Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2004.05.13 08:03:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Lady Michelle
Well, I can easily explain that. They explode with the ship.
My editors would fire me outright if I relied on such "contrivance" to explain oversights/errors.
And I mean I understand that there will be aspects to npc's that are just a little out of reach of the players. But see the only answers we have are "players" guessing what is going on.
Not a "yes" this is a bug/"no" this is not a bug.
Eve Guardian - Former Reporter
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Lady Michelle
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Posted - 2004.05.13 08:11:00 -
[8]
They have said openly it's not a bug.
Like I said before, NPC Pirates use illegal hardware, illegal UNKNOWN MODIFIED HARDWARE.
If only I could remember where this was stated.
----------------------!!-------------------------
- CEO and Founder of Cold North Industries.
I don't believe in conspiracies, they are nothing but a conspiracy to make us all believe everything is a conspiracy. |
Pychian Vanervi
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Posted - 2004.05.13 08:41:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Shar Tegral
I'd love to find that one myself. To me it sounds like balderdash. It is one thing to know that the NPC's never run out of ammo, run out of capacitor, and many other things but to have missiles that can go 2.5 to 3x what is out there?
Hmmmm... of course out of the hundreds I've killed I've never seen one leave me a missile or launcher remotely capable of reproducing such feats.
I think you will find if the Rats had the same issues as the players to deal with, as in Ammo and cap usage missile range they would be about as challenging as walking up a small hill. They need to be a little beefed up or 3 day trials would be able to take on spawns and kill missions.
Plus you have just stated above that you have killed Hundreds? So I guess its not a problem killing them you just felt like moaning because they may have something good that you want but can't have.
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It's all about the fortune and glory, fortune and glory!
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2004.05.13 08:48:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Pychian Vanervi
Plus you have just stated above that you have killed Hundreds? So I guess its not a problem killing them you just felt like moaning because they may have something good that you want but can't have.
Can't have?
I'm sorry if I gave you that impression. I asked if something was a bug. Not why I can not have it. Fundamentally a difference.
And yes I have killed several hundred. Regardless of what difficulty I face if I see something wierd I'm going to mention it. While it may not be defeating me it might be immense overkill to others.
Eve Guardian - Former Reporter
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Pychian Vanervi
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Posted - 2004.05.13 09:17:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Shar Tegral
I'm sorry if I gave you that impression. I asked if something was a bug. Not why I can not have it. Fundamentally a difference.
Did I read this wrong?
Originally by: Shar Tegral
Hmmmm... of course out of the hundreds I've killed I've never seen one leave me a missile or launcher remotely capable of reproducing such feats.
You were given an explaination of what the reason behind the super missiles the rats use yet you continue to go on about it.
Why does it bother you so? If you can easily kill hundreds then you should have no real isues with it. Unless it is you are agrieved about never getting the illusive drop.
Whatever your real motives I am sure its not a really big thing to worry about.
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It's all about the fortune and glory, fortune and glory!
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2004.05.13 09:30:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Shar Tegral on 13/05/2004 09:34:53
/me sighs
If you want to qoute... qoute it properly.
Originally by: Shar Tegral
Hmmmm... of course out of the hundreds I've killed I've never seen one leave me a missile or launcher remotely capable of reproducing such feats.
Of course I've never found a laser off of them that requires zero capacitor too...
Quote:
Why does it bother you so?
I believe that when I started the thread I explained what bothered me. Alas, you wish to treat it as something else. Everything is quite plain unless you wish for my words to mean something else.
I.e. Whatever your real motives I am sure its not a really big thing to worry about.
I actually have no need to explain myself to you at all. Nor anyone... never have and I never will. What I say is what I mean and I'm sorry if you won't accept that. Once the fact that she said that it was confirmed not a bug... that was that... Until you stumbled along.
Eve Guardian - Former Reporter
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Pychian Vanervi
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Posted - 2004.05.13 09:47:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Shar Tegral
.
Quote:
Why does it bother you so?
I believe that when I started the thread I explained what bothered me. Alas, you wish to treat it as something else. Everything is quite plain unless you wish for my words to mean something else.
I.e. Whatever your real motives I am sure its not a really big thing to worry about.
I actually have no need to explain myself to you at all. Nor anyone... never have and I never will. What I say is what I mean and I'm sorry if you won't accept that. Once the fact that she said that it was confirmed not a bug... that was that... Until you stumbled along.
I step down, I had no intention to start a flame war and maybe its too early for me to post on the forums.
Needless to say coffee is being feed direct into my blood stream as I ttttyyyyppppe this.
Sorry for any miss quotation and I step back.
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It's all about the fortune and glory, fortune and glory!
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2004.05.13 09:50:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Pychian Vanervi
Needless to say coffee is being feed direct into my blood stream as I ttttyyyyppppe this.
Anyone in this position is forgiven much... heck no offense taken really. I was confused is all.
/me strolls off to the coffee maker thinking, "Damn that's a might fine idea."
Eve Guardian - Former Reporter
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Demangel
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Posted - 2004.05.13 09:53:00 -
[15]
LOL what is up with you people? Shar asks a simple question about something that obviously doesn't make sense and it's suddenly a debate on all kinds of abstract things... Half of which are suppositions about Shar's interests and insinuations about him in general (though i wouldn't call any of them nescessarily insulting.)
You know I think all these threads about rhe missile changes and all the bickering and bad blood going on right now have made everyone just itching to fight...
My point of view is that this does sound like a bug, and unless CCP specifically said that NPC light missiles should be able to go further than 80+ KM's I would reccomend Shar report it.
Obviously it's not making the game unplayable... But for some players there is this concept called "Suspension of disbeleif."
Some people are willing to go to great lengths not to lose this, they have a talent for creating plausible explainations for the hows and why's of things that make no sense.
Some obvious points to accept are the simple facts that for any game to be fun or challenging, it's not uncommon to have the need to give NPC's/Bots weapons, abilities, and more that a player can never have.
Sometimes in the name of making something easier, or for that matter harder, a DEV screws the pooch by making it more difficult for many players to accept as "believable."
It is much easier to pretend:
"The NPC won't run out of ammo cuz it's weapons hold more, and they havn't shot more than a dozen rounds or so."
Than it is to pretend:
"A normal light missile travels 20KM..." (don't qoute me on that figure, I havn't shot a light missile in a while, just throwing a number out there) "but these guys missiles somehow magically travel 80KM, sometimes more, uhm... It's uh... High tech... No wait... It's the force!"
In the end it's not a situation worth debating, as really it's entirely up to the individual. I personaly don't like things like that... but you might be fine with it... If it's a bug though CCP should be told about it. If not, then they will just ignore the pettition or whatever he submits anyway.
If you really want to go and argue about something as trivial as Shars question or intentions though, all I can say is, go get a punching bag and work off some of that fiestyness you built up reading the forums. 
I for one didn't see any whining, moaning, or even whimpering about it. I didn't see him demanding he get the same missiles... He just asked for logic, and he was given accusation. It's kind of funny actually, so nobody think I'm trying to flame them for thier responses  , I just couldn't let this one lie without sticking up for the guy.
Galaxion > If you drove a car shaped like a thorax women would call you
Demangel > Dude... I would call..
Demangel > wait that sounded g@y I bet.
Galaxion > Just a bit.
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Pychian Vanervi
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Posted - 2004.05.13 10:26:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Demangel
I for one didn't see any whining, moaning, or even whimpering about it. I didn't see him demanding he get the same missiles... He just asked for logic, and he was given accusation. It's kind of funny actually, so nobody think I'm trying to flame them for thier responses , I just couldn't let this one lie without sticking up for the guy.
I made my peace man, all is calm once more on this thread.
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It's all about the fortune and glory, fortune and glory!
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Demangel
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Posted - 2004.05.13 10:54:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Pychian Vanervi
Originally by: Demangel
I for one didn't see any whining, moaning, or even whimpering about it. I didn't see him demanding he get the same missiles... He just asked for logic, and he was given accusation. It's kind of funny actually, so nobody think I'm trying to flame them for thier responses , I just couldn't let this one lie without sticking up for the guy.
I made my peace man, all is calm once more on this thread.
It's ok, Like I said, I just felt like stickin up for the guy ;) it also gave me a chance to drop my .02 ISK on his question so... Heheh. Forgive me
Galaxion > If you drove a car shaped like a thorax women would call you
Demangel > Dude... I would call..
Demangel > wait that sounded g@y I bet.
Galaxion > Just a bit.
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Pychian Vanervi
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Posted - 2004.05.13 11:01:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Demangel
It's ok, Like I said, I just felt like stickin up for the guy ;) it also gave me a chance to drop my .02 ISK on his question so... Heheh. Forgive me
I think your .02 isk turned into a 14,000 isk on the subject, but hey I am cool, forgiveness is given.
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It's all about the fortune and glory, fortune and glory!
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Darius Octavius
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Posted - 2004.05.13 11:02:00 -
[19]
Don't know how long you've been playing Shar but NPC missles behave in a vastly better manner than they used to. Was a time they would fire from 80km away and immediately impact a roid and explode causing the player ships damage. LOL...splash damage at 80km, what a riot. Or, they would fly through any intervening roids and hit your ship. In the past I've had light missles chase me for over 200km. Have not done alot of NPC hunting lately but seems these things have been fixed.
In any event, the official word is the NPC rats have stuff we can't get and it blows up with their ships (very convenient yes?). If they get too crazy too often as they did before then something should be done.
Stellar Products and Quality Resources
ticker: SPQR
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Kerosene
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Posted - 2004.05.13 11:16:00 -
[20]
I'll try give you a sensible answer. To cut it short if the missiles had range like they used to then any kestrel with enough training could take down npc cruisers indefinately.
That was deemed to be too easy so the missiles got upgraded. Was a bit naughty that we didn't get told in patch notes and most of use found out by getting several heavies up our butts.
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mqwam
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Posted - 2004.05.13 14:37:00 -
[21]
It¦s a known "feature". It was introduced with castor in december I think. And at that time there were some threads about it. It was even mentioned in a patch thread so CCP should know about it for month.
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=55190
I don¦t see any reason why npc missiles should have no flighttime. You can shoot blaster npcs or even other turret npcs with skills and equip sitting beyond their weapon range...
But light missiles are hitting at 100km...
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Rod Blaine
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Posted - 2004.05.13 15:49:00 -
[22]
jeez, this one is old.
That so called "bug" of heavy missiles with 130KM range (its more like unlimited, but its the targeting that is the limit it seems to me), has been dicussed endlessly already.
It's a way of balancing the NPC's against our superior intellect.
And still they are too damn easy. There is no spawn of angels I cant kill alone, or I havent found it yet (still have to try taking on 4 or more BS's at once).
_______________________________________________
Yes yes, blogging is passÚ I know.
Rod's Ramblingz on Eve-Online
Solutions to your issues. |
Lachenlaud
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Posted - 2004.05.13 15:56:00 -
[23]
I was doing a kill mission last night for one of my Level 2 agents against Angels (Ambusher and three Outlaws) and they had bloodclaws that could hit a ship moving away from them at 2.2k/s.
Kinda jealous really 
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Tigersbane
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Posted - 2004.05.13 16:36:00 -
[24]
Shar - to answer your question about why you never get drops that allow you to fire at these ranges etc.....
A Dev posted the reason a while ago - It was something along the lines of "the pirates rig their hi tech modules to explode upon ship destruction"
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Rod Blaine
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Posted - 2004.05.13 17:31:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Lachenlaud
I was doing a kill mission last night for one of my Level 2 agents against Angels (Ambusher and three Outlaws) and they had bloodclaws that could hit a ship moving away from them at 2.2k/s.
Kinda jealous really
Yes, apart from ahving a veeery long range, NPC missiles also have increased speed.
Don't ask how fast they go cause I never tried that out. All I know is that my 2km/sec frig doesnt outrun their heavy missiles.
_______________________________________________
Yes yes, blogging is passÚ I know.
Rod's Ramblingz on Eve-Online
Solutions to your issues. |
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